Top 15 finishers of all-time

[Top10alltime]

I just got an idea to do something here on RealGM PC Board. I hope this will get some traction (hopefully 3 pages at least).

So a good amount of people will be sharing their top 15 finishers of all-time (at least 10-15 people), then I will go ahead and track what the people say is top 15 finishers of all-time.

So.. how this works is in this very thread, the people share their top 15 finishers of all-time (if there is enough people willing to share).
Then, after enough people will vote, and are going to discuss, I will add up the votes and this is how the voting method works...

1st place: 15 points
2nd place: 14 points
3rd place: 13 points
4th place: 12 points
5th place: 11 points
6th place: 10 points
7th place: 9 points
8th place: 8 points
9th place: 7 points
10th place: 6 points
11th place: 5 points
12th place: 4 points
13th place: 3 points
14th place: 2 points
15th place: 1 point

Then, the players with the 15th most points will be ranked up in this order, and I will post this. Then, it's not finished there.....


What I will do, is I'll track any series of each player against elite personnel, I'll post a specific thread for each of the players, then once I'm finished every single one of the 15 series of each player, I'll show the game by game, even quarter by quarter finishing attempts against these players.
And I do count foul FGAs, because if and 1s count, so should this. I recheck for if the goaltend is right (1 hair difference for the ball going downward, I'll count it as non goaltend because it's too small for my eyes to see). I also count missed tip-ins.

And AFTER these threads, I post a final thread comparing each player, and using this data, I rank them along with certain other variables.

I don't know if this is a good idea or a bad one, but I'm trying it anyways, I hope y'all are interested! And after I'm done with this finishing tracking, I might go for something else, I'll ask for ideas after I'm finished with this (IF there is enough people willing to share)

Thank you, and may Christ bless you on your journey! I'll post my top 15 finishers later..

EDIT: Due to a post by HomeCourtLoss, that moved me, I am not only going to track finishing against elite personnel, but also going to track the rim pressure (gravity at the rim), and the 3 difficulties of finishing: assisted finishing, putbacks/offensive rebounds, and self-created finishes (Thank you again, HCL).

It will be easier to track these players and see a significant difference in these series, which should move most of us, don't you think?

[70sFan]

That's a very cool idea!

May I ask how you define finishers for this thread? Are we talking about strictly interior finishers?

[Top10alltime]

That's a very cool idea!

May I ask how you define finishers for this thread? Are we talking about strictly interior finishers?

Thank you very much for supporting this idea (I assume you read this all the way through)

I'm defining finishers as scoring in the RA (restricted area), so yeah, it's scoring at the rim. I'm also seeing how they scale up against elite personnel (example: 2010 Wade finishing vs KG who, despite all the blabbering about his rim protection, is still at least a fringe ATG rim protector). You can't just take easy shots vs absolute mismatches and score easy buckets like that. You need to show your real game against elite personnel, and I'm tracking a single series for each of them too, so it's the playoffs.

So glad you're in with this idea, I hope to see others that will like this idea (again, at least 10-15 people should join for this to happen, although this will take tons of time to track), otherwise this is probably not going to happen, considering the lack of interest.

There are also other variables such as the rim pressure and traffic and post moves making it harder to focus on one player. I would count these in finishing as well.

Thanks again!

[70sFan]

Alright, I am not ready to make the definitive list, but we can start with collecting worthy names.

Guards

George Gervin
Michael Jordan
Tony Parker
Dwayne Wade
Stephen Curry


Forwards

Julius Erving
Adrian Dantley
Marques Johnson
Kevin McHale
James Worthy
Charles Barkley
Amar'e Stoudemire
LeBron James
Kevin Durant
Giannis Antetokumpo
Zion Williamson

Centers

Wilt Chamberlain
Walt Bellamy
Artis Gilmore
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
David Robinson
Shaquille O'Neal
Dwight Howard
Anthony Davis
Nikola Jokic

[falcolombardi]

Alright, I am not ready to make the definitive list, but we can start with collecting worthy names.

Guards

George Gervin
Michael Jordan
Tony Parker
Dwayne Wade
Stephen Curry


Forwards

Julius Erving
Adrian Dantley
Marques Johnson
Kevin McHale
James Worthy
Charles Barkley
Amar'e Stoudemire
LeBron James
Kevin Durant
Giannis Antetokumpo
Zion Williamson

Centers

Wilt Chamberlain
Walt Bellamy
Artis Gilmore
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
David Robinson
Shaquille O'Neal
Dwight Howard
Anthony Davis
Nikola Jokic

Add shai and luka to the lists too

[Top10alltime]

Alright, I am not ready to make the definitive list, but we can start with collecting worthy names.

Guards

George Gervin
Michael Jordan
Tony Parker
Dwayne Wade
Stephen Curry


Forwards

Julius Erving
Adrian Dantley
Marques Johnson
Kevin McHale
James Worthy
Charles Barkley
Amar'e Stoudemire
LeBron James
Kevin Durant
Giannis Antetokumpo
Zion Williamson

Centers

Wilt Chamberlain
Walt Bellamy
Artis Gilmore
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar
David Robinson
Shaquille O'Neal
Dwight Howard
Anthony Davis
Nikola Jokic

Alright, I hope others join! Thanks for this list!

