Peaks project update: #3

Gibson22 · Post #1 » by **Gibson22** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 5:48 pm

1) Michael Jordan 1990-91
2) Lebron James 2012-13

It was a very close race between Lebron and Shaq, with Lebron getting a ton of other points for different seasons (n.3,4,5, and 8 most voted seasons belong to him). We should try to revert back to the 48 hours standard, guys discussion is cool and is actually the whole point of all these projects but you should remember to vote in a reasonable time, 48 hours has always been the standard time window on real gm, and trust me if these things take too long, people won't have free time for months and months.

Now we move on to the second place. Remember, once a player gets elected, you can't vote him no more, so, Michael Jordan and Lebron James are gone, you can't vote MJ 1990, or Lebron 09 etc. and REMEMBER: you can use your 3 ballots to vote for different seasons of the same player more than once, even all 3

The rules

Reasoning/statistical support is required for votes to be counted. A simple list of names will not be counted.
Window time for votings: 48 hours/thread.

THE VOTING SYSTEM:

Everyone gives their 1st-ballot choice, 2nd-ballot choice, and 3rd-ballot choice. I'll award 4,5 pts for a 1st ballot, 3 for a 2nd ballot, and 2 for a 3rd. Highest point-total wins the spot (24-hour run-off will then only be done in the unlikely event of a tie).

Players don't get credit for all the votes they receive in a round, we just count the votes (and the points) for the designated year. At the end of the 48 hours (not sure about that) the season that has most points wins. Other voted seasons of the winning player will get a mention.

So, you can use your 3 choices to vote for more than 1 season of the same player (if you think that the best 3 seasons among the players left belong all to the same player, nothing is stopping you from using all you 3 choices on that player), but you can't continue voting for other seasons of that player once he wins and gets his spot. The final list will be 1 season per player, with a mention of the other seasons of the winning player who received votes.

Spoiler:

Mavericksfan · Post #2 » by **Mavericksfan** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 5:53 pm

Wilt 1967
Shaq 2000
Kareem this is a tough one for me. I’m going to go with 1972.

Kareem was by far the best player on an utterly dominant team(Voted GOAT team by realgm) and posted ridiculous numbers across the board.

The two selected and the 3 I have mentioned here round out my top 5 peaks so things start getting interesting after that.

dontcalltimeout · Post #3 » by **dontcalltimeout** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 6:16 pm

So this next one should be Shaq 2000. His most complete year with the least questions about defense and being mentally bought-in ITO effort.

Other names we should be bringing up are Kareem. House favorite tends to be 1977... but 1972 has a nice story. How do folks see the difference b/w those years? Is there a case for another Kareem yr? 1973 and 1974?

Also, where are folks seeing Hakeem? I agree with those who see 1993 as the best combination of his late 80's/early 90s defensive mobility + activity and his mid-90s skill on offense. Some folks like 1994, but is there a case for that except for the championship winning bias?

Other contenders:
Wilt 1967 - the yr he put it all together.
Garnett 2004 - a truly unicorn level player at his most unicorn-y. Led the 5th best offense and 6th best defense as the MVP on both ends.
Steph. Shaq for the new NBA.
Magic and Bird should be coming up as well.
Duncan 02? Very good defender and post player. amazing ceiling raising reason.
D-Rob gets knocked for an offensive game that's not resilient but ATG-level defense and good offense adds up to a very strong player in 95 and 96.
Bill Russell, depending on how you see his offense. And those early-to-mid 60s years are hard to suss out.

Samurai · Post #4 » by **Samurai** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 6:18 pm

1. Wilt 67 - legendary all-around year. Led the league in rebounds, PER, TS%, Minutes, 2nd in assists and 5th in points/game.
2. Shaq 2000 - led the league in PER, VORP, points/game, 2nd in rebounds, OWS and DWS. But finished only 12th in TS% which draws a distinction from Wilt.
3. Kareem 71 - "Dominant" is a word used a lot but rarely does anyone define it when they declare that X was more dominant than Y. Using Webster's definition as "commanding, controlling or prevailing over all others", the difference between Kareem's league leading PER and WS and the runner-up in each category was far greater - far more dominant - than the differential for either 67 Wilt or 2000 Shaq. Basically Kareem "prevailed over all others" or was more dominant relative to his peers than Wilt or Shaq. But dropping Kareem to 3rd below them due to my perception of the quality of his peers with the ABA diluting some talent from the NBA.

