RealGM

Who was the best player in the 2008 season?

And what is your top 5 or top 10 best players in 2008?

1. Kobe
2. Paul
3. LeBron
4a. Garnett
4b. Duncan

This is the way I see it I guess.

KG
Kobe
LeBron
Duncan

HM: Dirk, Nash, Paul, Manu

or something

Oh boy...this is going to be another Kobe vs KG fan showdown.

1. Kobe
2. Lebron

Was the obvious consensus at the time. Garnett? come on Jaivl, I know you love some Garnett but KG himself called Kobe the best player in the league in a post-game.

2008 was the year where Kobe Lebron became a discussion and to (nearly) everyone at the time, Kobe was 1a and Lebron 1b. I was a Lebron fan, at the time btw. But I did have Kobe at 1, as much as I hated him (Being hyped/called GOAT by many at realgm. It was among the worst I’ve experienced on forums). Funny thing is now that the Kobe (only) fans are gone, I love the guy.

Yeah i’m also not really buying KG as the best player that year. He was the best player on the best team, but not in the league imo. I don’t think people really considered him top 5 the year prior.

I have it:

LeBron
KG
Kobe
Paul
-----
Duncan
Dirk
McGrady

LeBron, Duncan, or Garnett

Lebron
Kobe
Duncan
Paul
Garnett

Lebron

1. KG
2. LeBron
3. CP3
4. Kobe
5. Dirk

KG turned a 24 win team into a 66 win team, won a championship, and had by FAR the best RAPM in the NBA. There was a bigger difference between 1st and 2nd than there was between 2nd and 9th. In the playoffs, the Celtics were +10.3 with him on the floor and -9.5 with him on the bench. It was maybe one of the 5 best defensive seasons in the history of the NBA. He’s a clear #1. Chris Paul’s the toughest to rank as he had insane box score stats in both the RS and playoffs, but still only ranked 26th in RAPM. I’d guess his priors must be screwing with him somewhat as he still had better raw plus/minus numbers than Dirk and Kobe. Think he deserves to at least be top 3.

LeBron’s playoff numbers are deflated by playing the majority of his postseason games against that elite Celtics defense, but he still had a playoff on/off of +24.6 and a legendary 45 point Game 7 to come closer than anyone else to knocking off the eventual champs. Kobe had a very nice season, but he finished awfully, shooting 33.9% from the field the last 3 games against Boston to blow what was a decent opportunity at a winnable title. Dirk probably had a slightly better season than Kobe by the numbers, but I’ll give Kobe the benefit of the doubt for making it out to the Finals while Dirk’s Mavs had a very disappointing result losing to the Hornets in 5. Duncan, Nash, and Manu all could have had cases for the Top 5 of they didn’t each have an awful playoff series win route to getting eliminated.

bledredwine wrote:1. Kobe
2. Lebron

Was the obvious consensus at the time. Garnett? come on Jaivl, I know you love some Garnett but KG himself called Kobe the best player in the league in a post-game.

2008 was the year where Kobe Lebron became a discussion and to (nearly) everyone at the time, Kobe was 1a and Lebron 1b. I was a Lebron fan, at the time btw. But I did have Kobe at 1, as much as I hated him (Being hyped/called GOAT by many at realgm. It was among the worst I’ve experienced on forums). Funny thing is now that the Kobe (only) fans are gone, I love the guy.

No it wasn’t. These were the first place votes for MVP that year:

Kobe 82
Paul 28
KG 15
Bron 1

Furthermore, the main reason that KG didn’t get stronger MVP consideration is that he played less games and minutes during the regular season than the other contenders. If he’d played 82 games instead of 71 and averaged 36 MPG instead of 32.8, there’s a very good chance he would have won the award. Also, Kobe got a lot of “sentimental” votes at the time since he was coming up on 30 and had never won it yet. There was a lot of discussion at the time of it being a career achievement award for Kobe. After KG played every game in the playoffs and won a ring outplaying Kobe head-to-head, there were a lot of people who would have called KG the best player in the game at the time, even before advanced stats came more into vogue which have obviously made people appreciate KG much more than they did during his actual prime.

bledredwine wrote:1. Kobe
2. Lebron

Was the obvious consensus at the time. Garnett? come on Jaivl, I know you love some Garnett but KG himself called Kobe the best player in the league in a post-game.

2008 was the year where Kobe Lebron became a discussion and to (nearly) everyone at the time, Kobe was 1a and Lebron 1b. I was a Lebron fan, at the time btw. But I did have Kobe at 1, as much as I hated him (Being hyped/called GOAT by many at realgm. It was among the worst I’ve experienced on forums). Funny thing is now that the Kobe (only) fans are gone, I love the guy.

