2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Complete

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2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Complete 

Post#1 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jun 13, 2023 8:12 pm

Here's a link to the Discussion thread that preceded the vote.

Previous instructions here in spoilers:

Spoiler:
The time draws near for us to come together again and give our say on who, when all is said and done in June, is most deserving of the great accolades of 2021-22.

This is something we began in 2010 with the Retro Player of the Year project which took us back to the dawn of the Shot Clock Era, and it's something we've continued since - with the addition of other awards beginning in 2015.

Here's a link to the original thread:

Retro Player of the Year Project

That thread has links to votings from individual years as well as the spreadsheets, which I'll be posting again below:

RealGM All-Season Award Winners

RealGM All-Season Awards Shares through 22-23

What are the awards and how will we vote for them?

Player of the Year
Only 5 man ballot.
Vote weighting the same as NBA MVP: 10-7-5-3-1.
To be based on actual basketball achievement this NBA season - not a statement of who you'd draft first, or any other reasoning.

But that is still intended to give you a lot of room for your own vantage point, which you will be expected to speak from when you vote.

This is the original award, and the only award you must vote for.

All other awards will have a 3 man ballot using the 5-3-1 voting scheme the NBA uses for its other awards.

The other awards:

Offensive Player of the Year
Defensive Player of the Year
Rookie of the Year
Most Improved Player
6th Man of the Year
Coach of the Year
Executive of the Year

All awards should be seen from an achievement-oriented perspective like the POY, however the concept of achievement admittedly gets murkier the more you go down the list. Be sincere and open about what you put forward, and I'm sure it will be great.

One more note: All ballots must be complete in order to count. If you simply put down first place votes, it won't count. If you forget to type a name for the last spot on some award, your vote for that award won't count.

How do we become voters?

1. Participate in this thread sincerely and frequently. Note: Voters from previous years are allowed more wiggle room on this.
2. PM me.

When and where will we vote?

Typically voting opens within a week of the last NBA Finals game, and goes for a week.


TL; DR:
1. Only vote if you're in the Voting Body (shown below).
2. Only post in this thread for your official vote until I tally the totals up so it's easy for me.
3. Any award you vote for you need to do a full ballot or it won't count.
4. POY voting is mandatory, all others optional.
5. Top 5 for POY, Top 3 for all others.

Voting Body

1. The-Power
2. AEnigma
3. Ambrose
4. ardee
5. Colbinii
6. Doctor MJ
7. Dutchball97
8. eminence
9. GSP
10. HeartBreakKid
11. iggymcfrack
12. jalengreen
13. jazzfan1971
14. MyUniBroDavis
15. OkayoKD
16. Outside
17. TexasChuck
18. rk2023
19. SpreeS
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#2 » by Ambrose » Wed Jun 14, 2023 2:32 pm

Player of the year

1. Nikola Jokic-I don't really think this one requires an explanation. It speaks for itself.
2. Jayson Tatum-This is where things get interesting. Everyone from here on out has pretty severe flaws in their cases. The gap between 1 and 2 is massive. I decided on Tatum for the simple fact that he was the only one left that had a semblance of consistency between durability, a high level regular season, and high level postseason. If not for a sprained ankle early in ECF G7, it's quite possible he advances and this isn't a close choice.
3. Jimmy Butler-The perception of Jimmy has come back to Earth. He had a strong regular season for him, but compared to everyone else in contention was lacking a bit. He made that up with a monster series against Milwaukee, but after that, injured or not, he wasn't anything special in the postseason. I couldn't justify putting him ahead of Tatum with the large regular season gap, and Butler really not having much better of a postseason if at all. While the gap between his regular season and Embiid's was large, so was the postseason gap, and it's hard to ignore the consistencies we've seen from both guys there.
4. Joel Embiid-I strongly considered putting him 5th. His health issues and disappearing act in the postseason are commonplace at this point and are not acceptable of a player of his caliber. Overall, I decided that the extra amount of games and career best regular season kept him ahead of Giannis slightly, but I don't feel a good about it.
5. Giannis Antetokounmpo-His season has been severely underrated because he happened to get injured in round 1 and played against Jimmy going supernova. His regular season is well above any other player left, and even injured, was productive after rushing back. No one else left is comparable in terms of two way play or overall resume to me.

Offensive Player of the Year

1. Nikola Jokic-What is there to say? He's the best offensive player in the NBA, he had the most efficient high volume scoring season ever, and every number out there says he's on his own tier offensively right now.
2. Luka Doncic-He's not on the level of the POY candidates defensively, and obviously didn't make the postseason which hurts him. With that said, it's hard to ignore the value he brought offensively this year. Metrics like 538 Raptor are extraordinarily high on his offense this year, and it's easy to see why. Career highs in PPG, TS%, ORTG, OBPM, etc. Unfortunately for him his management screwed the team trading for Kyrie, and then told him to quit. Before that Luka was comfortably better than any non-Jokic player in the NBA offensively, and Dallas was a playoff team because of it.
3.Steph Curry-He missed too many games and didn't have the caliber of year for me to place him second. That said, he had some phenomenal postseason games to bump him the list. He averaged a career high on ps PPG, and still brings an unmatched level of gravity and defensive attention at this stage of his career. No one who played more than him brings as much offensive impact as he does imo.

Defensive Player of the Year

1. Anthony Davis-This mostly comes down to peak play. I thought what we saw from AD the first this postseason was far and away above anything we saw from anyone else this year. He also played more regular season minutes than the DPOY, so I can't say his durability issues cost him here. When he's at his best AD is absolutely an ATG defensively.
2. Bam Adebayo-Bam was a defensive force for Miami all season. He was asked to do so much on that end this postseason for the Heat to be successful and time and time again his impact was felt on that end. Between being their only rim protector, switching everything, and guarding guys on the perimeter, he was thrown into a remarkably difficult situation defensively and yet he consistently excelled at it to his team's benefit.
3.Jaren Jackson Jr.-He was legitimately impactful and disruptive player defensively this season after always showing the potential in years past. He couldn't necessarily adapt in the playoffs but he was a strong enough regular season to be a legitimate DPOY contender. He's a terror as a rim protector and that's incredibly valuable to a team in 2023.

Most Improved Player

1. Shai Gilgeous Alexander-To put it simply, SGA finally put together a fully healthy season while making the leap some have expected for a number of years now. I think he's a legitimate top 15 player in the NBA, and that's the really he gets the nod over Lauri because I think the gap between the two players currently is quite large.
2. Lauri Markkanen-Talk about a great story. This dude seemed cooked a few years ago with his exhaustion issues in Chicago, is dealt to Cleveland and kind of forgotten about, gets thrown in the Mitchell deal as an add on, and then becomes a legitimate All Star level player having by far the best season of his career. It's crazy to think all it took was to stop making him a spacer to get a huge leap, and that he's only 26 years old.
3. Jaren Jackson Jr.-JJJ has had all the tools to be the perfect modern big for a while. But he's never put it all together until this season. After forgetting how to shoot 3's for two years he was able to find a respectable percentage from deep again on solid volume. He efficiency overall offensively went from well below average to quite strong. He's still foul prone defensively but it does seem he also made a leap on that end this year as a legitimately impactful guy on that end. The last two years have seen his on/off numbers take a huge turn from awful to easily the best on the Grizzlies.

Coach of the Year

1. Erik Spoelstra-I firmly believe there isn't any other coach in the NBA who could've pulled off what he did this season. He's a big reason "Heat Culture" exists. He's able to get the most out of all of his guys, while simultaneously making things really difficult for other teams. Tatum/Brown looked really flustered at times, and no one did a better job of bothering Denver offensively than Miami (even if it wasn't enough).
2. Mike Brown-I think we need to remember that Mike Brown did an absolutely phenomenal job this year talking a team no one thought had a chance at making the playoffs to the 3rd seed in his first year as coach. He's been a defensive guy the majority of his career but was smart enough to adapt and build an offensive juggernaut that took this team further than they have gone in nearly 15 years. They were bounced in round 1 but for a team like Sac to push the reigning champs to 7 feels a lot more like a triumph than a letdown to me.
3. Mike Malone-The pettiest coach in the league these days knows exactly what he needs to do to get the best out of him team. You have to give Malone credit for constantly having his guys ready to play, keeping a chip on their shoulder at all times, and consistently thriving down the stretch in close games.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#3 » by rk2023 » Wed Jun 14, 2023 3:35 pm

POY:

Spoiler:
1. Nikola Jokic:
It is a testament to his basketball mind and commitment that this likely is my easiest ballot selection. I don’t think there has been anyone in NBA History who is comfortably a tier above Jokic’s offensive track record from the last two years. In the Regular Season, Jokic put up 24.5/11.8/9.8 on a blistering 70.1%!!! True Shooting (12% > League Average) whilst posting close to all time Tier-1 marks in various box & impact metrics. While his face value scoring efficiency dropped into the playoffs, ramping up volume to 30 points on 63% True Shooting is impressive and then some - this while maintaining the rest of what makes his triple-threat attack as special as it is (>= quadruple threat with off-ball activity considered, frankly). For any “It’s hard to field a solid performing playoff cast around Jokic due to this defense” believers: The Nuggets had a 11.7 Net-Rating (122.3 - 110.6) in non garbage-time minutes with Jokic on the floor this playoffs. Of course teammates are influencing such, but the Nuggets go as Jokic goes; while I’m not sold on him being a tangible positive value defender at this point in time, I will say that Jokic does a lot to mitigate his shortcomings on that end. As a historical blurb to conclude, there have been 18 unanimous POTY selections in 69 years (~26%) of the projects’ retro and real-time voting - where 9 players (Russell - 3, Wilt, Kareem - 2, Moses, Bird - 2, Jordan - 4, Shaq - 2, Garnett, James - 2) make up the slate of selections. Of course, this honor is relative-to-era/year at root, but it is still a surreal feat for Jokic to (hopefully) join. He’s earned every bit of it, as far as I am concerned.

2. Jayson Tatum:
When taking more of an approach prioritizing achievement and aggregate value, the higher Tatum gets in a seasonal ranking. There are still areas in his game I would like to see reinforced / tapped into more often, but he is available, he plays both ends, and the Celtics (most of the time) are catalyzed by him. This availability is reflected well in RS impact metrics quantifying the aggregate. For example, Tatum tied Embiid for 2nd in the league in BBI’s LEBRON WAR as well as Dunks-And-Threes eW (derived from EPM) in the regular season. In the playoffs, I would say the Celtics came short of overall expectations; however, with some roster holes, pretty poor coaching, and a cast I would say disappointed in comparison to their regular season performance - it’s still impressive to have been one win away from the NBA finals. Filtering a game he played very little in as well as his ankle injury, Tatum averaged the following this playoffs: 29/10.7/5.4/1.1/1.1 - on 60.2% True Shooting. When you look at recent players who were deployed in aggregate as their teams’ best scorer, playmaker, & defender (whether this is optimal or not), only Bron and Giannis come to mind. I believe Tatum fits this superlative (which is something I regard highly in player evaluation) when looking at the post-season.

3. Joel Embiid:
With how Philadelphia’s season ended, this may seem like a controversial vote. Even with Embiid being a conundrum and frustrating player to evaluate in a playoff setting (largely due to injury), I still would take his overall body of work third on the year - and I think that can be attributed towards a weaker candidate pool due to players missing loads of time and drawbacks / playoff struggles from other top 10 in the league candidates. I feel he had the 2nd most-valuable Regular season in the league (worse defense than the PS, but a much better scoring and decision-making arsenal on offense) which almost any impact metric would verify. Even with a significant scoring volume drop in the Nets series, I don't think his offense was problematic then. This was more the case against Boston, where he looked taken out of the game in spurts even with averages of 25.5 (but on 54.5% TS) & 2.0 assists. While I attribute more of this to injury, I believe he still has tangible warts as a scorer/decision-maker/offensive hub. Where I am left rather impressed with Embiid is his defense against Boston. Even hobbled, I think he was at or around the best performance of his career in that regard with his rim and paint deterrence - showcasing the tactical resilience of an athletic drop coverage big in some essence. With the durability, I am unsure if he has plateaued as a player yet. I am hoping he can continue to improve and sustain a fully healthy playoff run.

4. Jimmy Butler:
What a year it was for Jimmy. One of the greatest series I have witnessed to kick off the playoffs, but then a regression back to (and then past) the mean - which I would argue is a result of him playing on one ankle more than anything else: Jimmy Butler pre-ankle sprain - 35.5/6.8/4.7, 58.5 FG%/42.9 3P%/ 72.9 FT% (66.2 TS%), Jimmy Butler post-ankle sprain - 24.6/7.1/6.3, 41.9 FG%/29 3P%/ 85.4 FT% (52.7 TS%). I’m aware facing more tactically dialed in defensive opponents / coaching is responsible for some regression, but I have to figure he’d have performed better with two healthy feet. Even with this factored in, I still feel like a ballot with special emphasis on ‘achievement’ and RS/PS body of work should feature Butler (like I do for Tatum). I don’t think having either as a game-in-and-game-out first option on offense is ideal, but I admire how they essentially played this role for their given teams while checking off many macro-basketball areas en route to C.F. runs. This is not to mention Butler being the leader and culture-setter (not to get into the topic *too* much) for a team that vastly overachieved. A lot of the “playoff Jimmy” narratives - while I see some truth to them, as he ramps his game up as a whole - may be overstated to a point where it sells his regular season short. I find this to be the case in 2022-23. Pitching in 23/6/5 on ~+7 scoring efficiency, stupendous turnover economy, and ‘best in the league’ non-big defense is nothing to scoff at - and the situation with the Heat may be underrating this campaign in entirety. FWIW, he finished fourth in the league in LEBRON and EPM as well while keeping a pedestrian team (results-wise) above water.

