Gobert is nowhere near a superstar

[mdonnelly1989]

I'm done hearing about how 'valuable' Gobert is in the regular season just to watch the Jazz crumble in the playoffs.

Seriously? You can't take the Mavs without a top 5 player in the league.

This goes for Donavan Mitchell too... This Jazz team is too good on paper to be losing to the Luka less Mavs.

Gobert is nowhere near a super star and not someone I would want to build my team around even as a second tier star. His skill set just isn't as valuable today as it would be in the 90s with everyone going small today.

[BIGJ1ER]

How are you watching what transpired in this game and blaming Gobert? I suggest you rewatch the footage and take a look at the Jazz POA defence. Mavs have a 3%TOV rate, noone other than house can stay in front of brunson, and laughably no one has thought of forcing him right.

Oh, and when donovan mitchell is involved in the action tonight, the Jazz gave up 1.5ppp.

All those corner threes you're seeing generated - they're coming from the POA collapsing, forcing Gobert to help, leaving kleber and DFS etc wide open every time, which is still a better option for the D than an easy layup at the rim for brunson or dinwiddie. This Jazz roster sucks, plain and simple. Mavs are doing a good job of running them off the 3 point line too, lowering their potential offensive output as the Jazz love to spread Pnr and shoot threes.

I can't disagree more when I see Gobert getting blamed for nights like tonight, I'm truly baffled and wonder what you or anyone accusing him for being the primary cause of blame are watching when statements like this are made.

[LukaTheGOAT]

I still believe in Donovan Mitchell.

[GSP]

I still believe in Donovan Mitchell.

You shouldnt

Read on Twitter

[GSP]

I dont think anyone except ppl who overemphasize regular season impact stats like Raptor, Rpm etc actually consider Rudy a "superstar". Hes still a great top 20 player just very overpaid but Utah had no choice b/c theyre prolly not even in the playoffs without him

[dygaction]

Thought he could be modern day Bill Russell, elite defense but offensively challenged, but looks like he is even more challenged particularly playing next to Mitchell.

[TheGOATRises007]

I don't think anyone ever called him a superstar.

There's only a few of those in the league.

[Ryoga Hibiki]

Rudy is about top15, that is comfortably in 30% max range he's being paid now.
I think we should understand what to expect from a top15 player, though

[tsherkin]

I dont think anyone except ppl who overemphasize regular season impact stats like Raptor, Rpm etc actually consider Rudy a "superstar". Hes still a great top 20 player just very overpaid but Utah had no choice b/c theyre prolly not even in the playoffs without him

I think that's probably a pretty good way to look at it. Dallas was 22/47 (46.8%) from 3 in Game 2; not sure what Gobert is supposed to do about that. They made more 3s than 2s in the 1st and 2nd quarter, and then as many or more in the 3rd and 4th quarter.

[Jaivl]

Gobert is still an easy top 15 (10-12 for me).

I don't think that's a superstar, but your post is hella stupid. We're two days removed from watching him limit Dallas to 93 points basically by himself.

[Statlanta]

Their scheme and personnel don't match. Everybody on the perimeter is short/slow and Rudy is too conservative as a big to rotate to any shooter.

It's just a red carpet every time to the rim. I wish Luka got to see this defense.

[Colbinii]

Rudy is about top15, that is comfortably in 30% max range he's being paid now.
I think we should understand what to expect from a top15 player, though

Yup. These are players who typically have multiple characteristics:

1) Exceptional skill or ability [Kyrie's scoring, Goberts Defense, Trae Young Scoring]

2) Either a weakness or lack something which prevents them from having The entire package

3) From a team building standpoint, needs another player in the same range to be a playoff contender.

If you're a Top 15 player, you might be expected to win a playoff series but you shouldn't be expected to win 2 unless you're paired with another player of this caliber. Unfortunately Donovan Mitchell is closer to top 25-30 area and that makes this Utah squad either a 1st round exit or 2nd round fodder.

[70sFan]

Another Utah loss that Gobert gets undeserved blame for. Can we stop this ridiculous narrative?

