RealGM

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 1:54 pm**

The career of Olajuwon has been talked about here but could he be the best Center ever?

Brings up good facts about him not having good teams and carrying almost every year. The achievement of winning in 95 against such great opponents is unmatched.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 2:08 pm**

This guys youtube channel is hilarious.

"The Last Flop"
"The Last Choke"
"A Cowards Way"

I always wonder about what someone does to your family in order to make an entire youtube channel predicated on hating on LeBron James. And then you realize that the biggest idiot isn't the guy making the videos, and he isn't an idiot at all as he just preys on people who have hatred inside of them, it is the 15 Thousand Subscribers who waste countless hours of their lives watching these videos.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 2:25 pm**

There is much right in what he says. Society and attitude is falling and Lebron has displayed such characteristics many times.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 4:32 pm**

Kareem or Russell. They were much more consistent

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 4:37 pm**

Colbinii wrote:This guys youtube channel is hilarious.

"The Last Flop"
"The Last Choke"
"A Cowards Way"

I always wonder about what someone does to your family in order to make an entire youtube channel predicated on hating on LeBron James. And then you realize that the biggest idiot isn't the guy making the videos, and he isn't an idiot at all as he just preys on people who have hatred inside of them, it is the 15 Thousand Subscribers who waste countless hours of their lives watching these videos.

Well, they do something "right", since they have 3 times more subscribers than me... :banghead:

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 4:39 pm**

1993Playoffs wrote:Kareem or Russell. They were much more consistent

Agreed, in spite of tremendous apexes - I don’t think Hakeem or Shaq flanked their career with astounding prime qualities to the extent Kareem/Russ did.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 5:05 pm**

The career of Olajuwon has been talked about here but could he be the best Center ever?

If you are going to make a case for Olajuwon you could do the same for David Robinson.

Prior to his injury (7 seasons 1989-90 to 1995-96) he was as dominant as a player could be:

- averaged 55 wins a season in San Antonio (only Chicago won more)
- all-NBA 1st team 4 times, 2nd team once, 3rd team twice (with Olajuwon, Shaq, and Ewing around)
- all-defensive 1st team 4 times, 2nd team 3 times
- Spurs were the 3rd best team defensively all that time (only New York and Portland were better defensively)

And all that time he played 79-80 games a season and 38 min/g, played 21000+ minutes.

Yet his only teammates to play 5000+ minutes all that time were Sean Elliott (16559 min), Willie Anderson (10873), Terry Cummings (9647), Avery Johnson (9330), Vinney Del Negro (8601), Dale Ellis (5321), Rod Strickland (5250), and J.R. Reid (5145).

I doubt those 8 players could win more than 25-30 games in a season without Drob.

About the only really great player he played with all that time was 2 seasons with Dennis Rodman, and he came with his own package of problems (but on the court was really good).

Robinson did not get to play alongside Duncan until he was 32 years of age coming off an injury. Yet still won two titles with Duncan, at the ages of 33 and 37.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 5:19 pm**

I really struggle to see any justification that puts Hakeem above Kareem.

I could understand putting Hakeem above Wilt, Russel, or Shaq based on various reasons; however, there isn't a great justification that puts him above Kareem.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 5:27 pm**

He could be, if you squint really hard and fudge a bit . . . or he could be #6 behind Russell, Kareem, Wilt, Shaq, Duncan. In fact, he could be behind Mikan and Jokic with the same kind of alternative weighing of factors it takes to see him as #1 so make that he could be #8 center of all time.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 7:48 pm**

Wigginstime wrote:I really struggle to see any justification that puts Hakeem above Kareem.

I could understand putting Hakeem above Wilt, Russel, or Shaq based on various reasons; however, there isn't a great justification that puts him above Kareem.

This. It's totally impossible to rank him higher than Kareem.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 8:27 pm**

nate33 wrote:
Wigginstime wrote:I really struggle to see any justification that puts Hakeem above Kareem.

I could understand putting Hakeem above Wilt, Russel, or Shaq based on various reasons; however, there isn't a great justification that puts him above Kareem.

This. It's totally impossible to rank him higher than Kareem.

Maybe Hakeem was so dominant this past season that one more good season could move him beyond Kareem? Kareem didn't score a single point last year!

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 8:34 pm**

The justification for putting him over Kareem is the same as the one for putting him over Mikan, era strength differential. Kareem peaked in the 70s, an era weaker than the 60s of Russell and Wilt. Hakeem's era was not a particularly strong one compared to more modern ones with few great international stars and still some expansion diluting the league talent but it was stronger than Kareem's. So, someone who sees older players as "plumbers and firemen" might have Jokic over Hakeem and Hakeem over Kareem based on that despite the longevity advantage.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 8:46 pm**

penbeast0 wrote:The justification for putting him over Kareem is the same as the one for putting him over Mikan, era strength differential. Kareem peaked in the 70s, an era weaker than the 60s of Russell and Wilt. Hakeem's era was not a particularly strong one compared to more modern ones with few great international stars and still some expansion diluting the league talent but it was stronger than Kareem's. So, someone who sees older players as "plumbers and firemen" might have Jokic over Hakeem and Hakeem over Kareem based on that despite the longevity advantage.

