Steph Pippen vs LeBron James

[rand]

Who would you take for 2023, peak LeBron James or a hybrid of Steph Curry and Scottie Pippen both at their peak, taking only the stronger attribute from each player?

[TheLand13]

Does Steph Pippen get Durant as a teammate at some point?

[LesGrossman]

Does Steph Pippen get Durant as a teammate at some point?

Does LeBron "need more help"?

[eminence]

Steph Pippen, and it's not all that close, though that's generally my opinion of these combo guys vs real players. If they get all the best of one another and they aren't significantly overlapping players it's probably an absurdly good player. As you get larger physical outliers the level of player needed drops further. Boban+Ty Jerome is a GOAT candidate.

[TheLand13]

Does Steph Pippen get Durant as a teammate at some point?

Does LeBron "need more help"?

If he’s facing a Steph Pippen with Durant as his teammate? Yeah probably.

[TheLand13]

Steph Pippen, and it's not all that close, though that's generally my opinion of these combo guys vs real players. If they get all the best of one another and they aren't significantly overlapping players it's probably an absurdly good player. As you get larger physical outliers the level of player needed drops further. Boban+Ty Jerome is a GOAT candidate.

This, although I don’t know about that last part. But yes, a hybrid of Steph and Pippen is absurd.

But I would need to know more about this hybrid of the two before I can commit to him. Yes you’re getting Steph’s shooting and Pippens defense, which is insane. But what else is he as a player? Can he run the offense at an elite level? How good are his handles? What’s his height, weight, style of play? What’s his personality like?

Without really knowing these factors, it’s hard to pass up on LeBron, simply because I know exactly what I’m getting out of him, which is a legitimate GOAT candidate who we have seen carry teams in a way no one else has ever been able to before.

[No-more-rings]

Well assuming Curry’s handles and shooting carry over to a 6’8 220 frame I think that’s easily the goat offensive player.

[RCM88x]

I mean obviously Steph Pippen is better

[Cavsfansince84]

I mean obviously Steph Pippen is better

I agree though I think there is a built in advantage in combining two players when one gave most of his energy on defense and the other on offense into a hypothetical player when that is much harder to do on an actual bb court. Most guys can only sustain being near the top of the league on both ends for like 2-3 years at most. It would be a more interesting comparison if this were something like 2018 LeBron in 2009 LeBron's body.

[VanWest82]

Steph Pippen is basically MJ, only shooting 3s instead of 2s. Someone will argue Scottie's bigger and Jordan got the FT line at rate neither touched, but as a general concept the comp works.

[PaulieWal]

Steph Pippen is basically MJ, only shooting 3s instead of 2s. Someone will argue Scottie's bigger and Jordan got the FT line at rate neither touched, but as a general concept the comp works.

I think Steph Pippen would be comfortably better than MJ.

[TheLand13]

Steph Pippen is basically MJ, only shooting 3s instead of 2s. Someone will argue Scottie's bigger and Jordan got the FT line at rate neither touched, but as a general concept the comp works.

I think Steph Pippen would be comfortably better than MJ.

Not really. Again, we're only taking the strongest attributes from both players. So in this case, three point shooting and defense. That's not enough to make you better than MJ, let alone LeBron.

And VanWest, your comparison is way off. Steph Pippen is basically MJ? No he's not. Pippen's style of defense is very different from how MJ played that end, who specialized more in one on one defense than he did team defense like Pippen did. And only shooting threes instead of twos? Yeah, that's not how this works. How Curry got his offense is very different from how MJ did, not to mention how they played off the ball.

We have at best the greatest 3/D player the game will have ever seen, which I'm completely fine with. But I don't think that makes him better than MJ.

[VanWest82]

Steph Pippen is basically MJ, only shooting 3s instead of 2s. Someone will argue Scottie's bigger and Jordan got the FT line at rate neither touched, but as a general concept the comp works.

I think Steph Pippen would be comfortably better than MJ.

Not really. Again, we're only taking the strongest attributes from both players. So in this case, three point shooting and defense. That's not enough to make you better than MJ, let alone LeBron.

And VanWest, your comparison is way off. Steph Pippen is basically MJ? No he's not. Pippen's style of defense is very different from how MJ played that end, who specialized more in one on one defense than he did team defense like Pippen did. And only shooting threes instead of twos? Yeah, that's not how this works. How Curry got his offense is very different from how MJ did, not to mention how they played off the ball.

We have at best the greatest 3/D player the game will have ever seen, which I'm completely fine with. But I don't think that makes him better than MJ.

Mike was an excellent team defender earlier in his career. That's how he won DPOY. Why are we taking only the best attributes of the blended player but then assuming some lesser verion of the compared player?

