RealGM

Who do you take to build your team around?

Rudy Gay
Memphis Grizzlies
Position: F
Height: 6-8 Weight: 222
College: Connecticut
Player file | Team stats
2007-08 Statistics
PPG 20.1
RPG 6.2
APG 2.0
SPG 1.4
BPG 1.0
FG% 0.461
FT% 0.785
3P% 0.346
MPG 37.0

VS

Brandon Roy
Portland Trail Blazers
Position: G-F
Height: 6-6 Weight: 229
College: Washington
Player file | Team stats
2007-08 Statistics
PPG 19.1
RPG 4.7
APG 5.8
SPG 1.1
BPG 0.2
FG% 0.454
FT% 0.753
3P% 0.340
MPG 37.7

Roy, and it's not close. Roy has a far more complete game and leadership skills.

Expect this to turn into another Roy bashing thread from all the D-bags though.

Hmmm, ROY, All-Star, helped his team to a .500 season

Against

Mr. 20.1 ppg (Which is not that much greater then Roy's).

Call me a Blazer homer, but I know who I would take. Roy easily wins.

Gay, easily... for my fantasy team.

When comparing the stats, keep in mind that the Grizzlies play at one of the fastest paces in the game, whereas the Blazers played at one of the slowest.

Roy for me, even if he's perceived to have less upside.

I'm gonna go with Roy, but to say that isn't close?

Gay put up more points, rebounds, blocks, and steals while shooting a higher FG%, FT%, 3PT%, eFG%, and TS%, is two years younger, and two inches taller. I can fully understand why one would take Gay. But I go with Roy since he has shown more leadership and intangibles while leading a team to a better record.

CBS7 wrote:I'm gonna go with Roy, but to say that isn't close?

Gay put up more points, rebounds, blocks, and steals while shooting a higher FG%, FT%, 3PT%, eFG%, and TS%, is two years younger, and two inches taller. I can fully understand why one would take Gay. But I go with Roy since he has shown more leadership and intangibles while leading a team to a better record.

Sorry, but I just don't see that winners mentality in Gay that I see in Roy. I bet you 20 bucks that Travis Outlaw could put up 20 ppg on that Grizzlies team last year. I partly said 'not close' because of the pent up frustration of the bashing Roy got in the last thread.

OdenRoyLMA2 wrote:

CBS7 wrote:I'm gonna go with Roy, but to say that isn't close?

Gay put up more points, rebounds, blocks, and steals while shooting a higher FG%, FT%, 3PT%, eFG%, and TS%, is two years younger, and two inches taller. I can fully understand why one would take Gay. But I go with Roy since he has shown more leadership and intangibles while leading a team to a better record.

Sorry, but I just don't see that winners mentality in Gay that I see in Roy. I bet you 20 bucks that Travis Outlaw could put up 20 ppg on that Grizzlies team last year. I partly said 'not close' because of the pent up frustration of the bashing Roy got in the last thread.

You'd have a point if Gay wasn't actually the more efficient scorer then Roy.

Unless you think Outlaw would magically become a much better and more efficient offensive player on the Memphis team. If there was any way to take that bet I'd take it.

Not to mention the fact that Gay is much better at creating his shot then Outlaw.

CBS7 wrote:
You'd have a point if Gay wasn't actually the more efficient scorer. Unless you think Outlaw would magically become a much better and more efficient offensive player on the Memphis team. If there was any way to take that bet I'd take it.

Not to mention the fact that Gay is much better at creating his shot then Outlaw.

Not saying he'd be more efficient. But I can easily putting up similar numbers to Gay if he was the focal point of the offense, the dude can light it up in a hurry. Outlaw averaged 13.3 ppg and 4.6 rpg in only 26 minutes on a team where he was the 3rd or 4th option. If he was the first option on Memphis and played 37 mpg, I can see him putting up 20 ppg, 6 rpg and 2 apg.

Neither player is the type that you build a team around, but Gay would be the one to do so if you were forced to.

Its easy to say "so and so has a winners mentality" when that person is on a winning team, so that argument is crap, although it is apparent that Roy has a better bball IQ and more of a sense of what needs to happen to win the game, whereas Rudy is more of a natural player who goes off of instinct and intuition.

