2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs

Moderators: trex_8063, PaulieWal, Quotatious, penbeast0, Doctor MJ, Clyde Frazier

Read the OP

2012 by a landslide
3
8%
2012 by a decent margin
9
25%
2012 by a little
9
25%
Equal
2
6%
2013 by a little
3
8%
2013 by a decent margin
3
8%
2013 by a landslide
0
No votes
By far the most important
3
8%
As Important as the RS
2
6%
Not as important
2
6%
 
Total votes: 36

freethedevil
Veteran
Posts: 2,627
And1: 1,471
Joined: Dec 09, 2018
         

2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#1 » by freethedevil » Wed Aug 7, 2019 7:12 pm

Three questions.


Who had the better playoffs and by how much?


How important are their respective playoffs to an evaluation of their respective seasons?


I can't make multiple polls so I'm gonna ask that you choose one answer for both questions.
No-more-rings
Sixth Man
Posts: 1,885
And1: 766
Joined: Oct 04, 2018

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#2 » by No-more-rings » Thu Aug 8, 2019 3:35 am

People choosing “2013 by a decent margin” got some explaining to do. Lebron’s 2012 was better statistically and had to go through a lot of the east without Bosh. And Lebron’s d was as good as ever in 2012, so I can’t really see him making up ground there either.

It’s important enough for me to take 2012 over 2013, so take that for what it’s worth i guess.
freethedevil
Veteran
Posts: 2,627
And1: 1,471
Joined: Dec 09, 2018
         

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#3 » by freethedevil » Thu Aug 8, 2019 5:09 am

No-more-rings wrote:People choosing “2013 by a decent margin” got some explaining to do. Lebron’s 2012 was better statistically and had to go through a lot of the east without Bosh. And Lebron’s d was as good as ever in 2012, so I can’t really see him making up ground there either.

It’s important enough for me to take 2012 over 2013, so take that for what it’s worth i guess.

Yeah, the results are puzzling tbh.
KTM_2813
Junior
Posts: 382
And1: 309
Joined: Mar 23, 2016
     

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#4 » by KTM_2813 » Thu Aug 8, 2019 12:26 pm

I think that the strongest argument in favor of 2013 LeBron is that the 2013 Spurs were incredible competition. They weren't yet at the heights they would reach in 2014, but they were probably playing above their regular season level, where they were a 58-win team by point differential. Popovich had a good game plan, Kawhi was already a solid wing defender by that point, and also Wade was not quite himself. So even though 2013 LeBron has an inferior statistical portfolio to 2012 LeBron, I totally buy that the insane Finals competition gives 2013 LeBron an edge.

That said, Bosh missed significant time in 2012 and the Thunder were no joke in the Finals. It's not like 2012 LeBron's mammoth statistical run was the result of battling through cupcakes. Ultimately, I can see good arguments either way. I think I lean 2012, but this is a close call to me.
User avatar
E-Balla
RealGM
Posts: 30,154
And1: 18,545
Joined: Dec 19, 2012
Location: The Poster Formerly Known As The Gotham City Pantalones
   

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#5 » by E-Balla » Thu Aug 8, 2019 2:56 pm

No one would've voted for 2013 in this poll 5 years ago. Also you could've give us the ability to put multiple answers in the polls so we could answer both questions.
"The hottest place in Hell is reserved for those who remain neutral in times of great moral conflict." - Martin Luther King
User avatar
Joao Saraiva
RealGM
Posts: 10,624
And1: 3,705
Joined: Feb 09, 2011
   

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#6 » by Joao Saraiva » Thu Aug 8, 2019 4:07 pm

2012 clearly for me.

Great finals comeback from 2011. It was very important for his legacy.

G4 against Indiana and G6 vs Boston were defining moments for his career. Any time he was with his back against the wall he came back strong as hell.

In 13 he had up moments too, but his down games were much worse.
“These guys have been criticized the last few years for not getting to where we’re going, but I’ve always said that the most important thing in sports is to keep trying. Let this be an example of what it means to say it’s never over.” - Jerry Sloan
freethedevil
Veteran
Posts: 2,627
And1: 1,471
Joined: Dec 09, 2018
         

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#7 » by freethedevil » Thu Aug 8, 2019 7:47 pm

E-Balla wrote:No one would've voted for 2013 in this poll 5 years ago. Also you could've give us the ability to put multiple answers in the polls so we could answer both questions.