A lot of nice narratives.

KG dominated the league in RAPM. That was one of the most dominant defensive seasons ever and he was still great offensively in a smaller role than before because of team structure. Really close to peak KG.

Kobe's RAPM is more comparable to the next group. But I have him on top of that.

I would go:

1. KG
2. Kobe
3. Lebron
4. Dirk
5. Duncan

Jaivl wrote:KG
Kobe
LeBron
Duncan

HM: Dirk, Nash, Paul, Manu

or something

thanks for not feeling lonely for having CP3 out of my top5 that year. I know technically he could be in your top5 but I see you have him grouped with guys I think he is more comparable than the top group that year.

Best player?

1) Kobe
2) Kg
3 Lebron
4) Paul

Best season? I guess swap Paul and lebron. I dunno tough season to judge. Maybe Lebron was better than KG this is just how I felt then. I am pretty confident with those 4 guys though.

Dupp wrote:Best player?

1) Kobe
2) Kg
3 Lebron
4) Paul

Best season? I guess swap Paul and lebron. I dunno tough season to judge. Maybe KG was better than lebron this is just how I felt then. I am pretty confident with those 4 guys though.

How are you differentiating better player vs season here?

1 Kobe
2 Lebron
3 Paul
4 Garnett
5 Howard

Timmyyy wrote:

bledredwine wrote:1. Kobe
2. Lebron

Was the obvious consensus at the time. Garnett? come on Jaivl, I know you love some Garnett but KG himself called Kobe the best player in the league in a post-game.

2008 was the year where Kobe Lebron became a discussion and to (nearly) everyone at the time, Kobe was 1a and Lebron 1b. I was a Lebron fan, at the time btw. But I did have Kobe at 1, as much as I hated him (Being hyped/called GOAT by many at realgm. It was among the worst I’ve experienced on forums). Funny thing is now that the Kobe (only) fans are gone, I love the guy.

A lot of nice narratives.

KG dominated the league in RAPM. That was one of the most dominant defensive seasons ever and he was still great offensively in a smaller role than before because of team structure. Really close to peak KG.

Kobe's RAPM is more comparable to the next group. But I have him on top of that.

I would go:

1. KG
2. Kobe
3. Lebron
4. Dirk
5. Duncan

Jaivl wrote:KG
Kobe
LeBron
Duncan

HM: Dirk, Nash, Paul, Manu

or something

thanks for not feeling lonely for having CP3 out of my top5 that year. I know technically he could be in your top5 but I see you have him grouped with guys I think he is more comparable than the top group that year.

1. If you are resorting to RAPM, then Garnett doesn’t have much of an argument here.

2. One of the best defensive seasons ever and excellent offensively? Who was the Finals MVP that year? By what you say it should have certainly been KG. If Garnett wasn’t even the best player on his team that series (Pierce was, period.) and had enough help that Kobe called Jordan for advice, complaining about the “superteam”, then how could he be the best player that season? And how did Kobe come back and beat that super team the next year, winning finals MVP? You just don’t have much of a case here. If you’re not the best finals performer on your team, you’re not the best.

3. Garnett had 19 points per game to Kobe’s 28. That’s a big difference and once again, Garnett himself called Kobe the best player in the league. It was basically fact back then. It’s strange how we keep trying to rewrite history here.

bledredwine wrote:

Timmyyy wrote:

bledredwine wrote:1. Kobe
2. Lebron

Was the obvious consensus at the time. Garnett? come on Jaivl, I know you love some Garnett but KG himself called Kobe the best player in the league in a post-game.

2008 was the year where Kobe Lebron became a discussion and to (nearly) everyone at the time, Kobe was 1a and Lebron 1b. I was a Lebron fan, at the time btw. But I did have Kobe at 1, as much as I hated him (Being hyped/called GOAT by many at realgm. It was among the worst I’ve experienced on forums). Funny thing is now that the Kobe (only) fans are gone, I love the guy.

A lot of nice narratives.

KG dominated the league in RAPM. That was one of the most dominant defensive seasons ever and he was still great offensively in a smaller role than before because of team structure. Really close to peak KG.

Kobe's RAPM is more comparable to the next group. But I have him on top of that.

I would go:

1. KG
2. Kobe
3. Lebron
4. Dirk
5. Duncan

Jaivl wrote:KG
Kobe
LeBron
Duncan

HM: Dirk, Nash, Paul, Manu

or something

thanks for not feeling lonely for having CP3 out of my top5 that year. I know technically he could be in your top5 but I see you have him grouped with guys I think he is more comparable than the top group that year.

1. If you are resorting to RAPM, then Garnett doesn’t have much of an argument here.

2. One of the best defensive seasons ever and excellent offensively? Who was the Finals MVP that year? By what you say it should have certainly been KG.