Gregoire · Post #5 » by **Gregoire** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 6:22 pm

Shaq 00
Shaq 01
Hakeem 93

euroleague · Post #6 » by **euroleague** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 6:30 pm

Wilt 62
Wilt 67
Shaq 00

I've explained the reasoning before, and my ballot hasn't really changed

PS: You should learn how to quote people if you want to run this project

Post #7 » by **trex_8063** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 7:00 pm

1st ballot - '00 Shaquille O'Neal - He was just unstoppable down low around this point in his career. Avg 38.1 pts/100 (in 40 mpg) at nearly 58% TS (which was around +6% to league avg for that year, iirc), and that with half or whole team defenses collapsing on him constantly; but it was still too late if he'd already received the ball down low. That Curry-level gravity down low helped others out too (no wonder he had some wicked ORAPM's in '00 and surrounding years).
Combined with that, he had likely the single-best defensive year of his career, anchoring a league-best -5.9 rDRTG; things they were best at are the very things a rim-protecting big can effect most: DREB% (5th of 29) and opp eFG% (1st of 29). Awarded All-Defensive 2nd team and was 2nd [albeit distantly so] in DPOY voting this year (and even that is arguably undercrediting him).

2nd ballot - '67 Wilt Chamberlain - In scaled terms (from my scaled PER and WS/48 studies), this is one of the most statistically dominant seasons ever (both rs and playoffs). I hedge on it a little based on era, but there's no denying that [even with a little pace inflation] 24/24/8 on TS% that would be elite even by today's standards (was hyper-elite in '67) is something that needs attention in the early stages of this project. With him a little more applied defensively (although the Sixers were still only -2.2 rDRTG [3rd in league; they had better years defensively with Wilt]), and focusing on having everyone involved and offensive rhythm (they were a league-best +5.4 rORTG) the Sixers (who had a pretty wicked top 6 players, though little depth beyond that) rolled to a then-best 68 wins and seemingly cruised to a title (even rolling over a very good Celtics dynasty with relative ease).
And though era considerations/concerns exist, there's no [reasonably] denying that Wilt was a remarkable physical specimen [in a generational sense] who could transfer comfortably into any era.

3rd ballot - '77 Kareem Abdul-Jabbar - Was close to giving my third ballot to Wilt also (for '64, as I think that season is very little behind '67 overall), but decided I'm going to spread the love around a bit to another player I think is super-close here. In the aforementioned scaled [PER and WS/48] terms, '77 Kareem comes out looking like potentially the best season ever (with a couple of Wilt's seasons being comparable [or arguably better] once we factor in mpg [as these are rate metrics]). But best ever scaled figures (while avg 36.8 mpg in rs and 42.5 in the playoffs) really puts this version in the mix of things. This version of Kareem is scoring very high volume at near-ridiculous efficiency (especially in the playoffs), despite doing so primarily in post isolations, in an era with crap spacing, playing with limited ancillary scoring threats, and facing double [and triple] teams all night long.
He's still capable of near DPOY-level defense [in spurts, at least] at this stage too, and is one of the better/best big man passers in the league. And he doesn't miss a single game.

E-Balla · Post #8 » by **E-Balla** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 7:03 pm

E-Balla wrote:1. 2000 Shaq - He was #1 last time on my list. Other players have been more well rounded but I feel that if you give everyone a decent supporting cast that fits their play and put them on 30 teams 2000 Shaq comes out on top. He was just unstoppable, at best you fouled him 20 times and prayed he missed 25 FTs. Once you have to sign players to stop him, he enters another realm of dominance. Plus he's still a top 5ish defender that year.

