PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics]

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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1021 » by Cavsfansince84 » Mon Jul 5, 2021 5:23 pm

falcolombardi wrote:https://www.google.com/amp/s/thesportsrush.com/nba-news-dennis-rodman-intentionally-missed-shots-to-get-extra-rebounds-steve-kerr-provides-a-hilarious-anecdote-for-the-bulls-legends-insane-rebounding-stats/%3famp

any truth to this notion? is not the first time i read about rodman statpaddimg rebounds but not sure how true


The part about him grabbing off rebounds near the rim and just dribbling it out a lot is 100% true. Usually when he grabbed an off rebound he wouldn't even look to shoot. idk about missing shots on purpose.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1022 » by Goudelock » Tue Jul 6, 2021 1:47 am

falcolombardi wrote:https://www.google.com/amp/s/thesportsrush.com/nba-news-dennis-rodman-intentionally-missed-shots-to-get-extra-rebounds-steve-kerr-provides-a-hilarious-anecdote-for-the-bulls-legends-insane-rebounding-stats/%3famp

any truth to this notion? is not the first time i read about rodman statpaddimg rebounds but not sure how true


Wouldn't be the most farfetched thing in the world. I feel like that you kinda have to hunt for rebounds and do a little statpadding if you're going to lead the league in that category.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1023 » by Goudelock » Mon Jul 12, 2021 1:24 am

England is the Georgia Bulldogs of world football.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1024 » by MisterHibachi » Mon Jul 12, 2021 8:29 pm

Read on Twitter


Not a football fan so no idea how outrageous these comments are, but I guess the NBA isn't the only league with old timers downplaying the current league's talent level.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1025 » by Goudelock » Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:03 am

MisterHibachi wrote:
Read on Twitter


Not a football fan so no idea how outrageous these comments are, but I guess the NBA isn't the only league with old timers downplaying the current league's talent level.


Literally all of these statements are delusional. Bo Jackson's is the worst because its the nba equivalent of Shaq believing he would average 125 PPG in today's game.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1026 » by Dr Positivity » Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:39 am

Marino thinking he could throw 62 TDs is probably the closest to reasonable there, at least he can claim it’s an easier QB era now.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1027 » by falcolombardi » Tue Jul 13, 2021 1:46 am

from more to less, how would sports be rsnked by how much nostalgia and preference for older eras they have?

i feel like basketball and boxing would be on top and maybe soccer at the bottom
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1028 » by Dr Positivity » Tue Jul 13, 2021 2:14 am

falcolombardi wrote:from more to less, how would sports be rsnked by how much nostalgia and preference for older eras they have?

i feel like basketball and boxing would be on top and maybe soccer at the bottom


Something like boxing, baseball, hockey, golf, basketball, football, tennis. Don’t know enough about soccer fans to tell. I still think on the whole basketball is young person’s sport and there are more “60s guys couldn’t play today” people than old school is better types. Tennis is last as the style of play and equipment has changed too much and the three best players by far are right now.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1029 » by penbeast0 » Tue Jul 13, 2021 2:59 am

I think Doc P pretty much nails it, though I'd have ranked golf over hockey but I was far from sure not being a big fan of either.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1030 » by HeartBreakKid » Tue Jul 13, 2021 5:03 am

falcolombardi wrote:from more to less, how would sports be rsnked by how much nostalgia and preference for older eras they have?

i feel like basketball and boxing would be on top and maybe soccer at the bottom

No one in basketball really matters before Magic and Bird which wasn't that long ago, and no one else during the 80s really matters either except guys who had success during the 90s.

Basketball's nostalgia doesn't go that far back because ironically most people weren't watching basketball a long time ago. Always got to laugh when a guy says "you probably were too young to see them play" and they're talking about 2005 players or something.


I'd say baseball is king of nostalgia.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1031 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:44 pm

falcolombardi wrote:from more to less, how would sports be rsnked by how much nostalgia and preference for older eras they have?

i feel like basketball and boxing would be on top and maybe soccer at the bottom


I would put baseball and boxing at the top of the list. These are both sports that peaked in popularity a long time ago and whose old-time fans in general are content to trash the modern game.

I'd imagine the same is true of hockey where they've let defense crippled the game effectively making it impossible for Wayne Gretzky to get surpassed.

