Mobley vs Sengun

[durantbird]

Which big man would you rather have on a 5 years deal?

[One_and_Done]

Mobley and it's not even close. You never want a guy like Sengun to be your starting 5 if you can avoid it, whereas Mobley is ideal at the 4 or 5.

[70sFan]

Mobley and it's not even close. You never want a guy like Sengun to be your starting 5 if you can avoid it, whereas Mobley is ideal at the 4 or 5.

You don't want an all-star level player to be your starting center? I don't know, I think plenty of teams in the league would be fine with Sengun on the lineup.

[One_and_Done]

Mobley and it's not even close. You never want a guy like Sengun to be your starting 5 if you can avoid it, whereas Mobley is ideal at the 4 or 5.

You don't want an all-star level player to be your starting center? I don't know, I think plenty of teams in the league would be fine with Sengun on the lineup.

Sengun isn't an all-star. Plenty of teams would be fine with him, but you never want to build your team around flawed players if you can help it.

[70sFan]

Mobley and it's not even close. You never want a guy like Sengun to be your starting 5 if you can avoid it, whereas Mobley is ideal at the 4 or 5.

You don't want an all-star level player to be your starting center? I don't know, I think plenty of teams in the league would be fine with Sengun on the lineup.

Sengun isn't an all-star. Plenty of teams would be fine with him, but you never want to build your team around flawed players if you can help it.

He played like one last year.

All players have flaws, not all teams can get Jokic or Giannis to their lineup. Are you trying to tell me that Mobley has no flaws as a player?

[One_and_Done]

You don't want an all-star level player to be your starting center? I don't know, I think plenty of teams in the league would be fine with Sengun on the lineup.

Sengun isn't an all-star. Plenty of teams would be fine with him, but you never want to build your team around flawed players if you can help it.

He played like one last year.

All players have flaws, not all teams can get Jokic or Giannis to their lineup.

12 guys make the all-star team. Sengun had no business being an all-star last year or this year. It's also notable that his numbers are down now that the Rockets are doing better, which aligns with how the Rockets played better without him last year.

Sengun has alot of flaws you have to work around, and which leave your team suboptimal. He was struggling so much against Wemby they had to put him on a reduced minutes diet vs the Spurs, and try to feed him minutes in favourable match ups. Just a flawed player. If you're shooting for 48 wins and a 1st round exit, he might just be the 5 for you.

Jokic strengths are so great he mostly overcomes his flaws. Sengun is not like that.

[70sFan]

Sengun isn't an all-star. Plenty of teams would be fine with him, but you never want to build your team around flawed players if you can help it.

He played like one last year.

All players have flaws, not all teams can get Jokic or Giannis to their lineup.

12 guys make the all-star team. Sengun had no business being an all-star last year or this year. It's also notable that his numbers are down now that the Rockets are doing better, which aligns with how the Rockets played better without him last year.

Sengun has alot of flaws you have to work around, and which leave your team suboptimal. He was struggling so much against Wemby they had to put him on a reduced minutes diet vs the Spurs, and try to feed him minutes in favourable match ups. Just a flawed player. If you're shooting for 48 wins and a 1st round exit, he might just be the 5 for you.

Jokic strengths are so great he mostly overcomes his flaws. Sengun is not like that.

Tell me more about these flaws, because struggling against generational prospect with GOAT level physical tools doesn't reject you from being all-star level player.

You just mentioned Jokic, Sengun doesn't have the same limitations as Jokic (rim protection).

I'm sure Mobley inability to shoot isn't a flaw though and no team could ever exploit.

[DCasey91]

I like Sengun, I don't like him on a champ potential winning team unless there's a really really high leverage on ball scorer. SGA fits the bill and that's pretty much it imo and that's still too early to call it.

Same problem as Sabonis they are not proper centers just masquerading as one.

Whereas with Mobley it's not hard to see a relative elite defensive team all round.

