Is Dame a top 10 player overall?

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Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#1 » by dygaction » Mon Mar 15, 2021 2:53 am

Of course he is one of the top scorers that can make ridiculous 3s and is clutch. What if you consider everything, from scoring, efficiency, playmaking, defense, to playoff performance?
Dame is known for clutch and the stats support that. He also has very memorable moments in the playoffs. But if you look at his playoff stats and compare to his regular seasons, you will find that his efficiency, 3p%, 2p%, per 100 points, rebounds, and assists all decrease. If you drafting players to for next season only, will Dame make your top 10?
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#2 » by HeartBreakKid » Mon Mar 15, 2021 6:44 am

I'm not a big Damian Lillard guy so I'll lean toward no without thinking about it too heavily.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#3 » by Pelly24 » Mon Mar 15, 2021 7:07 am

Dame is averaging like 30/5/8 on 63 TS%, just as he did last year. He almost singlehandedly willed Portland to a playoff birth at will in the bubble last year after his team was destroyed by injuries. He's been to the playoffs every year over the last like, 7 years, maybe his whole career. He's an excellent passer and abetter floor general than Steph while also being a better on one one scorer who can get to the line a lot. Dame's never played on a team designed to maximize his strengths. His best situation might be like trading CJ for Ben Simmons and having a Tobias Harris-like second option to go along with a decent defender. Really, if you put Dame on Utah instead of Donovan Mitchell, they'd be legit contenders. Good rim protector, top 20 second-best player, multiple 17 ppg scoring options besides himself. They'd be way more dangerous. Dame might be called the best guard in basketball and a lot of people would say he's better than Steph and Harden (they'd be wrong, of course) but they'd be saying it.

LeBron, KD, Harden, Jokic, Giannis, Kawhi, Embiid, AD, Dame and Luka is how I'd have it. Dame is one of the more underrated superstars in recent history. I think a few more healthy years he'd have to easily rank above Paul Pierce, Ray Allen, people like that. To me he can be a top 45 or so player ever at this rate. He'll be like a 8-10 all-nba guy, been to the conference finals twice, always in the playoffs, historically great regular season numbers, exciting. One of the three or so best point guards in the league during a golden age for point guards. People truly sleep on this guy. Of course he's a top 10 player, has been dating back to at least 2018-2019, top 12-15 before that, at worst.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#4 » by Texas Chuck » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:37 pm

Of course he's one of the ten best players in the league right now.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#5 » by bondom34 » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:48 pm

Think he's on the border. Lebron, Giannis, Embiid, Jokic, Curry, Harden, Kawhi, Doncic, Davis I'd all feel pretty good about taking above him (Luka most debatable). Which is 9 and leaves a big group that doesn't include Durant, Butler, George, Gobert (maybe not Gobert in this group but will leave him noted), and probably a few more in consideration I'm forgetting. I'd probably say no as well but he's in that latter grouping.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#6 » by dygaction » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:52 pm

The reason I asked is because if everyone is healthy, I have him right at 11 behind Jokic, Embiid, LeBron, Harden, Giannis, Luka, KD, Kawhi, AD, and Curry. In front of PG13, Irving, Butler, CP3, and Simmons.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#7 » by LukaTheGOAT » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:55 pm

No, no to me because he typically regresses a lot in the PS. I would take a HEALTHY PG13, Kyrie, Jimmy Butler, besides the usual top 10.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#8 » by dygaction » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:56 pm

LukaTheGOAT wrote:No, no to me because he typically regresses a lot in the PS. I would take a HEALTHY PG13, Kyrie, Jimmy Butler, besides the usual top 10.

Just saying, hard to have PG13 at least for this season when you talk about PS regression :D
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#9 » by Waynearchetype » Mon Mar 15, 2021 3:58 pm

dygaction wrote:
LukaTheGOAT wrote:No, no to me because he typically regresses a lot in the PS. I would take a HEALTHY PG13, Kyrie, Jimmy Butler, besides the usual top 10.

Just saying, hard to have PG13 at least for this season when you talk about PS regression :D

That's a bad shot.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#10 » by No-more-rings » Mon Mar 15, 2021 4:18 pm

I think like basically the past several years, he's arguably been top 10 but probably never clear cut once playoffs are factored in. He's gotten better in the playoffs, but is rarely dominant.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#11 » by bondom34 » Mon Mar 15, 2021 4:20 pm

I'm a little confused at the PG playoff thing. PG's been a better playoff performer overall IMO as well. Dame has a few memorable moments, but overall the reputation far outlives the actual performances, and PG the inverse.

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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#12 » by dygaction » Mon Mar 15, 2021 4:22 pm

Waynearchetype wrote:
dygaction wrote:
LukaTheGOAT wrote:No, no to me because he typically regresses a lot in the PS. I would take a HEALTHY PG13, Kyrie, Jimmy Butler, besides the usual top 10.

Just saying, hard to have PG13 at least for this season when you talk about PS regression :D

That's a bad shot.

Really? Paul George
Reg: 33.3 min 43.6 FG%, 38.4 3p%, 84.7 FT%, 6.4r, 3.4a, 2.6to, 20.1p
Post: 38.4 min 41.9 FG%, 35.6 3p%, 81.9 FT%, 7.1r, 3.8a, 3.1to, 20.1p
If you use per 100, or per min, EVERYTHING drops in playoffs except turnover. Maybe his last year dragged down the whole (89 games total) playoff stats .
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#13 » by eminence » Mon Mar 15, 2021 4:43 pm

He's on the fringe. So far for this season I'd take Jokic/LeBron/Giannis/Embiid/Gobert/Kawhi/Curry/Harden/Luka though some he has an argument. That'd leave him #10 for this season in particular, but given health to all I'd put KD/AD/Butler up over him as well, some others arguable as well PG13, Kyrie, Tatum, playoff Draymond, etc (sorry if I've completely spaced on someone).

