League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria:

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League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#1 » by Ainosterhaspie » Mon Sep 9, 2019 7:04 pm

Starting in 1980, who do you have as the best player each year if you take into account not just the specific year but how the players did in the prior and following year? Basically average out the three years. If you want to give some weight to two years prior and two years after do that to, but please note you're doing that. I'd suggest giving two years out significantly less weight, than one year out.

For injuries/retirement you can drop the missing year from consideration. For example, don't knock 93 MJ because of 94 retirement or knock 87 because he basically missed basically all of his 86.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#2 » by limbo » Mon Sep 9, 2019 7:25 pm

1980: Kareem
1981: Kareem
1982: Moses
1983: Moses
1984: Bird
1985: Bird
1986: Bird
1987: Magic
1988: MJ
1989: MJ
1990: MJ
1991: MJ
1992: MJ
1993: MJ
1994: Hakeem
1995: D-Rob
1996: MJ
1997: MJ
1998: MJ
1999: D-Rob
2000: Shaq
2001: Shaq
2002: Shaq
2003: Duncan
2004: KG
2005: KG
2006: Dirk
2007: Dirk
2008: CP3
2009: LeBron
2010: LeBron
2011: LeBron
2012: LeBron
2013: LeBron
2014: LeBron
2015: Steph
2016: LeBron
2017: LeBron
2018: LeBron
2019: Kawhi
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#3 » by Narigo » Mon Sep 9, 2019 7:38 pm

1980-Kareem
1981-Erving
1982-Moses
1983-Moses
1984-Bird
1985-Bird
1986-Bird
1987-Magic
1988-Jordan
1989-Jordan
1990-Jordan
1991-Jordan
1992-Jordan
1993-Jordan
1994-Hakkem
1995-Shaq
1996-Jordan
1997-Jordan
1998-K.Malone
1999-Shaq
2000-Shaq
2001-Shaq
2002-Duncan
2003-Duncan
2004-Garnett
2005-Garnett
2006-Nowitzki
2007-Duncan
2008-LeBron
2009-LeBron
2010-LeBron
2011-LeBron
2012-LeBron
2013-LeBron
2014-LeBron
2015-Curry
2016-Curry
2017-LeBron
2018-LeBron
2019-Giannis
Narigo's Fantasy Team

PG: Stephen Curry
SG:
SF:
PF: Larry Bird
C:
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#4 » by An Unbiased Fan » Tue Sep 10, 2019 2:59 am

1980-Kareem
1981-Erving
1982-Moses
1983-Moses
1984-Bird
1985-Bird
1986-Bird
1987-Magic
1988-Magic
1989-Magic
1990-Jordan
1991-Jordan
1992-Jordan
1993-Jordan
1994-Hakkem
1995-Hakeem
1996-Jordan
1997-Jordan
1998-K.Malone
1999-Shaq
2000-Shaq
2001-Shaq
2002-Shaq
2003-Duncan
2004-Duncan
2005-Dirk
2006-Kobe
2007-Kobe
2008-Kobe
2009-Kobe
2010-Dwight
2011-LeBron
2012-LeBron
2013-LeBron
2014-LeBron
2015-Curry
2016-Curry
2017-KD
2018-KD
2019-Giannis
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#5 » by freethedevil » Tue Sep 10, 2019 3:24 am

1980 kareem
1981 kareem
1982 Malone
1983 Malone
84-86 Bird
87 Magic
88-93 Jordan
94-95 hakeem
96-98 jordan
99-02 Shaq
03 Duncan
4-6 Garnett
07- Duncan
08- Kobe
09-18 Lebron
19 Curry


# of Years at #1(based on three year stretches):
1. Lebron -> 10
2. Jordan -> 8
3. Shaq -> 4
4. Garnett/Bird -> 3
5. Kareem/Duncan/Hakeem -> 2
6. Kobe/Magic -> 1

Notes:
-> Duncan loses one of his years when he was the best in the league(02) because of shaq's insane proceeding year
-> Garnett loses a year where he was at the top of the league(08) because of his injury next season
-> Jordan almost loses two years at the top(and maybe he should, i would need to relook) because of double reirement
-> Lebron's contestable years, 2011, 2015, and 2017 don't matter because of surrounding seasons
-> Curry gets 2019 by default because giannis and to a lesser extent kawhi didn't do much the proceeding season
-> Jordan's peak **** over hakeem and Lebron's **** over curry for multiple seasons
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#6 » by E-Balla » Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:56 am

