REDOING THE NBA HALL OF FAME (retired today)

Post #1 » by **penbeast0** » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:13 pm

BAA/NBA/ABA playing careers only; we are not including college, Olympic, foreign, etc. You can select up to 10 players (you do not HAVE to fill out your list). They do not have to be in order. The 10 players with the most votes make the HOF. Voting will stay open as long as there is active interest. We take the top 10 votegetters, in case of a tie, I will go back and ask everyone to vote on just the tied players, ranking them in order with just 1st place votes counting, then 2nd if 1st ties again, etc.

RealGM PC Board 2020 HOF

Retired 1960 or before

Retired 1965 or before

Retired 1970 or before

Retired 1975 or before

Retired 1980 or before

Retired 1985 or before

Retired 1990 or before

Retired 1995 or before

Retired 2000 or before

Retired 2005 or before

Retired 2020 or before

Retired 2010 or before

Post #2 » by **penbeast0** » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:23 pm

Some candidates:

Tim Duncan
Tony Parker
Kobe Bryant
Carmelo Anthony
Dwayne Wade

Dirk Nowitzki
Tyson Chandler
Pau Gasol//still active
Amar'e Stoudamire
Zach Randolph

Manu Ginobili
Deron Williams
Joe Johnson
Paul Pierce
Chris Bosh

Kevin Garnett
Metta World Peace
VINCE CARTER

and from last time:
Terry Porter
Baron Davis

Post #3 » by **penbeast0** » Fri Jun 19, 2020 11:27 pm

Sure Things:

Duncan
Kobe
Wade
Dirk

Pau//still active
Manu
Pierce
Garnett

That leaves three spots for:

Tony Parker
Chris Bosh
Vince Carter

Post #4 » by **Doctor MJ** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:20 am

If we're saying Pau counts as retired then I don't see any wiggle room. I'll listen, but I'm going to go ahead and post a vote because it's unlikely to change:

Tim Duncan
Dirk Nowitzki
Kevin Garnett
Kobe Bryant
Dwyane Wade
Paul Pierce
Manu Ginobili
Pau Gasol
Tony Parker
Chris Bosh

Identical to beast's list I believe:

This is a brutal class to compete with, so just for conversations sake, some words on other players:

Vince Carter - gotta be a lock for the Naismith Hall, right? Was expecting him to make it in ours too despite his issues.
Amar'e Stoudemire - the Suns golden age runs 6 years from Nash's arrival to Amar'e departure
Luol Deng - looking back I think we can state pretty definitively that Deng was the MVP of the Thibs era Bulls

Deron Williams - felt like something close to a lock at one point and merits discussion, but fell off a cliff
Tyson Chandler - really an awesome career and that title makes it feel substantial, but a very limited player with a lot of not-so-valuable years
Zach Randolph - great player for multiple franchises, considered an icon in Memphis
Elton Brand - hard to know what to do with Sterling-era Clippers, they always felt destined for demoralization, and Brand didn't break the mold either

For the record, while I could imagine voting for Baron Davis (or Penny or Vlade or Terry) again, I'm not intending to make a pitch here or jump others' bandwagons. Maybe something will change my mind, but the top 10 I see is just so strong.

EDIT: On retirements - in case you were going to have to look this stuff up:

Pau Gasol has not played in over a year, but I believe he last said he was considering retirement, not definitively retired.
Vince Carter has officially announced his retirement.
Tyson Chandler said a year ago he'd only play one more year, so seems fair to call him retired.
Kyle Korver is old and a free agent, so this might be last year or not
Andre Iguodala has guaranteed money next year, so not retiring I'm sure.

Dr Positivity · Post #5 » by **Dr Positivity** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:15 am

I don’t think we should be counting players who aren’t retired yet

clearlynotjesse · Post #6 » by **clearlynotjesse** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:30 am

Case for Vince Carter if he counts as retired:

He was really good for a really long time.

People knock him because they think he could've been so much more (might be true). He was a scorer with meh efficiency, which no one likes anymore, but he was just a very positive contributor for basically his entire (very long) career.

His first three years might be his best three year stretch. He wins ROY and makes All-NBA in his 2nd and 3rd years. Unfortunately don't have RAPM for those years. 27 ppg on 55 TS% is great for that era. Offenses were average-ish with not much talent around him.

After that we have the following RAPM numbers:

02-04: +3-4 every year ('03 only 43 games - only major injury of his career)
05-10: +2-3 every year
11: not great
12-15: +3-4 every year

~16 straight years of being really good! Playoff struggles were real, never was on a great team, and never really won anything. But 16 years! That's longer than a lot of people's whole careers. Throw some cultural impact in there (dunks are cool) and I would take this over Parker or Bosh.

Dr Positivity · Post #7 » by **Dr Positivity** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 5:21 am

I feel good about these 9 if they all count

Tim Duncan
Kobe Bryant
Kevin Garnett
Dwyane Wade
Dirk Nowitzki
Manu Ginobili
Pau Gasol
Paul Pierce
Tony Parker

Leaning Bosh for the last spot but I could be talked out of him to vote a player like Vince or Porter

Dutchball97 · Post #8 » by **Dutchball97** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 6:59 am

Well this seems rather straight forward.