2. 2001 Shaq - Thinking on it more he should've been 2nd on my first ballot. When it comes to "perfect" seasons (seasons in which players were clearly the best player on the floor in almost every game played - let's say 90%) Hakeem, Jordan, Lebron, Wilt, etc. have them and usually I place them over a year like 2001 but on second thought maybe that was wrong. Shaq was half assing it this year. Defensively the Lakers ranked 21st and Shaq's on/off wasn't too hot on that end. There's no getting past that when discussing this season. Beyond that he was still the clear best offensive player in the league leading the Lakers to a +5.4 offense and when needed he became professional and absolutely obliterated teams now that he had another superstar in Kobe Bryant next to him.

At the end of the season Shaq decided to turn it on and averaged 34/13/4 on 63 TS% (122 ORTG) while going 9-1 (their one loss was by 1 point against the Knicks where Shaq had 31 points on 13 shots in 38 minutes while his team had 47 combined points on 30% shooting). Then in the playoffs they turned into the GOAT team next to the 2017 Warriors having a +21 net rating and going 15-1. In their one loss Shaq had 44 points, 20 rebounds (6 offensive), and 5 assists on 17/28 shooting against the DPOY and IMO the GOAT modern era defender. Overall Shaq had 20/10 in all but one of his last 33 games of the season (he had 19/14 against San Antonio in game 2). If 2000 Shaq is the most dominant season ever 2001 once Shaq gave a damn is what that same player would look like on a stacked team like the ones most of these guys we're mentioning outside of Duncan, Shaq, and Hakeem had.

3. 2003 Tim Duncan - He led a good but not great defensive supporting cast and a terrible offensive supporting cast to 60 wins, a +2 offense, and a -4 defense. The team had a +9.1 net rating with him on the floor and a -5.6 net rating without him on the floor. He was the only player with a negative off court rating on the team.

Once the postseason hit Duncan played like he did in 02 again absolutely dominating and having probably the best postseason next to 01 Shaq. Against Phoenix he seemed to focus more on his defense averaging a good but not special 18.7/16.0/5.2 but after that he exploded averaging 26.7/15.2/5.3 the rest of the way on the way to a Finals win. People like to mention Dirk's injury but I want to mention in games 1-3 vs Dirk San Antonio was 2-1 and Duncan was averaging 35/18/6 on 66 TS% (131 ORTG). So maybe they lose if Dirk doesn't get hurt, but they would've had to lose with Duncan still putting up 30+/15+/5+ each night.

I do want to mention it was hard to omit Hakeem. Usually I place him over Duncan mainly because of his head to head matchup domination but his best postseason (95) came on a team with another star player on it while Duncan had a performance on that level all alone. 93 is a good year too but Seattle was able to get the ball out of his hands pretty easily to win. Sure Seattle had an amazing defense but when we're talking about years this great any small issue can drop you out the top 3.

Can someone get JB in here? That possible third place vote to 2013 Lebron or 67 Wilt might've put him over Shaq and I'm ready to bring up my next 2 spots on the list if Shaq clears.

Gibson22 · Post #9 » by **Gibson22** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 7:19 pm

euroleague wrote:Wilt 62
Wilt 67
Shaq 00

I've explained the reasoning before, and my ballot hasn't really changed

PS: You should learn how to quote people if you want to run this project

What? I'm a professional quoter. How dare you! Have you guys got the tag?

Gibson22 · Post #10 » by **Gibson22** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 7:22 pm

E-Balla wrote:
E-Balla wrote:1. 2000 Shaq - He was #1 last time on my list. Other players have been more well rounded but I feel that if you give everyone a decent supporting cast that fits their play and put them on 30 teams 2000 Shaq comes out on top. He was just unstoppable, at best you fouled him 20 times and prayed he missed 25 FTs. Once you have to sign players to stop him, he enters another realm of dominance. Plus he's still a top 5ish defender that year.

