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Colbinii wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

It hasn't hit us yet but it's going to be a sad day when we cant look forward to the GOAT every off-season. I've had tons of fun in this thread (especially with the trolls) as I've spent the better part of 6 years reading this thread weekly.

Yea man a lot of my favorite posters tend to frequent this thread. When he retires it's gonna feel like I don't see my RealGM fam as often anymore haha. Hardly even browse this PC board anymore more nowadays, let alone general discussion

Heej wrote:

Colbinii wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

It hasn't hit us yet but it's going to be a sad day when we cant look forward to the GOAT every off-season. I've had tons of fun in this thread (especially with the trolls) as I've spent the better part of 6 years reading this thread weekly.

Yea man a lot of my favorite posters tend to frequent this thread. When he retires it's gonna feel like I don't see my RealGM fam as often anymore haha. Hardly even browse this PC board anymore more nowadays, let alone general discussion

He's not done yet. You just have to believe

D.Brasco wrote:

This is slightly misleading, given missing the post season is worse than being eliminated in the first round. I also think it's fair to question whether playing in the East has contributed to his post season dominance given his struggles in the west this season. I.e. Would he have reached 8 finals if he'd spent the majority of his career playing west of the Mississippi?

Baski wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

He has, but those stats look all out of place next to each other and forced. Gives it a "grasping for straws" vibe. I mean how do you rank " No first round exits"? That's some "6 for 6" level stuff right there.

LOL..I'm the biggest Lebron fan there is, but that was a reach! But, maybe they're dumbing it down for the trolls and James haters? They had other stuff to go with there, though.

Ooduwa wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

This is slightly misleading, given missing the post season is worse than being eliminated in the first round. I also think it's fair to question whether playing in the East has contributed to his post season dominance given his struggles in the west this season. I.e. Would he have reached 8 finals if he'd spent the majority of his career playing west of the Mississippi?

Not at all. Those are simply truths. And if you take everything he has done as a whole, they become even more amazing. And there may be a point there if and when he played the teams from the west and he stunk it up or just played meh, but that wasn't the case. His finals numbers are GOAT level, too. Other than the first Cavs team, where he was 22 and the rest of the team was garbage (for a championship contender) and the first trip with the Heat, he has been GOAT like in the finals against the western conference, including quite possibly the greatest team ever. No, possibly other than the goofy "No first round exits" thing, it's a justified list.

Ooduwa wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

This is slightly misleading, given missing the post season is worse than being eliminated in the first round. I also think it's fair to question whether playing in the East has contributed to his post season dominance given his struggles in the west this season. I.e. Would he have reached 8 finals if he'd spent the majority of his career playing west of the Mississippi?

It's incredibly silly to say that missing the playoffs during an injury-plagued 16th season in the West casts a shadow on everything that he accomplished before then. He's 34, not 24.

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:

D.Brasco wrote:

This is slightly misleading, given missing the post season is worse than being eliminated in the first round. I also think it's fair to question whether playing in the East has contributed to his post season dominance given his struggles in the west this season. I.e. Would he have reached 8 finals if he'd spent the majority of his career playing west of the Mississippi?

It's incredibly silly to say that missing the playoffs during an injury-plagued 16th season in the West casts a shadow on everything that he accomplished before then. He's 34, not 24.

Sometimes I wonder how much better people think Western defenses become simply by being in the West. He's still gonna go ham regardless and opposing defenses are still gonna focus on him, leaving his teammates (who would supposedly be better too) in favourable positions to score. I just don't get it. Like Miles Turner and Al Horford are supposed to be less of a challenge than Capela and Aldridge? I mean yes you got Anthony Davis and Rudy Gobert but Draymond Green barely has an effect on LeBron so I dunno what they would to do change things.

Baski wrote:

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:
This is slightly misleading, given missing the post season is worse than being eliminated in the first round. I also think it's fair to question whether playing in the East has contributed to his post season dominance given his struggles in the west this season. I.e. Would he have reached 8 finals if he'd spent the majority of his career playing west of the Mississippi?

It's incredibly silly to say that missing the playoffs during an injury-plagued 16th season in the West casts a shadow on everything that he accomplished before then. He's 34, not 24.

Sometimes I wonder how much better people think Western defenses become simply by being in the West. He's still gonna go ham regardless and opposing defenses are still gonna focus on him, leaving his teammates (who would supposedly be better too) in favourable positions to score. I just don't get it. Like Miles Turner and Al Horford are supposed to be less of a challenge than Capela and Aldridge? I mean yes you got Anthony Davis and Rudy Gobert but Draymond Green barely has an effect on LeBron so I dunno what they would to do change things.

It really doesn't make any sense. Like, you can just compare his numbers against the West to his numbers against the East for his career.

Against the West: 27/7.6/7.3 on 50.6/35.6/72.3 shooting splits, and a 58.4 TS%.
Against the East; 27.3/7.3/7.2 on 50.3/33.6/74.3 shooting splits, and a 58.8 TS%.