Definitely wouldn't put basketball high on the list because in a very real sense is been "currently peaking" for a long time. I think what you're alluding to here is the fact that people still are attached specifically to Kobe Bryant, Michael Jordan, and Wilt Chamberlain, but frankly to me this seems like like healthy, balanced nostalgia to me. It just means people care about the game enough to be looking to discuss multiple eras.

In American sport, I'd put American football as the least nostalgia-driven of the major team sports, and there I'd say that the key is that they've specifically catered to a fanbase that doesn't remotely understand the game in front of them and hence doesn't really care about the past. Also the way they treat history as if nothing existed before the Super Bowl has really effectively killed off the legends of the half century plus that came before where football was literally a preparation for war. Now add in that Tom Brady's clear cut GOAT status is making people care less about the Joe Montanas of the world.

I'm surprised that soccer is at the bottom of your list but feel like you know better than me. What I always find interesting about historical soccer is the way they didn't seem to pay attention to anything other than goals statistically. It's like they were trying to prevent historical study.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1032 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jul 13, 2021 3:52 pm

Dr Positivity wrote:
falcolombardi wrote:from more to less, how would sports be rsnked by how much nostalgia and preference for older eras they have?

i feel like basketball and boxing would be on top and maybe soccer at the bottom


Something like boxing, baseball, hockey, golf, basketball, football, tennis. Don’t know enough about soccer fans to tell. I still think on the whole basketball is young person’s sport and there are more “60s guys couldn’t play today” people than old school is better types. Tennis is last as the style of play and equipment has changed too much and the three best players by far are right now.


Golf and tennis are interesting.

I think with golf the thing is that at this point Tiger Woods is basically all that matters. If you asked for an Athlete of the Century, Tiger would have a good chance of winning it despite the fact that golf courses are getting removed all over the country, and Tiger was literally still played up until his recent accident. I don't think any athlete looms so far over a sport that's seen as major the way Tiger does. Older folks will always remember Palmer and Nicklaus, but the modern sport has lived and died with Tiger.

Tennis is funny because as you say, everyone basically agrees that the modern players are the greatest (Federer, Nadal, Djokovic, Serena)...but the community of tennis knows that the sport peaked in popularity in the '70s & '80s, with John McEnroe being the biggest crossover star in men's history. I always feel like the reason why tennis is so positive and focused on talking about the modern game is partly a gentlemen's agreement that the sport itself needs help growing back again.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1033 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:01 pm

HeartBreakKid wrote:
falcolombardi wrote:from more to less, how would sports be rsnked by how much nostalgia and preference for older eras they have?

i feel like basketball and boxing would be on top and maybe soccer at the bottom

No one in basketball really matters before Magic and Bird which wasn't that long ago, and no one else during the 80s really matters either except guys who had success during the 90s.

Basketball's nostalgia doesn't go that far back because ironically most people weren't watching basketball a long time ago. Always got to laugh when a guy says "you probably were too young to see them play" and they're talking about 2005 players or something.


I'd say baseball is king of nostalgia.


Just want to specifically note that I think Wilt Chamberlain is the extra dimension here that has to be mentioned.

Y'all know that when it comes to player comparison stuff, I'm very much in the Russell>Wilt camp. But as much as I admire Russell on and off the court, I can't deny that Wilt isn't simply the #1 pre-Bird/Magic icon the sport produced, he's someone who (literally) stands out enough that people knew and know him who might never have watched a basketball game.

He was essentially seen as the super-man. More than any other athlete. That's why people still tell tales about him, and that's why we have people earnestly believe many of these tales even in hard core communities such as RealGM.

All this to say that I'd argue it's essentially because of Wilt that basketball conversations that go back to the '60s have remained fairly common, while stuff from the '50s and earlier are much less frequent, and this type of split between the '50s & '60s certainly was no given. (For baseball, by contrast, the '50s - and the '20s before that - represent the most significant decades.)
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1034 » by falcolombardi » Tue Jul 13, 2021 4:13 pm

basketball is a sport that is not only younger than baseball, it also has evolvr at a way faster pace

rules wise, tactically and technically

the 50's didnt even have the shot clock for the most part which i think is what really separated those decades

the arrival of bill russel + shot clock in 56 Marks a clear cut point for before and after (so does his retirement in 69 cause the aba and expansión)

is when the has dropping statlines start appearing and de got the guys who would hang on long enough to play with the likes of kareem (who played long enough to be a bit part of the popularity boom if nba in the 80's

giving a certain "credibility" even to those lowest in the older game who have to concede that -for example- a one wilt hanged on with peak kareem and a one kareem was still dominant in the times of bird and magic

that is why i think post russel is a common cut point in people minds, that gets muddled with the 60's even though it started earlier
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1035 » by kayess » Tue Jul 13, 2021 8:12 pm

