RingsDontLie wrote:PierceFan4ever wrote:Yeah I'm not sure where this Ingram having a higher ceiling than Tatum is coming from considering Tatum is better than him right now as a rookie and being younger. Unless you really think Ingram is somehow going to turn into Durant then I don't see how his ceiling is higher. Ingram is still a poor free throw and 3 point shooter but his slashing game has improved; better job at getting to the line. Tatum is already an elite shooter and he still has a lot of room to grow physically and skill wise.
My goodness, even with Kuzma as the only challenging rookie to Simmons...people are rating Tatum higher. If we are talking now, Kuzma is the better player than Tatum or Brown. If we are talking now, Ingram is the better player than Tatum or Brown.
Kuzma, in his rookie season is averaging more points than Jaylen Brown in his 2nd season.
The board fails to realize is that Ingram has more responsibility than Tatum or Jaylen. He's not playing alongside an MVP candidate like Kyrie that can take the pressure off of him and find him more looks...he's playing alongside a rookie guard Lonzo Ball, whose still figuring things out.
The Lakers is Ingram's team now, and he is the points leader, and go to guy, so he is playing with the added pressure of being a team leader. He just sunk a game winner against Philly to boot. That shows you the confidence growth. I can't see Jaylen carrying a team offensively and going head to head with Kevin Durant like Ingram was able to do:
Jaylen might be able to have a good game on occassion, but not over a long period, because he's just not that talented as Ingram.
I actually like Tatum and his skillset. It's comparable to that of a rookie Kobe...just very fluid..good looking shot, etc. I haven't watched him much, but you don't need to see much to know he is very talented. I think Tatum is the only real young talent that can challenge Ingram eventually in this poll. But Ingram simply has the length advantage even if Tatum becomes as special, so you have take Ingram.
Kuzma being the only challenger to Simmons?
First of all, Kuzma is not even close to Simmons so therefore isn't even a challenge. Secondly, both Tatum and Mitchell are rated higher than Kuzma for good reasons. Aside from rebounding, there is nothing Kuzma is better than Tatum at. Every advanced stat favors Tatum offensively and Tatum is a way better defender than Kuzma right now based on stats and eye test. Not to mention, Tatum is 3 years younger than Kuzma so no Kuzma is not better, and this discussion won't be even close the next few seasons. It's the only thing Lakers fans can hold their hat on with because of Ball's poor play. Again, show me how Ingram is better than Tatum at what exactly? Getting to the line more? He shoots 20 percent worse from threes, 20 percent worse from free throws, Tatum beats him in every defensive measure, Tatum almost scores more on less shots and much less usage. Brown and Ingram are near even offensively with Brown shooting better from threes but defensively Brown is much better than Ingram.
You need to realize the Celtics are 23-5 with Brown and Tatum starting and playing 30 minutes a night. They're both huge reasons why the Celtics are sitting on top of the east. You also need to realize that both Tatum and Brown aren't allowed to do whatever they want on the court like the Lakers duo which hinders their stats to put up better numbers. You're acting like Ingram gets double team or carrying a massive workload. If he was, then Kuzma wouldn't be the Lakers leading scorer. You look at Ingram's numbers and they aren't all that impressive like you're suggesting what's impressive is that he looks like an nba player after looking like a dleaguer for the better part of last season. He's not carrying a high load of Randle, Clarkson, Pope, Kuzma, Brook Lopez at times are playing well. And if there's one thing Ball does well, he sets up his teammates to take good shots.
Again, Brown and Ingram's offensive stats are pretty identical except Brown is a much better defender. So your take on Ingram being able to take over is skewed when you don't post any supporting facts. And Brown can't take over as of right now when we have Kyrie Irving on the team and rightfully so. I don't need to see Ingram having his career game against Durant. I also saw Brown being the best player on the Celtics against the Warriors a couple weeks before in a much more anticipated game. I also have seen Brown have strong games against Lebron and the Cavs a couple times now.
Just because someone has length advantage shouldn't favor a certain player over someone who is an elite shooter at age 19
Ingram has a long ways to go to catch Tatum when it comes to shooting. There's no factual information to suggest that Ingram is better as a scorer. Like I said his shooting levels from 3 and free throws are much worse than Tatum while Tatum being a much better defender. Tatum is also younger and at this stage compared to Ingram last year, he was way better. Ingram still looks raw. I don't think they're that close in talent personally but if Lakers fans want to live off Ingram using his length like Giannis or KD while failing to realize the massive difference in talent or physical strength in Giannis' case, so be it.