2. 2001 Shaq - Thinking on it more he should've been 2nd on my first ballot. When it comes to "perfect" seasons (seasons in which players were clearly the best player on the floor in almost every game played - let's say 90%) Hakeem, Jordan, Lebron, Wilt, etc. have them and usually I place them over a year like 2001 but on second thought maybe that was wrong. Shaq was half assing it this year. Defensively the Lakers ranked 21st and Shaq's on/off wasn't too hot on that end. There's no getting past that when discussing this season. Beyond that he was still the clear best offensive player in the league leading the Lakers to a +5.4 offense and when needed he became professional and absolutely obliterated teams now that he had another superstar in Kobe Bryant next to him.

At the end of the season Shaq decided to turn it on and averaged 34/13/4 on 63 TS% (122 ORTG) while going 9-1 (their one loss was by 1 point against the Knicks where Shaq had 31 points on 13 shots in 38 minutes while his team had 47 combined points on 30% shooting). Then in the playoffs they turned into the GOAT team next to the 2017 Warriors having a +21 net rating and going 15-1. In their one loss Shaq had 44 points, 20 rebounds (6 offensive), and 5 assists on 17/28 shooting against the DPOY and IMO the GOAT modern era defender. Overall Shaq had 20/10 in all but one of his last 33 games of the season (he had 19/14 against San Antonio in game 2). If 2000 Shaq is the most dominant season ever 2001 once Shaq gave a damn is what that same player would look like on a stacked team like the ones most of these guys we're mentioning outside of Duncan, Shaq, and Hakeem had.

3. 2003 Tim Duncan - He led a good but not great defensive supporting cast and a terrible offensive supporting cast to 60 wins, a +2 offense, and a -4 defense. The team had a +9.1 net rating with him on the floor and a -5.6 net rating without him on the floor. He was the only player with a negative off court rating on the team.

Once the postseason hit Duncan played like he did in 02 again absolutely dominating and having probably the best postseason next to 01 Shaq. Against Phoenix he seemed to focus more on his defense averaging a good but not special 18.7/16.0/5.2 but after that he exploded averaging 26.7/15.2/5.3 the rest of the way on the way to a Finals win. People like to mention Dirk's injury but I want to mention in games 1-3 vs Dirk San Antonio was 2-1 and Duncan was averaging 35/18/6 on 66 TS% (131 ORTG). So maybe they lose if Dirk doesn't get hurt, but they would've had to lose with Duncan still putting up 30+/15+/5+ each night.

I do want to mention it was hard to omit Hakeem. Usually I place him over Duncan mainly because of his head to head matchup domination but his best postseason (95) came on a team with another star player on it while Duncan had a performance on that level all alone. 93 is a good year too but Seattle was able to get the ball out of his hands pretty easily to win. Sure Seattle had an amazing defense but when we're talking about years this great any small issue can drop you out the top 3.

Can someone get JB in here? That possible third place vote to 2013 Lebron or 67 Wilt might've put him over Shaq and I'm ready to bring up my next 2 spots on the list if Shaq clears.

What? I didn't count his third vote and Lebron was already above shaq. His third pick couldn't influenze the result

E-Balla · Post #11 » by **E-Balla** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 8:11 pm

lebron3-14-3 wrote:
E-Balla wrote:
E-Balla wrote:1. 2000 Shaq - He was #1 last time on my list. Other players have been more well rounded but I feel that if you give everyone a decent supporting cast that fits their play and put them on 30 teams 2000 Shaq comes out on top. He was just unstoppable, at best you fouled him 20 times and prayed he missed 25 FTs. Once you have to sign players to stop him, he enters another realm of dominance. Plus he's still a top 5ish defender that year.

2. 2001 Shaq - Thinking on it more he should've been 2nd on my first ballot. When it comes to "perfect" seasons (seasons in which players were clearly the best player on the floor in almost every game played - let's say 90%) Hakeem, Jordan, Lebron, Wilt, etc. have them and usually I place them over a year like 2001 but on second thought maybe that was wrong. Shaq was half assing it this year. Defensively the Lakers ranked 21st and Shaq's on/off wasn't too hot on that end. There's no getting past that when discussing this season. Beyond that he was still the clear best offensive player in the league leading the Lakers to a +5.4 offense and when needed he became professional and absolutely obliterated teams now that he had another superstar in Kobe Bryant next to him.

