I'm rewatching 2016-2018 finals...

[No-more-rings]

I want to live in a world where 25/11/8 is mediocre, Jesus. That would be a defining achievement in most other superstars’ career.

Lebron isn’t most superstars, he’s judged by goat standards. So you tell me if 25/8 on 53.5 ts% with 5.8 tov per game is even good offense. He redeemed himself and it was a great story and great for his legacy, but full disclosure i can only imagine what would’ve been said if that 3-1 lead doesn’t get blown or if a couple bounces go the other way. He won, so the narrative is strongly in his favor, if he would’ve lost the anti-Lebron guys would’ve had a field day. Fair or unfair that’s what it is.

So we now judge LeBron differently than anyone, even Jordan?

Sounds totally fair.

And you wonder why people are defensive of LeBron.

Sent from my SM-G960U using RealGM mobile app

This isn’t really a constructive retort imo, but i’ll respond anyway.

I’ll just say this. If people are going to call it the “clear goat series” meaning no debate to the contrary, i think i can offer some reasoning to think it may not be.

[Cavsfansince84]

SMH.

What isn’t clear to you about my point? I’m talking about how the view of a performance can be heavily skewed by narratives and winning or losing. People don’t consider that enough within the context of a series. You can’t use narrative to boost up a series but ignore what the backlash would’ve been if he lost.

I could just as easily smh here. That's the whole reason why finals performances are given so much weight in the first place. That's exactly why LeBron's 2016 series is given so much weight. Because he did come back from 3-1 while under the pressure to try and win a title in Cleveland. Just as he felt similar pressure in 2012 and came out with huge games each time his team needed them. Context matters any time you discuss an all time great level series imo. Which does include to some degree whether it was in a winning or losing effort.

[Bidofo]

If the standard is GOAT (finals) series, then mediocre is exactly what I would call LeBron’s game 4. Simplifying it to a simple slash line is a bit disingenuous, especially when he was a turnover machine that game.

[Dr Positivity]

Thanks Dr. Positivity for the recap. You bring up a good and very underrated point: Kerr’s inflexibility on offense really hurt the Warriors in this series. Defenders were able to rough up Curry off the ball all playoffs long and Kerr should’ve seen how that wore him down. Yet, he still played Curry in a predominantly off-ball role making it tough for him to even catch the ball, let alone get in a rhythm.

They nearly lost to OKC because of that and eventually did lose to the Cavs because of that. I get that Kerr believes that Steph’s off-ball gravity opens up opportunities for others but at some point you have to get the ball to your best offensive player. Of course, Curry also deserves blame for not being as assertive as he could’ve been.

Definitely seems like they didn't have a plan B to their very complex off the ball offense.

While it's unclear how much Curry was hurting, I think GSW offense before Durant is just not the all time great it played like in the regular season. Like a lot of fast paced teams (including 2015 Warriors who made up for it by beating MEM and CLE with defense) it is harder to do in the playoffs. Once GSW was pushed into a total halfcourt game (I believe there was a graphic in G7 that they had no transition points at halftime) some of it is just them beating themselves at that point with non-perfect talent. They play a lot of centers with Perkins level offense which is almost a dead strategy these days, and their SF and PF offense is not worldbeating. Curry and Klay are great but also overlap, compared to a combination like Curry and a great slasher. I don't think the Warriors were a Nash Suns level offense with the best defense in the league, they were something worse than Suns level offensive talent, but still pretty good, and with the most defensive talent. The talent of 2015 team on defense (Iggy, Draymond, Bogut all being among the best defenders of their era) is not going to show up as much in the numbers as a team like the Grindhouse Grizzlies who played a total defense style, but was possibly higher. So it is also to Cavs credit as well they were able to score enough to win against an elite defensive core of its era, and were more talented on offense than they looked at times in the finals as GSW was able to eliminate one of their biggest advantages against a team like Toronto of having Love and Frye bombing 3s beside Lebron and creating impossible spacing situation.

Another factor I thought of in the last few days for why the Cavs were able to play such good transition defense, is with TT and Love being the best offensive rebounding frontcourt in the league, and TT in particular going HAM, it likely forced GSW to have to stay back and rebound instead of leaking out.

