2019 NBA Offseason Discussion

[Colbinii]

Anyone else keeping up with this Almeda County Sheriffs Office f***ery with Masai? Originally he punched the officer giving him a concussion and causing a hospital visit, then eye witnesses said he just pushed the officer softly after being shoved, then the police said the officer had a bodycam that proved Masai struck him in the face but they couldn't release it for the investigation, now after prodding from some great reporters they're saying the bodycam shut off the second Masai struck the officer.

Yeah I totally believe the bodycam magically cut off the exact second Masai started to strike because as we all know he's the Nigerian Saitama.

There is no coincidence this happened in the white and money filled United States of America.

Decided to fix that right quick.

I dont like classifying as all of America like that because I am American, live in America and surround myself in social groups and platforms where such isnt the case.

[E-Balla]

Anyone else keeping up with this Almeda County Sheriffs Office f***ery with Masai? Originally he punched the officer giving him a concussion and causing a hospital visit, then eye witnesses said he just pushed the officer softly after being shoved, then the police said the officer had a bodycam that proved Masai struck him in the face but they couldn't release it for the investigation, now after prodding from some great reporters they're saying the bodycam shut off the second Masai struck the officer.

Yeah I totally believe the bodycam magically cut off the exact second Masai started to strike because as we all know he's the Nigerian Saitama.

From a Globe and Mail article:

But according to police spokesperson Sergeant Ray Kelly, Ujiri showed his identification "in a very threatening kind of way."

What does that even mean?!

[Not being naive, I know what they're doing. It's just so absurd.]

What color was the hand with the identification in it?

[E-Balla]

There is no coincidence this happened in the white and money filled United States of America.

Decided to fix that right quick.

I dont like classifying as all of America like that because I am American, live in America and surround myself in social groups and platforms where such isnt the case.

And I'm sure some non white not rich people were in the arena. Doesn't really change the makeup of the area as a whole.

[Outside]

Regarding the Houston situation, it seems to me that the extreme analytics-driven style of play created an environment where chemistry and personality clashes could flourish.

Morey and D'Antoni bought fully into the data that showed how effective the iso play could be. That made Harden the singular focus of the offense, and he responded marvelously by putting up incredible individual numbers that led to excellent overall offensive efficiency. Harden honed his game over several seasons to leverage every advantage of that style of play -- the combination of three-point shooting, drives to finish at the rim, driving and kicking to three-point shooters, and driving to set up lobs to Capela. He pushed the envelope on the legality of moves with his foul hunting on threes (the most efficient play in the game), foul hunting on drives, and the four-step step-back that is technically legal because of the gather. Harden honed these skills relentlessly and became a master at all of it, wringing every bit of production and efficiency out of this style of play.

But there are two problems with it. First, it's not as successful in the postseason because refs don't give you the same calls you got in the regular season. It's still really good, but not good enough to overcome the Warriors. Second, it created an environment that accentuated Harden the individual, not the Rockets as a team. As I suppose is natural considering human nature, Harden has become enamored with himself as the star around which the Rockets' world revolves, thinking of teammates as accessories to his greatness and becoming disengaged when he doesn't have the ball.

That has apparently led to a lot of frustration and resentment on everyone's part. Add Chris Paul to this volatile mix, and he becomes a frustration and resentment force multiplier.

You would think, given the injuries to Durant and Thompson, that the Rockets would be perfectly positioned to run it back and get to the finals next season, but instead, it all seems to be falling apart. It will be interesting to see what happens.

[Colbinii]

It's still really good, but not good enough to overcome the Warriors.

I don't think this is necessarily true. The issue with not beating the Warriors was injuries to Chris Paul in 2018 and an even more injury filled season in 2019 forcing Harden to take on an offensive role mirroring 2017 Russell Westbrook.

A Harden who could play even Curry [or my God Kawhi minutes] in the regular season would have increased Houstons chances.

I dont think it led to a lot of resentment on most players; only the other star (CP3). Eric Gordon has already embraced a bench role. Austin Rivers looks happier now than he was playing for his father [and certainly happier than playing for Grunfield]. PJ Tucker averaged his career FGA/G in the 2019 season at the age of 33.

If you get a player in there who is a similar or even lesser player than CP3 but can impact the game in different ways we likely have no issues with Houston.

[dontcalltimeout]

Do folks think there's any chance CP returns closer to his 2018 self with a full offseason of rehab? Or do we think that step is really gone gone?

[Outside]

It's still really good, but not good enough to overcome the Warriors.

I don't think this is necessarily true. The issue with not beating the Warriors was injuries to Chris Paul in 2018 and an even more injury filled season in 2019 forcing Harden to take on an offensive role mirroring 2017 Russell Westbrook.

A Harden who could play even Curry [or my God Kawhi minutes] in the regular season would have increased Houstons chances.

I dont think it led to a lot of resentment on most players; only the other star (CP3). Eric Gordon has already embraced a bench role. Austin Rivers looks happier now than he was playing for his father [and certainly happier than playing for Grunfield]. PJ Tucker averaged his career FGA/G in the 2019 season at the age of 33.

If you get a player in there who is a similar or even lesser player than CP3 but can impact the game in different ways we likely have no issues with Houston.

But the fact remains that they haven't been able to overcome the Warriors. You bring up the injury excuse for last year, but when the tables turned and the Warriors lost Durant this year, the Rockets folded. I don't buy that they lost because Harden was worn down. They had a golden opportunity, and instead of coming together, they fell apart. The underlying issues came to the fore, and it showed on the court.