At the end of the season Shaq decided to turn it on and averaged 34/13/4 on 63 TS% (122 ORTG) while going 9-1 (their one loss was by 1 point against the Knicks where Shaq had 31 points on 13 shots in 38 minutes while his team had 47 combined points on 30% shooting). Then in the playoffs they turned into the GOAT team next to the 2017 Warriors having a +21 net rating and going 15-1. In their one loss Shaq had 44 points, 20 rebounds (6 offensive), and 5 assists on 17/28 shooting against the DPOY and IMO the GOAT modern era defender. Overall Shaq had 20/10 in all but one of his last 33 games of the season (he had 19/14 against San Antonio in game 2). If 2000 Shaq is the most dominant season ever 2001 once Shaq gave a damn is what that same player would look like on a stacked team like the ones most of these guys we're mentioning outside of Duncan, Shaq, and Hakeem had.

3. 2003 Tim Duncan - He led a good but not great defensive supporting cast and a terrible offensive supporting cast to 60 wins, a +2 offense, and a -4 defense. The team had a +9.1 net rating with him on the floor and a -5.6 net rating without him on the floor. He was the only player with a negative off court rating on the team.

Once the postseason hit Duncan played like he did in 02 again absolutely dominating and having probably the best postseason next to 01 Shaq. Against Phoenix he seemed to focus more on his defense averaging a good but not special 18.7/16.0/5.2 but after that he exploded averaging 26.7/15.2/5.3 the rest of the way on the way to a Finals win. People like to mention Dirk's injury but I want to mention in games 1-3 vs Dirk San Antonio was 2-1 and Duncan was averaging 35/18/6 on 66 TS% (131 ORTG). So maybe they lose if Dirk doesn't get hurt, but they would've had to lose with Duncan still putting up 30+/15+/5+ each night.

I do want to mention it was hard to omit Hakeem. Usually I place him over Duncan mainly because of his head to head matchup domination but his best postseason (95) came on a team with another star player on it while Duncan had a performance on that level all alone. 93 is a good year too but Seattle was able to get the ball out of his hands pretty easily to win. Sure Seattle had an amazing defense but when we're talking about years this great any small issue can drop you out the top 3.

Can someone get JB in here? That possible third place vote to 2013 Lebron or 67 Wilt might've put him over Shaq and I'm ready to bring up my next 2 spots on the list if Shaq clears.

What? I didn't count his third vote and Lebron was already above shaq. His third pick couldn't influenze the result

Oh my b. The way you said it was like it counted. I was trying to get my 09 LeBron write-up with those Shaq years off the board. :lol:

Leaves a bad taste in my mouth seeing the 6th best LeBron season second here I was gonna try to change some votes to our Lord and savior 09 Bron Bron.

Odinn21 · Post #12 » by **Odinn21** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 8:37 pm

I already withdrew myself from participating but I want to point out some fundamental issue here.

I feel like these 'it's possible to vote for multiple seasons of a single player' and 'different seasons shall be counted as one for a player' things are making this project a bit too ambiguous.

I picked 1999-00 Shaq as the goat season and I'll compare him to LeBron.
LeBron's most similar regular season performance to 1999-00 Shaq is 2008-09. Not so great team in reality, but both made their teams win 65+ games with great SRS values. Both sides were top 5 in ortg and drtg.
In terms of narrative LeBron should've been the unanimous MVP in 2013, just like Shaq in 2000.
Then we come to postseason performances; LeBron's 2013 playoffs performance isn't better than Shaq's 2000 performance. Heck, I don't find LeBron's 2013 playoff run close enough to Shaq's 2000 run. It was 2012 playoffs for LeBron as his best.

( As for LeBron's 2009 playoff run; viewtopic.php?p=77271606#p77271606 )

But then again, LeBron's 2011-12 regular season performance isn't better than Shaq in 1999-00.

