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10 Best Seasons Combined: Duncan closer to Hakeem or Hakeem closer to Shaq

This answer only applies of course for those who think Shaq is better than Hakeem who is better than Duncan

I personally don't see an argument for Duncan over Hakeem. Hakeem was better defensively (comfortably) and better offensively.

I do however, see an argument for Hakeem over Shaq. Hakeem was more balanced. But personally think Shaq overcomes that with his dominance on the offensive end.

Probably too much of a leading question. I don't recall many people who have them ranked Shaq > Hakeem > Duncan on here.

Shaq is not necesarrily better

This is how I would rank each player's best ten season stretch. The margins are incredibly thin all around but I guess that means I've got Hakeem closer to Shaq...

DUNCAN 98-99 to 07-08
RS: 25.4 PER | .550 TS% | 128.5 WS | .225 WS/48 | 6.4 BPM | 110 ORtg | 94 DRtg
PS: 26.4 PER | .552 TS% | 26.1 WS | .215 WS/48 | 7.3 BPM | 110 ORtg | 97 DRtg

SHAQUILLE 93-94 to 02-03
RS: 29.1 PER | .584 TS% | 125.1 WS | .241 WS/48 | 6.9 BPM | 115 ORtg | 101 DRtg
PS: 28.7 PER | .568 TS% | 24.0 WS | .211 WS/48 | 7.0 BPM | 114 ORtg | 104 DRtg

HAKEEM 85-86 to 94-95
RS: 24.8 PER | .557 TS% | 114.1 WS | .194 WS/48 | 5.7 BPM | 110 ORtg | 97 DRtg
PS: 26.9 PER | .575 TS% | 17.9 WS | .204 WS/48 | 7.5 BPM | 114 ORtg | 101 DRtg

I actually have both Hakeem and Duncan ahead of Shaq, so...

Hakeem 8th, Duncan 9th, Shaq 10th on my rank. Hakeem was the best player out of those 3.

What are the reasons for having Hakeem significantly over Duncan as a defender? Is there something more detailed beyond stocks + eye test + accolades?

mdonnelly1989 wrote:I personally don't see an argument for Duncan over Hakeem. Hakeem was better defensively (comfortably) and better offensively.

Which metrics prove this? Which metrics are you basing this on?

Dooley wrote:What are the reasons for having Hakeem significantly over Duncan as a defender? Is there something more detailed beyond stocks + eye test + accolades?

Hakeem is considered a top 2 defender of all time at all positions. Duncan is considered top 10. And albeit is historically great in his own right. I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively

70sFan wrote:I actually have both Hakeem and Duncan ahead of Shaq, so...

What about between Hakeem and Duncan ?

mdonnelly1989 wrote:

Dooley wrote:What are the reasons for having Hakeem significantly over Duncan as a defender? Is there something more detailed beyond stocks + eye test + accolades?

Hakeem is considered a top 2 defender of all time at all positions. Duncan is considered top 10. And albeit is historically great in his own right. I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively.

You're kidding, right?

All Defensive First Teams:
Duncan: 8
Hakeem: 5

All Defensive Teams:
Duncan: 15
Hakeem: 9

DPOY:
Hakeem: 2
Duncan: 0

Career Defensive Rating:
Duncan: 96
Hakeem: 98

Duncan leads in Defensive Win Shares per 48 in the RS and playoffs, though, it is close.

There's also this:



They're at least relatively close on defense. What you're saying here- "I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively."- is totally unfounded.

And, I'd take Russell and Wilt and Thurmond over Hakeem defensively. Many, many would, here, and elsewhere.

So, he's not a top 2 defender of all time at all positions, either.

ty 4191 wrote:

mdonnelly1989 wrote:

Dooley wrote:What are the reasons for having Hakeem significantly over Duncan as a defender? Is there something more detailed beyond stocks + eye test + accolades?

Hakeem is considered a top 2 defender of all time at all positions. Duncan is considered top 10. And albeit is historically great in his own right. I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively.

You're kidding, right?

All Defensive First Teams:
Duncan: 8
Hakeem: 5

All Defensive Teams:
Duncan: 15
Hakeem: 9

DPOY:
Hakeem: 2
Duncan: 0

Career Defensive Rating:
Duncan: 96
Hakeem: 98

Duncan leads in Defensive Win Shares per 48 in the RS and playoffs, though, it is close.

There's also this:



They're at least relatively close on defense. What you're saying here- "I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively."- is totally unfounded.

