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Best Mid-Range game ever...
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 10:37 pm
by rrravenred
Just a query as to who people think is/was the nastiest from the 12-20 range. Neither the surer inside shot (with the possibility of FTs) nor the riskier perimeter jumper, a lot of players have made their living inside the arc but outside the paint...
Some random thoughts;
- later Jordan... a mean, MEAN turnaround fadeaway. A reduction in hops didn't mean a reduction in PPG.
- Chris Mullin, absolute money. The crew-cut was geeky but the mid-range was unstoppable
- McAdoo, size and range made this proto-Dirk an MVP
- Bird, of the many ways Larry Legend could kill you, this was one of the most lethal
- Rip Hamilton, yep, a product of the Detroit system ,but still awesome off the screen...
2c worth and counting...
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 10:39 pm
by Liqourish
Reggie Miller?
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 10:40 pm
by Myth_Breaker
If we talk about legends, add West and Barry. But if we talk about Rips of this world, I must add Glenn Robinson as well.
Oh, and Kobe's obviously not bad. Also Wilt was great within 12-16 feet range, what partially fits the OP.
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 10:48 pm
by rrravenred
Heh... on Rip, I take your point.
(though, to be fair, both he and the Big Dog DID make a pretty good living from there)
I considered Kobe, but he combines unearthly shooting with occasionally dire shot selection. He's in the mix...
In regards to West, I always had him pegged as either a long range bomber OR a fearless slasher (which would equip him damn well for today's game, of course)... was his mid-range that good?
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 10:53 pm
by Myth_Breaker
rrravenred wrote:Heh... on Rip, I take your point.
(though, to be fair, both he and the Big Dog DID make a pretty good living from there)
I considered Kobe, but he combines unearthly shooting with occasionally dire shot selection. He's in the mix...
In regards to West, I always had him pegged as either a long range bomber OR a fearless slasher (which would equip him damn well for today's game, of course)... was his mid-range that good?
Well, West - like Barry - couldn't be so much long-range bomber in the current meaning of the term since in his times it wasn't awarded with additional point, so was utilizing his range to the full only when couldn't get a closer shot - like with his famous buzzer-beater in 1970 Finals vs. Knicks. So Jerry shoot more often from mid-range: but had absolutely complete offensive arsenal anyway.
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 11:16 pm
by rrravenred
Myth_Breaker wrote:Well, West - like Barry - couldn't be so much long-range bomber in the current meaning of the term since in his times it wasn't awarded with additional point,
Oh, absolutely. That's why I specified 12-20ft in the OP. My impression has always been that in pre-3pt lne basketball defenses were able to cover the mid-range with more impunity, as the only thing a 20+ ft shot would give the offensive team was a lower FG%.
Myth_Breaker wrote:so was utilizing his range to the full only when couldn't get a closer shot - like with his famous buzzer-beater in 1970 Finals vs. Knicks. So Jerry shoot more often from mid-range: but had absolutely complete offensive arsenal anyway.
Fair enough.
Posted: Wed Mar 5, 2008 11:27 pm
by Myth_Breaker
rrravenred wrote:-= original quote snipped =-
Oh, absolutely. That's why I specified 12-20ft in the OP. My impression has always been that in pre-3pt lne basketball defenses were able to cover the mid-range with more impunity, as the only thing a 20+ ft shot would give the offensive team was a lower FG%.
True... Sigh: imagine Lakers winning some rings in the 60s even despite Celtics' better overall talent if only West's 3s counted... (To be fair, with 3-point line also 1967 Sixers would have more trouble vs. Barry's Warriors, but not to this extent: not enough to change a tide of the series).
Reggie
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:00 am
by writerman
Reggie Miller--really great midrange game to go with his long range game
Re: Best Mid-Range game ever...
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:46 am
by a-rod
rrravenred wrote:Just a query as to who people think is/was the nastiest from the 12-20 range. Neither the surer inside shot (with the possibility of FTs) nor the riskier perimeter jumper, a lot of players have made their living inside the arc but outside the paint...
Some random thoughts;
- later Jordan... a mean, MEAN turnaround fadeaway. A reduction in hops didn't mean a reduction in PPG.