Even the reasoning that if Harden could've played fewer minutes circles back to running a system so utterly dependent on a singular iso scorer. The whole reason they got Paul was so that they could continue to run the iso system when Harden sat. It became a switch-off thing -- Harden is the iso king when he's in the game, Paul is the iso king when Harden sits. D'Antoni talked about it, being able to have a HOF point guard on the floor at all times. It wasn't about leveraging synergy between the two or running an offense that spread responsibility and opportunity. Adding Paul, they were doubling down on the iso path, and one of the weaknesses of that system is that you are hosed if one of your two iso kings gets hurt. Harden is durable, but Chris Paul isn't.

Denver had a lot more injury issues than Houston, yet they kept going because of their depth and because their offense is more distributed. Houston's system is top-heavy in the extreme by design, so they can't complain if they design a system so dependent on two guys and one of them gets hurt, especially when one has a track record of getting hurt.

[E-Balla]

It's still really good, but not good enough to overcome the Warriors.

I don't think this is necessarily true. The issue with not beating the Warriors was injuries to Chris Paul in 2018 and an even more injury filled season in 2019 forcing Harden to take on an offensive role mirroring 2017 Russell Westbrook.

A Harden who could play even Curry [or my God Kawhi minutes] in the regular season would have increased Houstons chances.

I dont think it led to a lot of resentment on most players; only the other star (CP3). Eric Gordon has already embraced a bench role. Austin Rivers looks happier now than he was playing for his father [and certainly happier than playing for Grunfield]. PJ Tucker averaged his career FGA/G in the 2019 season at the age of 33.

If you get a player in there who is a similar or even lesser player than CP3 but can impact the game in different ways we likely have no issues with Houston.

But the fact remains that they haven't been able to overcome the Warriors. You bring up the injury excuse for last year, but when the tables turned and the Warriors lost Durant this year, the Rockets folded. I don't buy that they lost because Harden was worn down. They had a golden opportunity, and instead of coming together, they fell apart. The underlying issues came to the fore, and it showed on the court.

Even the reasoning that if Harden could've played fewer minutes circles back to running a system so utterly dependent on a singular iso scorer. The whole reason they got Paul was so that they could continue to run the iso system when Harden sat. It became a switch-off thing -- Harden is the iso king when he's in the game, Paul is the iso king when Harden sits. D'Antoni talked about it, being able to have a HOF point guard on the floor at all times. It wasn't about leveraging synergy between the two or running an offense that spread responsibility and opportunity. Adding Paul, they were doubling down on the iso path, and one of the weaknesses of that system is that you are hosed if one of your two iso kings gets hurt. Harden is durable, but Chris Paul isn't.

Denver had a lot more injury issues than Houston, yet they kept going because of their depth and because their offense is more distributed. Houston's system is top-heavy in the extreme by design, so they can't complain if they design a system so dependent on two guys and one of them gets hurt, especially when one has a track record of getting hurt.

Plus no one mentions Iguodala's injury was the only reason Houston wasn't ousted in 5. Houston won games 4 and 5 by 7 combined points, Iguodala makes that difference.

[Texas Chuck]

I find it all pretty simple -- the team has functioned best just letting Harden do Harden things---but that has a limit and Harden hasn't been as effective in the playoffs. Meanwhile Paul is a basketball genius who has been a great player, and almost certainly still sees himself as a very good player and is likely frustrated that he's under-utilized. Mix in egos and competitiveness and a coach and GM who both put all their faith in their systems and forget all about the human element and you are going to have some issues.

I'd put more blame on the ownership/management/coaching than I would on Paul or Harden here. This is an organizational problem coming down from the top. They are geniuses in many ways, but have some clear blind spots that are rearing their heads now and I'm not sure their egos are going to allow them to change any more than Paul or Harden can.

[E-Balla]

I find it all pretty simple -- the team has functioned best just letting Harden do Harden things---but that has a limit and Harden hasn't been as effective in the playoffs. Meanwhile Paul is a basketball genius who has been a great player, and almost certainly still sees himself as a very good player and is likely frustrated that he's under-utilized. Mix in egos and competitiveness and a coach and GM who both put all their faith in their systems and forget all about the human element and you are going to have some issues.

I'd put more blame on the ownership/management/coaching than I would on Paul or Harden here. This is an organizational problem coming down from the top. They are geniuses in many ways, but have some clear blind spots that are rearing their heads now and I'm not sure their egos are going to allow them to change any more than Paul or Harden can.

I will say people have made this criticism for years and were written off but it was obvious it was going to reach this point.

[Texas Chuck]

I will say people have made this criticism for years and were written off but it was obvious it was going to reach this point.

It was written off because James Harden can be that brilliant an offensive player and people love MDA's style going back to SSOS with Nash and of course Morey is maybe the most analytic driven GM in the league which is always going to play great here.

But without Harden or Nash we saw that MDA's system isn't magic. It needs that guy. Now if you have a basketball genius, his system will maximize them without question, but...

[Clyde Frazier]

Read on Twitter

That's a good get for indiana considering they don't have a ton of scoring. Warren is solid when healthy.

Read on Twitter

Don't mind this move for atlanta. If there's someone there at 4 who they think is a relative sure thing, you tend to overpay a bit for that. Meanwhile, the rich keep getting richer in NOLA...

Read on Twitter

I can't keep up!

[MisterHibachi]

Griffin's been an absolute maestro the past week.

[anthony00]

the thunder board is the most depressing board on here

[Dupp]

Griffin's been an absolute maestro the past week.

He’s a great gm and in particular he always wins trades.

[Basileus777]

Houston lost to the Warriors this postseason because of their defense. The Harden led offense did its job just fine.

[anthony00]

Read on Twitter

[Dupp]

Read on Twitter

[anthony00]

Read on Twitter

my exact reaction lol

[The High Cyde]

I think it's a good idea tbh I mean it's not like they have a ton of options here