I did?
User avatar
CodeBreaker
Veteran
Posts: 2,786
And1: 1,956
Joined: Jul 21, 2017
     

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#8 » by CodeBreaker » Tue Aug 13, 2019 2:55 am

2012 LeBron

Image
Image
DatAsh
Junior
Posts: 405
And1: 186
Joined: Sep 25, 2015

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#9 » by DatAsh » Tue Aug 13, 2019 3:16 am

CodeBreaker wrote:2012 LeBron

Image


One of the best games ever played.
JordansBulls
RealGM
Posts: 58,068
And1: 3,976
Joined: Jul 12, 2006
Location: HCA (Homecourt Advantage)

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#10 » by JordansBulls » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:33 am

Tough to say as both versions were down 3-2 with HCA in a series.
Image
"Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships."
- Michael Jordan
freethedevil
Veteran
Posts: 2,627
And1: 1,471
Joined: Dec 09, 2018
         

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#11 » by freethedevil » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:30 am

JordansBulls wrote:Tough to say as both versions were down 3-2 with HCA in a series.

So? :-?
User avatar
CodeBreaker
Veteran
Posts: 2,786
And1: 1,956
Joined: Jul 21, 2017
     

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#12 » by CodeBreaker » Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:41 am

JordansBulls wrote:Tough to say as both versions were down 3-2 with HCA in a series.

Image
Image
freethedevil
Veteran
Posts: 2,627
And1: 1,471
Joined: Dec 09, 2018
         

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#13 » by freethedevil » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:07 am

CodeBreaker wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:Tough to say as both versions were down 3-2 with HCA in a series.

Image

Dude punishers players who make their teams great in the rs. Not worth the effort.
HBK_Kliq_33
Veteran
Posts: 2,831
And1: 1,282
Joined: Jul 05, 2018

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#14 » by HBK_Kliq_33 » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:24 am

freethedevil wrote:
JordansBulls wrote:Tough to say as both versions were down 3-2 with HCA in a series.

So? :-?


Jordansbulls just loves saying "HCA" for some reason.
VoodooPriest
Sophomore
Posts: 178
And1: 112
Joined: Jun 15, 2013

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#15 » by VoodooPriest » Tue Aug 13, 2019 11:25 am

JordansBulls wrote:Tough to say as both versions were down 3-2 with HCA in a series.


SMH at the years you've wasted reposting this. The joke's on you.
JLei
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,179
And1: 2,646
Joined: Aug 25, 2009
 

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#16 » by JLei » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:32 pm

Who had the better playoffs? 2012. He was more effective at his role against that specific set of opponents.

Who was the better player? 2013 by a decent margin.

So much of it is due to role and circumstance and opponents being different. First some of it is scouting. 2012 was the first season he really started playing PF and posting up. Teams were spazzing trying to defend him because he's a unique problem at the 4. They were double teaming when all he really had was a right shoulder fadeaway, letting him slip every screen and get dunks even though he was no threat to pick and pop etc. Second thing I'd say is Wade still being a superstar left Bron with a lot of single coverage. Boston absolutely got raped by Wade in 2011 and sold out to stop him in 2012 leaving Bron to do work. Bron really wasn't a good enough shooter in 2012 to really beat a team by himself like that and it took a super hot performance in game 6 to get by the Celtics.

The Finals was check mate. The Thunder actually had to double team him in the post (He could power dribble into the lane against Harden and Durant who were too small) and their big guys (Perkins) were hot garbage.

Contrast with 2013. He's a much better player but Wade is trash. Teams are super overloading the paint but he's still beating it because he's a better shooter. They aren't spazzing out against him at the 4 even though he's a vastly superior post player at this point (added a drop step and could seal opponents with his lower body strength). He faces a significantly more equipped team to defend him in the Finals. Kawhi (future 2time DPOY) Duncan and Splitter at the rim. Wade is still trash until they drain his knee so they just plain ignore him despite him being on the court for 35 minutes a game (mostly with Lebron).

Results are worse. It makes sense.

Role, teammates, opponent matter. Can't just compare stats and results without taking into account that context.
Modern Era Fantasy Game Champ! :king:
PG: Ricky Rubio 16
SG: Brandon Roy 09
SF: Danny Green 14
PF: Rasheed Wallace 06
C: Shaquille O'Neal 01

G: George Hill 14
F: Anthony Parker 10
C: Amir Johnson 12
freethedevil
Veteran
Posts: 2,627
And1: 1,471
Joined: Dec 09, 2018
         

Re: 2013 Bron vs 2012 Bron Playoffs 

Post#17 » by freethedevil » Wed Aug 14, 2019 12:46 am

JLei wrote:Who had the better playoffs? 2012. He was more effective at his role against that specific set of opponents.

Who was the better player? 2013 by a decent margin.

So much of it is due to role and circumstance and opponents being different. First some of it is scouting.

This is like saying players in the three point shot era are better because they had three point shots. It's not neccesarily wrong, but I'd expect you to apply this consistently.

Return to Player Comparisons