5. Anthony Davis:
From people I talk with about basketball (as a Lakers fan :roll: :lol: ), Davis sometimes ends up an unnecessarily polarizing player when it comes to discourse. However, I feel the most confident voting him fifth with the general theme of the ballot considered. A major decider in my choice was the value exerted on defense this past playoffs. I think the Denver series was less than ideal (though Rui and James 'on Jokic' worked out at times process wise), but Davis was a destroyer of worlds in the first two playoff series. While the Grizzlies weren't fully healthy, they were held 10.4 points below their RS mark in offensive rating - whereas the Warriors were held 4.5 points below theirs. this nuance would lead me to consider Davis the best player in both of those series. Our teams' consistency wasn't quite there on a game-to-game basis and there were some games where the tactics/execution on defense left a ton to be desired, but the defensive floor-raising from Davis was transcendent when the proper adjustments were made. With all of this considered, I think the biggest drawbacks with Davis' game - as it stands - are durability and a decline in offensive potency and self-creation (where the two have somewhat a 'chicken and egg' effect with one another). I'd have liked a better approach in the Denver series, but with facing a stonewall in Jokic and pretty stellar front-courts of Looney/Green/Jackson/Tillman - I think Davis help up well. Davis posted 22.6 points a game on 59.9% TS in the playoffs, but the game to game consistency wasn't great to say the least. It seems our team in the PS was sort of deployed to make Davis look better, which is reflected in the on/off data (+3.87 on, -9.62 off - albeit a small/noisy sample). In the regular season, Davis' presence (once again anchoring our defense) did help us overachieve and turn the corner from 13th seed into the play-in & playoffs - and a majority of this change was done after LBJ tore a tendon in his foot. Playing through a bone spur, Davis was less consistent (recurring into the PS) on a game to game basis.. but still offered many spurts of the all-time great paint scoring, play-finishing, and defense which characterized his prime. Somewhat tying back to the theory the team is more built around him than anybody else, Davis was 11th in EPM, 5th in LEBRON, and 5th in RAPTOR over the course of the regular season. His Box Stats were 26/12.5/2.6/1.1/2.0 on ~+5 scoring efficiency - with a defensive rating / net rating swing of 7.8 points. Using RS as the focus, he likely wouldn't crack my ballot.. but the situational value in the playoffs gives him the final nod for me.


OPOY:

Spoiler:
1. Nikola Jokic:
See Above, should go without saying.

2. Stephen Curry:
After Jokic, it gets harder to come to a definitive ranking. However, with ‘goodness’ and overall impact considered - I feel pretty confident giving the 2nd spot here to Curry despite time missed through the regular season. On a /possession basis, what Curry did was pretty phenomenal in the regular season (119.8 ORTG with him on, 29 points on +~7 true shooting % efficiency, upper end creation rates and underrated on-ball ability). Considering the fact that he’s 35 years old now, I’m all the more impressed - but somewhat lower on him in an absolute sense due to age and corresponding fatigue. I saw this as pretty relevant in the playoffs. In the Kings series, Curry went for 34 a game on 62% True Shooting - whereas he only put up 27 on 54.6% TS against the Lakers. I will say that his playmaking against us was nothing short of world-class, and he ultimately went down swinging with some subpar teammate play and having the kitchen sink thrown at him. Although he still brings a lot to the table and can catalyze an offense in multiple ways (2nd to Jokic in that regard IMO), I am unsure how much the series-to-series consistency compares to his peak self now that Curry has aged.

3. Damian Lillard:
The vote seems more unorthodox amidst the other selections which feature more of an emphasis on playoff play, but I find it hard to give this spot to (1) Durant due to playoff drawbacks, (2) Booker because as I am not sure his baseline is as valuable as Durant/Luka/Lillard regardless of the recent playoff sample, and (3) Luka because the Mavs ended up out of the play-in (like Portland) while Lillard objectively had more impact (see below) than him. Like in many great campaigns from players before him, Lillard was a victim of his situation here. I think this selection would be the best one across the year to argue against winning bias.

8.1 O-EPM (1st in the league), 5.99 O-LEBRON (1st on the league), 8.3 OBPM (2nd), 121.4 Team Offensive Rating in Lillard minutes, 121.5 -> 110.0 ORTG Net-Swing across the season, 121.5 -> 108.6 ORTG Net-Swing in games Lillard played, 27-31 Record with Lillard. Overall: the team defense, non Lillard minutes, & record without - albeit 'tanking' - were abysmal.


DPOY:

Spoiler:
1. Anthony Davis:
See above in POY explanation(s). Since i focused holistically with Davis and this selection is less correlated with POY voting than OPOY in Jokic's case, I could add a brief explanation. Drop coverage does have its questions from a resiliency standpoint, but I think a big man with the physical/athletic profile of Davis playing drop in a playoff setting is a game changing scheme (with the right effort put in, which was there for the most part). The combination of rim protection, mucking up coverages, defensive playmaking, and rebounding is a package I feel to have added the most value across all defenders for their given teams this past PS.

2. Draymond Green:
While not the game-to-game defensive super-computer he was from (say) 2015-17, Green still remains one of the league's best defenders. Co-linearity, a roller coaster season, and going from spurts of coasting to 'flipping the switch' (all at the team level) may contribute to this measure, but Golden State's defense was ~8 (111 -> 119) points worse with Green off the floor. Tied for fifth in D-LEBRON and fourth in D-EPM this RS, where Davis and Anunoby were the only two >= 30 MPG players who came in the vicinity of Green's value in the latter. In the playoffs, I thought he was the best non Davis defender and felt he led the charge in thwarting the Kings half-court offense in games 4 - 7. With foul trouble, he was less consistent in the Lakers series.. but still had some great moments (mainly Games 2 and 5).

3. Jaren Jackson Jr:
Although he lags behind most of the other Regular Season DPOY-Caliber anchor bigs in terms of minutes played (and perhaps? aggregate value as a result of this), I think Jackson was the best defender on a per possession basis this past regular season (1st in D-LEBRON, T-4th in D-EPM as well). Along with Tillman, I liked his defense in Round 1 of the playoffs and felt Memphis did the best job in aggregate of making things hard for the Lakers star duo. Across the year (RS + PS), Memphis had a 110.5 DRTG with Jackson on.


ROY:

Spoiler:
1. Walker Kessler:
I am aware that other '22 draft-class players in the league had less streamlined roles, were thrown into situations less conducive towards winning, and have higher ceilings than Kessler. However, when looking at added value - I am finding it hard to make a case for any of my other candidates against Kessler. These #s might not be replicable across a larger MPG sample and while facing off against more starting-5 caliber players, but Kessler had the best impact in his class by a substantial margin (both pragmatically and through one # catch-alls). On top of that, the low-touch play finishing / scoring, rebounding, and rim protection triad of value-proposition(s) is a formula that scales down amazingly as teams add better talent - which is something I value vastly more for role/rotation players than top end talent on a team (to add, I think the entire class of 2022 is at the level of the former right now). To play devils' advocate, I understand the importance of player development, learning through adversity & growing pains, and being tasked with more of a difficult role from the get go - so I wouldn't disagree at all if people don't regard Kessler *this* high for the award. I am looking less at ceiling / high end(s) of play here however, hence my decision.

2. Jalen Williams:
I think Williams had a phenomenal campaign and made a name for himself in OKC's starting lineup - a roster that overachieved in the grand scheme of things. Being a pretty well-sized guard and having good athletic tools, I was a fan of his interior scoring, defense, and role as a connector. It's the same logic here as Kessler's vote (in comparison to Banchero) that is influencing my placement. His impact doesn't stand out as much as the former, to the point where I am not surprised due to him having more minutes to work with / more of an offensive load and self-creation responsibility than Kessler. I probably would like Paolo better as a first option (albeit by not that much, presumably), but feel Williams to be more scalable an offensive player while the better defender.

3. Paolo Banchero:
This may be a somewhat sour/controversial selection (to which I may add - I think he has the highest ceiling in the draft class), but I feel confident in taking Williams and Kessler as the top two for all of the aforementioned logic. At the same time, I acknowledge that this may be apples to oranges in comparison - as we all didn't get to see Banchero with as good of support as the other two. While he fluctuated from Orlando's first through third option throughout the season, I am a fan of Fultz and Franz as the more consistent 1/2 options for now. With his already stellar paint scoring and pretty solid physical/athleticism profile, I would love for Paolo to add some more off-ball, low touch, and post-oriented utility within the framework of Orlando's offense. He's got a bright future, which I am excited to see play-out.


COY:

Spoiler:
1. Erik Spoelstra:
Yes, the Heat came short of the Larry O'B. However, I don't think this takes away anything they were able to accomplish - as they lost to a much more talented squad. A major reason, if not the most prominent one, in turning the tide from a Regular Season underachiever to the exact opposite in the playoffs was Spoelstra and Miami's ability to field competitive lineups that exceeded the sum of their parts. Even if shooting variance did contribute to such in the playoffs, I would say defensive process and execution led the way all the more so.

2. Mike Brown:
I’m happy to see Brown back and thriving as a head coach. In terms of setting lineups and deploying tactics, I found his work in the regular season quite innovative and a great example of blending things that worked across the league together (eg. solid and non-wasted ball movement, high 3PAR, many cuts and off-ball actions, having Sabonis be a hand-off hub and ‘spacing big’). All of this led to a near 120 offensive rating. Even with being at a personnel disadvantage against the Warriors in R1, I thought Brown went toe-to-toe with Kerr although the Kings lost in 7.

3. Mike Malone:
Hard for me to have a ballot without the world champions’ coach. In the regular season, I wasn’t the biggest fan and certainly didn’t like the ‘Sloan Rotations’ Denver would deploy. He got better as the playoffs went on with roster and rotation management however, and I very much like how Denver’s defense fared (especially against Phoenix and Miami). While serviceable (and then some), he doesn't stand out *too* much as an X&O coach - but I find Malone very integral in setting a selfless and team-oriented culture as a player coach.


EOY:

Spoiler:
1. Danny Ainge:
A vote like this didn't cross my mind at first, but I'm convinced on it after reading around this thread. The Jazz aren't quite a team that could win a playoff series or fight for the chances of stealing one quite yet, but to say they got a foundation after trading two super-stars & being stuck in the (upper) middle would be an understatement.Getting 7 FRPs and 3 swaps, regardless of who is traded, is absurd. On top of that: trading for Lauri and Sexton panned out, older players with less of a perceived future in Utah (at the deadline and throughout the season) were re-routed, Kessler and Ochai seem like good support pieces, I liked the Dunn/Olynyk additions should they stay, and Pick 9/16 in a deep & talented draft provides an opportunity to upgrade even more on the margins. The most wins may not have been added compared to other teams and their respective transaction activity, but this may be as good as it gets for a re-set/re-tool year.

2. Calvin Booth:
Perhaps I could be riding out the thought process of winning/recency bias a little with selecting Booth at 2, but I feel confident doing so. The track record into and through the 2022-23 season speaks for itself, and Denver's brain trusts' decision to add Caldwell-Pope and Bruce Brown (1) showed you can build a title team around Jokic [regardless if this was a baseless criticism after all] and (2) gave Denver a functionally / archetype-wise versatile roster with guard, wing, forward, and big-man (Jokic checks a LOT of boxes, tbf) play. This is not to mention the draft selections of Braun and Watson - where the former contributed whenever his number was called and the latter projects to be a good role player imo (the same point about versatility applies with those two and Nnaji on the roster moving forward).

3. Leon Rose:
Struggled to decide on a final EOY selection between Rose and McNair, but leaned towards the former here. I think both's transactions were integral in taking typical bottom - middle-bottom (I'm aware the Knicks made the PS in 2021) to the playoffs. As it pertains to 2022-23 specifically, it is my guess that the Knicks decisions added more wins to the team - the 'meat & potatoes' of such being the re-signing of Robinson, addition(s) through FA of Brunson and Hartenstein, extensions of their younger players, and trade for Josh Hart at the deadline.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#4 » by Doctor MJ » Wed Jun 14, 2023 4:12 pm

Hey folks, if you're not reading the instructions, read them before posting.

Specifically: While I don't mind placeholder posts, I don't want anything else in this thread until after I tally the votes.

WestGOAT, I'm going to quote your post over to the Discussion thread.

ShaqAttack, I'm going to PM you.

And then I'm going to delete both posts in this thread in hopes others won't think to add more such posts.

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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#5 » by AEnigma » Wed Jun 14, 2023 5:53 pm

Will do my Player of the Year ballot separately.

