RealGM

Who do you got higher all time?

Westbrook easy. His biggest weakness (efficiency) is something that Isiah’s worse at.

iggymcfrack wrote:Westbrook easy. His biggest weakness (efficiency) is something that Isiah’s worse at.

All of Russ' age 22-28 seasons were between 99 and 102 ts+ and all of Isiah's age 21-27 seasons were between 96 and 103 ts+(both drop off quite a bit after that). My point being that efficiency wasn't that big of an issue for either guy in their primes and that by itself probably isn't a defining way to say which guy is better all time.

Cavsfansince84 wrote:

iggymcfrack wrote:Westbrook easy. His biggest weakness (efficiency) is something that Isiah’s worse at.

All of Russ' age 22-28 seasons were between 99 and 102 ts+ and all of Isiah's age 21-27 seasons were between 96 and 103 ts+(both drop off quite a bit after that). My point being that efficiency wasn't that big of an issue for either guy in their primes and that by itself probably isn't a defining way to say which guy is better all time.

I would argue that
1) the range shown hides somewhat of a difference in where each typically was during the span shown
2) "efficiency wasn't that big of an issue for either guy in their primes" may or may not be true but, as "the point" derived from the spans above ... I think people might use years outside those cited as prime and significant to career value (not least 2018 Westbrook, 1990 Thomas).

Some details on point one ...
If one is comfortable with the spans chosen ...
Westbrook is at a cumulative 71.6 ts add or 10.22857143 per year.
Thomas -215 ts add or -30.71428571 per year.
A half point gap per game over a long span (nearly 300 pts total) isn't huge but (especially cumulatively) it's not nothing either.

Owly wrote:I would argue that
1) the range shown hides somewhat of a difference in where each typically was during the span shown
2) "efficiency wasn't that big of an issue for either guy in their primes" may or may not be true but, as "the point" derived from the spans above ... I think people might use years outside those cited as prime and significant to career value (not least 2018 Westbrook, 1990 Thomas).

Some details on point one ...
If one is comfortable with the spans chosen ...
Westbrook is at a cumulative 71.6 ts add or 10.22857143 per year.
Thomas -215 ts add or -30.71428571 per year.
A half point gap per game over a long span (nearly 300 pts total) isn't huge but (especially cumulatively) it's not nothing either.

Here is what I was getting at though:
a. for WB it wasn't actually much of a weakness in that timeframe
b. it sort of was for Isiah but he was on lower shot volume anyhow
c. that based on the above making the argument that their scoring efficiency is the defining way to compare them is a bit strange or simplistic. It's leaving a lot of other things on the table which would be more relevant imo.

Cavsfansince84 wrote:

Owly wrote:I would argue that
1) the range shown hides somewhat of a difference in where each typically was during the span shown
2) "efficiency wasn't that big of an issue for either guy in their primes" may or may not be true but, as "the point" derived from the spans above ... I think people might use years outside those cited as prime and significant to career value (not least 2018 Westbrook, 1990 Thomas).

Some details on point one ...
If one is comfortable with the spans chosen ...
Westbrook is at a cumulative 71.6 ts add or 10.22857143 per year.
Thomas -215 ts add or -30.71428571 per year.
A half point gap per game over a long span (nearly 300 pts total) isn't huge but (especially cumulatively) it's not nothing either.

Here is what I was getting at though:
a. for WB it wasn't actually much of a weakness in that timeframe
b. it sort of was for Isiah but he was on lower shot volume anyhow
c. that based on the above making the argument that their scoring efficiency is the defining way to compare them is a bit strange or simplistic. It's leaving a lot of other things on the table which would be more relevant imo.

I mean the primary thing to take into account is their creation where Westbrook

A. does alot more of it(creating chances, breaking down defenses with the ball pre-pass, ect)

and

B. is far more effecient(goatish playoff ast:tov% ratio as a higher volume ball-handler at his peak, higher astLtov ratio than peak isiah even pre-peak)

Westbrook is just a better player I think

Westbrook pretty comfortably even with his flaws.