Votes:
Tim Duncan
Kobe Bryant
Kevin Garnett
Dwyane Wade
Dirk Nowitzki
Paul Pierce
Manu Ginobili
Vince Carter
Tony Parker
Chris Bosh

Post #9 » by **penbeast0** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:48 pm

I hadn't seen Vince's retirement announcement, counting Iggy and Korver as still playing from everything I've read. If Vince counts, it becomes very difficult again but I think he's the 11th guy.

Post #10 » by **trex_8063** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 1:28 pm

I'm going to make my picks official right off the bat:

Tim Duncan
Kevin Garnett
Kobe Bryant
Dirk Nowitzki
Dwyane Wade
Paul Pierce
Pau Gasol (EDIT: replace with Chris Bosh if Pau deemed ineligible)
Manu Ginobili
Vince Carter
Tony Parker

What a brutally stacked class. My first 8 are rock-solid, and even Carter is pretty solid for me. Parker is the only one I'm remotely shaky on, but I'm going with it. Chris Bosh is a super-close #11, and is really the only other guy I'd seriously consider at this point. Terry Porter would probably be my #12, but relatively distantly so.

Ryoga Hibiki · Post #11 » by **Ryoga Hibiki** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 1:39 pm

This class it's really too strong, even deeper than the previous one.
The top8 are locks in every class, but I would have easily voted Parker, Bosh and Carter in any of the last 5 ballots.
Probably keeping Bosh and Parker.

Dr Positivity · Post #12 » by **Dr Positivity** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:23 pm

penbeast0 wrote:I hadn't seen Vince's retirement announcement, counting Iggy and Korver as still playing from everything I've read. If Vince counts, it becomes very difficult again but I think he's the 11th guy.

Vince is retired, however Pau is not and wants to play his last season with the Lakers I believe

eminence · Post #13 » by **eminence** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 3:51 pm

What's the decision on Vince/Pau? My initial impression was I'd take either over Parker/Bosh, but I'll have to go back and look.

Narigo · Post #14 » by **Narigo** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 4:31 pm

Tim Duncan
Kobe Bryant
Kevin Garnett
Dirk Nowitzki
Dwyane Wade
Manu Ginobili
Vince Carter
Chris Bosh
Paul Pierce
Pau Gasol(Edit: Tony Parker)

Post #15 » by **penbeast0** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 4:36 pm

Dr Positivity wrote:
penbeast0 wrote:I hadn't seen Vince's retirement announcement, counting Iggy and Korver as still playing from everything I've read. If Vince counts, it becomes very difficult again but I think he's the 11th guy.

Vince is retired, however Pau is not and wants to play his last season with the Lakers I believe

I will take this input since there are many here that know more than I do. So, Pau is not retired but Vince Carter is.

So my vote will move Vince into the top ten instead of Pau.

Post #16 » by **penbeast0** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 4:36 pm

Dr Positivity wrote:
penbeast0 wrote:I hadn't seen Vince's retirement announcement, counting Iggy and Korver as still playing from everything I've read. If Vince counts, it becomes very difficult again but I think he's the 11th guy.

Vince is retired, however Pau is not and wants to play his last season with the Lakers I believe

I will take this input since there are many here that know more than I do. So, Pau is not retired but Vince Carter is.

So my vote will move Vince into the top ten instead of Pau.

Dr Positivity · Post #17 » by **Dr Positivity** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 5:15 pm

You can also put Vince in my top 10 instead of Pau if the latter is ineligible

eminence · Post #18 » by **eminence** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 5:48 pm

Changed my opinion on Parker a bit, really was too consistent a piece of that Spurs dynasty to leave off imo. Bosh v Carter v ??? for the last slot, plenty of the old guys really deserve contention there with them.

9 sure votes:
Duncan
Kobe
KG
Dirk
Wade
Manu
Parker
Gasol
Pierce

Dr Positivity · Post #19 » by **Dr Positivity** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 6:01 pm

Well it just got announced players can be traded before the season. So I guess Vince might not be retired if he got traded to a playoff team.

Post #20 » by **Doctor MJ** » Sat Jun 20, 2020 8:56 pm

penbeast0 wrote:
Dr Positivity wrote:
penbeast0 wrote:I hadn't seen Vince's retirement announcement, counting Iggy and Korver as still playing from everything I've read. If Vince counts, it becomes very difficult again but I think he's the 11th guy.

Vince is retired, however Pau is not and wants to play his last season with the Lakers I believe

I will take this input since there are many here that know more than I do. So, Pau is not retired but Vince Carter is.

So my vote will move Vince into the top ten instead of Pau.

Alright, now I have to think about this.

Hey beast, where are we going from here? Is this thread the end, or did you have something else in mind? I ask because I'm not going to be around much tomorrow and the next couple days.