I think there's lots of similarity in how Jordan and Curry get their shots coming off screens and pin downs, giving the ball up to get it back, etc. The difference is Jordan was catching it in the MR whereas Curry C&S 3s. They both were great creating their own shot off the bounce, again Jordan more so in MR vs. three. Jordan put pressure on the rim like Scottie.

Kawhi is another interesting comp but he wasn't the threat moving off ball that MJ and Curry were, so stylistically it doesn't make as much sense.

[PaulieWal]

I think there's lots of similarity in how Jordan and Curry get their shots coming off screens and pin downs, giving the ball up to get it back, etc. The difference is Jordan was catching it in the MR whereas Curry C&S 3s. They both were great creating their own shot off the bounce, again Jordan more so in MR vs. three. Jordan put pressure on the rim like Scottie.

No offense but MJ wasn't getting his shots like Curry does. Yes, both are excellent off-ball players, but Curry is in another stratosphere with his off ball movement vs. MJ. And that's not a slight on MJ, they are two very different players and the way their team offenses needed them to operate was also quite different.

[VanWest82]

I think there's lots of similarity in how Jordan and Curry get their shots coming off screens and pin downs, giving the ball up to get it back, etc. The difference is Jordan was catching it in the MR whereas Curry C&S 3s. They both were great creating their own shot off the bounce, again Jordan more so in MR vs. three. Jordan put pressure on the rim like Scottie.

No offense but MJ wasn't getting his shots like Curry does. Yes, both are excellent off-ball players, but Curry is in another stratosphere with his off ball movement vs. MJ. And that's not a slight on MJ, they are two very different players and the way their team offenses needed them to operate was also quite different.

How do you suggest Curry's off ball movement gets translated to Scottie? Are we changing laws of physics here? MJ was as fluid as anyone at that size in the history of sport. Little guys move better. Stylistically, MJ was getting his shots a lot like Steph does.

[PaulieWal]

I think there's lots of similarity in how Jordan and Curry get their shots coming off screens and pin downs, giving the ball up to get it back, etc. The difference is Jordan was catching it in the MR whereas Curry C&S 3s. They both were great creating their own shot off the bounce, again Jordan more so in MR vs. three. Jordan put pressure on the rim like Scottie.

No offense but MJ wasn't getting his shots like Curry does. Yes, both are excellent off-ball players, but Curry is in another stratosphere with his off ball movement vs. MJ. And that's not a slight on MJ, they are two very different players and the way their team offenses needed them to operate was also quite different.

How do you suggest Curry's off ball movement gets translated to Scottie? Are we changing laws of physics here? MJ was as fluid as anyone at that size in the history of sport. Little guys move better. Stylistically, MJ was getting his shots a lot like Steph does.

Yes we are changing the laws of physics here

The whole comp is make-believe, dude lol. "Steph Pippen"

Any my reply was more so just comparing MJ vs. actual Curry in their off ball prowess and how they play and get their shots. MJ wasn't running around screens non-stop like Curry does.

[TheLand13]

Mike was an excellent team defender earlier in his career. That's how he won DPOY.

MJ's best attributes when it comes to defense was his one on one play. Yes he was at his best as a team defender early in his career, but one on one is always where he excelled the most.

Why are we taking only the best attributes of the blended player but then assuming some lesser verion of the compared player?

...I'm not. I'm outright telling you what MJ's best attributes as a defender are. No where do I say that MJ was a bad team defender.

I think there's lots of similarity in how Jordan and Curry get their shots coming off screens and pin downs, giving the ball up to get it back, etc. The difference is Jordan was catching it in the MR whereas Curry C&S 3s. They both were great creating their own shot off the bounce, again Jordan more so in MR vs. three. Jordan put pressure on the rim like Scottie.

...how many Michael Jordan games have you watched?

Don't get me wrong, Jordan is one of the greatest off ball players in the history of the game, but how he got his baskets off ball and how Curry did it were totally different.

[OdomFan]

Steph Pippen easily. Scotties defensive ability mixed with Currys shooting, speed. The speed alone will only make the defense that much more dangerous against Lebron and anyone else. Lebron would be very frustrated against such a hybrid.

[tsherkin]

Is this a serious question?

Lebron vs Steph is at least an interesting debate. Lebron vs Steph who is 6'7 and also arguably the best perimeter defender of all-time? That clearly wins.

[SinceGatlingWasARookie]

Does Steph Pippen get Durant as a teammate at some point?

Klay and Dray is enough. Steph Pippen does not need Durant.

But Steph Pippen is a small forward so he gets to pay with 2 guards. Klay and Barbosa and Klay and Poole.

Iguodala and Wiggins become back up defensive stoppers.