The vote result feels like people claimed something like this;
LeBron in 2012-13 regular season + LeBron in 2012 playoffs > Shaq in 1999-00 regular season + Shaq in 2000 playoffs

euroleague · Post #13 » by **euroleague** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 8:46 pm

lebron3-14-3 wrote:
euroleague wrote:Wilt 62
Wilt 67
Shaq 00

I've explained the reasoning before, and my ballot hasn't really changed

PS: You should learn how to quote people if you want to run this project

What? I'm a professional quoter. How dare you! Have you guys got the tag?

I got it

E-Balla · Post #14 » by **E-Balla** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 9:27 pm

Odinn21 wrote:I already withdrew myself from participating but I want to point out some fundamental issue here.

I feel like these 'it's possible to vote for multiple seasons of a single player' and 'different seasons shall be counted as one for a player' things are making this project a bit too ambiguous.

I picked 1999-00 Shaq as the goat season and I'll compare him to LeBron.
LeBron's most similar regular season performance to 1999-00 Shaq is 2008-09. Not so great team in reality, but both made their teams win 65+ games with great SRS values. Both sides were top 5 in ortg and drtg.
In terms of narrative LeBron should've been the unanimous MVP in 2013, just like Shaq in 2000.
Then we come to postseason performances; LeBron's 2013 playoffs performance isn't better than Shaq's 2000 performance. Heck, I don't find LeBron's 2013 playoff run close enough to Shaq's 2000 run. It was 2012 playoffs for LeBron as his best.

( As for LeBron's 2009 playoff run; viewtopic.php?p=77271606#p77271606 )

But then again, LeBron's 2011-12 regular season performance isn't better than Shaq in 1999-00.

The vote result feels like people claimed something like this;
LeBron in 2012-13 regular season + LeBron in 2012 playoffs > Shaq in 1999-00 regular season + Shaq in 2000 playoffs

No posters here have even tried to defend the 2013 LeBron postseason. People have different criteria, for tons of people around here outside of the fact a player got the ring or not postseason performance doesn't factor into their decision at all. Might be more posters than I originally thought, but it's a clear pattern in these discussions so far.

Odinn21 · Post #15 » by **Odinn21** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 10:13 pm

E-Balla wrote:
Odinn21 wrote:I already withdrew myself from participating but I want to point out some fundamental issue here.

I feel like these 'it's possible to vote for multiple seasons of a single player' and 'different seasons shall be counted as one for a player' things are making this project a bit too ambiguous.

I picked 1999-00 Shaq as the goat season and I'll compare him to LeBron.
LeBron's most similar regular season performance to 1999-00 Shaq is 2008-09. Not so great team in reality, but both made their teams win 65+ games with great SRS values. Both sides were top 5 in ortg and drtg.
In terms of narrative LeBron should've been the unanimous MVP in 2013, just like Shaq in 2000.
Then we come to postseason performances; LeBron's 2013 playoffs performance isn't better than Shaq's 2000 performance. Heck, I don't find LeBron's 2013 playoff run close enough to Shaq's 2000 run. It was 2012 playoffs for LeBron as his best.

( As for LeBron's 2009 playoff run; viewtopic.php?p=77271606#p77271606 )

But then again, LeBron's 2011-12 regular season performance isn't better than Shaq in 1999-00.

The vote result feels like people claimed something like this;
LeBron in 2012-13 regular season + LeBron in 2012 playoffs > Shaq in 1999-00 regular season + Shaq in 2000 playoffs

No posters here have even tried to defend the 2013 LeBron postseason. People have different criteria, for tons of people around here outside of the fact a player got the ring or not postseason performance doesn't factor into their decision at all. Might be more posters than I originally thought, but it's a clear pattern in these discussions so far.

I think I misrepresented my thought.
I feel like people tend to consider a combined overlook when they think of peak, rather than overall single season.
What I see is LeBron in 2012-13 rs and Shaq in 1999-00 rs are pretty comparable and close, but Shaq's playoffs performance is the superior one with a considerable margin. Yet LeBron got voted higher. It just doesn't feel and look right to me.

I don't know, English isn't my native language and maybe I'm not doing well enough here to explain myself.

Edit: I checked out the #2 thread and it was more about which version of LeBron rather than LeBron vs. Shaq or Kareem. Maybe that's why I'm having a bit of an issue. The discussion was so different than what it was supposed to be. Maybe I'm a bit judgemental but that's the way I think.