So I think I'd probably side with him being just outside in the 10-15 range.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#14 » by Duke4life831 » Mon Mar 15, 2021 4:57 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:Of course he's one of the ten best players in the league right now.

I definitely see the argument, but I dont think its an "of course" situation though.

LeBron, Giannis, KD, Harden, Kawhi, Embiid, Jokic

That is 7 I think most would agree are the "of course" guys. Then you hit the next group of guys like

AD, Luka, Curry, Dame. So I think you could make a pretty argument of him being outside of the top 10. Now ya its just semantics because at worst he is 11th or 12th.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#15 » by Pelly24 » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:22 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:Of course he's one of the ten best players in the league right now.

I definitely see the argument, but I dont think its an "of course" situation though.

LeBron, Giannis, KD, Harden, Kawhi, Embiid, Jokic

That is 7 I think most would agree are the "of course" guys. Then you hit the next group of guys like

AD, Luka, Curry, Dame. So I think you could make a pretty argument of him being outside of the top 10. Now ya its just semantics because at worst he is 11th or 12th.


TBH I really don't see the argument there for anyone but Steph (who is better than Kawhi and generally better than Embiid, I'm not fooled by this one season in the most ideal circumstances imaginable. Steph is better than Embiid and Kawhi, and at least as good as Harden or close enough, in my eyes). AD barely made the playoffs while he was on his own, has been intermittently stellar but was moistly only a top 15 player this year, Luka is like barely a positive this year and Dame's been clearly better all season in addition to arguably being better last year. Even with Embiid...he's peaking higher sure, but is this really always the Embiid we'll see? I had Dame ahead of him before this year, idk.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#16 » by Pelly24 » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:25 pm

I think if Dame were on the jazz instead of Mitchell he might be seen as a top 6 player.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#17 » by Prez » Mon Mar 15, 2021 9:59 pm

I think regular season wise he might be literally 10th for me, but it's tough when we talk playoffs.

The interesting discussion is him vs. Luka and a healthy, in-form Jimmy for that 10th spot. I think playoff wise (and this is crazy given one of them has only played in 1 playoff series his career) I go Luka > Jimmy > Dame.

Jimmy is the one I struggle with, he's one of those guys who is super comfortable taking a step back but his playoff performance last season was illuminating and he's right back in star form the last few weeks. I understand Dame has some massively clutch moments in the playoffs but if you asked me who I'd rather have for a full playoff run start to finish and both guys are 100% healthy and rested, I might actually take Jimmy. Luka as well, I just see him as a big time player who will step up when it matters - I just don't think you can contain him the way Dame has been in the past.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#18 » by LukaTheGOAT » Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:13 pm

dygaction wrote:
Waynearchetype wrote:
dygaction wrote:Just saying, hard to have PG13 at least for this season when you talk about PS regression :D

That's a bad shot.

Really? Paul George
Reg: 33.3 min 43.6 FG%, 38.4 3p%, 84.7 FT%, 6.4r, 3.4a, 2.6to, 20.1p
Post: 38.4 min 41.9 FG%, 35.6 3p%, 81.9 FT%, 7.1r, 3.8a, 3.1to, 20.1p
If you use per 100, or per min, EVERYTHING drops in playoffs except turnover. Maybe his last year dragged down the whole (89 games total) playoff stats .


Paul George is clearly better. Paul George, the supposed "choker," has the 6th highest playoff PIPM (even with injuries the last couple of postseasons) dating back to 2001 up until 2019 at 4.33. Damian Lillard has a -0.8 PIPM during that span. PG13 is better, don't get caught up in the moment.
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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#19 » by LukaTheGOAT » Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:19 pm

dygaction wrote:
Waynearchetype wrote:
dygaction wrote:Just saying, hard to have PG13 at least for this season when you talk about PS regression :D

That's a bad shot.

Really? Paul George
Reg: 33.3 min 43.6 FG%, 38.4 3p%, 84.7 FT%, 6.4r, 3.4a, 2.6to, 20.1p
Post: 38.4 min 41.9 FG%, 35.6 3p%, 81.9 FT%, 7.1r, 3.8a, 3.1to, 20.1p
If you use per 100, or per min, EVERYTHING drops in playoffs except turnover. Maybe his last year dragged down the whole (89 games total) playoff stats .


Also here is Dame from 16-20 in the PS. I'll take my chances and pass

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Re: Is Dame a top 10 player overall? 

Post#20 » by dygaction » Mon Mar 15, 2021 10:28 pm

LukaTheGOAT wrote:
dygaction wrote:
Waynearchetype wrote:That's a bad shot.

Really? Paul George
Reg: 33.3 min 43.6 FG%, 38.4 3p%, 84.7 FT%, 6.4r, 3.4a, 2.6to, 20.1p
Post: 38.4 min 41.9 FG%, 35.6 3p%, 81.9 FT%, 7.1r, 3.8a, 3.1to, 20.1p
If you use per 100, or per min, EVERYTHING drops in playoffs except turnover. Maybe his last year dragged down the whole (89 games total) playoff stats .


Also here is Dame from 16-20 in the PS. I'll take my chances and pass

Read on Twitter
/photo/1


My major concern for Dame is his drop in playoffs as mentioned in the op, but I think PG13's graph would be very similar.

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