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Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Thu Dec 5, 2019 2:28 am
by Doctor MJ
lavta wrote:limbo wrote:
I get it, LeBron was Luka's idol,
As a sidenote, this isn't even the case really. Doncic's idol is Spanoulis whose stepback and jersey number he copied. Then he goes to the draft and gets asked "who's your favourite player" and he says "Vassilis Spanoulis" and the NBA media looks at him confused and he says "LeBron in the NBA". Then on he just says LeBron. Maybe Duffy advised him as well.
This happened to Giannis as well, there was an interview in which he was asked his favourite player and he says Diamantidis and then he's never asked lol.
NBA marketing only and solely happens through players and there's this narrative tool they use where they make sure people know every great player's favourite player. "Remember Kobe? He was great. Now Harden, Durant, Westbrook are great who idolised him". Kobe gone through the same stuff as him idolising Jordan. Also Doncic is the first great player that they can point to as an idoliser of LeBron so it's an important marketing benchmark. We will see this with Steph soon, they already tried with Trae Young somewhat. But whenever an elite off the dribble shooting point guard who they can actually point to as an idoliser of Steph, just wait for all the marketing you see now with Doncic-LeBron with whoever-Steph when that time comes.
I dislike this stuff as well but such narrative tools and many others are the stuff NBA builds its marketing with. Gotta accept that it won't end soon.
Interesting. Good thoughts.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Thu Dec 5, 2019 4:08 am
by GSP
The Mavs bench continues to be incredible. Luka had one of his handful of bad games of the season and it didnt matter at all
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Thu Dec 5, 2019 4:09 am
by Heej
GSP wrote:The Mavs bench continues to be incredible. Luka had one of his handful of bad games of the season and it didnt matter at all
Rick Carlisle is the KD of his coaching generation lol.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Thu Dec 5, 2019 6:47 am
by GSP
Heej wrote:GSP wrote:The Mavs bench continues to be incredible. Luka had one of his handful of bad games of the season and it didnt matter at all
Rick Carlisle is the KD of his coaching generation lol.
If only Porzingis wasnt the Bargnani with elite rim protection of this gen
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:09 am
by NaturalThunder
41 points, 12 rebounds, and 11 assists on 70% TS tonight.
There are three instances in NBA history of players under the age of 21 with a 40 point triple-double. Doncic has two of them. Oh, and he was a +29 tonight in an 11 point win.
The kid is a top 3-5 MVP candidate in his age 20-21 season. We're witnessing one of the greatest 2nd seasons in NBA history.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:35 am
by Dupp
NaturalThunder wrote:41 points, 12 rebounds, and 11 assists on 70% TS tonight.
There are three instances in NBA history of players under the age of 21 with a 40 point triple-double. Doncic has two of them. Oh, and he was a +29 tonight in an 11 point win.
The kid is a top 3-5 MVP candidate in his age 20-21 season. We're witnessing one of the greatest 2nd seasons in NBA history.
Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:30 pm
by leolozon
Dupp wrote:NaturalThunder wrote:41 points, 12 rebounds, and 11 assists on 70% TS tonight.
There are three instances in NBA history of players under the age of 21 with a 40 point triple-double. Doncic has two of them. Oh, and he was a +29 tonight in an 11 point win.
The kid is a top 3-5 MVP candidate in his age 20-21 season. We're witnessing one of the greatest 2nd seasons in NBA history.
Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.
Yeah, he has to be 2nd considering the Mavs over-under was 40.5 before the season started. They're on 58-win pace right now (3rd in SRS, a lot of close games they could have won). Best offense in the league. And that's with Porzingis being pretty bad offensively.
Right now, he should be considered like one of the most deserving guy who won't win MVP, only because Giannis is having a historical season on an awesome team.
Dallas does have a tough schedule ahead : Heat, Bucks, Celts, 76s, Raps... 5 of the best 8 teams in the league in a row (let's say 10 with the Mavs and Rockets). They also have a back-to-back against the Lakers. I'll be happy if they go 4-5 to finish 2019.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 3:47 pm
by Colbinii
Dupp wrote:NaturalThunder wrote:41 points, 12 rebounds, and 11 assists on 70% TS tonight.
There are three instances in NBA history of players under the age of 21 with a 40 point triple-double. Doncic has two of them. Oh, and he was a +29 tonight in an 11 point win.