Objectively they are close as players individually but team wise? I don't think it's close at all.

Rockets main back is Smith Jr, Brooks, Thompson, Eason and FVV

I just think at the end of the day there are more examples of success with Mobley's archetype then with Sengun if neither are going to be the most important player on the team overall.

Really the question is can Mobley be the most important defender on a champ winning list?

[One_and_Done]

He played like one last year.

All players have flaws, not all teams can get Jokic or Giannis to their lineup.

12 guys make the all-star team. Sengun had no business being an all-star last year or this year. It's also notable that his numbers are down now that the Rockets are doing better, which aligns with how the Rockets played better without him last year.

Sengun has alot of flaws you have to work around, and which leave your team suboptimal. He was struggling so much against Wemby they had to put him on a reduced minutes diet vs the Spurs, and try to feed him minutes in favourable match ups. Just a flawed player. If you're shooting for 48 wins and a 1st round exit, he might just be the 5 for you.

Jokic strengths are so great he mostly overcomes his flaws. Sengun is not like that.

Tell me more about these flaws, because struggling against generational prospect with GOAT level physical tools doesn't reject you from being all-star level player.

You just mentioned Jokic, Sengun doesn't have the same limitations as Jokic (rim protection).

I'm sure Mobley inability to shoot isn't a flaw though and no team could ever exploit.

Sengun doesn't have particularly good size, athleticism, length, etc. He isn't a particularly good shooter. He was a bunch of weaknesses, like being a PnR target and doesn't compensate by giving you elite rim protection like Gobert or GOAT offense like Jokic. I don't care if rim protection stats like Sengun, and I haven't checked if they do, but defensive stats in general are less reliable than offensive ones. You don't feel Sengun going to the rim. You feel his strong perimeter guys hounding you into bad angles. Houston looked much better letting Smith play the 5, giving them shot blocking and 3pt shooting.

Mobley is shooting well from 3 this year, but it doesn't matter as much anyway because he doesn't bring all the weaknesses Sengun does. Mobley can move quickly around the perimeter and provide help defense, elite defense in fact. Sengun is a jumble of interesting skills that are distributed in suboptimal categories.

[OhayoKD]

Sengun isn't an all-star. Plenty of teams would be fine with him, but you never want to build your team around flawed players if you can help it.

He played like one last year.

All players have flaws, not all teams can get Jokic or Giannis to their lineup.

12 guys make the all-star team. Sengun had no business being an all-star last year or this year. It's also notable that his numbers are down now that the Rockets are doing better, which aligns with how the Rockets played better without him last year.

Sengun has alot of flaws you have to work around, and which leave your team suboptimal. He was struggling so much against Wemby they had to put him on a reduced minutes diet vs the Spurs, and try to feed him minutes in favourable match ups. Just a flawed player. If you're shooting for 48 wins and a 1st round exit, he might just be the 5 for you.

Jokic strengths are so great he mostly overcomes his flaws. Sengun is not like that.

Why is it 2 posts in you haven't listed a single one of these flaws?

I'm pretty sure these "flaws" are something you came up with after you saw the rockets win a bunch of games without him.

[One_and_Done]

I mean, his flaws are pretty well known, but I listed them for those who are apparently unaware in the post right above you.

[OhayoKD]

I mean, his flaws are pretty well known, but I listed them for those who are apparently unaware in the post right above you.

Fair enough

[giordunk]

I also think Mobley without question. Versatile defender, and he's really made strides in his offensive game. Imagine your defensive anchor can spread the floor, create for himself and create for others. Other than the more obvious ones like Anthony Edwards and Victor Wembanyama, Evan Mobley has really shown flashes of being a Top 10 in the league type player in his prime.

Sengun at this point is like if an NBA team realized the talent in Vucevic and tried to let him develop and play a major role right away, instead of waiting to get his first chance to lead a team at the age of 28.

[The Master]

Tough poll.