Executive of the Year
1. Pat Riley

    2017: Drafted (and eventually extended) Bam Adebayo
    2018: Signed Duncan Robinson (undrafted) to a two-way contract; traded for / signed Jimmy Butler
    2019: Drafted Tyler Herro
    2020: Signed Gabe Vincent (undrafted) and Max Strus to a two-way contract
    2021: Re-signed Vincent and Strus to multi-year contracts; traded for / signed Kyle Lowry; signed Caleb Martin to a two-way contract
    2022: Re-signed Caleb Martin to a multi-year contract
    2023: Signed Kevin Love and Cody Zeller in buyout market
I share all this to emphasise that Riley was the one who built this Finals team. Every player there is present because Pat Riley pursued them and actively moved for them when no one else really did. For me there is always an element of: is it better to be responsible for a player being on the team? Riley is not top of my ballot this year for signing Butler and drafting Bam several years ago, but he would not be on the ballot at all if they were there independently of Riley. Still, this year I am primarily praising how previous lesser roleplayers like Vincent, Strus, and Martin became key to a Finals run, and how those players were all overlooked by every other executive. (Oh, and Kevin Love paid off, but there I think that was more a case of Love individually pursuing a veteran playoff team in dire need of a power forward.) When players an executive drafted continue to progress, I think the executives deserve to be awarded for that vision. No one knew Vincent or Strus would be key contributors in the Finals when they were signed. After a postseason where everyone incessantly talked about “Heat culture”, I have no qualms recognising the man who built that culture.

2. Leon Rose
Main moves this year were signing Jalen Brunson and trading for Josh Hart, which were both excellent pickups for the team (Hartenstein also a nice depth move). I commend his previous vision in trading for (or otherwise selecting) Quickley and Grimes, both of whom made strides this season as essential rotation players for a decent playoff team. Those four players have this roster primed for a superstar… but I am not sure I see who that reasonably may be. So maybe the other option is to build a version of the 2004 Pistons… between Barrett, Randle, and Fournier, and near full future pick control, they could conceivably trade for a pair of all-star calibre players, but what they need most is a frontcourt upgrade, and those players are both scarce and actively secured by their teams. This season, where they upset a top two SRS team to win only their second series in the past twenty years, might be as good as it gets for the Knicks.
3. Danny Ainge
Some process of elimination here. Booth joined this season and added KCP, Bruce Brown, and Christian Braun; good moves, but he has nothing else to his credit. Connolly, his predecessor, had a rocky start with the Timberwolves. The Warriors struggled. Pelinka turned the Lakers around… by undoing his own damage. The Grizzlies mostly held firm from last year. McNair made a splashy move for Sabonis but I think such a move was short-sighted and will not age well given Haliburton’s age and early excellence. The Clippers struggle to maintain relevance with their superstars perpetually injured. James Jones made a splashy move for Durant which did not meaningfully pay off, although he has avenues for contention next year. Marks handled trade requests as best he could but ultimately has the team back in a rebuild with limited control over their own picks. Griffin is still experimenting with the Pelicans, although I cannot say I found the move for McCollum too inspiring. The 76ers, Raptors, Bulls, Celtics, and Hawks all failed to meaningfully change their fortunes this year. Koby Altman seems to have rushed his push for a “star”. Presti drafted Jalen Williams, which was shrewd, but the team is still waiting on a breakthrough. So we are left with Ainge, who blew up the team but obtained an all-star scorer, a promising defensive centre, and I think eight first round picks (plus swaps). None of that has translated into wins, but it is an exemplary base for the future.
(HM: Calvin Booth)

Coach of the Year
1. Erik Spoelstra

No one is better at ensuring everyone is on the same page, bought into their role, and ready to adapt, and he is probably the coach best at adapting his schemes for each opponent.
2. Mike Malone
Impeccable roster management all year. Maximised everyone around Jokic and had a young team ready for the Finals. Figured out counter-adjustments quickly.
3. Tom Thibodeau
Still a capable defensive coach and team motivator, and for the first time clearly showed an ability to run a modern offence. Do not think this roster was usual 5-seed quality, and I liked how he responded to Miami even with a defeat.
(HM: Mike Brown)

Sixth Man of the Year
1. Austin Reaves

By year’s end was the best player of possible options; was the third most important piece to a capable conference finals team (and consequently will not be in line for this award anytime soon lol).
2. Bruce Brown
Thrived in his role, outstanding 3&D, never really faltered, key piece on a comfortable title team.
3. Immanuel Quickley
Top sixth man in the regular season and reliably won his minutes captaining the second unit. Bad postseason drags him down to #3.
(HM: Malcolm Brogdon)

Defensive Player of the Year:
1. Anthony Davis

Clearly the best playoff defender. Indifferent to his missed time, although will note he was one of the best defenders in the regular season regardless. Struggled against the Nuggets, but had an all-time defensive series against the Grizzlies.
2. Draymond Green
Basically the sole piece keeping the Warriors afloat defensively in the regular season. Did a great, albeit dirty, job against Sabonis and the Kings in the postseason, and made life as difficult as he could for the Lakers. Still the league’s smartest defender.
3. Jaren Jackson, Jr.
Best per minute defender in the regular season. Fared moderately well in the postseason, but was more limited than he had been and could not adjust properly.
(HM: Bam Adebayo)

Offensive Player of the Year:
1. Nikola Jokic

League’s best passer and most efficient scorer, with I think the best on-court offence. Only offensive limitation is his ballhandling and according possibility of being somewhat taken out of the game (exploited to an extent by the Lakers), but either way, easy top five offensive peak for me, with a fair case for #1 ever.
2. Steph Curry
Bounce-back regular season, and still is the engine behind his team’s offence. More versatile than Lillard without a clear on-ball disadvantage.
3. Damian Lillard
Arguably better than Steph offensively at this point, but missed the postseason and lacks Steph’s off-ball flexibility. More impressed by his regular season offensive production than Luka’s regular season offensive production, and trusting Luka more in the postseason was irrelevant this year.
(HM: Luka Doncic)

Will not submit for Rookie of the Year or for Most Improved because my ordering of those ballots is too arbitrary. For posterity, the players I would consider for Most Improved are Lauri, Claxton, Fox, and JJJ, probably but not necessarily in that order. Shai and Brunson will be popular picks but I do not think either took any real leap from where they were by the end of last season.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#6 » by Doctor MJ » Wed Jun 14, 2023 7:04 pm

AEnigma wrote:Will do my Player of the Year ballot separately.

Executive of the Year
1. Pat Riley
2017: Drafted (and eventually extended) Bam Adebayo
2018: Signed Duncan Robinson (undrafted) to a two-way contract; traded for / signed Jimmy Butler
2019: Drafted Tyler Herro
2020: Signed Gabe Vincent (undrafted) and Max Strus to a two-way contract
2021: Re-signed Vincent and Strus to multi-year contracts; traded for / signed Kyle Lowry; signed Caleb Martin to a two-way contract
2022: Re-signed Caleb Martin to a multi-year contract
2023: Signed Kevin Love and Cody Zeller in buyout market

2. Danny Ainge
3. Leon Rose
(HM: Calvin Booth)

Coach of the Year
1. Erik Spoelstra
2. Mike Malone
3. Tom Thibodeau
(HM: Mike Brown)

Sixth Man of the Year
1. Austin Reaves
2. Bruce Brown
3. Immanuel Quickley
(HM: Malcolm Brogdon)

Defensive Player of the Year:
1. Anthony Davis
2. Draymond Green
3. Jaren Jackson, Jr.
(HM: Evan Mobley)

Offensive Player of the Year:
1. Nikola Jokic
2. Steph Curry
3. Damian Lillard
(HM: Luka Doncic)

Will not submit for Rookie of the Year or for Most Improved.


A couple things:

1. Please give commentary with each award.

2. Please remove specific references to previous years in your EOY vote, and do make sure you're trying to tie the award to the performance this year. I recognize that it's tough evaluate a GM simply based on one year, but aside from general principle, Riley won this award for the '19-20 season with his off-season acquisition of Jimmy Butler and Tyler Herro being at the front of everyone's mind, and Bam Adebayo's place on the team being established before that, and there are issues with using them perpetually for Riley's yearly candidacy.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#7 » by iggymcfrack » Thu Jun 15, 2023 8:17 am

Player of the Year
1. Nikola Jokic- What is there to even say? Best or 2nd best on/off of all-time. Arguably the greatest box score season in history between regular season and playoffs. Probably the best offensive season in league history. And then to cap it off, he led his team to a 16-4 record in the playoffs and a championship. Don't see how you could have a more unanimous #1.

2. Joel Embiid- Had him a decent amount lower for a while, but the guys below him ultimately ended up going out of the postseason with a whimper as well. Embiid did have a very dominant regular season and someone needed to come and take it from him more than they did for him to lose the spot. Also, while Game 7 was awful, it's not like his whole postseason sucked. He did average 31/11 with 3 blocks in Games 3-6 against Boston.

3. Jayson Tatum- Game 7 against the Heat left a sour taste in people's mouths, and his numbers weren't crazy, but other than Jokic he was the most consistent superstar of the season. He was 7th in the NBA in regular season minutes played as the clearcut best player on the best regular season team in the NBA. He kept his numbers at the same level in the playoffs and had 51/13/5 on .746 TS% in Game 7 against Philly.

4. Jimmy Butler- Seemed like the ultimate playoff elevator against Milwaukee with an all-time elite first round series for the 1/8 upset, but wasn't honestly that crucial to the Heat's success the rest of the way. Finished with significantly worst postseason numbers than regular season numbers and had the worst playoff on/off on the team. I had him 5th at the end of the regular season and he led his team to the Finals so I'm not going any lower, but much like Tatum last year, the playoff run lost a little shine as time went on.

5. Anthony Davis- Most dominant defensive player in the playoffs by far, leading the playoffs in both RPG and BPG while holding the man he was guarding to crazy low percentages. Also, despite taking criticism for his offense, he was actually very good on that end too, averaging 23 PPG on .627 TS%. The lack of time on the floor is the only legitimate complaint as he missed a ton of RS games and didn't quite have a lengthy enough postseason run to completely put that out of people's minds. Still feel like he's very close to Tatum, Butler, and even Embiid though.


Offensive Player of the Year
1. Nikola Jokic- Again, what is there to even say. In the regular season, the Nuggets had an ORtg of 125.4 with him on the floor compared to 106.7 with him on the bench. That's 6 points better than the best offense in the league when he's in and 2.5 points worse than the worst offense in the league when he isn’t. He led the league in every advanced stat you could imagine and then followed it up by leading the playoffs in points, rebounds, and assists. I can't imagine any sane person making a serious vote for anyone else here.

2. Damian Lillard- I feel like a lot of people forgot about Dame with the Blazers slipping out of the playoff race, but he ranked #1 in offensive EPM and #2 in offensive RAPTOR. When he was on the floor, the Blazers had an ORtg of 120.3 which would have been good enough to lead the league even though he played with a pretty pitiful supporting cast. He had career highs in both PPG and TS% while also playmaking and passing enough to lift everyone else on the floor.

3. Luka Doncic- His defensive effort sucked at points and he wasn't a great fit with Kyrie, but like Dame, he led a very poor supporting cast to an ORtg that would have been good enough to be league best when he was on the floor at 120.2 in this case. The box score stats were dazzling, averaging 32/8/8 on .609 TS% with much fewer turnovers than he'd ever previously recorded in a season.


Defensive Player of the Year
1. Anthony Davis- His utter dominance in the postseason was completely unmatched as regular season DPOY Jaren Jackson Jr. looked insignificant in comparison when they were both on the floor. The amount he reduced field goal percentage of shots he contested was I believe twice anyone else's in the first 2 rounds before he ran into the unstoppable Jokic train. Well-deserved award IMO.

2. Jaren Jackson Jr.- Best defensive player of the regular season, consistently blocked shots at an incredible rate and wreaked havoc at the rim. Faced a bad matchup in the first round where he had a tough time exerting his well, but still deserves recognition IMO.

3. Draymond Green- His off the court issues hurt the team, but purely for what he did on defense, he was still irreplaceable for Golden State, putting up excellent advanced numbers and anchoring the team throughout their playoff run.


Rookie of the Year
1. Walker Kessler- Advanced stats aren't everything and I understand giving the guy who played more minutes in a more difficult role, the edge when it's close, but in this case, it's not at all. Kessler ranked between 30th and 60th in most advanced stats when none of the other rookies playing decent minutes were even league average. This is a guy who knew his role and performed it extremely well on a team that was competing almost the entire way.

2. Jalen Williams- On an even more competitive team, Williams managed to be an efficient scorer on decent volume and actually had almost as many assists as Banchero too. Pretty much any objective stat you look at would have Jalen a little above Paolo.

3. Paolo Banchero- Was put in a tough position as the lead scorer for a young team and obviously has incredible talent which should translate well when he has time to refine it, but a lot of what he did this year was just put up low percentage shots at high volume. He ranked 180th out of 198 players in true shooting and was under 30% from three. The talent's all there and he obviously showed incredible flashes, but he's not all the way there yet.


6th Man of the Year
1. Austin Reaves- No question here. RAPTOR which includes regular season + playoffs actually had him as the 25th best player in the entire league. A virtual nobody to start the season, Reaves ended up leading the Lakers in NetRtg in both the regular season and playoffs and showed out the most when the lights were brightest.

2. Immanuel Quickley- The playoffs were disappointing, but nobody showed out there other than Reaves and even when he wasn't scoring, he was still playing good defense. His importance to the Knicks throughout the season shouldn't be dismissed due to 8 bad offensive games.