- Chris Mullin, absolute money. The crew-cut was geeky but the mid-range was unstoppable
- McAdoo, size and range made this proto-Dirk an MVP
- Bird, of the many ways Larry Legend could kill you, this was one of the most lethal
- Rip Hamilton, yep, a product of the Detroit system ,but still awesome off the screen...
2c worth and counting...
Reggie Miller-Rip Hamilton,Larry,Chris Mullin,sam Jones(The Greatest)
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:50 am
by Jemini80
if the 3 point line wasn't around, Reggie Miller would have averaged over 26 ppg for his career because he would have just taken more of his automatic mid-range shots.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 12:51 am
by Texas Longhorns
Right now? It's hard to tell. Monta Ellis has a great mid-range game, but I'd go with Rip Hamilton.
All-Time- Michael Jordan, nuff said.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:24 am
by Smills91
Larry Bird.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:35 am
by kookie_819
Smills91 wrote:Larry Bird.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 1:40 am
by TradeMachine
Right now, I'd say among Deng, Marvin Williams, and Roy are on top of the list.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 2:33 am
by High 5
TradeMachine wrote:Right now, I'd say among Deng, Marvin Williams, and Roy are on top of the list.
Marvin at the beginning of the year was about as close to automatic as you're going to get, but he has cooled off a lot. I like whoever said Monta Ellis. I don't know if it's true or not, but every time I have seen him this year his mid range shot has been beautiful.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 3:47 am
by OhMyBosh
Michael Jordan has the best mid-range jumper. Ever.
Nobody gets guarded like he does when he goes for a shot. He doesn't need screens to get it off either. His form and release is flawless.
For today, I'll give it to Kobe. You will never see Deng, Marvin, or Roy get guarded as tightly as Kobe. Other players actually have room to get off a shot. It'll seem like they have a better mid range jumper.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 4:35 am
by TrueLAfan
To me, a mid-range guy usually doesn't have an effective three point game. Once in a while, guys have the complete shooting package. It's rare.
Best of the current crop:
--Monta Ellis (surprised he hasn't been mentioned more)
--Rip Hamilton
--Luol Deng
--Steve Nash (really a great all around offensive game)
Classic greats
--James Worthy. He had the great first step and was a great finisher. But you had to play off him, because he could knock down 15-20 footers all day, no sweat.
--Alex English. Didn't have three point range. Averaged 26 ppg on 51% plus shooting for a decade. You do the math.
--Reggie Miller. I'll do the math. Subtract his three pointers from his shot totals. He shot .516 on non-threes.
--Larry Bird. Kind of unfair. He's good from everywhere on the court.
--Patrick Ewing/Brad Daugherty. What, you have to be a guard or forward to have a terrific mid-range game? I'd include Lanier, Sikma and Laimbeer here, except they were more long distance shooters.
--Jamaal Wilkes. "Twenty foot layups."
--Mo Cheeks. Didn't shoot a lot. But when he did, they went in. Career 52% plus.
--Walt Frazier. Could finish when he had to; simply shot over smaller PGs and anyone who played off him, which included pretty much everyone.
--Jerry West. Sixties version of Reggie Miller, except he scored more.
--Some guy with the initials MJ.
Sleeper choice:
--Walter Davis. Scoring machine. People are fooled by his ppg...and don't notice he rarely played over 32 mpg. From 1978 to 1987, Davis is 17th in scoring among players who played 200 games...20.7 ppg. Good, not great. But he did that in less than 31 mpg. He didn't shoot threes, and he didn't finish that often. He did, however, shoot over 52% from the field during that time.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:16 am
by Harry Palmer
No one's mentioned King?
Edit: ...or Dantley?
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:25 am
by tsherkin
Harry Palmer wrote:No one's mentioned King?
Edit: ...or Dantley?
Or Glen Rice.
Posted: Thu Mar 6, 2008 5:36 am
by Harry Palmer
Other guys worth mentioning, though as all around players/scorers not nearly as good, but just for mid-range:
Jeff Malone, Allan Houston, Calvin Murphy, Byron Scott, Big E, etc.
Another interesting note: Hakeem's Dream shake in the left mid-corner and Kareem's skyhook from the right elbow are 2 of the top mid-range moves of all time.