[Dr Spaceman]

Thanks Dr. Positivity for the recap. You bring up a good and very underrated point: Kerr’s inflexibility on offense really hurt the Warriors in this series. Defenders were able to rough up Curry off the ball all playoffs long and Kerr should’ve seen how that wore him down. Yet, he still played Curry in a predominantly off-ball role making it tough for him to even catch the ball, let alone get in a rhythm.

They nearly lost to OKC because of that and eventually did lose to the Cavs because of that. I get that Kerr believes that Steph’s off-ball gravity opens up opportunities for others but at some point you have to get the ball to your best offensive player. Of course, Curry also deserves blame for not being as assertive as he could’ve been.

Definitely seems like they didn't have a plan B to their very complex off the ball offense.

While it's unclear how much Curry was hurting, I think GSW offense before Durant is just not the all time great it played like in the regular season. Like a lot of fast paced teams (including 2015 Warriors who made up for it by beating MEM and CLE with defense) it is harder to do in the playoffs. Once GSW was pushed into a total halfcourt game (I believe there was a graphic in G7 that they had no transition points at halftime) some of it is just them beating themselves at that point with non-perfect talent. They play a lot of centers with Perkins level offense which is almost a dead strategy these days, and their SF and PF offense is not worldbeating. Curry and Klay are great but also overlap, compared to a combination like Curry and a great slasher. I don't think the Warriors were a Nash Suns level offense with the best defense in the league, they were something worse than Suns level offensive talent, but still pretty good, and with the most defensive talent. The talent of 2015 team on defense (Iggy, Draymond, Bogut all being among the best defenders of their era) is not going to show up as much in the numbers as a team like the Grindhouse Grizzlies who played a total defense style, but was possibly higher. So it is also to Cavs credit as well they were able to score enough to win against an elite defensive core of its era, and were more talented on offense than they looked at times in the finals as GSW was able to eliminate one of their biggest advantages against a team like Toronto of having Love and Frye bombing 3s beside Lebron and creating impossible spacing situation.

Another factor I thought of in the last few days for why the Cavs were able to play such good transition defense, is with TT and Love being the best offensive rebounding frontcourt in the league, and TT in particular going HAM, it likely forced GSW to have to stay back and rebound instead of leaking out.

Yeah this is my take as well. If you look at GSW offensive performance against MEM, CLE (x2), OKC, they’re generally a +2 offense. That’s very good but not all-time tier.

Their half court offense just wasn’t that great. In 2018 they had a better overall offense than Houston, but Houston was clearly better in the half court and playing a style that prevented transition opportunities slowed them down significantly.

[andyhop]

Another factor I thought of in the last few days for why the Cavs were able to play such good transition defense, is with TT and Love being the best offensive rebounding frontcourt in the league, and TT in particular going HAM, it likely forced GSW to have to stay back and rebound instead of leaking out.

I was reading something a few days ago about a college team who tracked their offensive rebounding attempts against their defensive numbers and they found that the more players their team had going for the rebound the better the defense was.

A high school coach heard about it and did the same finding similar results.

Found it again:
http://team.fastmodelsports.com/2019/04/18/crash-glass-offensive-rebounding/

[Dr Positivity]

Game 1 2017 Finals

Cavaliers 91 @ Warriors 113
June 1st, 2017

Lebron 28 pts (9-20), 15 reb, 8 ast, 2 blk, 8 TOV
Kyrie 24 pts (10-22), 2 ast, 4 TOV

Love 15 pts (4-13), 21 reb, 3 blk

Durant 38 pts (14-26), 9 reb, 8 ast
Curry 28 pts (11-22), 10 ast, 3 stl
Klay 6 pts (3-16)
Draymond 9 pts (3-12), 1 reb, 2 stl, 1 blk

