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Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, and Lebron James are always talked about as great, great offensive players while being only decent defenders. Magic was a 6'9 foward that played point guard. Bird was a 6'9 foward with the court awareness, ballhandling skills, and passing skills of, well, Magic Johnson. Lebron is a 6'8 foward, an athletic beast, and somebody who you can run your offense through because of his great passing skills and playmaking ability. They are all triple-double threats, are able to play multiple positions, and are as versatile as they come.

To me, they are are all underrated defensive players. Everyone always says how Magic and Bird were excellent team defenders. And everyone talks about how Lebron is good on d now and has improved. I argue that they are great defensive players.

Magic might not have been able to defend some quick pg's, but he still gave the Lakers great flexibility because he had the size to defend a 2,3, and sometimes a 4. I have been watching Lakers-Celtics on espn classic, and its obvious that Magic was an amazing team defender. I know why he led the league in steals twice. Also, if Magic was defending a perimeter player, its more difficult to execute a postentry pass to a post player because of magic's height. And when Magic goes to double on a post player, his height allows him to cut off the big man's vision. He was versatile on offense, but he brought close to that same versatility on defense. Also, he's arguably the best defensive rebounding guard ever. In the 1980 finals, they put him on Dr. J to keep Erving, a tremendous offensive rebounder, off the glass.

Bird could guard 3's and 4's. He was a great, great rebounder. Again, watching the games closely and paying attention to Bird's d, I can also see he was a great team defender. His anticipation on d was as good as it was on offense. He also had seasons where he averaged close to 2 stls. and 1 blk. per game. Not bad for somebody as "unathletic" as Bird. And what I said about doubling guys in the post for Magic applies to Bird, too. And Lebron, for that matter.

Lebron can defend the 2,3, and sometimes the 1 and 4. He's a well above average defensive rebounder and provides great defensive versatility. It's hard to actually post up on him. This season, he played excellent d on Paul pierce in the postseason (i know, the 41, but pierce is a great scorer, and for the other games, Lebron did good) and even against Kobe (who to me is the best scorer in the league). His freak athleticism allows him to play a wide variety of offensive players. He's a good shotblocker for his position from the weakside and excellent on the break. He, like Bird, is a 2 stls. and 1 blk. threat.

Now, I know Bird and Magic had some limitations on defense. And i know Lebron doesn't consistently lockdown players yet (though nobody can actually lockdown players all the time). But what they can, did, and do do, to me outwieghs what they couldn't do by alot. Enough to call them great, or at least great assets for their teams, on d.

So agree or disagree with my argument. Also, who to you is the best defender out of the 3?

Bron

Bird ... there is a reason why he owns defensive honors

KyleCleric wrote:Bird ... there is a reason why he owns defensive honors

Because his weakside D was great? His man to man was decent. But he got on those teams for blocking and stealing (which he was good at).

I never thought that Bird was as good as his reputation on defense. He got steals from playing passing lanes but I don't think he was a particularly good man defender.

ronnymac2 wrote:Larry Bird, Magic Johnson, and Lebron James are always talked about as great, great offensive players while being only decent defenders. Magic was a 6'9 foward that played point guard. Bird was a 6'9 foward with the court awareness, ballhandling skills, and passing skills of, well, Magic Johnson. Lebron is a 6'8 foward, an athletic beast, and somebody who you can run your offense through because of his great passing skills and playmaking ability. They are all triple-double threats, are able to play multiple positions, and are as versatile as they come.

To me, they are are all underrated defensive players. Everyone always says how Magic and Bird were excellent team defenders. And everyone talks about how Lebron is good on d now and has improved. I argue that they are great defensive players.

Magic might not have been able to defend some quick pg's, but he still gave the Lakers great flexibility because he had the size to defend a 2,3, and sometimes a 4. I have been watching Lakers-Celtics on espn classic, and its obvious that Magic was an amazing team defender. I know why he led the league in steals twice. Also, if Magic was defending a perimeter player, its more difficult to execute a postentry pass to a post player because of magic's height. And when Magic goes to double on a post player, his height allows him to cut off the big man's vision. He was versatile on offense, but he brought close to that same versatility on defense. Also, he's arguably the best defensive rebounding guard ever. In the 1980 finals, they put him on Dr. J to keep Erving, a tremendous offensive rebounder, off the glass.

Bird could guard 3's and 4's. He was a great, great rebounder. Again, watching the games closely and paying attention to Bird's d, I can also see he was a great team defender. His anticipation on d was as good as it was on offense. He also had seasons where he averaged close to 2 stls. and 1 blk. per game. Not bad for somebody as "unathletic" as Bird. And what I said about doubling guys in the post for Magic applies to Bird, too. And Lebron, for that matter.

Lebron can defend the 2,3, and sometimes the 1 and 4. He's a well above average defensive rebounder and provides great defensive versatility. It's hard to actually post up on him. This season, he played excellent d on Paul pierce in the postseason (i know, the 41, but pierce is a great scorer, and for the other games, Lebron did good) and even against Kobe (who to me is the best scorer in the league). His freak athleticism allows him to play a wide variety of offensive players. He's a good shotblocker for his position from the weakside and excellent on the break. He, like Bird, is a 2 stls. and 1 blk. threat.

Now, I know Bird and Magic had some limitations on defense. And i know Lebron doesn't consistently lockdown players yet (though nobody can actually lockdown players all the time). But what they can, did, and do do, to me outwieghs what they couldn't do by alot. Enough to call them great, or at least great assets for their teams, on d.

So agree or disagree with my argument. Also, who to you is the best defender out of the 3?

LeBron *can* play very good d, but he takes many, many possessions off each game, and sometimes seems to take entire games off (on d, not on offense). Being a "great" defender is all about bringing it on every possession, and LeBron simply doesn't.

If he was on a team with a couple other stars, where he didn't have to make a play every single time on offense, he probably would be a very good defender, as he'd have more energy for that end of the court.

Magic was not a bad defender, he was a very good defender who used his height and skill to lock down guys. Bird led the league 3 times in defensive win shares, he may not be the "best" defender, but he was a very smart defender. LBJ is a pretty good defender, he still has a lot to learn, but hopefully he will get better.

well if lebron had help on offense he wouldn't have to expend so much energy on offense giving him more freedom on defense to actually play every possession hard.

lebron is the best defender of the 3.

last possession and i needed any 1, 2 or 3 to be covered, i would take lebron.