3. Malcolm Brogdon- Like Quickley, a somewhat disappointing playoffs was still not enough to keep him from getting recognition for a very good regular season.


Coach of the Year
1. Erik Spoelstra- Absolutely incredible job holding the team together through injuries and malaise, giving them enough slack for their old bones to recover without letting them fall out of the playoffs together and then having them at peak capacity when it matters most. Made all the right adjustments in the playoffs until he came up against a team whose talent was just too much to overcome.

2. Mike Malone- Some questionable bench lineups in the regular season had people rightly questioning him, but the Nuggets still got the 1 seed and then when it mattered most in the playoffs, he didn't set a single foot wrong. Added a star to the bench lineups to turn a weakness into a strength, gave his stars rest when he could while also realizing which guys he could trust when it mattered and which ones needed to remain anchored to the bench.

3. Mike Brown- Best coach of the regular season, got a young team to believe in themselves as contenders and had them this close to upsetting the Warriors. Should be well positioned to make a better run next year.


Executive of the Year
1. Danny Ainge- Incredible job in Utah. An all-time fleecing in the Gobert trade led to him getting back 4 first round picks, a swap, and the best player asset in the trade (Kessler). Then, he gets similarly incredible value for Mitchell, getting 3 picks, 2 swaps, and arguably getting the best player value AGAIN with their new superstar of the future, Lauri Markkannen making only $17MM/year. Back to back grand slams for one of the wiliest basketball minds in the game.

2. Calvin Booth- Made a great trade, picking up KCP as the final piece of the puzzle for the Nuggets starting lineup, offloaded Bones before he could be a distraction, and ultimately saw the fruits of his labor with a Nuggets championship.

3. Sean Marks- Faced with an impossible situation of whiny malcontented superstars forcing his hand, Marks still managed to get an absolute haul back of players and picks that will have Brooklyn reloading very soon instead of having to tear down and start from scratch.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#8 » by eminence » Sat Jun 17, 2023 7:17 pm

POY Vote:
1. Nikola Jokic - everyone reading currently has no doubts about this and is more worried about his all-time placement, and rightfully so. A wire to wire win for Jokic, there's just no in-season competition. An ATG on the offensive end who looked anywhere from fine to good on the defensive end too. I'm curious to see if the Nuggets can keep it rolling and turn themselves into the next dynasty.

2. Jayson Tatum - Had him as a reasonably strong #3 during the RS, close to Embiid in 2nd, and then came out and dominated the direct competition in the 2nd round. Very very strong closing out that series. CFs ended on a bit of disappointment, but not every game on a rolled ankle can be memorable for positive reasons. Thought he had a slightly better series than Butler overall.

3. Joel Embiid - I didn't hate him winding up with the MVP though Jokic deserved it more. POs end in disappointment again, but they were the only team to sweep round one and then went 7 vs Boston. Consistently improves his defensive effort in the POs, somewhat offsetting offensive struggles. Pretty tough decision vs Jimmy for 3/4.

4. Jimmy Butler - I came back down on him as the season ended. This is where one great first round series got him, it brought him to the top of his pack, but from there on out he didn't really continue to elevate his game (I'd say Curry/Davis both had better 2nd best series than Jimmy despite playing only 2 and 3 series). Outside of the Bucks series I have some questions about how much separation there is between he and Bam. But in that Bucks series, oh my, I don't have an all-time Game Score table to hand, but I know 30.4 is nothing to trifle with.

5. Stephen Curry - Tough decision vs AD for me. Curry missed time, isn't fully what he once was, and is still Jokics closest competitor for best offensive player in the league in my estimation. With Klay post-injury and Draymond destroying Pooles confidence, the offensive support on the Warriors is really not there anymore. In the playoffs had a big series vs the Kings and was more middling (by these standards) against the Lakers.

HMs:
Davis - Closest to taking #5, I was generally a bit down on his RS relative to most, had he played to his standards then the Lakers easily avoid the play-in and maybe even take the 3 seed. Obviously missed time is also bad, but that's true for Curry/LeBron too. If I weighted POs more heavily he'd get #5 at least.
LeBron - Pretty cleanly over Davis for the RS and close to a toss-up with Curry (I lean Curry), PO run wasn't bad, but didn't strike me as particularly elevating.
Luka, Dame, SGA - great RSs, no playoffs to speak of, not strong enough to beat out guys I saw as having similar strength RSs and played decently well in the POs (Curry/LeBron).
Giannis - Had himself and his team in position to make a run, got hurt, that always sucks. Kawhi somewhat similar, though basically worse.
Mitchell - Not injured, but laid an egg in the 1st round.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#9 » by ardee » Sun Jun 18, 2023 11:36 am

POY

1. Nikola Jokic (beyond obvious choice, one of the strongest no. 1s this project will ever have. Should have won the MVP obviously, top 8 peak of all time in my book. Not much more to say about this guy than has already been said)

2. Jayson Tatum (tbh, kind of a weak number 2. Up and down Playoffs after a fairly strong regular season, but looking at the combined product he still wins out over the other competitors. The game 7 against Philly helps quite a bit here after he had a string of bad games that made people think he flat out was not a superstar)

3. Jimmy Butler (he was in 2 for a while but the Finals were a letdown. The ankle injury was just unfortunate, because if he maintained his play from before it for the entire Playoffs, he'd be pushing Jokic for no. 1. I still have him over Embiid though, who just left a very bad taste in my mouth after showing nowhere near his RS level all Playoffs)

4. Joel Embiid (what can I say? Great RS but he just keeps failing to match it again and again when the games actually matter. If I'm being honest, I'd take Davis over him for a Playoff run, but since this is a whole season award the RS matters here, where Embiid has both the edge in both level of play AND durability (played 10 more games))

5. Anthony Davis (if he had a more healthy RS and put up more of a fight in the WCF he'd be in contention for the 2-3 spot. Had some consistency issues in the PS on offense but when he was playing well I think he was the second best player in the league behind Jokic)

HM: Steph Curry, LeBron James, Devin Booker
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#10 » by AEnigma » Sun Jun 18, 2023 10:11 pm

For me, in determining “Player of the Year”, as in, “which five players defined this year for me,” the two primary considerations were “how good were you”, i.e. do I think you could be argued as a top five player, and “how relevant were you”, i.e. did you play for one of the year’s five most relevant teams. It is distinct from ranking the best players, or even best players among postseason teams, although the two rankings do significantly correlate.

This year, I think there were six “relevant” teams overall: the Nuggets (1st seed champions), the Heat (conference champions), the Celtics (#1 SRS conference runners-up), the Lakers (conference runners-up), the 76ers (third in SRS, “best” conference semi-finalist), and the Bucks (overall 1st seed). Iffy one there is the 76ers, but Embiid was the league MVP and imo the second best player in the regular season, so for inclusion purposes we have the same effect. Outside of those teams, I would probably look to Curry and Kawhi as potential top five players in a vacuum, and maybe even Luka in an extremely abstracted sense, but without a true standout performance in either the regular season or postseason, none of them make the cut. Booker did play himself into the vicinity of that discussion but I do not actually see him as a top five player, nor did I ever think the Suns were a threat to win the title (and even post-Beal trade I have extreme doubts, because right now they do not have a frontcourt capable of surviving defensively through four rounds).

There are years where this approach can create problems. 2021 is most significant, where for the first time since 2002 (and 1990 before then), three of the four conference finalists did not have a top five player (although I would probably have all three team leaders in my top ten for season accomplishment). Curry missed the playoffs, Lebron was injured and a first round exit, Kawhi had a season ending injury, Luka was a first round exit, Embiid did not perform like a top five player in the postseason (*cough*), Durant played only 35 games… oh, and Gobert had an MVP-calibre defensive campaign for a dominant 1-seed. Wild COVID season all-in-all. Most of the time, I think there is sizeable overlap with top five players and top five teams for a season.

To illustrate that concept, I will quickly run through some recent ballots:

2022-1. Curry (personally still had Giannis as the better player, but strong edge in season accomplishment)
2022-2. Giannis
2022-3. Jokic
2022-4. Tatum
2022-5. Luka
So there, a top five relevant team (Heat) lost out to a top five relevant player on an irrelevant team, but I imagine the forum that placed Jokic at #1 for that year would probably not push back on that too much. :lol:

2020-1. Lebron
2020-2. Davis
2020-3. Giannis
2020-4. Jokic
2020-5. Butler
This year, the Lakers having two top players threw off the rankings a bit, and ultimately I did not think the Celtics being semifinalists surpassed Giannis’s regular season accomplishments. Both the Bucks and Celtics were highly relevant to telling this year’s story, but Tatum was not a top five player to me.
Contrasting with 2023…
A.) 2023 Embiid was a fair degree worse than 2020 Giannis;
B.) Tatum has elevated from his 2020 level;
C.) the 2020 Bucks were much more significant to the overall narrative of 2020 than the 2023 76ers were to 2023; and
D.) the Celtics were much more significant to the overall narrative of 2023 than they were to 2020,
so this time around I am more likely to exclude the league MVP over the leader of the functional fourth-place Celtics.

2019-1. Kawhi
2019-2. Curry
2019-3. Giannis
2019-4. Harden
2019-5. Embiid
Somewhat self-evident for those top four, with them constituting the top four best players and top four most relevant teams overall (even if the Rockets were only a second round exit). The challenge with fifth would be weighing a conference finalist (Lillard) against the leader of the toughest opponent faced by the champions (Embiid) against the guy I think was top five in the regular season (Paul George). Ultimately I felt better about the 76ers and Embiid’s playoff performance, so he earned the edge.

Returning to this year, Jokic is number one. He was the best player, he won the title, and even if he had lost in the Finals, neither Tatum nor Butler are close to him as overall talents.

From there? Well, as alluded to previously (and outright stated at one point in the discussion thread), I am primarily looking at five other teams: the Heat, represented by Butler; the Celtics, represented by Tatum; the Lakers, represented by Lebron or Davis, because the team did not excel so much that I think both merit inclusion; the Bucks, represented by Giannis; and the 76ers, represented by Embiid. Again, credit to Booker and Curry, but neither had laudable enough postseason or regular season accomplishments to overcome that barrier.

I will start with Giannis. For me he was the third best per possession player in the regular season. The Bucks earned the top overall seed. They lost in the first round to an 8-seed, for only the fifth time in NBA history, while being the first ever 1-seed to not even win two games against their 8-seed opponent. Giannis himself accomplished nothing (the Bucks won their sole game without him) and played terribly after rushing back from injury, with an especially unforgivable performance at the line in the clinching Game 5.
Now, the Heat did make the Finals, making them more akin to the 1999 Knicks than to the 1994 Nuggets / 2007 Warriors / 2011 Grizzlies. They did shoot irreplicably well. And losing in the first round as a 1-seed did not prohibit me from including either Dirk or Mourning in the Player of the Year ballots for their respective years (I would have Dirk third or fourth in 2007 and Mourning somewhere in the top five). Still, Dirk won MVP, and I felt Mourning probably should have won MVP. Giannis was good, but he was not at the level of Jokic or Embiid, nor did he clearly provide more overall regular season value than someone like Tatum did. Can I keep a maybe #3, maybe #4 regular season player on my ballot when he is massively upset in the first round and can barely play? I do not think so, and that brings us down to four teams (albeit five names) for four spots.

Of those five names, I think two are automatic locks behind Jokic. Tatum was one of the five most valuable regular season players and made the conference finals. Butler was at least in discussion for top five regular season value and made the Finals. Tatum comfortably outplayed Embiid head-to-head, and Butler had one of the greatest series in NBA history against Giannis and the Bucks.
I bring up both Tatum and Butler simultaneously because their careers have now become intertwined in much the way we saw with the 1996-2000 Knicks/Heat or the 1993-2000 Knicks/Pacers. Three conference finals bouts in four years is going to establish some sort of rivalry. In the discussion thread, I put together this comparison:
AEnigma wrote:Jimmy Butler averages against Jayson Tatum in the postseason: 23.3/6.9/4.9/0.6/2.1 with 1.7 turnovers on 54.4% efficiency, +0.05 per game
Jayson Tatum averages against Jimmy Butler in the postseason: 25.6/9.4/5.8/0.9/1.2 with 4 turnovers on 58.6% efficiency, +3.25 per game

Now, Tatum has also averaged more minutes, so we can restrict it a bit further to see what they produce when on the court with each other:
Butler = 23.5 points per 75 possessions on 55% efficiency, 110 Ortg
Tatum= 23.3 points per 75 on 58% efficiency, 114 Ortg

This is nothing new, and I wrote as much last year for the peaks project.
AEnigma wrote:Tatum outplayed Butler last postseason but made the mistake of continuing onto the Finals and hurting his own averages. Early returns on this season are also showing why in three years he will almost certainly end up being an easy inclusion into the next project. Butler has the most outstanding individual postseason games, and accordingly has received the most votes and support thus far, but I think his narrative benefits disproportionately from those outliers rather than from his expected performance level. Bam is easily the best secondary piece for all of these seasons and I think his contributions go too undersold when trying to put all credit to Butler.
AEnigma wrote:[Butler] has some impressive playoff games and performances while in Miami, but consistency has been an issue. Rawer impact lags behind Jayson Tatum, arguably even in the postseason.