Watch on YouTube

The Warriors looked much faster physically and mentally than the end of the last series. It helps energy wise to go 12-0 in the playoffs to that point instead of a brutal 7 game series in the WCF. It also helps that 28 year old Durant is one of the most athletic wings in the league. He makes their end to end speed much faster than Barnes, whether it’s racing ahead in transition, or taking the ball up the floor himself to either score or pass to someone. This really remedied their issues getting their transition game going in the last series as they thrived in that area this game. The version of Durant in this game could not fit better with how the Warriors play. He dropped 38 while almost never having an iso play ran for him by getting easy dunks, open 3s, or quickly shaking off a defender for a jumpshot in the flow of the offense. He also got 8 assists which is even more impressive considering he wasn't holding the ball a lot, and played solid defense. Curry was also great especially hitting 3s in the 3rd quarter when they blew the game open and getting the crowd into it, and had a good passing game as well. Klay’s offense was bad but he was really able to concentrate on defense and started off the game a menace on that end. Draymond had a great defensive game and got better near the end scoring. Zaza was an effective large person. The Warriors played a fantastic defensive game, better than the Cavs final 91 pts showed as as it was a high paced game. The Cavs had been hanging in it but the start of the 3rd quarter the Warriors put on a defensive clinic as the Cavs didn't score for the first 4 minutes and then were out of it after that. This Cavs team is better on offense than the year before so to shut them down so thoroughly is doubly impressive. The Cavs turnovers killed them throughout the game as it also led to Warriors offense. Lebron scored 28 points but had 8 TOVs, and did not look that scary overall in my opinion, getting some points early at the FT line but otherwise the Warriors defensive gameplan really worked on him and made him look old and tired. Kyrie was decent. Love had a pretty good game hitting 3s and grabbing 21 boards. After his huge impact the season before, the Khloe effect was apparent on Tristan as he was a complete ghost, and Deron is pretty much the definition of cooked. The Cavs started the game with some major defensive lapses giving open dunks to Warriors, and their transition D failed most of the game. Even though this wasn’t a close game, it was an entertaining and electric performance by the Warriors as they were playing at a high speed, hitting 3s, Curry was doing his post shot reactions, etc. It was their frontrunner side in full force.

MVP of the games

Game 1: Durant

[Dr Positivity]

Game 2

Cavaliers 113 @ Warriors 132
June 4th, 2017

Watch on YouTube

Lebron 29 pts (12-18), 14 ast, 11 reb, 3 stl
Kyrie 19 pts (8-23)
Love 27 pts (12-23)

Durant 33 pts (13-22) 13 reb, 6 ast, 5 blk, 3 stl
Curry 32 pts (7-17), 11 ast, 10 reb 8 TOV
Klay 22 pts (8-12)

Despite giving up 40 points in the first quarter the Cavaliers defense looked a lot better to start this game as they weren’t getting gashed on transition anymore, and were forcing Warriors turnovers. Curry got to the line like 10 times in the first quarter mostly on bad fouls though which made it look worse than it was. Other than the Curry fouls the Cavs played well and the he lead was only 3 points for the Warriors at the half as Cleveland was in a good place and looked confident they could win on the road, and compared to the game before the crowd wasn’t as much of a frenzy. Lebron was phenomenal in the first half driving to the basket and playmaking, and Love was going off. The Cavs experimented with benching Tristan and playing Frye or playing small and had some success. However in the second half Lebron suddenly looked as exhausted as he ever gets, and it became clear that trying to outgun the Warriors with smaller lineup and Lebron having to carry them on both ends was a hard strategy to keep up all game. Lue went back to Thompson for a lot of the second half considering their success beforehand going smaller, but their offense is not as effective with him creating less spacing and a tired Lebron. The Warriors defense looked better in the 3rd quarter, they stopped turning the ball over as much, got a few more transition points, and took off and never looked back.

The Warriors got big performances from their stars in this game. Curry got a lot of gifted points at the line in the 1st and was turning it over, however in the 3rd which was the most important quarter in this game he was brilliant scoring or assisting on most plays and controlling the game, and finished the game with a strong 32 point triple double. Durant had a killer defensive game with 5 blocks and 3 steals and other affected plays, and had an easy looking 32 points in the flow of the offense and helping hit the type of broken play shots to avoid droughts the Warriors were missing the year before. In the 4th he really took over and stuck the knife in Cleveland, including a memorable Durant Curry back to back 3 sequence. He also had some solid playmaking once again. The unsung hero however was Klay who not only had a very good offensive game with 22 points on 8-12, but played killer defense on Irving who was awful the whole night. It’s clear that getting Durant helped Klay focus his energy on defense more as he really looks fantastic on that end in this series so far after getting lit up by Irving the previous finals. Curry, Durant, Klay made 4 3s each which is going to be a hard recipe to beat Golden State. Draymond got three 3s as well, and did his usual effective defense, although had some foul issues. The Warriors made a lot of shots in this game while despite the Cavs playing Frye more, you never felt like they were raining 3s at will. This was a game with a lot of stars playing well as Lebron, Love, Durant, Curry, Klay had various forms of fastballs. Unfortunately for the Cavs the Warriors had 3/5 of those players, and probably 4/5 of the highest impact games. For player of the you could make a case for Lebron in a loss, Curry despite his turnovers arguably had the biggest offensive impact on the Warriors, and even Klay’s two way impact has a strong argument as Irving's bad shooting was key to this win. However Durant both made a lot of big plays on defense, and had strong offense with 33 pts, 6 asts and some daggers in the 4th, to give him arguably the highest two way impact on the Warriors, even if Klay had the most important defensive game and Curry offensive game. Lebron was best in the first half but he faded more as he went along while Durant was consistent.