The kid is a top 3-5 MVP candidate in his age 20-21 season. We're witnessing one of the greatest 2nd seasons in NBA history.
Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.
I can see Harden having a strong argument. Can't see him below 2nd is a premature and not fair to Harden.
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Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:05 pm
by Dundalis
Colbinii wrote:Dupp wrote:NaturalThunder wrote:41 points, 12 rebounds, and 11 assists on 70% TS tonight.
There are three instances in NBA history of players under the age of 21 with a 40 point triple-double. Doncic has two of them. Oh, and he was a +29 tonight in an 11 point win.
The kid is a top 3-5 MVP candidate in his age 20-21 season. We're witnessing one of the greatest 2nd seasons in NBA history.
Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.
I can see Harden having a strong argument. Can't see him below 2nd is a premature and not fair to Harden.
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Why exactly? Luka is basically scoring just as efficiently, not as much volume, but also creating more for others. And all of a sudden people are trying to argue that Luka has a great supporting cast to excuse their winning so they can give less credit to Luka. The fact is, the Rockets were considered a sure fire playoff team, and one that would contend for HC advantage, which they are doing. Most people had the Mavs not making the playoffs, or at best being in contention for the 8 seed when the Warriors fell off. You can't just rewrite the script after the fact and decide that all of a sudden Luka has a really good supporting cast. Not saying you are, but that seems to be the rhetoric used by some.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 4:53 pm
by limbo
League Offensive Rating:
1. Dallas - 118.1
.
.
.
2. Houston - 114.4
COMO ESTAIS, GUEY
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:01 pm
by Colbinii
limbo wrote:League Offensive Rating:
1. Dallas - 118.1
.
.
.
2. Houston - 114.4
COMO ESTAIS, GUEY
The Russell Westbrook effect.
Houston w/ Westbrook: 111.3
Houston w/o Westbrook: 123.4
Or, perhaps it is the fact that the Mavericks WITHOUT Luka have a better offensive rating than every other team in the NBA at 115.2.
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Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:02 pm
by Colbinii
Dundalis wrote:Colbinii wrote:Dupp wrote:
Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.
I can see Harden having a strong argument. Can't see him below 2nd is a premature and not fair to Harden.
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Why exactly? Luka is basically scoring just as efficiently, not as much volume, but also creating more for others. And all of a sudden people are trying to argue that Luka has a great supporting cast to excuse their winning so they can give less credit to Luka. The fact is, the Rockets were considered a sure fire playoff team, and one that would contend for HC advantage, which they are doing. Most people had the Mavs not making the playoffs, or at best being in contention for the 8 seed when the Warriors fell off. You can't just rewrite the script after the fact and decide that all of a sudden Luka has a really good supporting cast. Not saying you are, but that seems to be the rhetoric used by some.
I mean why can't you rewrite the script?
Are we not allowed to admit we were wrong?
Most people underestimated just how good the Mavericks bench would be, myself included. We have seen the bench be by far the best bench in the NBA for 25 games now.
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Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:06 pm
by Dr Spaceman
Colbinii wrote:limbo wrote:League Offensive Rating:
1. Dallas - 118.1
.
.
.
2. Houston - 114.4
COMO ESTAIS, GUEY
The Russell Westbrook effect.
Houston w/ Westbrook: 111.3
Houston w/o Westbrook: 123.4
Or, perhaps it is the fact that the Mavericks WITHOUT Luka have a better offensive rating than every other team in the NBA at 115.2.
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Holy crap. Is this from nba.com?
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:08 pm
by Bidofo
What are they being fed in Dallas? It’s insane how good they are on offense, and it’s not even like they’re sacrificing everything on defense like the Wizards, about league average on that end. Reminds me of the 06 team.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:08 pm
by Colbinii
Dr Spaceman wrote:Colbinii wrote:limbo wrote:League Offensive Rating:
1. Dallas - 118.1
.
.
.
2. Houston - 114.4
COMO ESTAIS, GUEY
The Russell Westbrook effect.
Houston w/ Westbrook: 111.3
Houston w/o Westbrook: 123.4
Or, perhaps it is the fact that the Mavericks WITHOUT Luka have a better offensive rating than every other team in the NBA at 115.2.
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Holy crap. Is this from nba.com?