Looks like noone is joining, I might not be able to do this, if there is no interest....

[f4p]

Alright, I am not ready to make the definitive list, but we can start with collecting worthy names.

Guards

George Gervin
Michael Jordan
Tony Parker
Dwayne Wade
Stephen Curry

assuming this means, given the same quality of shot, who would finish the most, i think the guard list probably starts and ends with kyrie.

[Top10alltime]

Alright, I am not ready to make the definitive list, but we can start with collecting worthy names.

Guards

George Gervin
Michael Jordan
Tony Parker
Dwayne Wade
Stephen Curry

assuming this means, given the same quality of shot, who would finish the most, i think the guard list probably starts and ends with kyrie.

Can you make your list? I've been hoping many people are interested, but seems like none, except 70sFan and I

[Top10alltime]

My top 15 (Can very easily change, easily)

Tier 1
1. Lebron (this is a clear cut choice, it's the starting point of why he has the GOAT rim pressure, he is easily, definitely the GOAT at finishing)

3 tiers gap (from now on, it's only 1 tier gap)

Tier 2
2. Shaq
3. Kareem
4. Wilt
5. Jordan
6. KD

Tier 3
7. Wade
8. Hakeem
9. Shai
10. Jokic

Tier 4
11. Curry (barely)
12. Giannis (even with the flaws, he still has to be top 15)
13. Zion

Tier 5
Here is where it gets hard... we have a couple of players here to choose from
14. Barkley (maybe?)
15. Kyrie (ehh)

[penbeast0]

McHale's more a post scorer than a finisher. I'd add Jerry West to the guard list, but Shaq and Wilt should be near or at the top along with LeBron, MJ, and Doc.

Question: Shawn Marion, Larry Nance? Guys who didn't really create but who cut and finished really well. I don't have them in my top 20 but should I?

[Top10alltime]

McHale's more a post scorer than a finisher. I'd add Jerry West to the guard list, but Shaq and Wilt should be near or at the top along with LeBron, MJ, and Doc.

Question: Shawn Marion, Larry Nance? Guys who didn't really create but who cut and finished really well. I don't have them in my top 20 but should I?

This is about top 15, not top 20. It's ridiculous I've been posting half of the posts on this thread, I really hoped people would be interested. But no point in tracking with no one willing to engage!

I also changed McHale to Kyrie, for finishing.

I hope you will be one to post the lists! Respect to you and 70sFan if you are going to post..

[f4p]

McHale's more a post scorer than a finisher. I'd add Jerry West to the guard list, but Shaq and Wilt should be near or at the top along with LeBron, MJ, and Doc.

Question: Shawn Marion, Larry Nance? Guys who didn't really create but who cut and finished really well. I don't have them in my top 20 but should I?

This is about top 15, not top 20. It's ridiculous I've been posting half of the posts on this thread, I really hoped people would be interested. But no point in tracking with no one willing to engage!

..

Your thread has only been up a quarter of a day and this is a low traffic board.

[70sFan]

My top 15 (Can very easily change, easily)

Tier 1
1. Lebron (this is a clear cut choice, it's the starting point of why he has the GOAT rim pressure, he is easily, definitely the GOAT at finishing)

3 tiers gap (from now on, it's only 1 tier gap)

Tier 2
2. Shaq
3. Kareem
4. Wilt
5. Jordan
6. KD

Tier 3
7. Wade
8. Hakeem
9. Shai
10. Jokic

Tier 4
11. Curry (barely)
12. Giannis (even with the flaws, he still has to be top 15)
13. Zion

Tier 5
Here is where it gets hard... we have a couple of players here to choose from
14. Barkley (maybe?)
15. Kyrie (ehh)

So I think the list can't be complete without Julius Erving. I don't know it's defensible to put him outside of top 10. James Worthy is like a lesser version of Julius/Giannis. He might not reach top 15, but he's definitely worth consideration.

I'd definitely take George Gervin over Kyrie just for his size and length that made him more versatile. His touch was also top tier.

I don't know how you rate bigs here, but Gilmore should be at worst in the 2nd tier. Amar'e and Robinson are a bit less reliable at creating for themselves, but their finishing ability is top tier, probably better than Hakeem's. What about Dwight?

[Top10alltime]

McHale's more a post scorer than a finisher. I'd add Jerry West to the guard list, but Shaq and Wilt should be near or at the top along with LeBron, MJ, and Doc.

Question: Shawn Marion, Larry Nance? Guys who didn't really create but who cut and finished really well. I don't have them in my top 20 but should I?

This is about top 15, not top 20. It's ridiculous I've been posting half of the posts on this thread, I really hoped people would be interested. But no point in tracking with no one willing to engage!

..

Your thread has only been up a quarter of a day and this is a low traffic board.

Weird my other threads got more posts than this....