And, I'd take Russell and Wilt and Thurmond over Hakeem defensively. Many, many would, here, and elsewhere.

So, he's not a top 2 defender of all time at all positions, either.

I'm willing to bet that if we did a poll Hakeem would end up going #2 in that poll. And very few votes would go to Duncan.

I think people would take David Robinson, Ben Wallace, Mutombo and maybe even Wilt and KG over Duncan. He's in that class.

I feel like Hakeem and Bill Russell are in their own tier slightly ahead of the next.

ty 4191 wrote:

mdonnelly1989 wrote:

Dooley wrote:What are the reasons for having Hakeem significantly over Duncan as a defender? Is there something more detailed beyond stocks + eye test + accolades?

Hakeem is considered a top 2 defender of all time at all positions. Duncan is considered top 10. And albeit is historically great in his own right. I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively.

You're kidding, right?

All Defensive First Teams:
Duncan: 8
Hakeem: 5

All Defensive Teams:
Duncan: 15
Hakeem: 9

DPOY:
Hakeem: 2
Duncan: 0

Career Defensive Rating:
Duncan: 96
Hakeem: 98

Duncan leads in Defensive Win Shares per 48 in the RS and playoffs, though, it is close.

There's also this:



They're at least relatively close on defense. What you're saying here- "I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively."- is totally unfounded.

And, I'd take Russell and Wilt and Thurmond over Hakeem defensively. Many, many would, here, and elsewhere.

So, he's not a top 2 defender of all time at all positions, either.

Found this. https://www.lineups.com/articles/best-defenders-in-nba-history-top-50/

https://www.nbadraft.net/forums/topic/best-defensive-centers-all-time/

https://www.ranker.com/list/the-best-nba-defensive-players-of-all-time-v1/jeffnorth

https://www.thesportster.com/basketball/top-15-nba-defenders-of-all-time/

This is 4 lists where The Dream was ranked top 2 and Duncan wasn't even top 5 on any list. Some lists not even top 10

mdonnelly1989 wrote:

ty 4191 wrote:

mdonnelly1989 wrote:
Hakeem is considered a top 2 defender of all time at all positions. Duncan is considered top 10. And albeit is historically great in his own right. I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively.

You're kidding, right?

All Defensive First Teams:
Duncan: 8
Hakeem: 5

All Defensive Teams:
Duncan: 15
Hakeem: 9

DPOY:
Hakeem: 2
Duncan: 0

Career Defensive Rating:
Duncan: 96
Hakeem: 98

Duncan leads in Defensive Win Shares per 48 in the RS and playoffs, though, it is close.

There's also this:



They're at least relatively close on defense. What you're saying here- "I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively."- is totally unfounded.

And, I'd take Russell and Wilt and Thurmond over Hakeem defensively. Many, many would, here, and elsewhere.

So, he's not a top 2 defender of all time at all positions, either.

I'm willing to bet that if we did a poll Hakeem would end up going #2 in that poll. And very few votes would go to Duncan.

I think people would take David Robinson, Ben Wallace, Mutombo and maybe even Wilt and KG over Duncan. He's in that class.

I feel like Hakeem and Bill Russell are in their own tier slightly ahead of the next.

You just totally ignored everything I posted.

Let's make a poll. Let's see.

mdonnelly1989 wrote:

Dooley wrote:What are the reasons for having Hakeem significantly over Duncan as a defender? Is there something more detailed beyond stocks + eye test + accolades?

Hakeem is considered a top 2 defender of all time at all positions. Duncan is considered top 10. And albeit is historically great in his own right. I don't know anyone or have ever meant anyone who considers Duncan on the same level defensively

IDK personally I think they're both all-time inner-circle defenders and I tend to think that there's not a ton of separation between the elite-elite all-time defensive bigs in terms of impact. I could maybe see an argument that Hakeem is a little ahead of Duncan. Pretty dubious that he's comfortably ahead or that the difference is clear and stark.

mdonnelly1989 wrote:Found this. https://www.lineups.com/articles/best-defenders-in-nba-history-top-50/

https://www.nbadraft.net/forums/topic/best-defensive-centers-all-time/

https://www.ranker.com/list/the-best-nba-defensive-players-of-all-time-v1/jeffnorth

https://www.thesportster.com/basketball/top-15-nba-defenders-of-all-time/

This is 4 lists where The Dream was ranked top 2 and Duncan wasn't even top 5 on any list. Some lists not even top 10

I created a new discussion. See the main page at the Player Comparisons homepage.

Basically any of them could be in any order.