His numbers are practically identical against the East and the West. He's played 449 regular season games against the West. He's also played 49 Finals games against the West. In those, he averages 28.2/10/7.7 on 47% shooting. Outside of his god awful Dallas series, LeBron averages 29.7/10.4/7.9 in the NBA Finals against the West.

That's 498 career games against just the West, over 6 seasons worth of games. HIs numbers during those games are practically identical to his numbers against the East.

The idea that he wouldn't be able to cut it against the West just doesn't hold up when you look at the facts. He's been playing against western conference teams his entire career, and he's been the LeBron we all know when he has played them.

Against the West: 29-28, misses the playoffs

Stats without wins are meaningless. This has always been so.

Ooduwa wrote:Against the West: 29-28, misses the playoffs

Stats without wins are meaningless. This has always been so.

There are a lot of things wrong with this post. Where to start?

1) LeBron played 55 games this year, not 57.
2) His team went 28-27 in those games, not 29-28.
3) Not all 55 of those games were against the West. 32 of them were.
4) The Lakers were 18-14 against the West with Lebron this year. That means they were 10-13 against the East with Lebron. So, his team did better against the West than the East.
5) The Lakers were much better with Lebron than without him. You cannot argue that his stats are meaningless when the team is very clearly better with him on the court than off.
6) Your post completely ignores the fact that he was still injured when he came back, and the Lakers dealt with many other injuries in addition to his. It also completely ignores the fact that this is year 16 LeBron, not prime LeBron. Most all-timers were retired before they got to year 16.

Step into the world of context. It's not a scary place.

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:Against the West: 29-28, misses the playoffs

Stats without wins are meaningless. This has always been so.

There are a lot of things wrong with this post. Where to start?

1) LeBron played 55 games this year, not 57.
2) His team went 28-27 in those games, not 29-28.
3) Not all 55 of those games were against the West. 32 of them were.
4) The Lakers were 18-14 against the West with Lebron this year. That means they were 10-13 against the East with Lebron. So, his team did better against the West than the East.
5) The Lakers were much better with Lebron than without him. You cannot argue that his stats are meaningless when the team is very clearly better with him on the court than off.
6) Your post completely ignores the fact that he was still injured when he came back, and the Lakers dealt with many other injuries in addition to his. It also completely ignores the fact that this is year 16 LeBron, not prime LeBron. Most all-timers were retired before they got to year 16.

Step into the world of context. It's not a scary place.

- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

- The Lakers weren't a playoff team with or without LBJ. I.e. Empty stats

- Lots of teams/players deal with injuries.

- Context like LBJ choosing to play with this Lakers team? Making excuses for his failures doesn't make sense when he's responsible for the context.

Ooduwa wrote:

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:Against the West: 29-28, misses the playoffs

Stats without wins are meaningless. This has always been so.

There are a lot of things wrong with this post. Where to start?

1) LeBron played 55 games this year, not 57.
2) His team went 28-27 in those games, not 29-28.
3) Not all 55 of those games were against the West. 32 of them were.
4) The Lakers were 18-14 against the West with Lebron this year. That means they were 10-13 against the East with Lebron. So, his team did better against the West than the East.
5) The Lakers were much better with Lebron than without him. You cannot argue that his stats are meaningless when the team is very clearly better with him on the court than off.
6) Your post completely ignores the fact that he was still injured when he came back, and the Lakers dealt with many other injuries in addition to his. It also completely ignores the fact that this is year 16 LeBron, not prime LeBron. Most all-timers were retired before they got to year 16.

Step into the world of context. It's not a scary place.

- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

- The Lakers weren't a playoff team with or without LBJ. I.e. Empty stats

- Lots of teams/players deal with injuries.

- Context like LBJ choosing to play with this Lakers team? Making excuses for his failures doesn't make sense when he's responsible for the context.

He "failed" because he didn't play. If that's what you want to hang your hat on then go for it.

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:

thebigbird wrote:There are a lot of things wrong with this post. Where to start?

1) LeBron played 55 games this year, not 57.
2) His team went 28-27 in those games, not 29-28.
3) Not all 55 of those games were against the West. 32 of them were.
4) The Lakers were 18-14 against the West with Lebron this year. That means they were 10-13 against the East with Lebron. So, his team did better against the West than the East.
5) The Lakers were much better with Lebron than without him. You cannot argue that his stats are meaningless when the team is very clearly better with him on the court than off.
6) Your post completely ignores the fact that he was still injured when he came back, and the Lakers dealt with many other injuries in addition to his. It also completely ignores the fact that this is year 16 LeBron, not prime LeBron. Most all-timers were retired before they got to year 16.

Step into the world of context. It's not a scary place.

- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

- The Lakers weren't a playoff team with or without LBJ. I.e. Empty stats

- Lots of teams/players deal with injuries.

- Context like LBJ choosing to play with this Lakers team? Making excuses for his failures doesn't make sense when he's responsible for the context.