Where does that leave us?
    - Tatum generally outperforms Butler head-to-head, although there can certainly be situational context for that (the Heat are less suited to defended Tatum than the Celtics are to defend Butler), and Butler’s turnover economy makes the real gap in production smaller than it may appear
    - Tatum has generally been more “impactful” than Butler, although much of that is tied to team structure
    - Tatum has consistently been healthier than Butler, both in the regular season and in the postseason
    - Butler’s best games and series go beyond Tatum’s both generally and this season
    - Butler is a better leader than Tatum… which you would expect given their respective ages and levels of experience.
    - Butler was +9 in this series to Tatum’s +3; both were positive in four games, but Butler was only negative in two games whereas Tatum was negative in three games. I point this out because while the Heat found success without Butler in a way not true for the Celtics without Tatum, for this series, lineups with Butler still had the advantage, and it is tough to say Butler had disproportionally good support outside of coaching (that said, if someone were to say the gap between Spoelstra and Mazzulla may well be worth more than six points across a seven-game series, I would agree).
    - Both players had arguably career best regular seasons this year, and undeniably career best scoring. Per game, I am not sure either established a clear edge in raw productivity.
    - Through three rounds, I do not think either player established any advantage in productivity, and in a head-to-head comparison with two players who faced each other in the postseason, I am reluctant to penalise the winner for reducing their averages after the fact.
    - By virtue of making the Finals and being responsible for a historically rare (arguably unprecedented) upset, Butler is much more essential to the overall narrative of this season (or at least of the eastern conference).
For me the #2 spot goes to Butler. I would feel more strongly about it had he not been injured, but he was, and that is what made this a real question. His body wore down as the playoffs progressed, with a stark gap between how he performed prior to missing that game against the Knicks and after. I understand the Tatum votes… he may well be the better player… but he did not define this year for me the way Butler did. This is not really a 1999 Knicks equivalent in that sense. Butler is a legitimate superstar and top ten player, with prior Finals experience. Yes, the defence played well. Yes, the shooting was otherworldly. Yes, after the Bucks series, Butler did not really “carry”. But unless Bam takes a substantial leap next year, this has been Butler’s team, and the team is in large part a reflection of him, and the team looks to him as a captain, and that all matters to me more than “oooh his team had a better point differential when he was on the bench and his injury sunk his averages enough to be disqualifying and he was obviously carried by his star defensive centre.”



WHICH BRINGS US TO THE LAKERS. :wink:
AEnigma wrote: Davis was absolutely the team’s most important player in their two series wins, and therefore on balance probably their most important player for the entire postseason. He also was not their best player in the regular season, nor has he ever been. He was not the team’s leader. He was not the engine of the offence (again despite what I have seen claimed…). And if we are going to suddenly weaponise plus/minus and on/off against the guy who was, then we need to have a long conversation about whether Jimmy Butler belongs on the ballot either. It is really frustrating to see how flexible standards can become when an injured and “contentious” player fails to live up to their usual production, even while captaining a conference finals team. Booker and Edwards and Brunson are all immortalised by BPM… but the guy right behind them was apparently too far below his regular season production to be taken seriously. Top ten in LEBRON, DPM, and EPM… ten in RAPM among stars, and eleventh in LA-RAPM… but oh, the regular season production was just not enough compared to someone like Steph (worse in everything except EPM). Oh, he is 38 and injured, so we know he cannot actively be that good anymore, results be damned, all hail the young wings, they are all basically the same on defence anyway.

I see a lot of “it was close” in the regular season, and yeah, kind-of, in the sense that it is not unfair to be so inspired by a postseason gap that it makes up for the regular season gap. I want to be clear on this though: the only decent “impact” measure that does not prefer Lebron (who also played more than Davis, albeit not by much) is, somewhat ironically, LEBRON. EPM, DPM, raw plus/minus, RAPM (luck adjusted or otherwise), raw on/off… all of them place Lebron securely ahead. In a more meta sense, Lebron was and is the team’s leader. Lebron was the one on whom the team should have relied less — Lebron played something like 1100 minutes across the season with either Wenyen Gabriel, Thomas Bryant, or basically no one, and somehow, those lineups survived… and then in the postseason it turns out playing with no competent big (or high-level small-ball big) will in fact bleed points against elite and prepared competition. Shame on Lebron, I guess.

But okay, the injuries are what really “sunk” his season, right? Sure, when he set the scoring record, he definitely looked like a top five player, but that status may as well have vanished right there.

Quick exercise on that:
Player A — 27/10.5/5.5 on 58.5% efficiency with 3 turnovers on 40 minutes a game
Player B — 24.5/10/6.5 on 58.4% efficiency with 2 turnovers in 38.7 minutes a game
Player C — 27/6.5/6 on 56.5% efficiency with 2 turnovers in 39.7 minutes a game

That is, in some order, the postseason runs for Butler, Tatum, and Lebron. Was Lebron bleeding value defensively? No, if anything I thought he was probably the most valuable team defender of those three. A lot of respect to Tatum for how he handled Embiid at the end of that series, but Lebron performed similarly against Jokic while also being asked to switch onto Jamal. We are far off peak defender Lebron here, but that is irrelevant when looking at how he performed relative to other forwards. Peak Lebron would have been on another level past someone like Aaron Gordon, so our downgrade is him just being on the level of other capable superstars.

Okay, so Davis was better across two series, and on average the entire postseason. Was he a better player for the Lakers overall? Not asking more important, because literally speaking, yes, the team with no other centres needed that one centre to have any chance at success. Did he drive them more? I do not think so, and that is not some reluctance to place him ahead of Lebron. Lebron wanted Davis to be ahead lol. The entire idea of this partnership was for Lebron to hand over the reins, but Davis needs to take them! Again, I am looking for season-defining players. What defines this Lakers season: Lebron carrying a garbage team to keep postseason hopes alive while Davis was injured (and securing the all-time scoring record in the process), or Davis anchoring the defence of a conference finals team? I understand those who confidently say the latter, but for me that is a close question.

Even then, for as much as we can talk about postseason averages, Lebron was the guy who showed up at the end. I do not think we should gloss over that so easily. All postseason, we heard talk about Lebron having another gear but deliberately taking a more passive approach to maximise the team’s chances to make a long run. I am not just referring to media voices here; that was straight from Ham and Lebron. Mind you, passive Lebron was still the team’s lead scorer and shot creator every round, but alright, how did that work out? He arguably cost them Game 5 against the Grizzlies, but hard to be too upset with that given the overall series results, and he was good for the team every other game. Could easily argue the rest of the team let him down in Game 2 and ruined their chance at a sweep.

Against the Warriors, he struggles in Game 1 and the team wins, but then we have a near identical repeat of the prior round’s Game 2 where Lebron shows up and everyone else goes cold (although with how the Warriors played, everyone would have needed to be in top form to win that game, so whatever). Team cruises in Game 3. Lebron struggles a bit in Game 4, so maybe we can say the team bailed him out, but overall still a nice contributor. Blown out in Game 5, no one’s fault particularly, and then he is again exceptional in Game 6.

So it is the conference finals, and Lebron has cruised but played well. They are outperformed in Game 1. Deep hole from the outset. Fine. Davis was better that game. 1-0, just need to go 4-2 rest of the way, same with the two prior series. Game 2, Davis is a letdown. I mean, on Lebron too for not having much left in the fourth quarter, but that game is on Davis in my eyes. Play at a superstar level, play like the best player on the team, and they win. Game 3, Davis bounces back… but then the team collapses in the fourth quarter, and Davis is especially rough. Borderline deciding quarter, in terms of “do we have a chance to win this series”, and he vanishes. Well, yikes, down 3-0, surely the team’s best player, the guy who has defined this Lakers season, will show up with elimination on the line???

I think he did.

1. Nikola Jokic
2. Jimmy Butler
3. Jayson Tatum
4. Lebron James
5. Joel Embiid
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#11 » by jazzfan1971 » Mon Jun 19, 2023 3:06 am

Player of the year

1 - Nikola Jokic. I'm not sure if we are supposed to look at playoff performance for these awards or not. But, since we waited until after the finals to vote, I'm assuming it's ok. And nobody was as good as Joker. Best or 2nd best in the regular season and by far the best in the playoffs. Joker is him.

2 - Embiid. I thought he had a strong case for MVP. But, his playoff success just drops him into the 2nd tier.

3 - Giannis. I'm not leaving the top 3 MVP vote getters off my top 3. So, Giannis goes here. Deservedly.

4 - Curry. I thought Curry looked his usual great self. Just the rest of the team had imploded a bit.

5 - Tatum. I gave Doncic consideration, but can't go there for a guy that couldn't get his team into the playoffs.

HM - Doncic, Butler, Lebron, Dame

OPY

1 - Dame. Just lit up the league offensively. Over on ESPN's RPM his score is 13% higher than the #2 guy. It's not particularily close. Looking at LEBRON he is also at the top of their list only 7% higher than the next guy. Dame is a bucket.

2 - Doncic. Also a bucket. 2nd in scoring in the league behind Embiid while being more impactful.

3 - Curry. RPM has the top 3 Dame, Doncic, Curry. And I can't argue with that list.

HM - Joker, Embiid. Both these guys probably deserve a spot on here. But, I'm sticking with the 3pt bombers for my top picks.

DPOY

1 - JJJ. Jaren was electric on the defensive end. He'll lose for votes for games played and maybe his game didn't translate that well in the playoffs. But, you couldn't watch him and not be amazed at some of the plays he was able to make.

2 - Evan Mobley. Mobley crushed the list on RPM and was top 4 on LEBRON. Another guy that was lackluster in the playoffs, but you can clearly see he is a force.

3 - Bam. I haven't given much weight to playoff performance so far, but I feel that when you combine his regular season and playoff success he earned this third spot.

HM - Green, Brook both these guys brought a lot to the table on defense. I saw one game where Green got up and blocked a shot I thought he had NO BUSINESS getting that high. I'm shocked that he still has those kind of hops at his age. Brook is just like the energizer bunny he just keeps going and going.

Roy

1 - Banchero. I hate hate hate to put him over Kessler as a Jazz fan, but he just looks like a future star out there where Kessler might never make an All-Star team.

2 - Kessler. He was BY FAR the best Rookie in the regular season. If you consider this award just for the one regular season he takes it hands down. But, I think this award generally looks forward.

3 - Jalen Williams. I've heard some people say that Jalen was the best rookie this last year over Kessler. I think they are wrong, but he does fit into a nice middle ground where you can see him maybe reaching a higher plateau than Kessler. But maybe not.

MIP

1 - Markkanen Lauri had a tremendous year and probably cost the Jazz a chance at Wemby he was so good. I think he has a lot of doubters and I hope he proves them wrong with a strong 2nd year in Utah.

2 - Brunson. Dude was lightning in a bottle for NY. I don't think anything else mattered this season in NY, if they didn't get Brunson it was going to look like a train wreck. But, they did and he looked amazing. He's gone from a guy you can't believe is beating your team to one you expect to light you up.

3 - SGA. SGA solidified himself among the top tier of players in the NBA this season.

6moy

1 - Austin Reeves. Cameron really had a fine year and helped with an unexpectedly deep playoff push. He will be in high demand as a free agent.

2 - Quickley. I'm just basing this off some research. I didn't really see anything from him that screams 6moy to me in the games I watched.

3 - I'm going to go WAY off book here. I like Jose Alvarado. He just passed my eye test when I watched him play and I'd probably put him #2 on my list but I'm probably already going to take a lot of crap for putting him #3 so I'll leave him here.

COY

1 - Spolestra. I don't know how anyone else wins this if we take playoff success into account. He's always been a great coach so no surprise here.

2 - Pop. I know, nobody else is voting Pop. But, he is a guy that COULD have coached SAS to 32 wins and chose to just develop talent and shepherd losses. Zero ego. Ultimate success. Plus he's one of the greatest coaches I've ever had the joy to watch.

3 - Hardy. I can't really think of a guy that deserves this spot so I'm going full homer here. I thought he ran a lot of good stuff and used players effectively and really got more out of his guys than he should have. I think there may be better candidates out there but I think he certainly deserves mention.

EOY

1 - Ainge. I think Ainge ran away with this. Like he lapped the field. We are going to look back on the Gobert and Mitchell trades someday and just bow down in awe. I CANT believe there are folks that pick McNair over Ainge. What did he do this season to remotely compare to what Ainge did?? Bugs me.

2 - Leon Rose. Ainge had the best trades. Rose had the best signing. Getting Brunson and not getting sucked into an Ainge trade were both fantastic moves. He deserves a lot of credit.

3 - Sean Marks. I loved how Marks navigated the challenges of trading KG and Kyrie this year. I thought he did an amazing job considering the level of challenge he was handed.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#12 » by Dutchball97 » Mon Jun 19, 2023 5:47 pm

Player of the Year:

1. Nikola Jokic - I don't think I need to convince anyone here. He was in my eyes the best player in the regular season but the post-season removed any doubts to this question. His offense held up as well as it always did but now the defense was on point too when it mattered most. Overall an incredibly dominant season that it a great cherry on top for the amazing seasons he's been producing year after year.