So many people saying 81 isn't Moses? For what reason? He was MVP in 82 and in 81 he dragged Houston to the Finals. Even beat Kareem head to head in the playoffs in 81.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#7 » by Ainosterhaspie » Tue Sep 10, 2019 5:37 pm

freethedevil wrote:1980 kareem
1981 kareem
1982 Malone
1983 Malone
84-86 Bird
87 Magic
88-93 Jordan
94-95 hakeem
96-98 jordan
99-02 Shaq
03 Duncan
4-6 Garnett
07- Duncan
08- Kobe
09-18 Lebron
19 Curry


# of Years at #1(based on three year stretches):
1. Lebron -> 10
2. Jordan -> 8
3. Shaq -> 4
4. Garnett/Bird -> 3
5. Kareem/Duncan/Hakeem -> 2
6. Kobe/Magic -> 1

Notes:
-> Duncan loses one of his years when he was the best in the league(02) because of shaq's insane proceeding year
-> Garnett loses a year where he was at the top of the league(08) because of his injury next season
-> Jordan almost loses two years at the top(and maybe he should, i would need to relook) because of double reirement

-> Lebron's contestable years, 2011, 2015, and 2017 don't matter because of surrounding seasons
-> Curry gets 2019 by default because giannis and to a lesser extent kawhi didn't do much the proceeding season
-> Jordan's peak **** over hakeem and Lebron's **** over curry for multiple seasons


I did say in OP you can ignore injury/retirement years. Was thinking specifically about MJ86, 94 and 95, but Garnett 09 fits as well. The basic idea is to smooth out really good or bad years that might be a bit fluky. Injury/retirement doesn't say much about the players growth or sustained level of play, so I figure ignore that as much as possible.

Thanks for adding some notes instead of just putting up a list.
My GOATs 1.LBJ/2.Jordan/3.KAJ/4.Duncan/5.Magic
Russell and Wilt grandfathered in at 6 and 7.

Yes I watched Jordan live, started paying attention to basketball in the bad boys era.

I respect Jordan way more now than I did when he played.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#8 » by Odinn21 » Tue Sep 10, 2019 6:43 pm

1980; Kareem
1981; Erving
1982; Moses
1983; Moses
1984; Bird
1985; Bird
1986; Bird
1987; Bird
1988; Jordan
1989; Jordan
1990; Jordan
1991; Jordan
1992; Jordan
1993; Jordan
1994; Hakeem
1995; Hakeem
1996; Jordan
1997; Jordan
1998; Jordan
1999; Duncan
2000; Shaq
2001; Shaq
2002; Duncan
2003; Duncan
2004; Garnett
2005; Duncan
2006; Kobe
2007; Duncan
2008; Kobe
2009; LeBron
2010; LeBron
2011; LeBron
2012; LeBron
2013; LeBron
2014; LeBron
2015; LeBron
2016; LeBron
2017; LeBron
2018; LeBron
2019; Giannis

The most debatable ones; 1987, 1993, 1999, 2002, 2006, 2009 and 2019.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#9 » by eminence » Tue Sep 10, 2019 9:14 pm

My picks.

80: KAJ
81: Bird
82: Moses
83: Moses
84: Bird
85: Bird
86: Bird
87: Magic
88: Magic
89: Magic
90: MJ
91: MJ
92: MJ
93: MJ
94: Hakeem
95: Hakeem
96: MJ
97: MJ
98: MJ
99: Duncan
00: Shaq
01: Shaq
02: Duncan
03: Duncan
04: KG
05: Duncan
06: Duncan
07: Duncan
08: KG
09: LeBron
10: LeBron
11: LeBron
12: LeBron
13: LeBron
14: LeBron
15: LeBron
16: LeBron
17: LeBron
18: Harden

Duncan being helped most by the injury qualifier was a surprise to me, but that's how I see it.

Total:
LeBron - 9
MJ - 7
Duncan - 6
Bird - 4
Magic - 3
Moses/Hakeem/Shaq/KG - 2
KAJ/Harden - 1
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#10 » by freethedevil » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:13 pm

Ainosterhaspie wrote:
freethedevil wrote:1980 kareem
1981 kareem
1982 Malone
1983 Malone
84-86 Bird
87 Magic
88-93 Jordan
94-95 hakeem
96-98 jordan
99-02 Shaq
03 Duncan
4-6 Garnett
07- Duncan
08- Garnett
09-18 Lebron
19 Curry


# of Years at #1(based on three year stretches):
1. Lebron -> 10
2. Jordan -> 8
3. Shaq -> 4
4. Garnett/Bird -> 3
5. Kareem/Duncan/Hakeem -> 2
6. Kobe/Magic -> 1

