Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard

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New Team?

Isiah/Garnett
2
10%
Magic/Dwight
18
90%
 
Total votes: 20

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Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#1 » by Matt15 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:47 am

Which duo would you rather build a team around?
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#2 » by GYK » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:37 am

Magic/Dwight
Magic is clear the best player in the comparison. For a lead playmaker he never dominated the ball so 1-4 more playmakers are possible.
Dwight is one of my four greatest defenders ever. He is near a top 10 defense(long as his backup is defensively adequate) by himself. His rim pressure was damn near as threatening as Shaq(Dwight might be the most athletic center post Wilt. At least upper body strength, end to end speed and vertical).
Orlando’a 4 out offense. Magic in place of Hedo. Now with the greatest passer ever/2nd best fast break player ever.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#3 » by 70sFan » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:02 am

For a peak, Magic and Dwight comfortably but the problem with Dwight is that his head often wasn't in basketball and his prime was very brief.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#4 » by 70sFan » Sun Feb 21, 2021 9:07 am

GYK wrote:Dwight is one of my four greatest defenders ever. He is near a top 10 defense(long as his backup is defensively adequate) by himself.

Do you really have Dwight over some of Russell, Wilt, Thurmond, Walton, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert?

Near top 10 defense with adequate backup doesn't mean much in all-time sense. All of the players I mentioned could do that and some (like Robinson, Wilt, Hakeem or Russell) did that without backup.

Now with the greatest passer ever/2nd best fast break player ever.

Who is better fast break player than Magic? Unless you count defense, I don't see how can anybody be even close.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#5 » by freethedevil » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:40 am

70sFan wrote:
GYK wrote:Dwight is one of my four greatest defenders ever. He is near a top 10 defense(long as his backup is defensively adequate) by himself.

Do you really have Dwight over some of Russell, Wilt, Thurmond, Walton, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert?

Near top 10 defense with adequate backup doesn't mean much in all-time sense. All of the players I mentioned could do that and some (like Robinson, Wilt, Hakeem or Russell) did that without backup.

Now with the greatest passer ever/2nd best fast break player ever.

Who is better fast break player than Magic? Unless you count defense, I don't see how can anybody be even close.

Don't think calling bird a better transition passer is unreasinable. Dwight's defense is probably being overstated here, but his offense fits pretty perfectly with magic.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#6 » by 70sFan » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:48 am

freethedevil wrote:
70sFan wrote:
GYK wrote:Dwight is one of my four greatest defenders ever. He is near a top 10 defense(long as his backup is defensively adequate) by himself.

Do you really have Dwight over some of Russell, Wilt, Thurmond, Walton, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert?

Near top 10 defense with adequate backup doesn't mean much in all-time sense. All of the players I mentioned could do that and some (like Robinson, Wilt, Hakeem or Russell) did that without backup.

Now with the greatest passer ever/2nd best fast break player ever.

Who is better fast break player than Magic? Unless you count defense, I don't see how can anybody be even close.

Don't think calling bird a better transition passer is unreasinable. Dwight's defense is probably being overstated here, but his offense fits pretty perfectly with magic.

Passer might be fair, but Bird can't run the break like Magic.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#7 » by freethedevil » Sun Feb 21, 2021 10:51 am

70sFan wrote:
freethedevil wrote:
70sFan wrote:Do you really have Dwight over some of Russell, Wilt, Thurmond, Walton, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert?

Near top 10 defense with adequate backup doesn't mean much in all-time sense. All of the players I mentioned could do that and some (like Robinson, Wilt, Hakeem or Russell) did that without backup.


Who is better fast break player than Magic? Unless you count defense, I don't see how can anybody be even close.

Don't think calling bird a better transition passer is unreasinable. Dwight's defense is probably being overstated here, but his offense fits pretty perfectly with magic.

Passer might be fair, but Bird can't run the break like Magic.

Ah fair. I thought we were only talkign passing.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#8 » by kendogg » Sun Feb 21, 2021 11:42 am

Magic+Dwight have a nasty synergy. Dwight can get higher than any center since the merger aside from Shaq. Just imagine how many easy dunks they'd get off lobs and drop offs. I think that Magic could keep Dwight's ego in check as well in terms of touches in the post. Magic clearly knew how to keep a big man involved in the offense. KG might have more career defensive impact than Dwight, but peak Dwight's defensive ceiling is just as high if not higher. And it is a LOT easier to find a good defensive forward roleplayer than a good defensive center roleplayer to pair with the respective duos.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#9 » by GYK » Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:10 pm

70sFan wrote:
GYK wrote:Dwight is one of my four greatest defenders ever. He is near a top 10 defense(long as his backup is defensively adequate) by himself.

Do you really have Dwight over some of Russell, Wilt, Thurmond, Walton, Hakeem, Robinson, Ewing, Mutombo, Wallace, Gobert?

Near top 10 defense with adequate backup doesn't mean much in all-time sense. All of the players I mentioned could do that and some (like Robinson, Wilt, Hakeem or Russell) did that without backup.

Now with the greatest passer ever/2nd best fast break player ever.

Who is better fast break player than Magic? Unless you count defense, I don't see how can anybody be even close.