MVPs of the game:
Game 1 - Durant
Game 2 - Durant

[Ainosterhaspie]

It was clear to me in that series that LeBron could only muster 2 quarters of top level play. He either had to coast in the first half to save himself for the second, or burn hard in the first half and hope they could coast across the line. He was incapable of putting together a full game. Age was clearly showing.

[Dr Positivity]

Game 3
June 7th, 2017

Warriors 118 @ Cavaliers 113

Watch on YouTube

Durant 31 pts (10-18), 9 reb, 4 ast
Klay 30 pts (11-18, 6-11 3pt)
Curry 26 pts (8-19) 13 reb, 6 ast, 2 stl
Draymond 5 pts, 8 reb, 7 assists

Lebron 39 pts (15-27), 11 reb, 9 ast
Kyrie 38 pts (16-29), 6 reb, 3 ast
Love 9 pts (1-9), 13 reb, 6 stl
JR 16 pts (5-10 3pt)

The Cavs this season were a team with great offense but not as good defense as the year before, and this game sort of personified that. They looked good on offense even without their 3s really falling that great (27%) and much like Game 5 the year before Lebron and Kyrie were spectacular trying to turn the series around with 39 and 38 points, however they were not able to play good enough defense to get the win. This game had more of a feel of a shootout where the Warriors were just keeping up with their scoring until the end and then stole it. The quarter that really killed the Cavs on that end was the 1st when they gave up 39 points to trail by 7 despite Lebron scoring 16 pts in that quarter. This compared to the Cavs home wins in 2016 and 2017 where they jumped out to big leads. The Cavs had a strategy to load up on defense against Curry and Durant but as a result Klay had 14 pts in the first seven minutes or so, and Draymond’s passing was fantastic finding the players that were open as a result of trapping Curry. Golden State hit 9 3s overall in the 1st quarter. The Cavs played better defense after that and in the 3rd quarter Kyrie put on one of the greatest finishing clinics by a guard probably ever to help gain them the momentum. In the 4th quarter it felt like the Cavs game all the way until about the last two minutes of the game as they had the home momentum on their side and were always getting the shot or little play they needed to keep it a 6-7 point lead. They were up 6 with 2 and a half minutes left followed by a JR 3 missing and a Love layup missing either which may have iced it and made it potentially a different series if they still won Game 4. Then after a Curry score (poor transition D by Cavs) ironically a Kyrie finish just rims out. Then the game slowed down due to fouls and turnovers which took the air out of the arena, and the Warriors went on a 11-0 run including Durant sticking the knife in with a dead ball 2 pt score and his iconic 3. Durant overall had some important moments throughout the game where the Warriors really needed a guy to just score over someone to put a few points on the board. This was another game where all three of the Warriors offensive stars were terrific. Despite getting lit up by Kyrie, Klay had a second straight game where he was up there for most important Warrior as he dropped 30 and did well in minutes without Curry and Durant. Kerr was able to rest Curry and Durant more than Lebron, which allowed them to close it out. Curry got 13 rebounds and did a good job creating some transition plays and had a low turnover game for him, and Durant of course came up big at the end. Curry, Klay, Durant combined for for 15 of the Warriors 16 3s. On the Cavs side despite some energy with 13 rebounds and randomly 6 steals, Love was the weak link for all-stars in this game, going only 1-9 and 1-7 from 3. It becomes a numbers game for the Cavs when the Warriors have 3 guys playing at a really high level and they have 2, and that’s before considering Draymond impact. The Warriors bench outplayed the Cavs as West and McGee are both solid big men in addition to Livingston and Iguodala. 2017 Deron may be the worst finals rotation player of the decade.

