dhsilv2 wrote:Kabookalu wrote:dhsilv2 wrote:
Bird played a lot in the paint on defense where he had Parish and McHale around. Similarly he was there too to double. Absolutely there was more iso though.
As for hand checking, it's harder to drive past someone who can physically hit your hand while you're dribbling. This was one of MJ's greatest strengths as well. Dan Majerle who was a pretty good athlete, but wasn't very fast latterally and got only worse as he aged was still getting steals off players and not getting beat off the dribble thanks to his hands well into his 30's.
I mean he was there, it just didn't happen too often though. It's not like the refs were super strict about calling every single instance of a player doubling a non ballhandler, however they almost ALWAYS called it when the player was being doubled while still in possession of the ball, and then passed it out. That helper better be running away from the player they were doubling like their life depended on it, or else it's a surefire whistle. Those were the easiest calls to make just because the refs are always focusing on the ballhandler. Double teaming was discouraged and it just didn't happen a lot. That's a free point they're giving up.
Hitting someone on the hand while they're dribbling is illegal in any era, lol. Hand checking allowed defenders to put their hands and forearm on the ballhandler, they weren't allowed to slap the player around.
You're correct on hand checking...though I sure saw enough hands getting swatted in that era...
As for the defense, the rule was you cannot double from the weakside, but you still had the 3 second rules and all that. Bird was often involved in doubles in the paint. But not on the outside. Still hand checking and tigher spacing imo made bird a better defender. Today his lack of speed would limit his ability to be that zone double team guy.
There is a difference between 1980s and 1990s. From what I have read I think it might be coach Cotton Fitzsimmons in the late 1980s who came up with clearing out a side with non shooter standing out at the weak side 3 point line to forces the refs to call illegal defense if anybody tried to sag over to the strong side. He got copied by coaches that came later in the 1990s.
I also have this vague memory of the NBA promoting so e minor rule tweak in tgec1990s that was supposed to give us fans more exciting one on one match ups like Michael Jordan vs Gary Payton with Gary Payton on an island. I can't find that minor rule tweak when I search for it in the history of rule changes.
We fans in the 1990s (or at least the media) believed the NBA's promotion that we were going to be excited by one on play but then we discovered extreme isolation basketball was boring basketball and the NBA got worried about TV ratings and the NBA changed their mind about promoting one on one basketball.
The 3 point shooting was the other big change. Players and coaches were anti-3 point shot because they that it was an ABA gimmick. They told us that 3 point shots will create long rebounds leading to fast breaks and therefore taking 3 point shots will harm teams even if the team has a decent 3 point shooter. The coaches were wrong. I read that Rick Pitino in the late 1980s was the first coach to embrace the 3 point shot. Pitino had been forced to use the 3 point shot in college because he had a team that could not win without the 3 point shot and then Pitino found himself coaching young Patrick Ewing who was struggling with his insde scoring because help defenders were bothering Ewing. Pitino had some players that could shoot 3s like Trent Tucker and Pitino had them start firing up 3s to create floor spacing for Ewing. Nobody had tried to use 3 point shooting to get the help defenders out of the paint before Pitino.
Bird claims he never practiced 3s except for just before the all star weekend three point shooting contests.
I was a Celtic fan in the 1980s before I moved to Northern California. I had never seen a modern team team set as many screens as the regular season 2015-2016 Warriors. I did see game film of 1960s teams setting very man screens to set up team mates for catch and shoot 10 foot shots. It was as if the 2015-16 Warriors had taken a 1960s offense and extended it out to the 3 point line.
What I saw Bird do in the 1989s is create screens for himself by running his defenders into other defenders that have their heads turned because they are trying to defend one of Bird's teammates.
Young 1980s Jordan would catch the ball at 18 feet out (within his shooting range) and beat his man off the dribble and then at about 9 feet out Jordan is seeing 3 help defenders coming over and Jordan picks the clearest path to the rim and tries to go arround and the help defenders and through the sea if reaching arms. That was more exciting basketball than any Jordan vs Payton one on one isolation. Too bad young Jordan did not have enough help from his teammates to put on his show deep in the playoffs.
The 1980s played fluid interior passing offenses compared to the 1990s. If there was a problem with the 1980s game it was poor defensive effort prior to the 4th quarters. In the 4th quarters the teams with extensive playoff experience cranked up their playoff versions of team defense while the teams without playoff experience cranked up their effort but looked disjointed and confused about where to sag to and when to rotate and switch.
The 1980s playoff experienced defense blatantly broke the illegal defense rules and the refs allowed that. They played a zonish man to man similar to what is played today excepts they sort of half pretended to defend their own men by moving a bit when their men moved even if they were in the paint and the man they were theoretically guarding was 12 feet away. These were extreme sags but they still were loosely connected to the guys they were theoretically guarding. Today players don't have to pretend to guard anybody but somebody has to guard the 3 point shooters. In the 1980s the 3 point shooters were not good enough to be guarded. The idea was just to let players shoot 3s and if they are good enough to hit thoses shots you put about with that. When a good shooter got to about 16 feet from the basket the sagging defender would stop sagging and would get back to his man.
The 1980s knew the long 2 was a bad shot for anybody except somebody like Andrew Toney. What the 1980s did not understand was how much better a 3 point shot was. If a mediocre shooter hits 17 footers at 40% let him shoot them but if he shoots 3s at 35% that is a good shot and he should keep firing 3s until his defenders guards him instead of sagging to provide help defense. Even if the 1980s NBA understood floor spacing they stil dis not have many players that could shoot open 3s at 35%. The 1980s NBA had guys that could shoot open 3s at 25% even though they never practiced 3 point shooting. all thoses guys that could hit 3% at 25% should have been practicing 3s to turn themselves into 35% three point shooters.
The NBA was full of smart coaches but they were not thinking outside of the box and they could not understand the value of 3 point shooting. What I find scary about 1980s coaches not understanding the value of the 3 point shoot is how many of our government policies are based on stuck in the box incorrect pack thinking every bit as stupid as the world's best coaches not understanding the value of floor spacing. At least in the NBA coaches eventually learn.
