RealGM

Who was the better defender in their primes between Pierce and Klay?

I personally think Klay is overrated and Pierce is underrated. After looking through some PI RAPM data Pierce's DRAPM was more impressive than I expected especially in '04 and '05:

Pierce by a good bit.

Pierce. He’s bigger and stronger which is the difference for me.

Klay in iso (that's why he gets overrated), Pierce otherwise.

clearlynotjesse wrote:Klay in iso (that's why he gets overrated), Pierce otherwise.

There’s truth in this though he was not a consistently great ISO defender either.

2016: 67th percentile in ISO in regular season, 65th in post season
2017: 34th and 64th percentiles
2018: 82nd, 36th percentiles
2019: 53rd, 59th percentiles

Klay. Never thought of Pierce as a great defender, Klay constantly defends and has success against the best guards.

HeartBreakKid wrote:Pierce by a good bit.

What? Pierce was not a defensive stopper, he was just a solid defender. Klay is a lockdown defender.

Gooner wrote:

HeartBreakKid wrote:Pierce by a good bit.

What? Pierce was not a defensive stopper, he was just a solid defender. Klay is a lockdown defender.

Who did he ever lock down?

Klay Thompson. Even if he never was a top notch defender, Pierce was merely above average

Pierce is one of those guys who compete for the title of the most unimpressive stars in nba history in terms of how his game looked. He was all around real solid but I have to go with Klay on this one.

Goes back to the way media worked when TV ruled everything. Clearly some don't know much about Paul Pierce pre ring.

I think this board has generally underrated Klay’s defense. Particularly his ability to guard smaller guards.

Pierce is just underrated in general. I don’t think either has a clear edge on this end.

Pierce played decent defense for a few years but had strong help D behind him. I think Klay ability to guard PGs makes him more useful.

Paul Pierce.

Ah, two of the most overrated perimeter defenders ever based on narrative and rings. In a vacuum I'll lean slightly towards prime Pierce who tends to get underrated as an athlete, but Klay probably gives you more actual impact over his prime years considering he plays so much off the ball, and has always had the freedom to expend more energy on that side given his usage. Not saying both guys weren't consistently good defenders (they were), but the term "lockdown" should never be used to describe either.

I never understood where this idea that Klay is overrated defensively comes from - cause he doesn't get steals?

Strong wing who's great at guarding 1 - 3 (realistically he can defend 1-4 in today's league)

Not to say Pierce wasn't also a really good defender, but I'd take Klay

Klay Thompson has a very specific defensive skill. He's good at man to man perimeter defense against smaller guards. This kind of defense is highly visible, so it artificially boosts Klay's defensive reputation because every fan watches the on-ball defense of the point guard. It's also a very useful skill, because it spares Steph Curry from chasing around another point guard all game.

If I needed a player to defend a point/small guard, I'd pick Klay over Pierce.

But for everything else, I'd take Pierce. He's bigger, he's stronger, he's longer, and he's super competitive on the defensive end. Pierce is an excellent counter to have against a physically dominant wing, like Lebron or Kawhi. He's not too shabby either against craftier smaller wings like Kobe. His feet look heavy but he never seemed to lack for footspeed in most of these matchups.

I dont think Klay is anything special when he isn't chasing point guards. He's a good competitor and he's decently strong. He's just lacking in size when going up against monster wings. He's 6'7 with a 6'9 wingspan, great size for a 2 guard, but most forwards are bigger than him.

Neither of these players are spectuacular defenders. Both are solid and deserve their reputations. I think they both get a little overrated due to how easy it is to see their defensive contributions, and I think this gets a bit out of hand sometimes with Klay.

parsnips33 wrote:I never understood where this idea that Klay is overrated defensively comes from - cause he doesn't get steals?

Strong wing who's great at guarding 1 - 3 (realistically he can defend 1-4 in today's league)

Not to say Pierce wasn't also a really good defender, but I'd take Klay

actual impact , his presence doesnt correlate with improved results as much as his reputation would suggest

he and other defenders are the eye test/defense equivalent of "empty stats", empty eye test of sorts,

he looks good in defense if you only look at him on ball but doesnt actually inprove a defense much

70sFan wrote:

Gooner wrote:

HeartBreakKid wrote:Pierce by a good bit.

What? Pierce was not a defensive stopper, he was just a solid defender. Klay is a lockdown defender.

Who did he ever lock down?

Serious question or...?

Dame (2019), Conley (2015), Russ (2016) and Cp3 (2014, 2018)

falcolombardi wrote:

parsnips33 wrote:I never understood where this idea that Klay is overrated defensively comes from - cause he doesn't get steals?

Strong wing who's great at guarding 1 - 3 (realistically he can defend 1-4 in today's league)

Not to say Pierce wasn't also a really good defender, but I'd take Klay

actual impact , his presence doesnt correlate with improved results as much as his reputation would suggest

he and other defenders are the eye test/defense equivalent of "empty stats", empty eye test of sorts,

he looks good in defense if you only look at him on ball but doesnt actually inprove a defense much

Doesn't a good defense require good on-ball defenders? Warriors have had historically good defenses with him regularly guarding the point of attack. Obviously Draymond, Bogut, Iguodala were better defenders, but Klay was about as involved in the defense as you can be and we saw the results.

Not sure I trust the defensive impact stats to accurately apportion credit at this point, they seem to me a little premature