MVPs of the game:

Game 1 - Durant
Game 2 - Durant
Game 3 - Lebron (Durant for Warriors)

Game 4
June 9th, 2017

Warriors 116 @ Cavaliers 137

Durant 35 pts (9-22), 4 reb, 4 ast, 2 blk
Curry 14 pts (4-13), 10 ast
Klay 13 pts (4-11)
Draymond 16 pts (6-16), 14 reb, 4 ast, 2 stl, 1 blk

Lebron 31 pts (11-22), 11 ast, 10 reb
Kyrie 40 pts (15-27), 7 reb, 4 ast
Love 23 pts (7-14, 6-8 3p), 5 reb
JR 15 pts (5-9 3pt)
Thompson 5 pts, 10 reb

Watch on YouTube

This could have been a really annoying, meaningless game to sit through. Fortunately, despite the stakes it manages to be one of the most entertaining and wild Cavs and Warriors finals games, and the cult classic game of their rivalry. Or at least it felt that way with the ability to skip through the endless reviews. The Cavs score 86 points in the first half and finish with 137 (that could’ve easily been 150 considering they missed a bunch of FTs and went cold in the 4th) and score 24 3s overall. In front of a hammered WWE-esque Cavs crowd the animosity between the teams seems the highest of the last two finals with flagrant and tangle ups the whole game, a weird Draymond/Kerr situation leading to a Drayomnd sucks chant, a Zaza nut shot, a fan gets ejected, etc. After Klay did a great job guarding Kyrie the first two games he got his ass lit up both games in Cleveland as Kyrie went for 40 points on 7 3s, and Lebron had a 31 point triple double. Love also bounced back with a good game. Tristan Thompson’s first quarter performance was huge, showing how much they missed his offensive rebounding in this series. On the Warriors side Durant carried them most of the night as hung around a 15 point deficit most of the night, Draymond had his most active game and Curry’s Finals MVP case died a slow death. It is too bad the Cavs didn’t win game 3 by having a better 3pt night or a better Love night, they outplayed Golden State in Cleveland overall and if they had this performance to tie it 2-2 it would’ve been pretty epic and guaranteed a lit Cleveland crowd in Game 6, although the Warriors were inevitably winning the series one way or the other.

MVPs of the game:

Game 1 - Durant
Game 2 - Durant
Game 3 - Lebron (Durant for Warriors)
Game 4 - Lebron

[Dr Positivity]

Well people were talking about Lebron and Durant in 2017 in the other thread, so I thought I'd bump this

Game 5
Cavaliers 120 @ Warriors 129

June 12th, 2017

Watch on YouTube

Lebron 41 pts (19-30), 13 reb, 8 ast, 2 stl, 1 blk
Kyrie 26 pts (9-22), 6 ast
JR 25 pts (7-8 3pt)
Love 6 pts (2-8)
Tristan Thompson 15 pts (6-8), 8 reb

Curry 34 pts (10-20), 10 ast, 3 stl
Durant 39 pts (14-20), 6 reb, 5 ast
Klay 11 pts (4-13), 5 reb
Iguodala 20 pts (9-14)

The Cavs came out pretty well in this game and scored 37 pts in the first quarter to lead by 4, and could have led by more if not for some bad fouls once again and turning the ball over in a ref filled first. They lead by 8 in the 2nd and then GSW goes on a 21-2 run that has to rank among one of their franchise’s best. They dominate on defense and that also helps their offense. Even though they lead by 17 and the game looks over, Cleveland fights valiantly and gets back in it and cut it to only a 5 point deficit going into the 3rd. However Curry and Durant make the big shots in the 4th to ice it.

Durant and Curry have arguably their best games of the finals at the same time. It gets lost because of how good Durant was every game, but this is a strong contender for THE playoff game for him considering the numbers in a title winning game. By the last few minutes of the game he has 39 points on 14-18 shooting before missing his last two meaningless shots which is a shame cause 39 on 14-18 would've been a bit more legendary. He especially comes out at the start of the 4th quarter with the eye of the tiger to really put the Cavs away. Curry drove the ball well to get 34 points and continued his excellent assist series with 10, and he hits a memorably Curry-esque 3 as the last Warriors score of the game. Kerr whipped out the Curry and Durant pick and roll to help finish the Cavs off. Klay defended Irving well as he did in every Warriors home game (most of Kyrie’s points in this game were when he was in foul trouble), and especially shut him down in the 4th. Draymond was active setting good screens, causing defensive havoc and passing. Iguodala dropped in 20 points as a sentimental good game. The Warriors depth was overall solid in this game as West who helped start the Warriors big run and Livingston, and with both teams having foul issues a much needed advantage. Lebron and Kyrie were great again but Love had a poor game. JR had a 7-8 3P game that would’ve been legendary if the Cavs had stolen it. Tristan Thompson showed up and had a good game again.

