’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places?

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’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#1 » by Matt15 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 2:08 am

What are the results? Do they Lakers still make the playoffs? Do the Suns win a title?
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#2 » by ceiling raiser » Mon Sep 13, 2021 2:31 am

Neither team wins a title. The Lakers make a deep playoff run in 2007, and the 2006 Suns probably miss the playoffs
Now that's the difference between first and last place.
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#3 » by Matt15 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 2:45 am

ceiling raiser wrote:Neither team wins a title. The Lakers make a deep playoff run in 2007, and the 2006 Suns probably miss the playoffs


How does Kobe miss the playoffs with a better supporting cast in the ’06 Suns if he already proved he could make it with a worse one with the Lakers? Barbosa/Bell/Kobe/Marion/Diaw seems like an easy playoff birth to me.
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#4 » by Stalwart » Mon Sep 13, 2021 4:48 pm

The Suns win a couple of titles if Kobe's on the team
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#5 » by Im Your Father » Mon Sep 13, 2021 6:00 pm

I think both teams are worse.
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#6 » by SHAQ32 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 7:33 pm

I'll tell you what. Nash's team doesn't go 34-48 with Lamar Odom and Caron Butler. I don't care who's playing SG/C.
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#7 » by Homer38 » Mon Sep 13, 2021 7:54 pm

ceiling raiser wrote:Neither team wins a title. The Lakers make a deep playoff run in 2007, and the 2006 Suns probably miss the playoffs


what?
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#8 » by Eddy_JukeZ » Tue Sep 14, 2021 12:50 am

I think the Suns would win the title in 2007. Nash was just a massive defensive liability vs the Spurs.

Kobe's playmaking isn't as good as Nash, but he's still good at it and a much better volume scorer(an underrated aspect in playoff success to me). I know people aren't high on Kobe's defense those 3 seasons, but I suspect DRAPM has it a fair bit higher than Nash's.

I don't think much changes in 2006, and I do think they'd be slightly worse in 2005.

Lakers miss the playoffs in 2006 and 2005 still. They maybe sneak in 2007 as an 8th seed and then Dirk likely stomps them in the 1st round instead of underperforming vs the Warriors.
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#9 » by Odinn21 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:04 am

Eddy_JukeZ wrote:I know people aren't high on Kobe's defense those 3 seasons, but I suspect DRAPM has it a fair bit higher than Nash's.

This part got me involved because I have the numbers. :D
(Engelmann's rs+ps PI-RAPM numbers)

2005; Nash was 368th (the top 79%) with -1.22 and Bryant was 316th (the top 68%) with -0.71.
2006; Nash was 290th (the top 63%) with -0.56 and Bryant was 309th (the top 68%) with -0.73.
2007; Nash was 211th (the top 46%) with -0.12 and Bryant was 240th (the top 53%) with -0.31.

There's not a significant gap between the 2 in D-RAPM numbers.

I don't think the Suns would win any titles btw. Bryant's play level wasn't great in 2004-05 season after such a bad break-up with O'Neal and more importantly with an on-going sexual assault case. I don't think he could make an impact in Phoenix like Nash did.
2007 is the best for him but the Suns with Nash were extremely resilient against tough defenses in that season. In terms of productivity Bryant was a more productive player than Nash but I don't see him bringing such well-ran offense. I don't think the Suns would win in 2007 but the Suns winning a title with Bryant instead of Nash is a chance I'd put around 30-35%. I'm not saying there's no chance.
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#10 » by Blazers-1977 » Tue Sep 14, 2021 1:52 am

2005:

Suns win 51 games and make the playoffs as the 3rd seed(due to how divison winners were given auto top 3 seed then) and then lose in the first round to the Kings in 7 games

Lakers win 46 games and make the playoffs as the 8th seed and get swept by the Spurs


2006:

Suns win 62 games and make the playoffs as the first seed but lose in the WCF to the Mavs in 7 games

Lakers miss the playoffs


2007:

Suns wins 63 games and win the championship(Kobe wins Finals MVP)

Lakers win 41 games and make the playoffs as an 8 seed before losing to the Mavs in 5 games
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Re: ’05-’07 Lakers/Suns: Kobe and Nash swap places? 

Post#11 » by DirtyDez » Tue Sep 14, 2021 5:49 am

Im Your Father wrote:I think both teams are worse.


This. All those guys suited Nash’s game to a tee.

The Lakers needed Kobe’s scoring.
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