Post #16 » by **trex_8063** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 11:11 pm

Odinn21 wrote:I already withdrew myself from participating but I want to point out some fundamental issue here.

I feel like these 'it's possible to vote for multiple seasons of a single player' and 'different seasons shall be counted as one for a player' things are making this project a bit too ambiguous.

Maybe I'm the one who's misunderstood things, but I don't think the bolded is the case. To my understanding, for example, if '13 Lebron had 42 pts, '12 Lebron had 22 pts, and '00 Shaq had 43 pts (and for the sake of argument, let's say those the only player-seasons of anyone receiving votes), '00 Shaq would win the spot with 43 pts (despite Lebron receiving 64 total pts).

Odinn21 · Post #17 » by **Odinn21** » Fri Jul 5, 2019 11:15 pm

trex_8063 wrote:
Odinn21 wrote:I already withdrew myself from participating but I want to point out some fundamental issue here.

I feel like these 'it's possible to vote for multiple seasons of a single player' and 'different seasons shall be counted as one for a player' things are making this project a bit too ambiguous.

Maybe I'm the one who's misunderstood things, but I don't think the bolded is the case. To my understanding, for example, if '13 Lebron had 42 pts, '12 Lebron had 22 pts, and '00 Shaq had 43 pts (and for the sake of argument, let's say those the only player-seasons of anyone receiving votes), '00 Shaq would win the spot with 43 pts (despite Lebron receiving 64 total pts).

Yeah, you're right. I went back to check the tally in the #2 thread. That's the way. My bad.

_Game7_ · Post #18 » by **_Game7_** » Sat Jul 6, 2019 12:09 am

03 Duncan- Ol'e faithful. Not the best scorer, not the flashiest, he is that old guy that steps on the court in the park and just gives you the business all day. Best intangibles of all-time IMO, oh yea he might also be the best defensive player of all time. All time great rebounder and back in the day his bank shot was as certain as the sun coming up in the mourning. Absolutely dominated in the 03 playoffs, put some respect on his name.

01 Shaq- 2000 is probably his best regular season as he wasn't as lazy, but he was better in the playoffs in 01 IMO, the Lakers didn't skip a beat and obliterated the competition. Either way, these two seasons is when Shaq put the world on notice that we are witnessing a dynasty, spear headed by the most unstoppable force of all time.

77 Kareem- After doing some research, it seems like this is his most dominate season, and he raised his level of play in the playoffs. Also faced some stiff competition. He was the most efficient he had ever been in the regular season, and in the playoffs he absolutely dominated averaging 34.6pts 17.7rbs 4.1ast 3.5blks on 60% from the field. No wonder some people have this guy as the GOAT, geesh.

Post #19 » by **penbeast0** » Sat Jul 6, 2019 3:21 am

62 Russell -- Wilt had the greatest statistical season in NBA history and Russell still contributed more to winning
65 Russell -- I have trouble with which Russell season is the best too

Could go Wilt, Kareem, Shaq, or Curry for next. Hard choice; tempted to cop out and just pick another Russell season at random.

Going with Wilt 67 -- Switched to passing and defense; actually took less shots per minute than any other starter, and it worked. Not the all over the court defender that Russell was but his offense was very effective too, even with limited shots.

ardee · Post #20 » by **ardee** » Sat Jul 6, 2019 11:22 am

E-Balla wrote:
lebron3-14-3 wrote:
E-Balla wrote:
Can someone get JB in here? That possible third place vote to 2013 Lebron or 67 Wilt might've put him over Shaq and I'm ready to bring up my next 2 spots on the list if Shaq clears.

What? I didn't count his third vote and Lebron was already above shaq. His third pick couldn't influenze the result

Oh my b. The way you said it was like it counted. I was trying to get my 09 LeBron write-up with those Shaq years off the board. Leaves a bad taste in my mouth seeing the 6th best LeBron season second here I was gonna try to change some votes to our Lord and savior 09 Bron Bron.

6th? How do you rank the best LeBron years again?