Updating my top 50 players of all time

[ceoofkobefans]

About 6 months ago I made this post https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=2247763&hilit=Top+50 ranking my top 50 players of all time, and now that the season is over I felt it would be appropriate to update my list. (I’ll try to tier it)

1. LeBron James (-)
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (-)
3. Michael Jordan (-)

4. Tim Duncan (+1)
5. Shaquille O’Neal (-1)

6. Kobe Bryant (-)
7. Hakeem Olajuwon (-)
8. Wilt Chamberlain (-)
9. Bill Russell (-)

10. Kevin Garnett (-)
11. Larry Bird (-)
12. Magic Johnson (-)
13. Steph Curry (+1)

14. Karl Malone (-1)
15. Oscar Robertson (-)
16. Dirk Nowitzki (+1)
17. Chris Paul (-1)
18. Kevin Durant (+1)
19. Jerry West (-1)

20. Julius Erving (+3)
21. David Robinson (-1)
22. Dwyane Wade (-1)
23. Steve Nash (-1)

24. James Harden (+1)
25. Charles Barkley (-1)
26. Moses Malone (+2)
27. John Stockton (-1)

28. Patrick Ewing (-1)
29. Scottie Pippen (-)
30. Giannis Antetokoumnpo (+4)

31. Jason Kidd (-)
32. Rick Barry (-)
33. Reggie Miller (-3)
34. Anthony Davis (+2)
35. John Havlicek (-2)
36. Kawhi Leonard (-1)

37. Russell Westbrook (-)
38. Nikola Jokic (N/A)
39. Elgin Baylor (+1)
40. Dwight Howard (-1)
41. Walt Frazier (-3)

42. Paul Pierce (-)
43. Kevin McHale-2)
44. Ray Allen (-1)
45. Allen Iverson (-1)

46. Gary Payton (-1)
47. Clyde Drexler (-1)
48. Alonzo Mourning (+1)
49. Artis Gilmore (N/A)
50. Isiah Thomas (-2)

Let me know who i snubbed and what order y’all would change and why!

[penbeast0]

Well, the obvious ones just in the top 10 for me are Kobe is too high (10-20) and Russell too low (1-4); it shouldn't matter whether your impact comes from scoring or from defense and rebounding. In that same vein, I would have Wilt over Shaq and Hakeem and probably Duncan as well at the top of tier 2 (#5).

[One_and_Done]

Certainly living up to your name. What is the criteria that could possibly lead to Kobe being 6th. Even ringzzzz doesn't hold up. Magic and Giannis also too low.

[70sFan]

It's a good list overall, here are my disagreements:

1. Kobe Bryant is too high on that list. The absolute highest I can see him is at the 10th spot.
2. Russell is way too low for me.
3. I don't think I'd rate Durant that high. I don't have him much lower, but putting him at 18th spot would be very tough.
4. I think Pippen is definitely too high, but many people rate Pippen higher than me (even though I am probably higher on Pippen's peak than most).
5. Kawhi is way too high, I wouldn't put him inside top 50 personally.
6. Westbrook is also way too high for me, I have him around 50th spot.
7. Gilmore too low, unless you don't think highly of his ABA career.
8. Isiah probably out of top 50 (I had him there for a moment, but it's not defensible).
9. No George Mikan is a huge omission. So is lack of Bob Pettit.

[Cavsfansince84]

I don't think Barry has much of an argument over Hondo tbh. The amount of games he missed from 68-71 is just too much and by the time he's back in the nba and able to stay healthy I think the injuries had taken a toll on him and his efficiency for a volume scorer was no longer good. Then add in Havlicek's leadership, defense, longevity & playoff record from 67-76 and I think he's a few spots above Rick(at least). It would also be really helpful if when people want to post a top 25 or 50 to list the 2-3 criteria you most value so we can respond based on that.

[PistolPeteJR]

I have never seen Magic outside of the top-10 and yet he's at 12 here. Could you please explain the rationale?

[MyUniBroDavis]

About 6 months ago I made this post https://forums.realgm.com/boards/viewtopic.php?f=64&t=2247763&hilit=Top+50 ranking my top 50 players of all time, and now that the season is over I felt it would be appropriate to update my list. (I’ll try to tier it)

1. LeBron James (-)
2. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (-)
3. Michael Jordan (-)

4. Tim Duncan (+1)
5. Shaquille O’Neal (-1)

6. Kobe Bryant (-)
7. Hakeem Olajuwon (-)
8. Wilt Chamberlain (-)
9. Bill Russell (-)

10. Kevin Garnett (-)
11. Larry Bird (-)
12. Magic Johnson (-)
13. Steph Curry (+1)

14. Karl Malone (-1)
15. Oscar Robertson (-)
16. Dirk Nowitzki (+1)
17. Chris Paul (-1)
18. Kevin Durant (+1)
19. Jerry West (-1)