MVPs of the game:
Game 1 - Durant
Game 2 - Durant
Game 3 - Lebron (Durant for Warriors)
Game 4 - Lebron
Game 5 - Durant

Series stats
Durant 35.2 pts, 8.2 reb, 5.4 ast, 1.6 blk, 1.0 stl, 47.4% 3pt, .698 TS%
Curry 26.8 pts, 8.0 reb, 9.4 ast, 2.2 stl, 38.8% 3pt, .619 TS%
Klay 16.4 pts, 2.2 ast, 42.5% 3pt, .561 TS%
Draymond 10.2 pts, 4.8 ast, 1.6 stl, 0.6 blk, .449 TS%

Lebron 33.6 pts, 12.0 reb, 10.0 ast, 1.4 stl, 38.7% 3pt, .387 3P%, .630 TS%
Kyrie 29.4 pts, 4.4 ast, 4.0 reb, 41.9% 3pt, .558 TS%
Love 16.0 pts, 11.2 reb, 38.7% 3pt, .528 TS%

Key quarters for Golden State:

Game 1, quarter 3 (GSW 33 CLE 20)
Game 2, quarter 3 (GSW 35 CLE 24)
Game 3, quarter 4 (GSW 29 CLE 19)
Game 5, quarter 2 (GSW 38 CLE 23)
Game 5, quarter 4 (GSW 31, CLE 27)

Overall series thoughts:

- Durant did not outplay Lebron. Durant was great but Lebron had a killer series with 33.6 pts, 12.0 reb and 10 ast, and he did it with less help and against a way better defense. In my MVP of the game rankings I had it 3-2 Durant, but I thought about giving Lebron game 2 at the time despite losing by 19. Durant had the better scoring series, but Lebron is a better playmaker and controls the game more than Durant. I would call it a toss-up. Durant however was the Warriors final MVP when you consider that he was great every single game, this is probably one of the most consistent finals for a star ever. His worst games were games 3 and 4 when he still went for over 30 and hit the game winner in the first game and in the second game has a less efficient 35 but it is the game he has the biggest margin over Curry and Klay. I did not feel like the Cavs were so loaded up on Curry that Durant just got free points every time. Durant made it look super easy and didn't take a hard shot all series, but some of that is being Durant and the difficulty of guarding a 7 foot guard.

- The Warriors have better depth than the Cavs and their depth plays better together, which is ok in 2016 when Lebron and Kyrie can outplay Curry and Klay, but with Durant the Warriors star power was going to be level with Cavs at worst so the Cavs really couldn’t get away with most of their bench being non factors and Frye being taken out of the series. Korver only shot 31% from 3 and hit 5 3s for the series which hurt them, although he was working hard on defense.

- The Warriors just seemed like they had more energy than the 2016 series with Curry being more fresh on offense and Klay more on defense. They were not as worn out by the long record breaking season as the year before clearly, and Kerr could rest them more than Lue could rest Lebron and Kyrie.

- I don’t think this was an overpowered series, just one where one team is enough better than the other to close it out in 5. I think a series like 2014 Spurs and Heat or 2004 Lakers and Pistons is more of a beatdown than this for example. The Cavs after the first two games acquit themselves pretty well. They blow a 6 point lead with 2 minutes left in Game 3, blow the Warriors out in Game 4 and make them work for it in Game 5. The Cavs deserved a 2-2 split after the first four games, at the end of the day the Warriors would've still won the series, but if you play the series a bunch of times it goes 6 or 7 quite a few of them.

[LordGrim]

@dr positivity

Great analysis overall but one important point...zebras were definitely favoring Cavs in games 3 and 4, Warriors shot lights out from 3 in game 3 to beat the fix but refs doubled down in game 4 and the majority of the 1st quarter fouls against Curry Klay Iggy Green were bs at best.