BBR
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Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:15 pm
by limbo
Colbinii wrote:Or, perhaps it is the fact that the Mavericks WITHOUT Luka have a better offensive rating than every other team in the NBA at 115.2.
Not Luka's problem.
Harden had 8 seasons to work with Houston's FO to build a competitive team around how he wants to play basketball and when it finally started to work he threw a hissy fit and approved to trade his best teammate (who is still playing very good) for Westbrook... It's not like Westbrook suddenly unexpectedly fell off a cliff. Dude has been playing like a steaming pile of dung for more than 2 seasons now.
Luka needed one offseason to turn Dallas from a bottom feeder to a contender and didn't need to flop his way into doing so. Dude revitalized the franchise with his energy and playstyle.
Harden's ship for winning titles, at least as the clear cut best player of a team, has sailed... Luka is the new Harden. In fact, Luka is better than Harden ever was at 20 years old.
I rest my case.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:24 pm
by Colbinii
limbo wrote:Colbinii wrote:Or, perhaps it is the fact that the Mavericks WITHOUT Luka have a better offensive rating than every other team in the NBA at 115.2.
Not Luka's problem.
Harden had 8 seasons to work with Houston's FO to build a competitive team around how he wants to play basketball and when it finally started to work he threw a hissy fit and approved to trade his best teammate (who is still playing very good) for Westbrook... It's not like Westbrook suddenly unexpectedly fell off a cliff. Dude has been playing like a steaming pile of dung for more than 2 seasons now.
Luka needed one offseason to turn Dallas from a bottom feeder to a contender and didn't need to flop his way into doing so. Dude revitalized the franchise with his energy and playstyle.
Harden's ship for winning titles, at least as the clear cut best player of a team, has sailed... Luka is the new Harden. In fact, Luka is better than Harden ever was at 20 years old.
I rest my case.
You made no case.
None of what you said has anything to do with MVP or how they are currently playing on the court.
Luka is tremendous this year, putting together an all-time season for a 20/21 year old and is a strong MVP candidate.
It's just asinine, unfair and stupid to say "He is clearly top 2" when Harden is statistically very similar and beats out Doncic in impact metrics.
I'm not saying Harden should be above Doncic, I'm saying he has a good argument to be above Doncic. Again, at this time I probably side with Doncic but to say they aren't in the same tier is a poor, biased take.
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Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:36 pm
by limbo
People now calling THJ, Seth Curry, Powell elite offensive players lmao. After a lot of these guys were getting passed around the league like a Sunday night in Amsterdam.
Stop it. I won't say Luka made these guys, but it's obvious he is the reason this team's ceiling and floor can operate at this level.
Thing is, Luka plays a way more engaging brand of basketball than Harden. When he dumps the ball to someone else, he's looking to cut, curl around screens, receive the ball on the go, call for two more screens etc. Akin to Curry, he's usually looking how he can make himself be a threat on offense with or without the ball.
Harden-ball is slow dog walk to the perimeter, pounding the basketball and then either calling for a screen or dancing for a pull up stepback.
I agree that Dallas has a better supporting cast than Houston, but i think people are underrating a chemistry aspect a guy like Luka brings on and off the court. Not to be on some contagious positive energy woo woo stuff, but i can imagine playing with Harden, watching him dance and shoot 15 threes and 20 FT's while you just spot up behind the arc can be a bit soul sucking.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 5:39 pm
by limbo
20-year old Luka is better now than any version of Harden.
Print this statement and frame it on your wall. I'll go to my grave with it.
Re: The 2019-20 Luka Dončić Thread
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 6:25 pm
by Dupp
Colbinii wrote:Dupp wrote:NaturalThunder wrote:41 points, 12 rebounds, and 11 assists on 70% TS tonight.
There are three instances in NBA history of players under the age of 21 with a 40 point triple-double. Doncic has two of them. Oh, and he was a +29 tonight in an 11 point win.
The kid is a top 3-5 MVP candidate in his age 20-21 season. We're witnessing one of the greatest 2nd seasons in NBA history.
Honestly can’t see him lower than 2nd in mvp right now.
I can see Harden having a strong argument. Can't see him below 2nd is a premature and not fair to Harden.
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I’d probably put harden 4th behind lebron if i were to guess how the voters would vote. Rockets team record is not great and people are probably not as surprised or amazed with hardens insane output as before because he’s been doing it for a while now.