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Josh Smith
Josh Howard
Caron Butler
Jamal Mashburn
Michael Redd
Ron Artest
Steve Smith
Michael Finley
Andrei Kirilenko
Rashard Lewis

Still deciding on my order but I think I'd give Artest the nod at #1

Ranking all 10 might be tedious but I'm interested in your best and worst peaks

I got Ron Artest IMO. He was the best defensive player maybe of that decade. And a top 3 defensive SF of all time and still gave you 20 points per night. He was Scottie Pippen minus the playmaking.

mdonnelly1989 wrote:I got Ron Artest IMO. He was the best defensive player maybe of that decade. And a top 3 defensive SF of all time and still gave you 20 points per night. He was Scottie Pippen minus the playmaking.

I don't think he's even the best defender in that list.

70sFan wrote:

mdonnelly1989 wrote:I got Ron Artest IMO. He was the best defensive player maybe of that decade. And a top 3 defensive SF of all time and still gave you 20 points per night. He was Scottie Pippen minus the playmaking.

I don't think he's even the best defender in that list.

You've got Kirilenko ahead because of his shotblocking or am I missing someone else?

Dutchball97 wrote:

70sFan wrote:

mdonnelly1989 wrote:I got Ron Artest IMO. He was the best defensive player maybe of that decade. And a top 3 defensive SF of all time and still gave you 20 points per night. He was Scottie Pippen minus the playmaking.

I don't think he's even the best defender in that list.

You've got Kirilenko ahead because of his shotblocking or am I missing someone else?

Yes, I have Kirilenko ahead or him. Better off-ball defender and very effective as a man defender as well

Tentative list

2004 Kirilenko (laps the field pretty easily IMO)

1998 Steve Smith
2004 Artest
2008 Lewis (Seattle Lewis works too)

2006 Redd
2008 Butler
some year Michael Finley
2007 Josh Howard (maybe I'm underselling him, he did have a great PS "run" boxscore wise)
2010 Josh Smith
2001 Mashburn (don't think I've ever seen him play? Going strictly by stats here)

GeorgeMarcus wrote:Josh Smith
Josh Howard
Caron Butler
Jamal Mashburn
Michael Redd
Rob Artest
Steve Smith
Michael Finley
Andrei Kirilenko
Rashard Lewis

Still deciding on my order but I think I'd give Artest the nod at #1

I'm gonna do it off memory and not look at stats, maybe I'm hella biased

Artest
Redd
Kirilenko
S Smith
Lewis
Finley
Mashburn
Butler
J Smith
Howard

Finley is a tough one. He put up monster numbers while Nash and Dirk were finding their legs and played enormous minutes. Then as they ascended he turned mostly into a jump shooter, and a good one at that. But hard for me to believe anyone save AK and Artest had a single better year than he did.

AK
Artest
Finley

Gets a lotter harder after that.

I also feel pretty confident about Josh Smith at the very bottom with the other Josh, Howard directly above him.

But that middle? I'd mostly be guessing.

AK imo is easily the best player on this list he was just in the wrong era.

He's the most versatile defender, if he played in the NBA today I have no doubt he would be a better than league average 3pt shooter... He could handle the ball and finish around the rim.

He is the absolute perfect archetype for the modern NBA.

I always loved Josh Smith but man that dude had terrible bball IQ. Without really looking he reminds me of Julius Randle. At ;least 10 times a game I'd be asking myself wtf is this guy even doing?

Butler, Mashburn, Redd, Finley, Smith all had decent statistical seasons but weren't really game changers imo. Redd probably being the best out of the group because he was such a bucket.

I barely even remember Josh Howard, I think he is the clear bottom here.

Artest was an incredible basketball player I'd have him slightly below AK

My top 3:
AK
Artest
Lewis

the middle guys

Smith
Howard

70sFan wrote:

mdonnelly1989 wrote:I got Ron Artest IMO. He was the best defensive player maybe of that decade. And a top 3 defensive SF of all time and still gave you 20 points per night. He was Scottie Pippen minus the playmaking.

I don't think he's even the best defender in that list.

That's close because both players are top 25 defensive players of all time.

Artests man defense and strength is closest during that time period imo to what Peak Dennis Rodman was.

They are very similar imo to defensive players

Now I kinda wish I left the defensive juggernauts (AK and Artest) out of the discussion... The 2 Josh's were pretty good on that end but certainly not at the AK/Artest level

I'll go with:

04 Artest
04 Kirilenko
05 Lewis
06 Redd
08 Butler
10 Smith
00 Finley
07 Howard
00 Mashburn
98 Smith

Random thoughts

Disagree that the Joshes are necessarily right at the bottom.

It may depend on whether seasons have to be in the 2000s (S Smith peaks earlier, Finley maybe, Mash ... probably not but maybe).

Howard is hurt by the team peaking later but 2006 for his combination of impact numbers and box-composites, at first glance seems better than Mashburn, better than Finley. Not a conventional superstar type but seems to have been valuable.

J Smith is perhaps, otoh a little lower due to BBIQ issues but each year 2009-12 he seems positively impactful and in '10 he's productive, he's not trying threes, the shooting is circa neutral, he's getting assists and not trying to take on too much usage. I think the ugly end and quick drop off colors things too much but he was really useful. There may be some issues with his negatives wrt scaling to good teams, unless a smart coach can eliminate them. He's more box-composite productive than Finley and depending on measures maybe held up better in the playoffs (as ever small samples, differing opponents etc), but takes more off the table and via googlesites RAPM slightly less impactful at peak.

Steve Smith might depend on how you weigh playoffs, whether you think his higher end performances there were more signal/replicable or noise.

Redd might depend how seriously you take career level impact signals against his defense in a single year.

Personal preference would be AK at the top but Artest/MWP/MSA has an impact case that you'd have take a good look at if doing this seriously (of course he also has the volatility downside).

I'd have as the top 4

Andrei Kirilenko
Rashard Lewis
Ron Artest
Michael Redd

AK has some pretty elite advanced stats including a 9 BPM season. Artest has always looked good in RAPM. I've always been a fan of Rashard's stretch 4 impact while being solid enough defensively. Redd is putting up a legit 25-26ppg and ahead of his time 3s/FTAs.

Josh Howard
Michael Finley
Steve Smith

Varying degrees of solid wings. Howard being the 2nd best player on 60 W+ teams is pretty impressive.

Josh Smith
Caron Butler
Jamal Mashburn

I don't know that much about Mashburn but his efficiency is not that great. I'm actually going to put Josh Smith NOT last, even though he has the lowest bball IQ here he still was a solid contributor to some 50 W Hawks teams due to his talent. I enjoyed the Caron Butler experience but unlike players in the above group who translated to contenders, it was mostly on fringe playoff Wizards teams where he got to be more of an iso guy and playmaker than he would on a better team, and while he was past his prime him getting injured on the Mavs was probably a good thing for them.