[Baski]

Nice Breakdown Dr. Positivity. Pretty much how I felt as I watched the series in real time. Game 1 had me applauding Curry's impact due to all the open layups and dunks he was creating for his teammates, but from then it began to look more and more like the Durant was the MVP and the Cavs played **** defense. The retroactive cries that Curry was unfairly robbed because of one poor game are only underrating Durant's performance. It was a stupid stupid decision to try to outgun the warriors as some 2016-esque defense from the Cavs could have made the series way more competitive than it ended up being.
I've hated Thompson since that series for what a bum he turned into. He was clearly the most disappointing player on the Cavs. Love was Love so complaining about him was par for the course at that point.

Looking forward to the 2018 breakdown, or should I say just game 1 and game 3, since the other 2 were barely memorable.

[Dr Positivity]

Nice Breakdown Dr. Positivity. Pretty much how I felt as I watched the series in real time. Game 1 had me applauding Curry's impact due to all the open layups and dunks he was creating for his teammates, but from then it began to look more and more like the Durant was the MVP and the Cavs played **** defense. The retroactive cries that Curry was unfairly robbed because of one poor game are only underrating Durant's performance. It was a stupid stupid decision to try to outgun the warriors as some 2016-esque defense from the Cavs could have made the series way more competitive than it ended up being.
I've hated Thompson since that series for what a bum he turned into. He was clearly the most disappointing player on the Cavs. Love was Love so complaining about him was par for the course at that point.

Looking forward to the 2018 breakdown, or should I say just game 1 and game 3, since the other 2 were barely memorable.

I’m doing Rockets Warriors next, have already seen the first 2 games

[Dr Positivity]

Rockets Warriors 2018 WCF

Game 1

Warriors 119 @ Rockets 106
May 14th, 2018

Watch on YouTube

Durant 37 pts (14-27)
Green 5 pts, 9 reb, 2 stl, 2 blk
Curry 18 pts (8-15), 8 ast, 2 stl

Harden 41 pts (14-24), 7 ast, 4 reb
Paul 23 pts (8-17), 11 reb, 3 ast
Gordon 15 pts (6-13, 6-9 3P)

The Rockets came out well and jumped to a 12-4 lead with Harden making plays, before Durant kills them the rest of the quarter and Warriors bench helps them lead in the 2nd. Harden has a great end to the 2nd to tie the game, then Warriors come up big led by defense in the 3rd again to stretch the lead to 14, before the Rockets role players make a run. Harden comes back and plays well but the Rockets never feel like a serious threat to overtake the Warriors as they march towards a game 1 road win.

The series starts out with a lot of intensity and dislike between the teams with Draymond chirping leading the way. The Warriors look a lot more like a regular basketball team in terms of being led by stars that create their own shot in the halfcourt than the previous year, but they still play a damn good game based on the talent, team play, effort and defense. It feels like Durant takes more contested shots in the 1st half of this game than he did the whole 2017 finals, however his talent hitting difficult shots is on full display. He has a few cold periods, but in the 1st and 3rd quarter especially he assassinates the Rockets with his size and shot making ability. Klay is hitting big shots and at the right times. Curry has the smallest offensive stats of the three but is driving and making threes happen, and Draymond and Iguodala both have excellent little things games. The Warriors bench got the team going with solid creating by Livingston, passing by West and Young hitting some 3s.

Like Durant, Harden’s ability to hit difficult shots from 3 is shown. In the 2nd and 3rd quarter he has one of the most glorious displays of ballhoggery I’ve ever seen, even by his standards. It feels like a full quarter worth of gametime is played where Harden is the only one touching the ball, unsurprisingly 20 something points in a row were scored by unassisted by him. It was like a high school team where the star player is much better than everyone. While it was working for that time, I think he got tired after that as most of the last quarter and a half or so he wasn’t quite the same, even with D’Antoni giving him a long rest. He also had quite a few lapses on defense. Paul looked really good earlier in the game when Harden was briefly injured and it’s clearly an advantage to always have one one, however a lot of the game he is a passenger, especially when Harden plays. I do not see much chemistry between them. They did not use Paul much as a spot up shooter. You could tell the Rockets were going to have some depth problems later in the series when it took one quarter for Ryno to play.

