The Lebron Thread - 2018 - 2019 - Pt. 2

[tone wone]

I feel like, if your team has a -5.35 SRS without your best player, it means that your team kind of sucks. To take it a step further, if playing with LeBron for 34 games destroyed your ability to function properly on a basketball court without him, then you have much deeper problems.

Lakers won 35 games last year, with many guys who had injury problems. They would have won over 40 this year, even if they didn't get LeBron, and if they kept Randle. But the system has changed, and it hampered the young players. LeBron knows how to use his pieces, but he doesn't really make his teammates better. Lakers really went "all or nothing" on this LeBron move.

The Lakers had the 22nd ranked offense in the League last year. What system are you talking about?

I want specifics. You don't get hid behind vague labels . They were one of the worst offensive teams in the league last season.

[nzahir]

What would you guys do this summer if LA misses out on KD, Kawhi, Klay, Kemba, and Butler? And then can't trade for AD or Dame?

Go for Beal (if even possible)? Is he even good enough to be the #2 option if KD leaves to say NY

Trade Ingram for a pick and use the cap the following summer. Sign more one year contracts.

So waste another year of Lebron for what? To hope you can sign AD the next year?

[G35]

Honestly, I don't really know what "makes his teammates better" means. I hear the expression a lot, but it is pretty messy. For example, Stephen Curry is rightfully regarded as the ultimate "makes his teammates better guy", but when he misses games, the Warriors fall off a cliff. So does he really make his teammates better, or does he just know how to use his pieces? I am not a fan of expecting players to have a part-time job in player development.

I don't think players can make each other better per se.

Players play better when they are allowed to play to their strengths.

Its not like anyone could actually make Draymond a great 3pt shooter, he either is or he isn't......

[BasketballFan7]

What would you guys do this summer if LA misses out on KD, Kawhi, Klay, Kemba, and Butler? And then can't trade for AD or Dame?

Go for Beal (if even possible)? Is he even good enough to be the #2 option if KD leaves to say NY

Trade Ingram for a pick and use the cap the following summer. Sign more one year contracts.

So waste another year of Lebron for what? To hope you can sign AD the next year?

Yes.

[nzahir]

Trade Ingram for a pick and use the cap the following summer. Sign more one year contracts.

So waste another year of Lebron for what? To hope you can sign AD the next year?

Yes.

Don't think that is a good idea, also waste of Lebron's career

I bet he has some agreement to go all in by this summer, if not he will stop trying as hard and sabotage them or request out

[MyUniBroDavis]

I feel like, if your team has a -5.35 SRS without your best player, it means that your team kind of sucks. To take it a step further, if playing with LeBron for 34 games destroyed your ability to function properly on a basketball court without him, then you have much deeper problems.

Lakers won 35 games last year, with many guys who had injury problems. They would have won over 40 this year, even if they didn't get LeBron, and if they kept Randle. But the system has changed, and it hampered the young players. LeBron knows how to use his pieces, but he doesn't really make his teammates better. Lakers really went "all or nothing" on this LeBron move.

The Lakers had the 22nd ranked offense in the League last year. What system are you talking about?

I want specifics. You don't get hid behind vague labels . They were one of the worst offensive teams in the league last season.

The Lakers aren’t a bad team because they aren’t talented, they are a bad team because they misuse players and don’t have a system

That’s not lebrons fault, it’s the coaching staffs fault. Having lebron doesent mean you can’t have a system, in fact lebron being the most versatile player ever and among the smartest ones ever means that if anything it’s easier to build a system incorporating him

The problem is the lakers offense is 99% improvising, and they are asking a bunch of young guys to do it.

There’s this stupid idea that how good a player is = their impact. A guy can be a great offensive player under one circumstance and a horrible one in another without a huge change in role. And at times it’s not obvious.

That being said they are a top 5 defensive team, missing probably two of their top 6 players impact wise, and you can add lebron + another perennial all star to fix their offense next year.

[Gooner]

Lakers won 35 games last year, with many guys who had injury problems. They would have won over 40 this year, even if they didn't get LeBron, and if they kept Randle. But the system has changed, and it hampered the young players. LeBron knows how to use his pieces, but he doesn't really make his teammates better. Lakers really went "all or nothing" on this LeBron move.

The Lakers had the 22nd ranked offense in the League last year. What system are you talking about?

I want specifics. You don't get hid behind vague labels . They were one of the worst offensive teams in the league last season.

The Lakers aren’t a bad team because they aren’t talented, they are a bad team because they misuse players and don’t have a system

That’s not lebrons fault, it’s the coaching staffs fault. Having lebron doesent mean you can’t have a system, in fact lebron being the most versatile player ever and among the smartest ones ever means that if anything it’s easier to build a system incorporating him

The problem is the lakers offense is 99% improvising, and they are asking a bunch of young guys to do it.