20. Julius Erving (+3)
21. David Robinson (-1)
22. Dwyane Wade (-1)
23. Steve Nash (-1)

24. James Harden (+1)
25. Charles Barkley (-1)
26. Moses Malone (+2)
27. John Stockton (-1)

28. Patrick Ewing (-1)
29. Scottie Pippen (-)
30. Giannis Antetokoumnpo (+4)

31. Jason Kidd (-)
32. Rick Barry (-)
33. Reggie Miller (-3)
34. Anthony Davis (+2)
35. John Havlicek (-2)
36. Kawhi Leonard (-1)

37. Russell Westbrook (-)
38. Nikola Jokic (N/A)
39. Elgin Baylor (+1)
40. Dwight Howard (-1)
41. Walt Frazier (-3)

42. Paul Pierce (-)
43. Kevin McHale-2)
44. Ray Allen (-1)
45. Allen Iverson (-1)

46. Gary Payton (-1)
47. Clyde Drexler (-1)
48. Alonzo Mourning (+1)
49. Artis Gilmore (N/A)
50. Isiah Thomas (-2)

Let me know who i snubbed and what order y’all would change and why!

When the CEOofKobeFans has Kobe below where I have him

[iggymcfrack]

Swap Kobe and David Robinson, move Giannis and Jokic up a bunch and it's not a bad list.

[ceoofkobefans]

It's a good list overall, here are my disagreements:

1. Kobe Bryant is too high on that list. The absolute highest I can see him is at the 10th spot.
2. Russell is way too low for me.
3. I don't think I'd rate Durant that high. I don't have him much lower, but putting him at 18th spot would be very tough.
4. I think Pippen is definitely too high, but many people rate Pippen higher than me (even though I am probably higher on Pippen's peak than most).
5. Kawhi is way too high, I wouldn't put him inside top 50 personally.
6. Westbrook is also way too high for me, I have him around 50th spot.
7. Gilmore too low, unless you don't think highly of his ABA career.
8. Isiah probably out of top 50 (I had him there for a moment, but it's not defensible).
9. No George Mikan is a huge omission. So is lack of Bob Pettit.

1. Yea I know I’m gonna disagree with most on the bean placing

2. Same thing I’m a lot lower on BR than everyone in this forum pretty Much

3. I could see him at like 20/21 ish but I think 18 is fair

4. Where would you have Scottie? And I have him at like a fringe mvp level at his peak

5. I think he has enough longevity with how good his peak is to be bottom of the top 40

6. I think russ’ peak with ok longevity is just too much to keep him out of the t40

7. He’s someone I wanna watch more I might end up being higher on him

8. I think he can be as high as low 40s and and as low as mid to high 50s

9. Didn’t include the guys that are ghosts when it comes to info on their games

[ceoofkobefans]

Swap Kobe and David Robinson, move Giannis and Jokic up a bunch and it's not a bad list.

Swap Kobe and David Robinson is prolly the craziest thing I’ve heard recently

[ceoofkobefans]

I have never seen Magic outside of the top-10 and yet he's at 12 here. Could you please explain the rationale?

Where do you have him and why?

The reason is mainly i like that good ole longevity and i dont think his is good enough to get him into that t10 (although I could I see him at 10 maaaybe 9)

[One_and_Done]

Peak D.Rob was better than Kobe and it's not close. His longevity is where there's a debate.

[PistolPeteJR]

I have never seen Magic outside of the top-10 and yet he's at 12 here. Could you please explain the rationale?

Where do you have him and why?

The reason is mainly i like that good ole longevity and i dont think his is good enough to get him into that t10 (although I could I see him at 10 maaaybe 9)

You value longevity over peak and prime, or on par?

I have Magic somewhere between 5-8, not fixed.

[ceoofkobefans]

Peak D.Rob was better than Kobe and it's not close. His longevity is where there's a debate.

I’d have it the other way around and Kobe clears Drob from a longevity and durability standpoint

[ceoofkobefans]

I have never seen Magic outside of the top-10 and yet he's at 12 here. Could you please explain the rationale?

Where do you have him and why?

The reason is mainly i like that good ole longevity and i dont think his is good enough to get him into that t10 (although I could I see him at 10 maaaybe 9)

You value longevity over peak and prime, or on par?

I have Magic somewhere between 5-8, not fixed.

Yes i value longevity over peak

What makes Magic so high for you?

[PistolPeteJR]

Where do you have him and why?