[RCM88x]

Utah's roster is in such a weird spot. They've basically tried to go all in defensively and offensively at times during the last 5-6 years and both have floundered in the playoffs. Perhaps their current all-offense approach works better in the regular season but in the playoffs they simply expect Gobert to defend every action and cover every mistake which is just not feasible.

Both Gobert or Mitchell either need to be traded or Utah needs to change their approach completely. But unfortunately for them they'll always be limited by their lack of a truly elite player, neither Gobert of Mitchell are on that level.

[mdonnelly1989]

Another Utah loss that Gobert gets undeserved blame for. Can we stop this ridiculous narrative?

I'm blaming the whole team, but I'm taking several big men on my team before Gobert. Stephen A was just talking about how Gobert is a liability out there when they go small.

Maybe it's not that he plays bad, but his skill set isn't evolved for todays game. When a team goes small he just doesn't dominate like he should IMO.

[RCM88x]

Another Utah loss that Gobert gets undeserved blame for. Can we stop this ridiculous narrative?

I'm blaming the whole team, but I'm taking several big men on my team before Gobert. Stephen A was just talking about how Gobert is a liability out there when they go small.

Maybe it's not that he plays bad, but his skill set isn't evolved for todays game. When a team goes small he just doesn't dominate like he should IMO.

We'll sure there are a number of bigs who are better overall, but I don't think any of them are as good defensively as Gobert is.

I imagine someone like Bam on this team instead of Gobert and see them struggling massively on the defensive end. As "bad" as Utah was for their standards they were still 9th in the league at -1.5 in DRTG.

[70sFan]

Another Utah loss that Gobert gets undeserved blame for. Can we stop this ridiculous narrative?

I'm blaming the whole team, but I'm taking several big men on my team before Gobert. Stephen A was just talking about how Gobert is a liability out there when they go small.

Maybe it's not that he plays bad, but his skill set isn't evolved for todays game. When a team goes small he just doesn't dominate like he should IMO.

I'd start with not listening what Stephen A says...

There are certain limitations in his offensive game that could be problematic against smaller lineups, but the truth is that any bigman in his role would look horrible defensively. Put Draymond in his place and he'd not look good either.

[LAL1947]

Another Utah loss that Gobert gets undeserved blame for. Can we stop this ridiculous narrative?

I'm blaming the whole team, but I'm taking several big men on my team before Gobert. Stephen A was just talking about how Gobert is a liability out there when they go small.

Maybe it's not that he plays bad, but his skill set isn't evolved for todays game. When a team goes small he just doesn't dominate like he should IMO.

I'd start with not listening what Stephen A says...

There are certain limitations in his offensive game that could be problematic against smaller lineups, but the truth is that any bigman in his role would look horrible defensively. Put Draymond in his place and he'd not look good either.

Perhaps, this is something that can be asked in the Wilt vs Duncan thread to stimulate discussion in that topic, i.e., how would Duncan look in Gobert's role on the Jazz? Would Wilt fare better than either on offense or defense?

I'd start with not listening what Stephen A says...

That's a good point, hehe.

[Texas Chuck]

I will die on the hill that Rudy Gobert has superstar impact. You know, because he has superstar impact. Dallas is abusing the perimeter defense, not Gobert. And the fact that his guards can't throw him a halfway decent lob pass is not on him either.

[70sFan]

I'm blaming the whole team, but I'm taking several big men on my team before Gobert. Stephen A was just talking about how Gobert is a liability out there when they go small.

Maybe it's not that he plays bad, but his skill set isn't evolved for todays game. When a team goes small he just doesn't dominate like he should IMO.

I'd start with not listening what Stephen A says...

There are certain limitations in his offensive game that could be problematic against smaller lineups, but the truth is that any bigman in his role would look horrible defensively. Put Draymond in his place and he'd not look good either.

Perhaps, this is something that can be asked in the Wilt vs Duncan thread to stimulate discussion in that topic, i.e., how would Duncan look in Gobert's role on the Jazz? Would Wilt fare better than either on offense or defense?

I'd start with not listening what Stephen A says...

That's a good point, hehe.

Both Wilt and Duncan would look better because you can't play small against them. Defensively though, they would also struggle to keep Jazz competitive, though lack of small balls would definitely help.