There’s this stupid idea that how good a player is = their impact. A guy can be a great offensive player under one circumstance and a horrible one in another without a huge change in role. And at times it’s not obvious.

That being said they are a top 5 defensive team, missing probably two of their top 6 players impact wise, and you can add lebron + another perennial all star to fix their offense next year.

No, it's LeBron's fault, he wants to run the "LeBron system". Walton tried to implement his system, that was more team oriented, but then LeBron said he was about to "crack", and he forced Walton to adjust the system to his majesty. Walton didn't want to end up like David Blatt in Cleveland, so he succumbed to LeBron.

[bondom34]

The Lakers had the 22nd ranked offense in the League last year. What system are you talking about?

I want specifics. You don't get hid behind vague labels . They were one of the worst offensive teams in the league last season.

The Lakers aren’t a bad team because they aren’t talented, they are a bad team because they misuse players and don’t have a system

That’s not lebrons fault, it’s the coaching staffs fault. Having lebron doesent mean you can’t have a system, in fact lebron being the most versatile player ever and among the smartest ones ever means that if anything it’s easier to build a system incorporating him

The problem is the lakers offense is 99% improvising, and they are asking a bunch of young guys to do it.

There’s this stupid idea that how good a player is = their impact. A guy can be a great offensive player under one circumstance and a horrible one in another without a huge change in role. And at times it’s not obvious.

That being said they are a top 5 defensive team, missing probably two of their top 6 players impact wise, and you can add lebron + another perennial all star to fix their offense next year.

No, it's LeBron's fault, he wants to run the "LeBron system". Walton tried to implement his system, that was more team oriented, but then LeBron said he was about to "crack", and he forced Walton to adjust the system to his majesty. Walton didn't want to end up like David Blatt in Cleveland, so he succumbed to LeBron.

Could you then explain why the same players were so bad offensively last year without the "Lebron system"?

[Colbinii]

The Lakers aren’t a bad team because they aren’t talented, they are a bad team because they misuse players and don’t have a system

That’s not lebrons fault, it’s the coaching staffs fault. Having lebron doesent mean you can’t have a system, in fact lebron being the most versatile player ever and among the smartest ones ever means that if anything it’s easier to build a system incorporating him

The problem is the lakers offense is 99% improvising, and they are asking a bunch of young guys to do it.

There’s this stupid idea that how good a player is = their impact. A guy can be a great offensive player under one circumstance and a horrible one in another without a huge change in role. And at times it’s not obvious.

That being said they are a top 5 defensive team, missing probably two of their top 6 players impact wise, and you can add lebron + another perennial all star to fix their offense next year.

No, it's LeBron's fault, he wants to run the "LeBron system". Walton tried to implement his system, that was more team oriented, but then LeBron said he was about to "crack", and he forced Walton to adjust the system to his majesty. Walton didn't want to end up like David Blatt in Cleveland, so he succumbed to LeBron.

Could you then explain why the same players were so bad offensively last year without the "Lebron system"?

LeBron made them regress because he has the capabilities of sucking talent out of his teammates and applying it to himself.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

[The High Cyde]

No, it's LeBron's fault, he wants to run the "LeBron system". Walton tried to implement his system, that was more team oriented, but then LeBron said he was about to "crack", and he forced Walton to adjust the system to his majesty. Walton didn't want to end up like David Blatt in Cleveland, so he succumbed to LeBron.

Could you then explain why the same players were so bad offensively last year without the "Lebron system"?

LeBron made them regress because he has the capabilities of sucking talent out of his teammates and applying it to himself.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

A real Monstar, this LeBron guy

[Colbinii]

Could you then explain why the same players were so bad offensively last year without the "Lebron system"?

LeBron made them regress because he has the capabilities of sucking talent out of his teammates and applying it to himself.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

A real Monstar, this LeBron guy

He is like an anti-Monstar energy drink. Sucks the energy out of his teammates.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

[Ron Swanson]

Like most situations, the answer is somewhere in the middle. Lebron is ultimately gonna be the reason as to how far this team goes, of course, but this idea that he's dragging an '07 Cavs level roster to respectability is just wrong. The Lakers were a 37-win team last year based on point-differential. Walton has had to implement a ton of new guys (McGee, Chandler, Stephenson, Rondo) that aren't good fits with the system he ran last year. It was the most predictable thing in the world that Walton would/is going to end up being the scapegoat here, but the reality is that he got that young team to overachieve last season.

[Cavsfansince84]

Like most situations, the answer is somewhere in the middle. Lebron is ultimately gonna be the reason as to how far this team goes, of course, but this idea that he's dragging an '07 Cavs level roster to respectability is just wrong. The Lakers were a 37-win team last year based on point-differential. Walton has had to implement a ton of new guys (McGee, Chandler, Stephenson, Rondo) that aren't good fits with the system he ran last year. It was the most predictable thing in the world that Walton would/is going to end up being the scapegoat here, but the reality is that he got that young team to overachieve last season.