Notes:
-> Duncan loses one of his years when he was the best in the league(02) because of shaq's insane proceeding year
-> Garnett loses a year where he was at the top of the league(08) because of his injury next season
-> Jordan almost loses two years at the top(and maybe he should, i would need to relook) because of double reirement

-> Lebron's contestable years, 2011, 2015, and 2017 don't matter because of surrounding seasons
-> Curry gets 2019 by default because giannis and to a lesser extent kawhi didn't do much the proceeding season
-> Jordan's peak **** over hakeem and Lebron's **** over curry for multiple seasons


I did say in OP you can ignore injury/retirement years. Was thinking specifically about MJ86, 94 and 95, but Garnett 09 fits as well. The basic idea is to smooth out really good or bad years that might be a bit fluky. Injury/retirement doesn't say much about the players growth or sustained level of play, so I figure ignore that as much as possible.

Thanks for adding some notes instead of just putting up a list.

Fixed accordingly. :)
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#11 » by Ainosterhaspie » Tue Sep 10, 2019 11:58 pm

freethedevil wrote:
Ainosterhaspie wrote:
freethedevil wrote:1980 kareem
1981 kareem
1982 Malone
1983 Malone
84-86 Bird
87 Magic
88-93 Jordan
94-95 hakeem
96-98 jordan
99-02 Shaq
03 Duncan
4-6 Garnett
07- Duncan
08- Garnett
09-18 Lebron
19 Curry


# of Years at #1(based on three year stretches):
1. Lebron -> 10
2. Jordan -> 8
3. Shaq -> 4
4. Garnett/Bird -> 3
5. Kareem/Duncan/Hakeem -> 2
6. Kobe/Magic -> 1

Notes:
-> Duncan loses one of his years when he was the best in the league(02) because of shaq's insane proceeding year
-> Garnett loses a year where he was at the top of the league(08) because of his injury next season
-> Jordan almost loses two years at the top(and maybe he should, i would need to relook) because of double reirement

-> Lebron's contestable years, 2011, 2015, and 2017 don't matter because of surrounding seasons
-> Curry gets 2019 by default because giannis and to a lesser extent kawhi didn't do much the proceeding season
-> Jordan's peak **** over hakeem and Lebron's **** over curry for multiple seasons


I did say in OP you can ignore injury/retirement years. Was thinking specifically about MJ86, 94 and 95, but Garnett 09 fits as well. The basic idea is to smooth out really good or bad years that might be a bit fluky. Injury/retirement doesn't say much about the players growth or sustained level of play, so I figure ignore that as much as possible.

Thanks for adding some notes instead of just putting up a list.

Fixed accordingly. :)

Poor Kobe
My GOATs 1.LBJ/2.Jordan/3.KAJ/4.Duncan/5.Magic
Russell and Wilt grandfathered in at 6 and 7.

Yes I watched Jordan live, started paying attention to basketball in the bad boys era.

I respect Jordan way more now than I did when he played.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#12 » by parapooper » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:27 am

Ainosterhaspie wrote:
freethedevil wrote:
Ainosterhaspie wrote:
I did say in OP you can ignore injury/retirement years. Was thinking specifically about MJ86, 94 and 95, but Garnett 09 fits as well. The basic idea is to smooth out really good or bad years that might be a bit fluky. Injury/retirement doesn't say much about the players growth or sustained level of play, so I figure ignore that as much as possible.

Thanks for adding some notes instead of just putting up a list.

Fixed accordingly. :)

Poor Kobe


Both Kobe and Garnett are pretty strange choices over LeBron for 2008 +/-1:
From 2007 to 2009 the rankings of these guys in VORP, BPM, WS, WS/48, PER and playoff VORP, BPM, WS, WS/48, PER are:
1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,1,1 ------ average distance from #1 rank: 0.1
4,7,4,9,6,2,6,2,6,5 ------ average distance from #1 rank: 4.1
8,6,9,8,9,11,7,11,7,10 -- average distance from #1 rank: 7.6
Sure, you don't need to prioritize some small statistical advantage over other things but here we are talking about one guy being #1 in basically everything vs. 2 guys barely averaging top5/8 respectively
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#13 » by DatAsh » Wed Sep 11, 2019 2:53 am

parapooper wrote:
Ainosterhaspie wrote:
freethedevil wrote:Fixed accordingly. :)