[Top10alltime]

My top 15 (Can very easily change, easily)

Tier 1
1. Lebron (this is a clear cut choice, it's the starting point of why he has the GOAT rim pressure, he is easily, definitely the GOAT at finishing)

3 tiers gap (from now on, it's only 1 tier gap)

Tier 2
2. Shaq
3. Kareem
4. Wilt
5. Jordan
6. KD

Tier 3
7. Wade
8. Hakeem
9. Shai
10. Jokic

Tier 4
11. Curry (barely)
12. Giannis (even with the flaws, he still has to be top 15)
13. Zion

Tier 5
Here is where it gets hard... we have a couple of players here to choose from
14. Barkley (maybe?)
15. Kyrie (ehh)

So I think the list can't be complete without Julius Erving. I don't know it's defensible to put him outside of top 10. James Worthy is like a lesser version of Julius/Giannis. He might not reach top 15, but he's definitely worth consideration.

I'd definitely take George Gervin over Kyrie just for his size and length that made him more versatile. His touch was also top tier.

I don't know how you rate bigs here, but Gilmore should be at worst in the 2nd tier. Amar'e and Robinson are a bit less reliable at creating for themselves, but their finishing ability is top tier, probably better than Hakeem's. What about Dwight?

Erving doesn't have a case over these guys IMO. Maybe top 15...
Worthy is not close to either as finishers. Off of touch alone. Maybe top 25....

What did Gilmore do better than Wade? I don't know if this is because your bias, but Wade is scoring at a pretty amazing clip against good personnel from what I watched. Wade has wayyyy more rim pressure (like top 5 rrim pressure all-time) than Gilmore, making it harder for him to score at the rim. Wade is better.

I think Hakeem's variety of moves at the rim gets him over Amare on DROB. Dwight is interesting, probably top 25. Like I said, I'm not fully locked in on the list.

[LA Bird]

Complaining about lack of interest an hour after thread was posted

Like 70sFan, I think it's better if the list is split up by size. Otherwise, the top finisher list would mostly just be bigs like a top defender list. For guards, Payton, Wade, Parker are locks in the modern data era. Before that, I would pick Oscar, Gervin, pre-retirement Jordan. For forwards, Barkley, LeBron, Giannis are obvious. Zion too but then including him makes this a peak comparison which could change some of the other picks. Durant has the efficiency but probably not the volume. Amare's numbers don't look that great without Nash so he's out for me. Griffin is forgotten nowadays but already in his rookie season without Paul, he had a better year as finisher than most peaks. Dr J definitely deserves a P4P mention but he is closer to guard sized than the other 250+ pound forwards here so maybe he should go on that list instead. For centers, Shaq and Wilt are no brainers. Robinson probably third. Similar to Durant, I am not sure Kareem and Hakeem have high enough volume in the restricted area to be at the top. But then on the flip side, there are strictly finishers like Chandler who nobody mentioned because of their offensive limitations overall. If Howard doesn't fall in that category, he should be on the list too.

[Peregrine01]

If you’re talking about brute force finishing, then it’s Shaq, Giannis and Bron.

If you’re talking about touch and dexterity, it’s Jokic and Steph. Bron and MJ are up there in this category too.

[70sFan]

Erving doesn't have a case over these guys IMO. Maybe top 15...

What makes him definitely lower than someone like Jordan? Why do you think he's not top 10? Have you seen anything concerning about his finishing ability?

Worthy is not close to either as finishers. Off of touch alone. Maybe top 25....

I wouldn't have him in my top 15 either, but I think he's at least worth mentioning in this discussion.

What did Gilmore do better than Wade? I don't know if this is because your bias, but Wade is scoring at a pretty amazing clip against good personnel from what I watched. Wade has wayyyy more rim pressure (like top 5 rrim pressure all-time) than Gilmore, making it harder for him to score at the rim. Wade is better.

Why do you even compare Wade with Gilmore? One is a super quick slasher and the other is 7'2 mammoth who is not affected by any contact.

What did Gilmore do better than Wade? Score efficiently at the rim, especially from stationary position. Doesn't mean he has to be higher, but I don't find it shocking at all.

I think Hakeem's variety of moves at the rim gets him over Amare on DROB. Dwight is interesting, probably top 25. Like I said, I'm not fully locked in on the list.

Hakeem is good, but he lacks the volume and sheer dominance inside. I also think Jokic might be better if we're looking for someone with a lot of moves and great touch.

[70sFan]

If you’re talking about brute force finishing, then it’s Shaq, Giannis and Bron.

Add Wilt and Gilmore to that list and we are fine

[Djoker]

Alright so I compiled some rim finishing numbers for a few of the best guys I could find. There are others like Amare, Griffin, Jokic, Embiid, Zion etc. but their numbers are noticeably worse than these guys. And I didn't want to include low volume guys/dunk merchants like Deandre Jordan, Chandler etc.



With the exception of Durant, all other guys on here have very high volumes of rim shots too with Shaq being the highest. Durant is the only one who declines quite a lot in the postseason. Playoff numbers are not adjusted to defensive strength of competition and we can see everyone drops off a bit but Durant drops off a lot in the postseason.