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Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Wed Mar 24, 2021 11:54 pm
by Matt15
Which duo would you rather build around in today’s league?

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 12:22 am
by Karate Diop
Pippen / Durant.

Allen is the odd man out here.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:17 am
by Cavsfansince84
I'd be ok with Ray and KG. I can't really buy into Pip or KD leading a team which is compounded by having them both. Ray in today's game is at least Lillard level also imo.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 9:42 am
by rand
KD is so much better offensively than the others, and Ray so much worse defensively than all others, KD/Pip are going to be better on both ends of the court and they also offer better lineup versatility.

The level of your best offensive player also makes a larger difference than the level of your best defensive player. That go-to guy is such a huge factor in determining the strength of an offense especially in the playoffs. KD is a much better go-to scorer than either Ray or KG, which is not a knock on the latter two.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:14 am
by Dutchball97
Pippen's playmaking is the difference maker here. I'm not a fan of superstar duos where neither is a primary ballhandler.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 10:30 am
by Jaivl
Pippen and KD is probably a bit better on their peaks (and even then I doubt it), but Allen and KG played great for SO LONG that I can't bring myself to not pick them.

rand wrote:KD is so much better offensively than the others, and Ray so much worse defensively than all others, KD/Pip are going to be better on both ends of the court and they also offer better lineup versatility.

There's no chance than they are better defensively, lol. Garnett alone is an easily bigger needle-mover on defense than the other two combined.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 11:34 am
by rand
Jaivl wrote:Pippen and KD is probably a bit better on their peaks (and even then I doubt it), but Allen and KG played great for SO LONG that I can't bring myself to not pick them.

rand wrote:KD is so much better offensively than the others, and Ray so much worse defensively than all others, KD/Pip are going to be better on both ends of the court and they also offer better lineup versatility.

There's no chance than they are better defensively, lol. Garnett alone is an easily bigger needle-mover on defense than the other two combined.

You're right, that defensive assessment was incorrect. But Allen was a net negative on defense for the most productive offensive seasons of his career whereas both Pip and KD were plus defenders, even if neither was near KD's defensive impact.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 2:05 pm
by Prokorov
Matt15 wrote:Which duo would you rather build around in today’s league?


Durant >> KG
Pippen >>> Allen

and Durant/pippen are a fit that better transcends eras

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 6:10 pm
by dygaction
Prokorov wrote:
Matt15 wrote:Which duo would you rather build around in today’s league?


Durant >> KG
Pippen >>> Allen

and Durant/pippen are a fit that better transcends eras


I think you have one extra > in each one :D .
On offense, KG>Pippen. Pippen is a slightly better playmaker. Pippen's ppg was lower but he was not the first option like KG. Durrant >>> Allen. On defense, KG + Allen gives you higher ceiling, but Pippen + Durant is also enough to build an elite defensive team. I would not worry about Durant team's defense as much as KG team's offense.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 6:24 pm
by G35
Easily Pippen and Durant.

KG and Ray don't like each other, whereas I think Scottie and Durant would fit very well together......


https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2018/03/12/boston-celtics-big-three-ray-allen-paints-picture-of-relationship-with-kevin-garnett-as-tenuous-from-the-start/

Deveney highlighted a number of interesting story lines from the book in a recent article, including several excerpts that suggest Allen’s notoriously icy relationship with Kevin Garnett may have been strained from the very start.

Allen recalled dribbling in front of his locker during the Celtics’ preseason trip to Rome in 2007, which was something Allen had done to prepare for games his entire career. The dribbling annoyed Garnett, though, who told Allen, “No, you’re not going to do that.”

You can’t tell me what to do,” Allen remembered responding, as teammates looked on. “You do what you do, and I do what I do.”

As Allen wrote, “Gee, can two grown men be any more juvenile?” And it was a similar experience when, before the start of the season, Garnett and Allen went out to dinner at a steakhouse in Boston and spoke about their roots together as teenage players in the 1990s, and the pain of being on losing teams in the past. After dinner, Allen wrote, he asked the waitress for the check.

“No,” Garnett said, “I tip way better than him, so you better give me the check.” It was the first time they’d gone to dinner together, and Allen pointed out that Garnett had no idea how much Allen tipped. “There was no point in arguing with the guy,” Allen writes. “What struck me was that he felt the need to be seen as being superior to me, even in something as petty as this.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 6:26 pm
by oaktownwarriors87
I said Allen/KG because KG's defense and rebounding is so hard to duplicate. KG also makes for an insanely good small ball center.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Thu Mar 25, 2021 7:30 pm
by Cavsfansince84
oaktownwarriors87 wrote:I said Allen/KG because KG's defense and rebounding is so hard to duplicate. KG also makes for an insanely good small ball center.


Ray's shooting isn't easy to duplicate either. I think people are really underrating what prime Ray Allen would do in today's league.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:15 am
by Threetimes10
Prokorov wrote:
Matt15 wrote:Which duo would you rather build around in today’s league?


Durant >> KG
Pippen >>> Allen

and Durant/pippen are a fit that better transcends eras


The best duo is you and your consistently misinformed takes. Durant isn't ">>" KG in any universe in which the rules of basketball remain the same. KG's defensive impact is greater than Durant's offensive advantage by any meaningful metric.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 5:03 am
by DirtyDez
Ray/KG cause Pippen had a bit of a shorter peak.

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 9:26 am
by Jaivl
Threetimes10 wrote:
Prokorov wrote:
Matt15 wrote:Which duo would you rather build around in today’s league?


Durant >> KG
Pippen >>> Allen

and Durant/pippen are a fit that better transcends eras


The best duo is you and your consistently misinformed takes. Durant isn't ">>" KG in any universe in which the rules of basketball remain the same. KG's defensive impact is greater than Durant's offensive advantage by any meaningful metric.

I agree with the general premise of KG being better than Durant in any universe, but the bolded is just not true. At least not by any metrics that I'm aware of.

Think about it - if that were true Boston Garnett (with similar defensive impact per-minute due to diminished role on offense, but losing nearly all his offensive impact) would be better than KD, and I think we all agree that's not the case (barring 2008).

Re: Scottie Pippen/Kevin Durant or Ray Allen/Kevin Garnett

Posted: Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:40 pm
by ccameron
I have KG as highest peak hear but I put Pippen above Ray for peaks, and I think the fit between Durant and Pippen is slightly better.