He "failed" because he didn't play. If that's what you want to hang your hat on then go for it.

When he played they weren’t a post season team, they were a game over .500. This isn’t difficult to understand.

Ooduwa wrote:- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

Jordan missed the playoffs on his 14th season, and "got" into the playoffs with a measly 30 wins in 1986 (playing like 6 games or so).
Kareem missed the playoffs at age 28, in the middle of his prime.
Kobe missed the playoffs at age 26, right in the middle of his prime.
Garnett missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.
Olajuwon missed the playoffs at age 29, in his prime.
Chamberlain missed the playoffs in his early prime.
Robertson missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.

That's a weird GOAT list you gotta have.

Jaivl wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

Jordan missed the playoffs on his 14th season, and "got" into the playoffs with a measly 30 wins in 1986 (playing like 6 games or so).
Kareem missed the playoffs at age 28, in the middle of his prime.
Kobe missed the playoffs at age 26, right in the middle of his prime.
Garnett missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.
Olajuwon missed the playoffs at age 29, in his prime.
Chamberlain missed the playoffs in his early prime.
Robertson missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.

That's a weird GOAT list you gotta have.

J.J. Redick the GOAT


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bidofo wrote:

Jaivl wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

Jordan missed the playoffs on his 14th season, and "got" into the playoffs with a measly 30 wins in 1986 (playing like 6 games or so).
Kareem missed the playoffs at age 28, in the middle of his prime.
Kobe missed the playoffs at age 26, right in the middle of his prime.
Garnett missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.
Olajuwon missed the playoffs at age 29, in his prime.
Chamberlain missed the playoffs in his early prime.
Robertson missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.

That's a weird GOAT list you gotta have.

J.J. Redick the GOAT


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Wait you think he's not? Get with the times bruh. #MountReddick

Jaivl wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

Jordan missed the playoffs on his 14th season, and "got" into the playoffs with a measly 30 wins in 1986 (playing like 6 games or so).
Kareem missed the playoffs at age 28, in the middle of his prime.
Kobe missed the playoffs at age 26, right in the middle of his prime.
Garnett missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.
Olajuwon missed the playoffs at age 29, in his prime.
Chamberlain missed the playoffs in his early prime.
Robertson missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.

That's a weird GOAT list you gotta have.

I thought this was the LBJ thread? Deflecting to some arbitrary list of players who’ve missed the post season in the past does nothing to detract from or negate the fact that LBJ missed the playoffs this season.

Ooduwa wrote:

Jaivl wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:- Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable.

Jordan missed the playoffs on his 14th season, and "got" into the playoffs with a measly 30 wins in 1986 (playing like 6 games or so).
Kareem missed the playoffs at age 28, in the middle of his prime.
Kobe missed the playoffs at age 26, right in the middle of his prime.
Garnett missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.
Olajuwon missed the playoffs at age 29, in his prime.
Chamberlain missed the playoffs in his early prime.
Robertson missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.

That's a weird GOAT list you gotta have.

I thought this was the LBJ thread? Deflecting to some arbitrary list of players who’ve missed the post season in the past does nothing to detract from or negate the fact that LBJ missed the playoffs this season.

How do you not understand why he brought it up?

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:

Jaivl wrote:Jordan missed the playoffs on his 14th season, and "got" into the playoffs with a measly 30 wins in 1986 (playing like 6 games or so).
Kareem missed the playoffs at age 28, in the middle of his prime.
Kobe missed the playoffs at age 26, right in the middle of his prime.
Garnett missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.
Olajuwon missed the playoffs at age 29, in his prime.
Chamberlain missed the playoffs in his early prime.
Robertson missed the playoffs a bunch of times in his prime.

That's a weird GOAT list you gotta have.

I thought this was the LBJ thread? Deflecting to some arbitrary list of players who’ve missed the post season in the past does nothing to detract from or negate the fact that LBJ missed the playoffs this season.

How do you not understand why he brought it up?

Because bringing it up was purposeless? Just because other players have disappointed and or failed in the past doesn’t mean we can’t hold LBJ accountable for missing the playoffs this season.

Ooduwa wrote:

thebigbird wrote:

Ooduwa wrote:
I thought this was the LBJ thread? Deflecting to some arbitrary list of players who’ve missed the post season in the past does nothing to detract from or negate the fact that LBJ missed the playoffs this season.

How do you not understand why he brought it up?

Because bringing it up was purposeless? Just because other players have disappointed and or failed in the past doesn’t mean we can’t hold LBJ accountable for missing the playoffs this season.

You: "Making the playoffs is a bare minimum expectation for a superstar or GOAT player. Failing in this area is inexcusable."

Reality check: Other GOAT candidates have missed the playoffs, even in the middle of their primes.

You: "IRRELEVANT!!! DEFLECTION!!!!!!!!"

There are two options here: either you're incredibly dense and somehow don't understand why this fact is directly relevant to your first statement, or you do understand why it's relevant but are arguing in bad faith.