2. Jimmy Butler - The big star of the first round, knocking out the 1 seed Bucks, and although he seemed to get worse as the play-offs went on, as a whole he had a great run. What propels him here isn't just a strong post-season though. I feel like he got underrated in the regular season due to his team record but he was right up there in most rate stats as well as cumulative stats despite missing some time. It was a close call with Tatum for this spot but in a season where a lot of stars got injured, missed the play-offs or simply disappointed I think rewarding someone who stepped up big time makes sense.

3. Jayson Tatum - Mr. Consistent this season. Played a lot of games, lots of minutes and he just kept playing at a high level. As an allround player on both sides of the ball, who shows plenty of effort and has the right attitude, what is not to love about him? The only thing holding him back from going even higher is that when it mattered most that consistency wavered somewhat whereas Butler never had any game in the play-offs turn into a disaster. I do think Tatum did enough to pass Embiid though as Embiid similarly had some terrible showings but didn't make up for it with games as dominant as Tatum had.

4. Joel Embiid - The clear second best player in the regular season definitely didn't live up to the hype in the play-offs but I don't think there is anyone else besides the three guys above that set themselves apart enough to make up the pretty sizeable regular season gap. His regular season was historic but he needs to step up in the play-offs to really contend for best player of the season.

5. Stephen Curry - #1 was easy and I was set pretty quickly on the 2-4 group after that in some order but I went through a lot of contenders for the final spot on my ballot. Giannis was top 3 in the regular but injuries stopped him from putting together enough of a post-season to stay on the list, similarly Kawhi also seemed on his way to a top 5 spot before injuries ended that once again. Then we have offensive juggernauts Damian Lillard and Luka Doncic who didn't get to show their worth in the play-offs. I feel like if their teams had made it they would've made the top 5 but as it stands their regular season alone isn't enough to top out over some more complete seasons. The final three contenders for me came down to Curry, AD and Booker. To be honest none of them really had "top 5" level seasons but they each impressed in different ways. Booker continued his strong regular season form from last year and then went nuclear in the play-offs. I think he definitely deserves a mention here but I don't think his heroic post-season showing bridged the regular season difference with Curry and AD. Now AD was the best defensive player of the season for me but I do prefer Curry for a couple of reasons. Curry had to carry a bigger load this year with the Warriors losing depth, Dray having a bit of an off-year, Klay being kind of done and Wiggins missing a large part of the season where AD had LeBron next to him, who at times looked like the better player on the team and is statistically very close to AD this year. Putting their play-offs next to each other I like Curry's consistency better, while both had a comparable amount of strong games relative to their total games played.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#13 » by jalengreen » Mon Jun 19, 2023 7:37 pm

Player of the Year

Spoiler:
1. Nikola Jokić: Strongest regular season combined with a championship run. Pretty obvious decision.
2. Jimmy Butler: Butler's reputation as a playoff riser might mask the fact that he has consistently been one of the most impactful regular season players in the league during his Miami Heat tenure. That was no different this year: elite regular season combined with an all-time great first round series performance. While his individual performance slowed down after the Bucks series, I place a lot of weight in carrying your team past a one seed. And while one could argue that the Heat were a deceiving eight seed, I don't think Butler's regular season shortcomings are why they were in that position, so he still deserves to be rewarded in an individual evaluation.
3. Jayson Tatum: Not quite a top tier player in terms of per-minute impact, but Tatum had top tier superstar durability to compensate for that in the regular season. Combined with a very solid deep playoff run, I think he deserves to be ranked over Embiid, a player with an MVP level regular season but very disappointing postseason.
4. Joel Embiid: There has been some revisionist history among NBA fans about Embiid's regular season, IMO. Jokic winning a championship doesn't invalidate the level that Embiid has played at, which was undoubtedly MVP caliber. The postseason struggles are real, though, and whether it's due to injury or not, that's something that must be factored in. It comes down to Tatum v. Embiid for #3 and the durability perspective makes me more confident in Tatum.
5. Anthony Davis: I considered a lot of candidates for #5, but ultimately no one stood out. Everyone except for Luka played <60 games (and he missed the playoffs), Lillard missed the playoffs, Curry played below his usual level in both the regular season and postseason, LeBron didn't have a usual LeBron playoff run, and far too often AD did not play like the best player on the team. Ultimately, Anthony Davis is my pick largely due to his unreal defensive impact in the postseason. His peak defensive impact throughout the first two rounds was as large as any player in recent history and it was a major reason for why the Lakers made a run into the WCF. I actually think that LeBron is likely still the best player on the Lakers, but from an achievement-oriented perspective I think AD has an edge (largely due to LeBron's injury).

HM: Luka Dončić, LeBron James, Stephen Curry, Damian Lillard


Offensive Player of the Year

Spoiler:
1. Nikola Jokić: Arguably the best offensive player in both the regular season and the postseason.
2. Damian Lillard: Up there with anyone on a rate basis in the regular season: #1 in O-EPM, #1 in O-LEBRON, 121.3 on-court ortg, +13.3 offensive on/off. Despite a minutes disadvantage (Curry 2434, Luka 2391, Lillard 2107), I think Lillard was clearly superior per-minute and I don't penalize him as much for missing games for the tank as I would if he was hurt.
3. Luka Dončić: Tough call here for #3. Ultimately, I think they (Dončić & Curry) had similar years and I could go either way, but I slightly prefer Luka's per-minute impact this year and I was not moved by Curry's postseason. When comparing two players where one's team went further than the other, I don't automatically give the edge to that player. It takes context. For instance, Tatum v. Embiid: Embiid's team would've gone further if he played like he should've. He deserves blame for their exit. OTOH, I do not think Luka's offense is the reason the Mavericks failed to make the playoffs and I am not worried about his playoff resilience.

HM: Stephen Curry


Defensive Player of the Year

Spoiler:
1. Anthony Davis: Transcendent defensive impact in the first two rounds of the playoffs (as great as anything we've seen in recent history), huge reason for the Lakers' run to the WCF. And still an elite regular season defender.
2. Evan Mobley: I prefer the defensive impact of the other three players mentioned here, but Mobley's massive lead in minutes played is something that should be considered, especially in comparison with Jaren Jackson Jr. While still having elite impact, of course, as the best defender on the league's top defense. As for the postseason, I think Jarrett Allen was more to blame for the Cavaliers' shortcomings than Mobley.
3. Jaren Jackson Jr.: The Grizzlies boasted the second best defensive rating in the league this year and JJJ was the engine. His defense continued to be extremely impressive in the first round series against the Lakers. Undoubtedly lacking in minutes played.

HM: Draymond Green
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#14 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jun 20, 2023 12:14 am

My personal votes with explanations.

General - personal - perspective here:

1. I factor in the playoffs heavily, but I do start my process with regular season achievement in mind, and I'm reluctant to change too much without a playoff run of some depth.

2. My numbered lists are meant to be true rankings. My Honorable Mentions are not necessarily the next guys on the list so much as the ones I feel compelled to shout out as having a significant year in the category in question. There's major player-overlap between the two approaches, but there can be differences and I'm not particularly interested in defending these choices.

Player of the Year
1. Nikola Jokic (Den)
2. Jayson Tatum (Bos)
3. Jimmy Butler (Mia)
4. Joel Embiid (Phi)
5. Anthony Davis (LAL)

HM: Devin Booker (Phx), Jalen Brunson (NY), Steph Curry (GS), Jaren Jackson Jr. (Mem), Jamal Murray (Den)

Jokic at #1 with the easiest call for me since Heatle-era LeBron. Absolutely epic year, and it has me so excited for what's to come, both from the Nuggets, and from those who will eventually be influenced by them.

Had Tatum at 3 and Embiid at 2 after the regular season. Hard for me not to see Tatum outplaying Embiid in series as a decisive factor when this sort of thing keeps happening to Embiid. Butler jumps Embiid too for similar reasons.

Tatum vs Butler was really tough for me. The truth is that I'll remember Butler's playoff run here more than I'll remember Tatum's year, but realistically I had Tatum well above Butler in the regular season, I can't imagine I'd be debating whether Tatum would still be ahead of Butler had the Celtics won their head-to-head playoff series, and despite Butler's Bird Award, I don't really feel like Butler clearly outplayed Tatum in the series.

Davis nabs the 5th spot. Underwhelming end against the Nuggets, but what he did to lead his team to the 3rd round was epic. Aside from the issues with health and consistency, there's this thing where in some matchups against good teams his capacity for impact is the best in the world, and in some he just isn't. Overall, it's enough to get him here this year.

Booker, Brunson & Curry can in some ways be grouped together. The star guards of the teams who got to the 2nd round. They deserve a bit more praise than that:

Booker has a pretty serious case for being the 2nd best player in the playoffs. Just a question of whether what I saw makes me feel like I've gotta lift him over others in the Top 5. Thing is, I kinda feel like the Suns go the same distance even if he got hurt. He looked like a god a couple times against Denver the way no one else did...but it never felt sustainable, and the sense of "threat" I felt with respect to the Suns was mostly out of an abstract notion of potential based on their stacked talent rather than how well they were actually able to play together.

Brunson is definitely the guy here that I feel a bit weird about. Am I convinced he was a Top 10 player this year? Dunno about that. But he had a year that cemented him in the hearts of Knick fans, and his game seemed remarkably resilient in the playoffs even relative to what we saw in Dallas.

Curry is Curry. It's not going to make the list of his most memorable seasons, but still the very best at what he does, and he managed an absolutely epic crescendo to pull off a Game 7 upset, that is only ever going to be doubted as an "upset" because people expect Curry & co to come out on top.

It was a bit of a step back this year for Memphis in terms of momentum, but that wasn't about JJJ. JJJ emerged as a clear cut star this year, and I think Memphis needs to seriously consider whether they still think Ja is their franchise player, or if it's really JJJ.

When a guy does what Murray did during Denver's championship run, he deserves a mention. Let me also say that I think Murray has a uniquely beautiful game, and I'm glad that he's looking like himself again.

Offensive Player of the Year
1. Nikola Jokic (Den)
2. Devin Booker (Phx)
3. Steph Curry (GS)

HM: Jalen Brunson (NY), Damian Lillard (Por)

Jokic by far here. I'll note that that makes it 3 OPOY's in a row for him in my book, and going back to World War 2, there are only two guys who I have as OPOY 4 years in a row (Oscar & Magic). He's getting into some rare air.

I racked my brains on the other spots. Lillard would be on the ballot if it were just the regular season. It's not his fault he wasn't in the playoffs...but that doesn't mean that the guys in the playoffs didn't rise up and accomplish amazing things Lillard didn't. So he doesn't quite make mine, but I'm glad he's making others'.

Brunson gets HM on this just like he did on POY. Still a wide band of uncertainty with him, but he looked terrifying down the stretch against Miami.

Defensive Player of the Year
1. Anthony Davis (LAL)
2. Evan Mobley (Cle)
3. Jaren Jackson Jr. (Mem)

HM: Alex Caruso (Chi), Draymond Green (GS)

AD jumps up to the top of my list. I just watched him in the playoffs and though that JJJ & Mobley weren't at that level yet.

I've felt that JJJ was better than Mobley all year, but the difference in minutes led me to have Mobley ahead during the regular season, and I just don't think it makes a lot of sense to elevate JJJ based on the playoffs.

Is Green an "honorable" mention here? :lol: Well, he's the guy who I left on my ballot I thought the hardest about putting on, and he remains a guy with a case to be the best defensive player in the world. He's also a guy whose temper really got out of control this year, and who was also on a team who really took a major fall defensively. In the end, I feel fine about him being left off this year.

And then there's the Caru-SHOW!. Realistically not a Top 5 DPOY guy by total value added, but I just think the guy deserves a shout for his defense next to DeRozan, Lavine & Vucevic.

Rookie of the Year
1. Walker Kessler (Uta)
2. Paolo Banchero (Orl)
3. Jalen Williams (OKC)

HM: Christian Braun (Den), Keegan Murray (Sac)

So, Banchero & Williams were the obvious candidates this year and I don't think need to be explained.

The placement of Kessler is what I've been pondering for months. He is the Most Valuable Rookie. He is not likely to be the best of this rookie class when all is said and done. Where does that leave him?

Well, I put him on top despite factoring in the latter. We're talking about the guy who now holds the record for most blocks by a rookie in the 21st century (Pau Gasol had it before), so by traditional standards were looking at a defensive anchor, who also plays smart and efficiently on offense. He may not be able to actually become a DPOY level guy, but I'm not prepared to say definitively I think he's a mere defensive role player going forward, and I have no intention of focusing only on offense for rookies.

Shout outs to Murray & Braun for helping playoff teams.

Most Improved Player
1. Lauri Markkanen (Uta)
2. Nic Claxton (Brk)
3. Shai Gilgeous-Alexander (OKC)

HM: Jalen Brunson (NY), Jaren Jackson Jr. (Mem)

Markkanen feels like a classic MIP candidate to me. The guy who goes from afterthought to being an all-star. How much of this is just opportunity? We'll never truly know, but this clearly wasn't you'd expect if you just extrapolated from his previous NBA stats. I also remember a podcast I listened to last off-season where one of the talking heads just kept insisting Markkanen wasn't "a good player by NBA standards". The Finn slapped the NBA across the face this year.

Claxton had slipped my mind before and y'know, he really took a leap this year.

I was really torn between the other 3 guys I've mentioned as to who would get the next (and last) spot on the ballot. I ended up going with the guy with the most dramatic box score rise who also got the least love from me on other ballots. Not saying that that was my reasoning, but I don't think it was a coincidence.