The counterpoint to that is that his competition at position was actually some of the strongest in league history, and he started midway through the 80s, which was an especially strong period as well. It's not quite the same as Mikan, though the parallel is worth exploring, certainly.

I don't really see the sell of Olajuwon as best ever, though you can certainly look at 92-95 as a very competitive peak.

Posted: **Tue Aug 1, 2023 9:12 pm**

Agreed, his competition was stronger at center than Jokic, Shaq, or Kareem, probably not as strong as Wilt or Russell on average.

Posted: **Wed Aug 2, 2023 1:54 am**

70sFan wrote:
Colbinii wrote:This guys youtube channel is hilarious.

"The Last Flop"
"The Last Choke"
"A Cowards Way"

I always wonder about what someone does to your family in order to make an entire youtube channel predicated on hating on LeBron James. And then you realize that the biggest idiot isn't the guy making the videos, and he isn't an idiot at all as he just preys on people who have hatred inside of them, it is the 15 Thousand Subscribers who waste countless hours of their lives watching these videos.

Well, they do something "right", since they have 3 times more subscribers than me...

I'm pretty sure we can close that gap for ya

Posted: **Wed Aug 2, 2023 2:01 am**

migya wrote:The career of Olajuwon has been talked about here but could he be the best Center ever?

Watch on YouTube

Brings up good facts about him not having good teams and carrying almost every year. The achievement of winning in 95 against such great opponents is unmatched.

The irony is Bill Russell has a stronger version of the argument made here for Hakeem as does Duncan. Kareem technically does not if you are an absolutist about "if you don't win you don't get credit", but otherwise he's a much stronger floor-raiser as well.

penbeast0 wrote:The justification for putting him over Kareem is the same as the one for putting him over Mikan, era strength differential. Kareem peaked in the 70s, an era weaker than the 60s of Russell and Wilt. Hakeem's era was not a particularly strong one compared to more modern ones with few great international stars and still some expansion diluting the league talent but it was stronger than Kareem's. So, someone who sees older players as "plumbers and firemen" might have Jokic over Hakeem and Hakeem over Kareem based on that despite the longevity advantage.

That still leaves Duncan though who more or less is a more accomplished, more successful, and less empirically assailable variant peaking at a point were foreign talent had more than doubled.

Not seeing a great case for Olajuwon on that front. Really the closest thing I've seen to a case there is the uh...compelling notion that Duncan won too many regular-season games

Posted: **Wed Aug 2, 2023 2:04 am**

Colbinii wrote:This guys youtube channel is hilarious.

"The Last Flop"
"The Last Choke"
"A Cowards Way"

I always wonder about what someone does to your family in order to make an entire youtube channel predicated on hating on LeBron James. And then you realize that the biggest idiot isn't the guy making the videos, and he isn't an idiot at all as he just preys on people who have hatred inside of them, it is the 15 Thousand Subscribers who waste countless hours of their lives watching these videos.

Perfect post.

Posted: **Wed Aug 2, 2023 5:53 am**

Wigginstime wrote:I really struggle to see any justification that puts Hakeem above Kareem.

I could understand putting Hakeem above Wilt, Russel, or Shaq based on various reasons; however, there isn't a great justification that puts him above Kareem.

Simply by him winning two straight championships in tough seasons and against great opposition. In 94 none of his teammates were allstar or close to it, in 95 Drexler was in his twelveth season, suffered injuries two years prior that he was never the same after. Kareem was great in the weaker 70s and never won anything without a star guard, like Shaq, and the 80s Lakers were loaded.

Olajuwon's defense is top 3 ever and he was consistent until he was mid 30s.

Posted: **Wed Aug 2, 2023 6:21 am**

OhayoKD wrote:
70sFan wrote:
Colbinii wrote:This guys youtube channel is hilarious.

"The Last Flop"
"The Last Choke"
"A Cowards Way"

I always wonder about what someone does to your family in order to make an entire youtube channel predicated on hating on LeBron James. And then you realize that the biggest idiot isn't the guy making the videos, and he isn't an idiot at all as he just preys on people who have hatred inside of them, it is the 15 Thousand Subscribers who waste countless hours of their lives watching these videos.

Well, they do something "right", since they have 3 times more subscribers than me...

I'm pretty sure we can close that gap for ya

Thank you

On a serious note, I never cared about subscriptions. I run my channel for fun and I always knew that only a minor group of NBA fans will appreciate my content. It's not something I do for living (I don't even monetize my content), so I'm fine with small group of people enjoying my work.

Posted: **Wed Aug 2, 2023 11:12 am**

Well if may opine my personal opinion about Hakeem...

What made him special is that if he were only an average offensive or defensive player he still would have been HOF-worthy based on his strength on the other side of the court, and that if he had been blessed with the fortunes of a Tim Duncan or Kareem Abdul-Jabbar he likely would have had 5-7 rings. Conversely I'm not sure anyone else in history gets 2 in his shoes

RealGM

Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever

Re: Olajuwon could be the best Center ever