I don't really know the NFL well enough - but is Brady really the clear cut GOAT when you look into advanced metrics and account for how stacked his teams have been? I remember stuff like DOVA coming out and painting him as getting a massive boost from his cast (and Manning elevating his teams way beyond where they were expected to be)
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1036 » by Dr Positivity » Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:18 pm

kayess wrote:I don't really know the NFL well enough - but is Brady really the clear cut GOAT when you look into advanced metrics and account for how stacked his teams have been? I remember stuff like DOVA coming out and painting him as getting a massive boost from his cast (and Manning elevating his teams way beyond where they were expected to be)


Yea the more I think of it the more I think the count the ringz mentality leading to Brady>everyone else is probably flawed, it makes more sense in basketball due to longer series and the GOAT players tending to correlate well with ring count, and even in basketball it’s still overrated. Eli and Foles have as many rings as Brees, Rodgers and prime Peyton combined. With that said Brady has probably the best argument for GOAT even without the titles as it’s not like Manning or Rodgers had clearly better regular season careers when considering both peak play, longevity or personality in the latter’s case, and there is still value in being clutch when you’ve stepped up that much like Brady. Brady now has a solid 4 more star seasons than Manning, it’s obscene he was already cheating Father Time throwing 500 yards as a 40 year old in Eagles Super Bowl and that was 3 seasons and 2 superbowls ago.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1037 » by falcolombardi » Tue Jul 13, 2021 9:42 pm

before the suoerbowl and longevity difference became too wide brady was kinda like the kobe to peyton's lebron back in the days

everyone knew peyton was "more good" but pundits elevted brady for perceived clutchness and more rings (only missed the killer instinct part)

this was when ring count was closer (3 to 1 instead of 7 to 2) and brady didnt have 5 extra years of great play after manning retirement

now the sheer amount of succes and longevity is making the argument hard for everyone else but i think brady has never stood out above the field of greats (manning, rodgers, mahomes now) in "goodness" or raw impact measured in statistics
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1038 » by Dr Positivity » Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:02 pm

falcolombardi wrote:before the suoerbowl and longevity difference became too wide brady was kinda like the kobe to peyton's lebron back in the days

everyone knew peyton was "more good" but pundits elevted brady for perceived clutchness and more rings (only missed the killer instinct part)


Maybe during first three Patriots superbowls but by 2007 on there isn’t really that much between them in terms of regular season performance in my opinion, Brady’s MVP seasons in 07 and 10 are up there with any Manning ones. I think Bird being originally rated higher than Magic but it flipping in 87 may be a better comp than Lebron v Kobe.
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1039 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jul 13, 2021 10:09 pm

Dr Positivity wrote:
falcolombardi wrote:before the suoerbowl and longevity difference became too wide brady was kinda like the kobe to peyton's lebron back in the days

everyone knew peyton was "more good" but pundits elevted brady for perceived clutchness and more rings (only missed the killer instinct part)


Maybe during first three Patriots superbowls but by 2007 on there isn’t really that much between them in terms of regular season performance in my opinion, Brady’s MVP seasons in 07 and 10 are up there with any Manning ones. I think Bird being originally rated higher than Magic but it flipping in 87 may be a better comp than Lebron v Kobe.


Yeah, to me the idea that Brady was a mere game manager ended in 2007.

I think that what you can say is that if you just take average quality of playoff performance, that's Joe Montana. I don't have any particular reason to rank Manning over Brady by any rationale. I can see some measures saying it's debatable, but the argument that we'd expect Manning to achieve comparable success to Brady if he'd only been drafted onto the Patriots doesn't seem realistic at this point.

Agreed also that a Bird/Magic comparison is closer to the mark than LeBron/Kobe, though in football, just as in basketball, there really is no one anywhere that is a close comparison to Bird. (Manning & Brady both play more like Magic.)
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Re: PC Board OT Thread Take 4 [No Politics] 

Post#1040 » by trex_8063 » Tue Jul 13, 2021 11:16 pm

This thread's making me want to YT search some retro great NFL games.....maybe the 49'ers/Bengals Super Bowl.
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