With SGA there's the thing that he really seemed poised for this breakout a couple years back before the (real?) injuries, and that has a lot to do with why Lauri & Nic grabbed spots ahead of him. But on the other hand, he's the guy rising to all-star & All-NBA this year who feels the most like a possibly top tier superstar in the making, and that makes it hard to dismiss his case.

6th Man of the Year
1. Austin Reaves (LAL)
2. Bruce Brown (Den)
3. Immanuel Quickley (NY)

HM: Malcolm Brogdon (Bos), Larry Nance Jr. (NO)

Reaves felt like such a break out to me that I first thought of him as an MIP candidate, and he certainly could have gotten at least an HM there. But realizing he's eligible for 6MOY, man, what a candidate for that one. I don't want to overstate his ceiling, but if I were the Lakers, I think I'd consider him to be untouchable right now. Absolutely valuable for the LeBron-AD core, and hope for the team going forward to at least have spirit.

I've really liked Brown since he came to prominence in Brooklyn. What he was doing in the playoffs this year - like Reaves - just screamed "this guy is a starer-level player".

Quickley was my 6MOY in the regular season and I'm reluctant to drop him. I think it's likely that it's not just the basketball world that hasn't caught on to how valuable his defense is, but that Leon & Thibs don't totally get it. Nevertheless, his playoffs were a bit soft, and while an injury was part of it, injuries are part of the game.

Brogdon won the actual 6MOY and I'm not going to say he was a ridiculous pick. He was solid.

I don't like giving the 6MOY award to guys who aren't on good teams, and that's one of the things that weakens Nance's candidacy, but I love the guy and think the Pelicans should appreciate what they have in him.

Coach of the Year
1. Erik Spoelstra (Mia)
2. Michael Malone (Den)
3. Mike Brown (Sac)

HM: Mark Daigneault (OKC), Tom Thibodeau (NY)

Spo had another post-season for the ages and really hammered in the impression he's the smartest coach around.

Malone played all the right cards in the playoffs and frankly feels like he deserves to win this award, but I can't honestly say that I think what he did was as crazy as Spo.

Brown had an absolutely great year helping turn around a franchise that had been in a pit for forever.

Reluctant to give a coach too much love for a middling season, but I do think what Daigneault did is impressive.

Shout out to Thibs who frankly I'd given up on. Was not expecting the Knicks, or any Thibs team, to turn into an offensive powerhouse.

Executive of the Year
1. Danny Ainge (Uta)
2. Leon Rose (NY)
3. Calvin Booth (Den)

HM: Monte McNair (Sac), Rob Pelinka (LAL)

As I've said, I don't like giving EOY to a tanking performance. Ainge feels different to me because he has a strong argument for the best player acquisitions of the year with Markkanen & Kessler. Were it simply about that it wouldn't be a given that he'd win, but definitely in the running, and then I always factor in the collateral gain/loss of such moves. Did you mortgage the franchise's future to get those guys? In this case Ainge got those guys while also acquiring other franchise's futures. Mind-blowing.

Rose is hard for me to place. This is a situation where my confidence in the GM and what his vision is ends up hurting him. Brunson & Hart? Great. Not trading for Mitchell? Actually great. But did he make that decision because he thought Brunson was this good, or was he just playing hardball and struck out?

Booth did not build these Nuggets - Tim Connolly did. Never the less, Booth this season acquired KCP & Brown and those moves impressed me quite a bit. It's still just acquiring role players, but that's what the Nuggets needed.

McNair won the actual award and I think he deserves some love. I do wonder about Sabonis long term as a playoff performer, but the Brown hire was dead smart, and the franchise is in a far better place than it was before.

I've been very critical of Pelinka, but I get why people see him as a candidate. You can definitely argue that no trade this year did more to help a franchise than Pelinka's Westbrook move, and while I don't think you can say he did it to give Reaves opportunity, he certainly knew it would give Reaves more of an opportunity.
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#15 » by OhayoKD » Tue Jun 20, 2023 3:59 am

At the buzzer but...
Doctor MJ wrote:

Will expand on the rationale later but I'll be voting for POY and leave the rest to my betters. Was thinking of trying EOY, but with the "double-dipping" considerations, I'd probably just confuse things.

Criteria/Methodology for player evaluation
For now, player-assessments are strictly era-relative. Am considering a shift to "impact averaged over time" or modernist-era-translation as factors, but for now it's really just how much you increase a random team's chances of winning it all. I'm not exclusively looking year to year necessarily(other teams may take a season or post-season to adjust), but it's not nothing. Surrounding years also matter to me, and for a rough rant explaining the steps, you can look here(I think I've fine-tuned that in ways but still):
https:/Wit /forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?p=103144819#p103144819

Other Considerations
Basing these guesses on historical and contemporary results, I'm working on a few assumptions:

-> Protecting the Rim is the most consistent source of value across different situations and contexts:
OhayoKD wrote:
Dutchball97 wrote:Perhaps at a higher theoretical treshold the gap between playmaker stacking and wing-scorer stacking becomes evident, but that treshold hasn't been reached and "paint-protectors" currently look like the least "situation-dependent" archetype. At an individual level, Duncan and Russell are probably the quintessential metronomes if we go by team success and if we go by individual impact, Russell and Kareem stand-out in terms of a lack of fluctuation. From rookie year to 1980 Kareem's "impact" stays pretty consistent with small postseason samples being where most of the fluctuation happens. Russell is still winning with seemingly average help right as he's about to retire.

-> Offensive players who are highly efficient-creators(think passer-rating instead of box-creation or ast:tov%) are the most resilient in playoff-settings
-> Players who function as on-court coaches(telling teammates where to go, prompting coaching decisions at key spots) on one or both-ends are extremely resilient to changes in situation and provide value higher than their physical production might indicate
-> Players who cannot require more specific conditions to reach their situational ceilings and therefore are curved down
Blackmill wrote:
OhayoKD wrote:it's not just about what you create. It's also about the quality of what you're creating AND how much you're leaving on the table with suboptimal decisions. Players on this tier have better discernable offensive "lift" than players the tier below, and often this is blamed entirely or pre-dominantly on "this is just because of who their teammates are", but I actually think the real source of this offensive advantage is the "quality" of what they're creating(and some of the backseat coaching stuff has an off-court effect that can't be tracked via impact stuff):



Don't have access to the numbers(paywall) rn but passer-rating also sees this. Curry and Jordan graded out as comparable or right behind creators in a pure volume metric like playval(based on ben's bpm which is using assist totals I think) or Box-OC, to guys like say Lebron, Magic, and Nash, but they had teammates telling players where to go(draymond/pippen respectively), and don't make the best possible reads as often(I think ben said it was something like 60% vs 80% of the high quality passes in his peaks video and we have the "good passes" number above).

Incidentally they don't seem to have the same level of offensive lift in the absence of a specific structure where those decisions are delegated to someone else:


By comparison, the best pre-triangle Jordan stretch(with Jordan arguably at his peak) sees a 52(Ben) or 53-win(E-balla) team over a 30-game sample going at +4.4 offensively(you can reach a +4.6 if you swap minuite distributions for the 5th and 7th mpg guys for 20 games and ignore the team didn't actually improve), Curry wasn't close to leading all-time offenses(and had worse metrics than both westbrook and durant) with Draymond on the bench.

-> All else being equal, being able to impact without the ball offers an advantage of being reliant on having the ball(KD vs Westbrook):
However, Nash’s situational value clearly changed from Dallas to Phoenix, as multiple APM methodologies demonstrate marginal impact in Dallas and seismic correlations in Phoenix. Improved health and the freedom-of-movement rule change were both factors, but I view these competing measurements as a classic case of fit. Similar to LeBron and Wade, Nash’s style of play created some diminishing returns. Unlike LeBron or Wade, Nash’s unheralded background and diminutive stature masked his poor fit in Dallas. Nash was more of a situational floor-raiser who could wash out in certain lineups next to ball-dominant scorers; he wasn’t as versatile as someone like LeBron, so pairing him with other centerpieces didn’t automatically supercharge such teams.

-> Players who disproportionately rely on being elite man-defenders to boost defenses are less likely to reach their situational ceilings than players who are not
-> Players who have limitations as ball-handlers are less likely to reach their situational ceilings than players who are not(There are levels to this, a Kareem or Jordan is dramatically less reliant on lower-ball-handling load to maximize their scoring value compared to players like Bird or Durant)
-> Credit is warranted when a player succeeds in-spite of roster-turnover or fo-drama, as it is harder to perform well in such situations
-> Failure is more forgivable in such circumstances(If the Suns go ballistic with an off-season to figure things out I'll retroactively raise Durant's 2023 a bit)

Off-court "impact on winning" matters, but I am going to be going off direct accounts and tangible actions/examples as opposed to media-narratives(am going to get into this with certain "coach-killer" claims at some point). Steph may be considered the leader of the Warriors, but as Dray is the one who is telling teammates what to do when he's on the sideline(you could hear this on mic'd up in game 2), is called the emotional leader by teammates, and is coaching up young-talent, he gets the lion's share of off-court credit. Not too relevant to a single-season ranking, but I'm planning to copy and paste this preamble(mostly) for the top 100 so humor me.

Off-court "gming" good and bad, taking pay-cuts, ensuring teammates sign contracts, side-line(or on-court) coaching(and the actual results), all come into play. I am not going to assume "the best player" is the "leader" even though people(teammates included) tend to assume that, but I will account for what specifically players in the organization say a player did or didn't do.

What is "Likely" to happen or how replicable something is(across different situations) is also relevant(not as much in a descriptive POY ranking). This is an important thing to consider with injuries(not so much with POY voting but still).

Competition quality matters but in terms of winning championships, the top-end is more relevant than the bottom-end. Beating the better "best" opponent matters more than beating a better "2nd best" opponent. Can be applied to looking at how strong a "year" is or how strong the path to a championship is. Regular season srs is also less relevant than something like say "San's psrs" in comparisons featuring teams from the last 10 years.

With all that said

POY BALLOT

1. Jokic
He was the best regular season player. He also completed a three-year stretch where had a better argument for being the best player every single one of those seasons than nearly anyone(and yes that includes any 3-year stretch for Jordan or Lebron). The only players in history I think may have had a comparably good argument are Bird, Kareem, and Russell. He destroyed 1-year impact-witnqlw like wowy, lineup-splits, extended wowy, ect(note that RAPM and APM-derivatives are less useful differentiating between 1-year peaks), and those sorts of numbers remain nigh-unprecedented when you make adjustments like taking out Jamal. Taken at face-value that 1-year rs portfolio looks better than anything that's available for the likes of Magic, Bird, or Jordan and right up-there with the likes of 2016 Steph, non-09/10 Lebron, and 03 Duncan. He also played significantly more than either of the other MVP-candidates and coasted to end the season because the Nuggets secured the 1-seed extremely early. Note that his best-teammate looks pretty pedestrian over a substantial when we flip things.

In the postseason the Nuggets went 16-4 posting point-differentials of +8.8, +8.9, +6, and +8.1 with their worst performance coming against a Lakers side that decisively clamped the champs. If you were to use the rs/off as I tend to do(sample-size) and attribute the playoff-improvement to Jokic(more on that later), there are a handful of players who've posted years that look comparable. I do not think he is especially advantaged in terms of fit(I consider the 2019 Raptors and Kawhi, Draymond/Steph, and Pippen/Jordan, Lebron/Bubble AD more exceptional in that regard) and even with weaker competition(like pretty much every team that was similarly dominant), the Nuggets were properly great.

Jokic is also a goat-tier offensive player with the only players i'd entertain as more valauble era-relative on that end being Oscar, Magic, Lebron, Nash, and Mikan. He is a truly do-it-all-scorer(someone like Durant can see their scoring suffer greatly when they have to function as a secondary ball-handler) who is good from pretty much every spot on the court on good to great volume. He is an all-time tough-shot-maker, an all-time post scorer, an all-time mid-range talent, an elite inside-guy, and might just be the best pure passing talent in league history. He also is one of the smartest players ever and like a Lebron, Nash, or Magic has impact that goes beyond what you can physically see him do(and thus should get some of the credit for his teammates improvement). His only weakness here is ball-handling(and it's not so easy to "push-pace"), but for a center he is absolutely exceptional there(and a matchup nightmare even for an all-time versatile defensive big like davis).

Jokic's defense held-up alot better in the playoffs than I thought and though he faced a fairly favorable set of positional matchups, it's notable his defense was outright good in the finals and against a certain Anthony Davis(albeit an injured one).

No one was as good and I would hope he would go down as a unanimous #1 here. He should have gone down as the first B2B2B MVP in nearly 30-years.

Caveats His playoff "impact" is actually pretty pedestrian if you use the postseason for off and while I'm not too big on one-offs, this is the third-year in a row this has been true. He actually was on pace to post a negative on/off for the 3rd year in a row before the final game.