Dwight, Russell, Wallace, Deke are my four greatest defensive players ever. I think they all had adequate backups. A new to the league Gortat was his backup on a team that had Nelson/Hedo/Lewis on it with Lee/Pietrus as their perimeter defense. This is a bad defensive team. I wouldn’t trust anyone but those four to anchor that defense(improving the team is many possibilities but I don’t see it defensively. It wasn’t just instincts and IQ. He physically was capable of doing things no other center ever, barring young Wilt, could. In terms of end to end speed and vertical).
So yea I have him above Wilt Thurmond Wes(often forgotten but was the closest to Bill in style without the playmaking but more Wallace built) prime Eaton(who might have the greatest defensive peak we have tons of video on) the 90’s golden age the 00’s PF golden age and even Rudy(who has nearly more argument over everyone mentioned).

Yea I meant Magic. I have Lebron as the greatest fastbreak player. I immediately know your position and agree. How brilliant he is on the break and how often he uses it should be no contest. But Lebron uses it sparingly to keep his teams at low pace. He optimizes all his possessions, including breaks, and theyre brilliant every time.
But hey Howard deserves recognition as a fastbreak center. His rim running was a key part to his team. Beating perimeter players in transition and parking right under the rim was huge for them, tho he wasn’t the most capable of centers to take advantage of this perfect positioning it did sink in the defense for a three point team. I never thought about who is the best transition center but Dwight and Robinson would be my first go to’s.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#10 » by 70sFan » Sun Feb 21, 2021 1:35 pm

Unseld was nothing like Russell or Wallace on defense.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#11 » by GYK » Sun Feb 21, 2021 3:23 pm

70sFan wrote:Unseld was nothing like Russell or Wallace on defense.

He certainly was billed as such. Exact reason for his rookie MVP. Media certainly was pushing him as the next Russell as that what they been accustomed to as the best player. I know he wasn’t as good but he was certainly known as a defensive team first player. More of a post defender than paint protector.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#12 » by 70sFan » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:00 pm

GYK wrote:
70sFan wrote:Unseld was nothing like Russell or Wallace on defense.

He certainly was billed as such. Exact reason for his rookie MVP. Media certainly was pushing him as the next Russell as that what they been accustomed to as the best player. I know he wasn’t as good but he was certainly known as a defensive team first player. More of a post defender than paint protector.

My point isn't that Unseld wasn't a great defender (he was, though obviously not on Russell level) but that Wes played nothing alike Russell.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#13 » by GYK » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:41 pm

70sFan wrote:
GYK wrote:
70sFan wrote:Unseld was nothing like Russell or Wallace on defense.

He certainly was billed as such. Exact reason for his rookie MVP. Media certainly was pushing him as the next Russell as that what they been accustomed to as the best player. I know he wasn’t as good but he was certainly known as a defensive team first player. More of a post defender than paint protector.

My point isn't that Unseld wasn't a great defender (he was, though obviously not on Russell level) but that Wes played nothing alike Russell.

Agreed but he certainly was originally pushed as such. Exclusive reason for his MVP. Coming in a team of scorers being a defensive anchor to a league leading record he absolutely was the Russell heir apparent.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#14 » by rand » Mon Feb 22, 2021 10:37 am

Magic is a dream paring for Dwight, who was both one of the easiest players to set up at the rim in basketball history because of his incredible explosiveness and one of the great big men who could have most benefit from a great set up man because of his lack of scoring skill. Plus Magic had a great demeanor, and Dwight needs to be teamed with a superstar who is not caustic. KG/Dwight would have been a terrible pairing, even though they could make a GOAT defensive team.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#15 » by Muha_i_samolet » Mon Feb 22, 2021 12:25 pm

Magic\Dwight easy.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#16 » by G35 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:43 pm

I'd go with Isiah and KG. I think both of their attitudes would go well together, but Isiah would have to lead, just like he did with Detroit.

Magic is obviously great, but Dwight is nowhere near Kareem on offense. One underrated part of Kareem is that he did not demand shots on offense and that allowed Magic to run a multi-faceted, fast break offense. They could post up James Worthy on the block...many people may not remember but Worthy was a great low-post player and would use his quickness to spin and get easy baskets.

Dwight is at his best when the offense is inside out and he has shooters surrounding him...similar to Hakeem but Dwight does not have the Hakeem's ceiling.

Plus Dwight is soft and a untrustworthy......
I'm so tired of the typical......
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#17 » by nate33 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 6:18 pm

For most eras of the NBA, I'd go with Magic/Howard.

However, in the current era where post-up centers have minimal value and shot creation from the PG position is so vital, one could make the case for Isiah/Garnett.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#18 » by Cavsfansince84 » Mon Feb 22, 2021 11:57 pm

I'd be more inclined to consider Isiah/KG if Isiah was a solid to good 3 pt shooter. I'm guessing he could develop into one but Magic is just such a great floor raiser on offense and Dwight is such a good def anchor that its hard to pass on them.
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Re: Isiah Thomas/Kevin Garnett or Magic Johnson/Dwight Howard 

Post#19 » by 70sFan » Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:42 am

nate33 wrote:For most eras of the NBA, I'd go with Magic/Howard.

However, in the current era where post-up centers have minimal value and shot creation from the PG position is so vital, one could make the case for Isiah/Garnett.

Magic is much better shot creator than Thomas.

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