Overall this really came off as a “team play beats one on one ball” game, the Warriors simply had more passing and more all star level players all of whom can contribute in their own way. It was an enjoyable game as it was played at a high intensity, has low turnovers and for the Rockets standards the fouls were not a problem.

MVP of the game: Durant (close between him and Harden, but Durant plays better defense and freezes out his team less to make up for worse efficiency)

Game 2

Warriors 105 @ Rockets 127
May 16th, 2018

Watch on YouTube

Durant 38 pts (13-22), 0 ast
Curry 16 pts (7-19), 7 reb, 7 ast
Klay 8 pts (3-11)
Draymond 6 pts, 6 reb, 6 ast, 2 stl, 2 blk

Harden 27 pts (9-24), 10 reb, 3 ast
Paul 16 pts (6-14), 6 ast, 3 stl
Ariza 19 pts (7-9)
Tucker 22 pts (8-9, 5-6 3P)
Gordon 27 pts (8-19)

The Warriors start out very sloppy in the 1st with turnovers and missing most of their 3s. After a small lead, the Rockets play with great pace and energy in the 2nd and their role players start going off to open up a 14 point lead at half. Despite Durant dominating in the 3rd, the Warriors don’t have the type of 3rd quarter they’re accustomed to and lose it by 2 points. The Rockets got hot in the 4th and turn it into the blowout.

The Rockets did a better job passing and playing in transition this game and their supporting players really stepped up in a home must win. Tucker, Ariza and Gordon combined for 68 points on 23 for 33 shooting and 12 3s (11 by Gordon and Ariza). Mbah a Moute was a liability in the minutes he played, then they took off without him. Harden had an average game for his standards but still got to 27 points and didn’t freeze the ball too much. Paul’s numbers don’t jump off the bench but he was excellent getting people involved when Harden wasn’t playing and in the 3rd quarter they really needed some of his scoring to counter Durant. He also played great defense on Curry. He did already show signs of injury by the end of the game.

Durant goes off AGAIN for the 7th straight game against the biggest opponent of the season (Cleveland last year, Houston this year) with just another 38 points on excellent efficiency (13-22). Sure he had 0 assists after 1 last game, but you can’t really blame him with how off the rest of the Warriors were for carrying them and trying to get them back in it. Curry did not look right. There’s been an attempt over the years to claim he was injured in 2016 finals, but it feels there’s a better case for him being injured in this series, and he did only come back from injury the previous round after long layoff (last 17 games of regular season and 1st round). He did some things driving taking advantage of switches, but his 3pt wasn’t a part of the Warriors offense at all, and so far is 1 for 13 in the series from there. From an eye test perspective he looked like a guy avoiding the 3pt shot due to knowing he doesn't have the lift. Klay came down to earth after the last game with 8 points on 3-11. Draymond was once again important to their passing game in the half court. I liked how West, Livingston, Young played once again in short minutes. Overall the Rockets needed this game more and it showed as they played with a sense of urgency and the Warriors couldn’t overcome Curry being so off.

MVPs of the game:

Game 1: Durant
Game 2: Durant (Paul for Rockets)

[SideshowBob]

No 2018 Finals yet?

[Dr Positivity]

Without going into too much details I jumped the gun starting this project and my experience watching games was not close to "normal" and was more just a useful litmus test at the time - So I will wait a little longer, and possibly have to rewatch 2016 and 2017 first

[Stan]

You can honestly skip the '17 & '18 Finals lol, just check out Game 1 from 2018

[parsnips33]

Thanks Dr. Positivity for the recap. You bring up a good and very underrated point: Kerr’s inflexibility on offense really hurt the Warriors in this series. Defenders were able to rough up Curry off the ball all playoffs long and Kerr should’ve seen how that wore him down. Yet, he still played Curry in a predominantly off-ball role making it tough for him to even catch the ball, let alone get in a rhythm.

They nearly lost to OKC because of that and eventually did lose to the Cavs because of that. I get that Kerr believes that Steph’s off-ball gravity opens up opportunities for others but at some point you have to get the ball to your best offensive player. Of course, Curry also deserves blame for not being as assertive as he could’ve been.

Even in these last Finals when everybody else was injured, Kerr stuck to Curry in the off-ball role. Not sure if it's Curry's nature as someone who won't rock the boat or Kerr's stubbornness as a coach, but somebody has to step up and make that call.

[Coach PM]

I wish Draymond won FMVP. Historic game 7 performance