Poor Kobe


Both Kobe and Garnett are pretty strange choices over LeBron for 2008 +/-1:
From 2007 to 2009 the rankings of these guys in VORP, BPM, WS, WS/48, PER and playoff VORP, BPM, WS, WS/48, PER are:
1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,1,1 ------ average distance from #1 rank: 0.1
4,7,4,9,6,2,6,2,6,5 ------ average distance from #1 rank: 4.1
8,6,9,8,9,11,7,11,7,10 -- average distance from #1 rank: 7.6
Sure, you don't need to prioritize some small statistical advantage over other things but here we are talking about one guy being #1 in basically everything vs. 2 guys barely averaging top5/8 respectively


How do they rank in impact metrics?
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#14 » by eminence » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:05 am

'Everything' is basically all the same thing there.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#15 » by freethedevil » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:14 am

Ainosterhaspie wrote:
freethedevil wrote:
Ainosterhaspie wrote:
I did say in OP you can ignore injury/retirement years. Was thinking specifically about MJ86, 94 and 95, but Garnett 09 fits as well. The basic idea is to smooth out really good or bad years that might be a bit fluky. Injury/retirement doesn't say much about the players growth or sustained level of play, so I figure ignore that as much as possible.

Thanks for adding some notes instead of just putting up a list.

Fixed accordingly. :)

Poor Kobe

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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#16 » by parapooper » Wed Sep 11, 2019 3:48 am

DatAsh wrote:
parapooper wrote:
Ainosterhaspie wrote:Poor Kobe


Both Kobe and Garnett are pretty strange choices over LeBron for 2008 +/-1:
From 2007 to 2009 the rankings of these guys in VORP, BPM, WS, WS/48, PER and playoff VORP, BPM, WS, WS/48, PER are:
1,1,1,2,1,1,1,1,1,1 ------ average distance from #1 rank: 0.1
4,7,4,9,6,2,6,2,6,5 ------ average distance from #1 rank: 4.1
8,6,9,8,9,11,7,11,7,10 -- average distance from #1 rank: 7.6
Sure, you don't need to prioritize some small statistical advantage over other things but here we are talking about one guy being #1 in basically everything vs. 2 guys barely averaging top5/8 respectively


How do they rank in impact metrics?


Wish those were as easy to check using bbref.
I'd say they would be closer since LeBron wasn't #1 until 09 and I think Garnett was in 08 - and 08/09 were Kobe's impact peak years reaching the top 5 if I recall correctly. But Garnett has way less minutes and you'd need a clear reversal to make up for the above numbers.

Edit - PIPM wins added, 07-09:
69.5
51.6
42.9
Can't figure out ranks for that
Garnett is so low because of injury in 09. To be fair all 3 are basically tied in 08 (Garnett ahead slightly and probably more per minute) but OP wanted to include surrounding years, moving average style
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#17 » by eminence » Wed Sep 11, 2019 4:09 am

Looking at ElGee's scaled PI RAPM sheet, top 10 in cumulative over that period, with ranks by year included.

1. LBJ 25.3 - 2nd, 5th, 1st
2. KG 25.0 - 4th, 1st, 2nd
3. Duncan 21.4 - 1st, 4th, 15th
4. Nash 20.4 - 5th, 3rd, 8th
5. Kobe 20.1 - 8th, 6th, 5th
6. Manu 18.9 - 3rd, 2nd, 36th
7. Dirk 18.4 - 6th, 7th, 13th
8. Wade 16.2 - 9th, 31st, 4th
9. Pierce 15.5 - 15th, 8th, 18th
10. Bosh 15.4 - 19th, 9th, 12th

LBJ/KG kind of the clear class by impact metrics (aren't they always, lol). Not weighting injury and '08 being the actual year in question I like KG. LBJ is the clear next choice in my mind though.
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Re: League's Best Player 1980-2019 With This Criteria: 

Post#18 » by Blazers-1977 » Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:10 am

Ok so I am going to use generally this criteria: 50% the season at hand, and 25% each for the season before and after.

1980-1981: Kareem
1982-1983: Moses
1984-1986: Bird
1987-1988: Magic
1989-1992: Jordan
1993-1994: Hakeem
1995: Shaq
1996-1997: Jordan
1998-1999: Malone
2000-2002: Shaq
2003: Duncan
2004: Garnett
2005: Duncan
2006: Dirk
2007-2008: Kobe
2009-2017: LeBron
2018-2019: Durant



Years where it differs from the actual best player:

1981: Erving
1988: Magic
1993: Jordan
1995: Hakeem
1999: Duncan
2005: Shaq
2006: Kobe
Maybe 2007: Dirk, Kobe and Nash are all tied this year
2011: Dirk
2014: Durant
2015: Curry
2019: Giannis

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