The reason is mainly i like that good ole longevity and i dont think his is good enough to get him into that t10 (although I could I see him at 10 maaaybe 9)

You value longevity over peak and prime, or on par?

I have Magic somewhere between 5-8, not fixed.

Yes i value longevity over peak

What makes Magic so high for you?

One of the GOAT offensive players, tremendous prime, excellent peak.

[Warspite]

1. Moses Malone : There are not 10 players who can win an MVP over KAJ, Bird, Magic and DrJ 3 out of 5 years.
2. You overrate every Laker Except Magic.
3. KG/Bob Pettit are the same player offensively vs defensively. One is top 10 the other is absent. The truth is they most likely are in the middle.
4. Anthony Davis = Bob Mcadoo They both belong in the 70-90 list.
5. You underrate every Celtic.
6. CP3 is his generations, Pistol. Gaudy states that dont translate to Wins.

Isiah Thomas is the only player on this list with a ring and no teammates. He has 2 and could have had 5 but lost to MJ, Magic and Bird. 2 injuries and a bad inbounds pass. If you care about stats He is not your guy but if you want to win no player achieved more with less than Isiah Thomas.

[migya]

1. Moses Malone : There are not 10 players who can win an MVP over KAJ, Bird, Magic and DrJ 3 out of 5 years.
2. You overrate every Laker Except Magic.
3. KG/Bob Pettit are the same player offensively vs defensively. One is top 10 the other is absent. The truth is they most likely are in the middle.
4. Anthony Davis = Bob Mcadoo They both belong in the 70-90 list.
5. You underrate every Celtic.
6. CP3 is his generations, Pistol. Gaudy states that dont translate to Wins.

Isiah Thomas is the only player on this list with a ring and no teammates. He has 2 and could have had 5 but lost to MJ, Magic and Bird. 2 injuries and a bad inbounds pass. If you care about stats He is not your guy but if you want to win no player achieved more with less than Isiah Thomas.

Agree with you on everything except Isiah being that great as his teams were quite loaded in the right spots and their playing style is what made them as good as they were. CP3 did win alot, not playoffs so much, but he carried some teams to an extent. He wasn't at the level of the greatest guards ever but his longevity is good. He is near top 20.

[One_and_Done]

1. Moses Malone : There are not 10 players who can win an MVP over KAJ, Bird, Magic and DrJ 3 out of 5 years.
2. You overrate every Laker Except Magic.
3. KG/Bob Pettit are the same player offensively vs defensively. One is top 10 the other is absent. The truth is they most likely are in the middle.
4. Anthony Davis = Bob Mcadoo They both belong in the 70-90 list.
5. You underrate every Celtic.
6. CP3 is his generations, Pistol. Gaudy states that dont translate to Wins.

Isiah Thomas is the only player on this list with a ring and no teammates. He has 2 and could have had 5 but lost to MJ, Magic and Bird. 2 injuries and a bad inbounds pass. If you care about stats He is not your guy but if you want to win no player achieved more with less than Isiah Thomas.

Agree with you on everything except Isiah being that great as his teams were quite loaded in the right spots and their playing style is what made them as good as they were. CP3 did win alot, not playoffs so much, but he carried some teams to an extent. He wasn't at the level of the greatest guards ever but his longevity is good. He is near top 20.

Yeh that made no sense. The Pistons were stacked. An ensemble effort, with I.T as the arguable best player. I give him less credit for those titles than Billups for the Pistons success.

[migya]

1. Moses Malone : There are not 10 players who can win an MVP over KAJ, Bird, Magic and DrJ 3 out of 5 years.
2. You overrate every Laker Except Magic.
3. KG/Bob Pettit are the same player offensively vs defensively. One is top 10 the other is absent. The truth is they most likely are in the middle.
4. Anthony Davis = Bob Mcadoo They both belong in the 70-90 list.
5. You underrate every Celtic.
6. CP3 is his generations, Pistol. Gaudy states that dont translate to Wins.

Isiah Thomas is the only player on this list with a ring and no teammates. He has 2 and could have had 5 but lost to MJ, Magic and Bird. 2 injuries and a bad inbounds pass. If you care about stats He is not your guy but if you want to win no player achieved more with less than Isiah Thomas.

Agree with you on everything except Isiah being that great as his teams were quite loaded in the right spots and their playing style is what made them as good as they were. CP3 did win alot, not playoffs so much, but he carried some teams to an extent. He wasn't at the level of the greatest guards ever but his longevity is good. He is near top 20.

Yeh that made no sense. The Pistons were stacked. An ensemble effort, with I.T as the arguable best player. I give him less credit for those titles than Billups for the Pistons success.

It's similar for both IT and Billups. Those teams were similar.