3. Garnett had 19 points per game to Kobe’s 28. That’s a big difference and once again, Garnett himself called Kobe the best player in the league. It was basically fact back then. It’s strange how we keep trying to rewrite history here.

For me Kobe was the best player in 2008, but Garnett was easily the best player of the Celtics, although Garnett had not won the final MVP.

bledredwine wrote:

Timmyyy wrote:

bledredwine wrote:1. Kobe
2. Lebron

Was the obvious consensus at the time. Garnett? come on Jaivl, I know you love some Garnett but KG himself called Kobe the best player in the league in a post-game.

2008 was the year where Kobe Lebron became a discussion and to (nearly) everyone at the time, Kobe was 1a and Lebron 1b. I was a Lebron fan, at the time btw. But I did have Kobe at 1, as much as I hated him (Being hyped/called GOAT by many at realgm. It was among the worst I’ve experienced on forums). Funny thing is now that the Kobe (only) fans are gone, I love the guy.

A lot of nice narratives.

KG dominated the league in RAPM. That was one of the most dominant defensive seasons ever and he was still great offensively in a smaller role than before because of team structure. Really close to peak KG.

Kobe's RAPM is more comparable to the next group. But I have him on top of that.

I would go:

1. KG
2. Kobe
3. Lebron
4. Dirk
5. Duncan

Jaivl wrote:KG
Kobe
LeBron
Duncan

HM: Dirk, Nash, Paul, Manu

or something

thanks for not feeling lonely for having CP3 out of my top5 that year. I know technically he could be in your top5 but I see you have him grouped with guys I think he is more comparable than the top group that year.

1. If you are resorting to RAPM, then Garnett doesn’t have much of an argument here.

2. One of the best defensive seasons ever and excellent offensively? Who was the Finals MVP that year? By what you say it should have certainly been KG.

1. I don't know what you mean with that. KG crushes the league in a stat that shows us the impact of an individual on the point differential in a basketball game. That should be a pretty convincing argument on his own.
But hey it is way more interesting what people thought at the time or what KG said in a meaningless interview or that you, the personified basketball knowledge, had Kobe above Lebron back then. I mean don't you see that this stuff has no substance?

2. Ouh sorry, you are right. A narrative driven award was given to another player and not him. I was wrong. You are strictly arguing with narratives...
By the way somehow now we only talk about finals when it is about the whole year. And even in the finals KG might have been the most impactful player because his defense was all time great and while his offense doesn't pop out in the boxscore it was pretty good still.

But hey let's just simplify basketball to PPG or 'he was unstoppable' or 'he wasn't able to win a title without a lot of help'.

Absolutely uninteresting and pointless discussion about narrative driven stuff. I'm out.

Timmyyy wrote:

bledredwine wrote:

Timmyyy wrote:
A lot of nice narratives.

KG dominated the league in RAPM. That was one of the most dominant defensive seasons ever and he was still great offensively in a smaller role than before because of team structure. Really close to peak KG.

Kobe's RAPM is more comparable to the next group. But I have him on top of that.

I would go:

1. KG
2. Kobe
3. Lebron
4. Dirk
5. Duncan



thanks for not feeling lonely for having CP3 out of my top5 that year. I know technically he could be in your top5 but I see you have him grouped with guys I think he is more comparable than the top group that year.

1. If you are resorting to RAPM, then Garnett doesn’t have much of an argument here.

2. One of the best defensive seasons ever and excellent offensively? Who was the Finals MVP that year? By what you say it should have certainly been KG.

1. I don't know what you mean with that. KG crushes the league in a stat that shows us the impact of an individual on the point differential in a basketball game. That should be a pretty convincing argument on his own.
But hey it is way more interesting what people thought at the time or what KG said in a meaningless interview or that you, the personified basketball knowledge, had Kobe above Lebron back then. I mean don't you see that this stuff has no substance?

2. Ouh sorry, you are right. A narrative driven award was given to another player and not him. I was wrong. You are strictly arguing with narratives...
By the way somehow now we only talk about finals when it is about the whole year. And even in the finals KG might have been the most impactful player because his defense was all time great and while his offense doesn't pop out in the boxscore it was pretty good still.

But hey let's just simplify basketball to PPG or 'he was unstoppable' or 'he wasn't able to win a title without a lot of help'.

Absolutely uninteresting and pointless discussion about narrative driven stuff. I'm out.

During Curry's prime year, we were calling him the best player until he was not the best in the finals. This may come as a surprise, but you have to be the best player on your team in the finals to be the best player, period. If not, please name other examples where the best (most dominant) player in the league wasn't the MVP on their team, in the finals. I'll wait.