He also looks alot worse using larger samples. 15-17 Steph and 15-17 Lebron look alot better in the RAPM sets, and Embid also cooks him in both the 3-year and career stuff I've seen. His 3-year rs impact still looks good relative to the likes of MJ and Shaq(especially shaq) but he goes from a step removed from the very best looking seasons to a couple steps even using raw-stuff. Luck-adjustment flips things but on a 3-year sample using luck-adjustment feels wrong. I also think Murray and Gordon both had bigger roles in the Nuggets postseason improvement, and he ran into two teams affected with injury(Lakers and Miami) with the most favorable home-court in the league. It's also worth noting that the Lakers series looks lot closer-looking if you account for how high-scoring the games were(a 6-point mov in a 120-orating series is not the same as a 6-point mov in a 90-orating series). While statistically the Nuggets are an all-time team it's hard to say they'd be favored vs the 2020 Lakers who merely rank 40th if we use something like Sansterre's methodology.

All of which is to say, while I certainly have no issue with someone arguing for Jokic to be higher, as things currently stand, I am not viewing Jokic's 2023 as a "goat-tier" year. I would also favor "non-goat" years like Duncan's 03 and Hakeem's 93/94 if we're just talking era-relative goodness. Nonetheless, he's an obvious #1 in the most talented era of league history. Give him all the props.

2. Butler
I think he was an arguable top-10 player in the regular season. I think he was also arguably the best player in the playoffs until injury and even with injury he outplayed another top 5 poy guy to make the finals with a short-handed team. I think purely on level of play he might be lower, but I also think Butler deserves some credit for the culture that has seen undrafted talent blossom in to contention-calibre starting pieces. He faded in the finals, but in a year where most of his competition got neutered by injury, an okay, not great finals performance seems forgivable.

3. Tatum
This is quite simple. Tatum was probably the 4th best player in the regular season(apm-derivatives would support that) on the second best team in the regular season. He was also arguably top-5 in the playoffs. I do think Butler outplayed him h2h(consider competition) so he's 3 and not 2 but he is a do-it-all perimeter player who was one of the best in the league wire to wire on a team that suffered a fair deal of drama and nearly completed the first 3-0 come-back in history.

4. Giannis
He was the 3rd best player on the best rs team by record(top 5 by srs) despite his best teammate missing time. His injury is also less of a factor to me than say an Embid, because he was able to recover fairly quickly and had the Bucks not ran into an eventual finalist in the 1st round there's a good chance the Bucks suffer his diminished influence playing hobbled till he found health. You can criticize his ft-shooting but even if that career-worst shooting performance was not injury-related, there's a decent chance the Bucks advance anyway if Giannis's defense isn't severely limited. I put him lower than Tatum due to his injury but he's earned some benefit of the doubt so he stays on the ballot.

5. Davis
He was the best defensive player in the playoffs, a dpoy(per-possession at least) lvl player in the regular season, and performed an all-time defensive feat for a big somehow nuetralizing the Warriors P n R. As Aneigma has noted, his impact stuff is juiced based on a lack of backups(and is flatly worse than Lebron anyway considering the RS), but the playoffs matter most and he was clearly the Lakers best player come-winning time. I also don't like him being removed from the picture as factor in the Lakers making the playoffs as the Lebron-less Lakers playing like a good team post-trade on davis going ballistic was a crucial factor in them having a conference run to speak of. If Lebron was healthy or AD didn't step up his defense, I would easily take Lebron base thanks to alot of the "off-court" stuff, but as the playoffs matter more to me, AD makes the top 5 with Lebron a hair behind.

If he had played the way he did in the 1st 2 rounds against the Nuggets, he would probably be in consideration for 2 or 3.


HM:
'

1, Lebron - Clearly top 5 for me during the regular season when you consider context(is arguably top 5 if you just go by impact stuff noisy as they are for 1-year), with him looking very impactful on a good team and a bad team. An easy top-10 during the postseason despite tearing his tendon and comfortably the best offensive player and 2nd best defender on what, by point-differential at least, was the best challenger to Denver(I am still giving Miami the mantle of 2nd best playoff team everything considered). Anenigma made a great case for Lebron being on the ballot but it would be inconsistent for me to put him in the top 5 even though its tempting. I don't worry about "accomplishment". Just what a player offers in terms of championship likelihood. This year should serve as a big-wake up call for people who were treating him as a significant off-court negative or a guy who is limited in terms of his ability to adapt on higher-end rosters. He operated as a tertiary ball-handler and a small-ball 5 or 4 stretches and was still extremely valuable with the Lakers playing like a 69-win team post-trade(record, not sure what the net is) wirh him on the court. He did really well in lineups with the likes of Westbrook and really well with abysmal spacing. Being one of the smartest players ever is probably worth more than many think.

That he was willing to be deployed the way he was offensively and defensively should prompt some serious questioning for those pushing him as an uncoachable egomaniac. Ham probably doesn't do as well as he did with your traditional(in terms of temperament) all-time great.

2. Embid. He was the 2nd best regular season player and if he was healthy I think he'd be top 3. Alas, he was injured, again, and despite being one of the most talented players ever, his career turning a warning shot for large players hoping to stay healthy in the current iteration of the league.

3. Booker. If he didn't get hurt in the last 2 games of the suns season, I'd consider him for 5 or 4. He was excellent in the postseason putting up great scoring with good defense and underrated playmaking(the idea that Durant was some sort of Curry-like fulcrum is absolutely absurd) and ball-handling. He was also a top 10 rs player when healthy but alas he missed a large part of the seaosn. He also played pretty weak defensive competition and a really weak 1st round opponent. The Suns did take the most games from the nuggets but they were also outscored by the most. I would also expect they would have lost against any of the other contenders given health.

4. Curry. Great playoffs, but he was not top 5 in the regular season and he was arguably worse in the playoffs than a guy who didn't make my ballot despite being up a tendon and down 30k minutes of milage. Warriors lost with home-court to a non-finalist after being close to .500 in the regular season in a pretty good situation in terms of fit. Steph was also a clear 3rd best in the biggest game of the season and he was wearing down quicker than his aforementioned tendon-less nemesis.

I see no good arguments for him being top 5 honestly, but he's probably better than anyone I haven't mentioned yet. As I've mentioned before he does a lot better projected across time than he does era-relative.

5. Luka. A better rs player than a couple of the guys on my ballot but...no playoffs no party :(
its my last message in this thread, but I just admit, that all the people, casual and analytical minds, more or less have consencus who has the weight of a rubberized duck. And its not JaivLLLL
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#16 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jun 20, 2023 6:11 pm

For voting tallies see spreadsheet.

Player of the Year: Nikola Jokic

Image

This is Jokic's 2nd, and 2nd straight, POY. Other than LeBron James - who repeated repeatedly - Jokic is the first to repeat since Shaquille O'Neal.

Jokic was a unanimous choice. He is the first to do this since LeBron in '12-13.

Top Finishers:
1. Nikola Jokic (DEN)
2. Jayson Tatum (BOS)
3. Jimmy Butler (MIA)
4. Joel Embiid (PHI)
5. Giannis Antetokounmpo (MIL)

Others Receiving Votes: Anthony Davis (LAL), Steph Curry (GS), LeBron James (LAL)

Offensive Player of the Year: Nikola Jokic

Image

This is Jokic's 3rd, and 3rd straight, OPOY. Both are matched only by Steph Curry (since we began in '14-15).

Top Finishers:
1. Nikola Jokic (DEN)
2. Damian Lillard (POR)
3. Luka Doncic (DAL)

Others Receiving Votes: Steph Curry (GS), Devin Booker (PHX)

Defensive Player of the Year: Anthony Davis

Image

This is AD's 2nd DPOY. He remains one of only 3 players, along with Rudy Gobert & Draymond Green, to win our award.

Top Finishers:
1. Anthony Davis (LAL)
2. Jaren Jackson Jr. (MEM)
3. Draymond Green (GS)

Others Receiving Votes: Evan Mobley (CLE), Bam Adebayo (MIA)

Rookie of the Year: Walker Kessler

Image

Top Finishers:
1. Walker Kessler (UTA)
2. Paolo Banchero (ORL)
3. Jalen Williams (OKC)

Most Improved Player: Lauri Markkanen

Image

Top Finishers:
1. Lauri Markkanen (UTA)
2. Shai Gilgeous-Alexander (OKC)
3. Jalen Brunson (NY)
(tie) Nic Claxton (BRK)

Others Receiving Votes: Jaren Jackson Jr. (MEM)

6th Man of the Year: Austin Reaves

Image

Reaves is the 1st to be unanimous in this award.

Top Finishers:
1. Austin Reaves (LAL)
2. Immanuel Quickley (NY)
3. Bruce Brown (DEN)

Others Receiving Votes: Jose Alvarado (NO), Malcolm Brogdon (BOS)

Coach of the Year: Erik Spoelstra

Image

This is Erik Spoelstra's 2nd COY, he joins Brad Stevens and Steve Kerr as multiple winners.

Spoelstra is the 1st to win this award unanimously.

Top Finishers:
1. Erik Spoelstra (MIA)
2. Michael Malone (DEN)
3. Mike Brown (SAC)

Others Receiving Votes: Gregg Popovich (SA), Will Hardy (UTA), Tom Thibodeau (NY)

Executive of the Year: Danny Ainge

Image

Ainge is the 1st to win EOY twice, and also the first to win on 2 different teams.

Top Finishers:
1. Danny Ainge (UTA)
2. Leon Rose (NY)
3. Calvin Booth (DEN)

Others Receiving Votes: Pat Riley (MIA), Sean Marks (BRK)
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#17 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jun 20, 2023 7:25 pm

Historical Spreadsheets updated:

RealGM All-Season Award Winners

RealGM All-Season Awards Shares through '22-23

Note worthy updates:

Active Players in Top 100 on List, with previous rank in parentheses.

2. LeBron James (2)
16. Steph Curry (16)
20. Nikola Jokic (26)
21. Kevin Durant (20)
22. Giannis Antetokounmpo (23)
24. Chris Paul (22)
29. James Harden (29)
35. Kawhi Leonard (35)
37. Anthony Davis (37)
40. Dwight Howard (40)
44. Joel Embiid (54)
48. Russell Westbrook (47)
49. Jayson Tatum (76)
51. Jimmy Butler (72)
65. Draymond Green (63)
73. Blake Griffin (71)
76. Luka Doncic (75)
78. Rudy Gobert (78)
80. Kevin Love (80)
84. Derrick Rose (84)
88. Paul George (88)
94. Victor Oladipo (94)

Top 10 in OPOY Shares (since we began in '14-15):
1. Steph Curry
2. Nikola Jokic
3. LeBron James
4. James Harden
5. Luka Doncic
6. Russell Westbrook
7. Damian Lillard
8. Chris Paul
9. Kevin Durant
10. Kawhi Leonard

Top 10 in DPOY Shares (since we began in '14-15):
1. Rudy Gobert
2. Draymond Green
3. Anthony Davis
4. Kawhi Leonard
5. Giannis Antetokounmpo
6. Joel Embiid
7. Jaren Jackson Jr.
8. Bam Adebayo
9. Evan Mobley
10. Clint Capela
(tie) Robert Williams

Most Times Winning Each Award:

POY
LeBron James - 9
Michael Jordan - 9
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar - 8
Bill Russell - 7
Wilt Chamberlain - 4
Tim Duncan - 4
Larry Bird - 3
Shaquille O'Neal - 3
Kevin Garnett - 2
Nikola Jokic - 2
Moses Malone - 2
Hakeem Olajuwon - 2
Bob Pettit - 2

OPOY
Steph Curry - 3
Nikola Jokic - 3
LeBron James - 2

DPOY
Rudy Gobert - 4
Draymond Green - 3
Anthony Davis - 2

6MOY
Andre Iguodala - 2
Lou Williams - 2

COY
Steve Kerr - 2
Erik Spoelstra - 2
Brad Stevens - 2

EOY
Danny Ainge - 2
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#18 » by Doctor MJ » Tue Jun 20, 2023 7:30 pm

With voting complete, feels free to post here if you wish to speak specifically to the voting.

Something I'm going to note: Participation in the actual voting this year was down. This might suggest that I need to ease up in how I run this. I'll reflect on that for next year.

Thank you to all who participated through Discussion and/or Voting!

Sincerely,
Doc
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Thread (voting ends Monday night, the 19th) 

Post#19 » by Colbinii » Tue Jun 20, 2023 7:46 pm

Doctor MJ wrote:With voting complete, feels free to post here if you wish to speak specifically to the voting.

Something I'm going to note: Participation in the actual voting this year was down. This might suggest that I need to ease up in how I run this. I'll reflect on that for next year.

Thank you to all who participated through Discussion and/or Voting!

Sincerely,
Doc


I think more time was nice, but maybe that wasn't the issue for everyone. I was out of town from Thursday - Late last night [Arrived around Midnight] and never had time to create a write-up.
tsherkin wrote:Locked due to absence of adult conversation.

penbeast0 wrote:Guys, if you don't have anything to say, don't post.


Circa 2018
E-Balla wrote:LeBron is Jeff George.


Circa 2022
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Re: 2022-23 RealGM All-Season Awards - Voting Complete 

Post#20 » by jazzfan1971 » Tue Jun 20, 2023 8:38 pm

My question is - Are player of the year and offensive player of the year the same award?

I was alone on this but I felt like putting joker on the offensive player list was redundant after putting him on the overall best list.

So I'm wondering does the same player always take both awards?
"Thibs called back and wanted more picks," said Jorge Sedano. "And Pat Riley, literally, I was told, called him a mother-bleeper and hung up the phone."

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