I don't think you can make the case that the 19 Laker roster is that much better than the 07 Cavs roster. Its just a collection of guys who are generally being over hyped right now mixed with a group of vets who are seen as either journeyman or well past their primes. Does it arguably have more talent? yes. Does talent = ability? no. I don't think it really matters how we look at it because at the end of the day its a Lakers team that might win 48-50 games if LeBron comes back and stays healthy or might win 42 games otherwise. Either way, they need to make a major roster move and/or fa signing next off season in order to really compete. I don't think Walton or his staff are really doing this team any favors either.

[Ainosterhaspie]

The Lakers offense wasn't good last year. To the extent that they had a system, it wasn't accomplishing anything of note. Now that LeBron is injured they have a chance to get back to their system without his interference and they are the worst offense in the league in games he doesn't play.

So they are bad running a system without. Then good with LeBron and no system. Then bad again without LeBron and back to the system. Maybe, just maybe the problem isn't LeBron since there zero evidence of quality offensive potential without him.

It sure looks like either the system sucks since it isn't producing anything, or the players running it suck since they can't do anything with it. Maybe it's both. Either way, it doesn't make much sense to stick with a system that's been nothing but a failure, but maybe that's just me.

In the modern game, youd better have some spacing and three point shooting if you want to succeed offensively. The Lakers are terrible shooters. Teams can collapse their defenses against the Lakers cutting off passing and driving lanes. It's really hard to get a system flowing when teams don't have to worry about closely guarding on the perimeter.

[G35]

Like most situations, the answer is somewhere in the middle. Lebron is ultimately gonna be the reason as to how far this team goes, of course, but this idea that he's dragging an '07 Cavs level roster to respectability is just wrong. The Lakers were a 37-win team last year based on point-differential. Walton has had to implement a ton of new guys (McGee, Chandler, Stephenson, Rondo) that aren't good fits with the system he ran last year. It was the most predictable thing in the world that Walton would/is going to end up being the scapegoat here, but the reality is that he got that young team to overachieve last season.

I don't think you can make the case that the 19 Laker roster is that much better than the 07 Cavs roster. Its just a collection of guys who are generally being over hyped right now mixed with a group of vets who are seen as either journeyman or well past their primes. Does it arguably have more talent? yes. Does talent = ability? no. I don't think it really matters how we look at it because at the end of the day its a Lakers team that might win 48-50 games if LeBron comes back and stays healthy or might win 42 games otherwise. Either way, they need to make a major roster move and/or fa signing next off season in order to really compete. I don't think Walton or his staff are really doing this team any favors either.

I recall threads and posts projecting that any team you add Lebron to instantly becomes a playoff team. That was Lebron's floor...that is what makes him special is that he can take any collection of players and make them a playoff team.

I don't think this Lakers team is as bad as people want to make it out to be...I would say that the Lakers and Kings are even par on talent. The difference is the Kings are going all in with their young talent and letting them learn together while the Lakers are bringing in Lebron and accelerating their learning curve. Perhaps if they had a few year with Lebron it might work out but we know that isn't why Lebron is here. The Lakers FO and Lebron want results yesterday and talent doesn't always develop that way......

[Dupp]

LeBron made them regress because he has the capabilities of sucking talent out of his teammates and applying it to himself.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

A real Monstar, this LeBron guy

He is like an anti-Monstar energy drink. Sucks the energy out of his teammates.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

Lonzo could shoot before Lebron showed up

[Statlanta]

The problem is that the team had a great fit for the most part last year and it allowed Ingram and Ball to learn how to deal with primacy/usage.

Now the team is constructed due to what the Cavs teams lacked with little regard to the fit for the younger players.

Lonzo and Ingram are being left to dry with the roster. Having Rondo, Lance and LeBron take the ball out of their hands and then being forced to be a playoff team with a worse fitting roster, while coming off a lesser primacy role from earlier in the season is just a tall task(especially given that both guys aren't really aggressive "get after it" guys to begin with).

[bondom34]

Last year they weren't any good offensively, they didn't really deal well with that at all. Walton did have them playing good defense though, which he is doing now too. The roster isn't close to 2007 Cavs level bad, it just also doesn't really fit with what works with Lebron, and without him lacks any real semblance of offensive ability. It's pretty crazy Walton has them defending this well even, but Ball and Ingram are quickly losing what stock they had left (especially Ingram).

[Mos_Heat]

Seems like his All-NBA 1st team streak is over.

[BasketballFan7]

A real Monstar, this LeBron guy

He is like an anti-Monstar energy drink. Sucks the energy out of his teammates.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

Lonzo could shoot before Lebron showed up

As bad as Lonzo's shooting is, his EFG% is +4% this season. A similar improvement next year would have him at the league average.

His per-minute/possession scoring is also up.