Sengun can become an ~All-NBA level player, or at least a tier better player than Sabonis, if his rim protection stats are sustainable, after 26 games he's net positive on 2nd defense in the league with -8% differential in DFG at rim and -2.5% differential in DFG overall, this is impressive growth (him being a nice addition to the elite defense with all of his offensive upside).

Mobley with decent spot up shooting will be elite though and we see glimpses of growth in this area past few weeks.

12 guys make the all-star team. Sengun had no business being an all-star last year or this year. It's also notable that his numbers are down now that the Rockets are doing better, which aligns with how the Rockets played better without him last year.

His numbers are down because he's struggling in the areas (0-10ft) that are his biggest strengths scoring wise, he was 68% from 0-3ft and 48% from 3-10ft in his 1-3 seasons, now he's 59% from 0-3ft and 44% from 3-10ft, with 'average' scoring % in these areas he would've been at ~20-11-5 on 59TS% scoring. So actually Rockets got significantly better with Sengun playing the same role as last year.

But it's a fluke (210 games sample size > 26 games sample size of him being above average scorer vs Sengun being below average scorer in terms of efficiency), let's wait if his defensive numbers are a signal of growth or fluke as well. Last year's scoring and this year's defensive output would be definitely allstar-level worthy. Well, anyway, he's the best player on +7 SRS team so far as a 22yo.

[70sFan]

12 guys make the all-star team. Sengun had no business being an all-star last year or this year. It's also notable that his numbers are down now that the Rockets are doing better, which aligns with how the Rockets played better without him last year.

Sengun has alot of flaws you have to work around, and which leave your team suboptimal. He was struggling so much against Wemby they had to put him on a reduced minutes diet vs the Spurs, and try to feed him minutes in favourable match ups. Just a flawed player. If you're shooting for 48 wins and a 1st round exit, he might just be the 5 for you.

Jokic strengths are so great he mostly overcomes his flaws. Sengun is not like that.

Tell me more about these flaws, because struggling against generational prospect with GOAT level physical tools doesn't reject you from being all-star level player.

You just mentioned Jokic, Sengun doesn't have the same limitations as Jokic (rim protection).

I'm sure Mobley inability to shoot isn't a flaw though and no team could ever exploit.

Sengun doesn't have particularly good size, athleticism, length, etc. He isn't a particularly good shooter. He was a bunch of weaknesses, like being a PnR target and doesn't compensate by giving you elite rim protection like Gobert or GOAT offense like Jokic. I don't care if rim protection stats like Sengun, and I haven't checked if they do, but defensive stats in general are less reliable than offensive ones. You don't feel Sengun going to the rim. You feel his strong perimeter guys hounding you into bad angles. Houston looked much better letting Smith play the 5, giving them shot blocking and 3pt shooting.

Mobley is shooting well from 3 this year, but it doesn't matter as much anyway because he doesn't bring all the weaknesses Sengun does. Mobley can move quickly around the perimeter and provide help defense, elite defense in fact. Sengun is a jumble of interesting skills that are distributed in suboptimal categories.

So you genuinely believe that players don't see Sengun at the rim? Another one to your "Hakeem a low intensity player" catalogue.

[One_and_Done]

You probably shouldn't mention Hakeem in the same sentence when discussing Sengun's poor D.

[70sFan]

You probably shouldn't mention Hakeem in the same sentence when discussing Sengun's poor D.

You probably should read carefully what I wrote.

Sengun isn't a poor defender at all, this is based on nothing else than stereotypes.

[Djoker]

Honestly it's very close and can go either way. Mobley is probably a bit better right now but Sengun has improved more since his rookie year. I have a feeling Sengun may be a better player in their primes although not super confident in that either.

[Statlanta]

I prefer Sengun, he's closer to the best player on his team than Mobley is for his own.

[One_and_Done]

I prefer Sengun, he's closer to the best player on his team than Mobley is for his own.

A team with Sengun as best player is going nowhere.