The bottom line here, to me, is that Gay is a monster athlete who can light it up from all over the floor. He is much farther away from his ceiling than Roy is--who may have already peaked, btw--and he is already a more efficient scorer even though he doesn't have the other options on his team to open things up for him. Roy bests him in two real categories: passing and intangibles. Gay is better in every other respect, a better scorer, shooter, rebounder, defender, disruptor, shot-blocker, athlete and has more potential for growth. They were about even in production this year, with maybe a slight edge to Roy, but Rudy is the obvious choice.

OdenRoyLMA2 wrote:

CBS7 wrote:
You'd have a point if Gay wasn't actually the more efficient scorer. Unless you think Outlaw would magically become a much better and more efficient offensive player on the Memphis team. If there was any way to take that bet I'd take it.

Not to mention the fact that Gay is much better at creating his shot then Outlaw.

Not saying he'd be more efficient. But I can easily putting up similar numbers to Gay if he was the focal point of the offense, the dude can light it up in a hurry. Outlaw averaged 13.3 ppg and 4.6 rpg in only 26 minutes on a team where he was the 3rd or 4th option. If he was the first option on Memphis and played 37 mpg, I can see him putting up 20 ppg, 6 rpg and 2 apg.

And shoot what, 40%? 38%?

I disagree completely. Gay was assisted on 42% of his shots compared to Outlaw's 62%, and that didn't stop him from being significantly more efficient. Outlaw was the 3rd/4th option and still shot just 43% without having to worry about creating his own shot all the time. I just don't know why I'm still arguing this. Are you trying to say that Gay is on the level of Outlaw?

I think you are overrating your own guys and severely underrating Gay here.

erudite23 wrote:Neither player is the type that you build a team around, but Gay would be the one to do so if you were forced to.

Its easy to say "so and so has a winners mentality" when that person is on a winning team, so that argument is crap, although it is apparent that Roy has a better bball IQ and more of a sense of what needs to happen to win the game, whereas Rudy is more of a natural player who goes off of instinct and intuition.

The bottom line here, to me, is that Gay is a monster athlete who can light it up from all over the floor. He is much farther away from his ceiling than Roy is--who may have already peaked, btw--and he is already a more efficient scorer even though he doesn't have the other options on his team to open things up for him. Roy bests him in two real categories: passing and intangibles. Gay is better in every other respect, a better scorer, shooter, rebounder, defender, disruptor, shot-blocker, athlete and has more potential for growth. They were about even in production this year, with maybe a slight edge to Roy, but Rudy is the obvious choice.

If Gay is such a megastar and the "obvious choice" then why can't he win more than 22 games? I don't see how Portland's supporting cast is that much better than his.

CBS7 wrote:

And shoot what, 40%? 38%?

I disagree completely. Gay was assisted on 42% of his shots compared to Outlaw's 62%, and that didn't stop him from being significantly more efficient. Outlaw was the 3rd/4th option and still shot just 43% without having to worry about creating his own shot all the time. I just don't know why I'm still arguing this. Are you trying to say that Gay is on the level of Outlaw?

I think you are overrating your own guys and severely underrating Gay here.

Again, I never said he'd be more efficient. I'm just saying it's easier to put up stats like that in Memphis' uptempo, wild system, rather than Portland's slow, over-bearing, grind it out system.

And no, I never said Outlaw is at the same level as Gay.

This is pretty close, I like Roy as a leader better than Gay, so I'll give Roy the very slight nudge over Gay.

Then again...

Gay gets significantly more defensive attention than Roy so his efficiency is much more impressive than Roy's.

^^^

Roy gets doubled and tripled teams constantly. And people don't realize that Roy was so banged up at the end of the season that he hardly played. And about 4 times last year Roy left the game with an inury. That killed his stats significantly.

Roy, he's a much better playmaker. But if I needed a swingman just to score, I'd go Gay.

OdenRoyLMA2 wrote:^^^

Roy gets doubled and tripled teams constantly. And people don't realize that Roy was so banged up at the end of the season that he hardly played. And about 4 times last year Roy left the game with an inury. That killed his stats significantly.

No Brandon Roy never got triple teamed constantly. There is one maybe two players int he league who you can say get triple teamed constantly but even then it's a bit of a stretch.

People throw that saying around way too much without really thinking it through...

NetsForce wrote:
No Brandon Roy never got triple teamed constantly. There is one maybe two players int he league who you can say get triple teamed constantly but even then it's a bit of a stretch.

People throw that saying around way too much without really thinking it through...

I watched 82 Blazer games last season. How many did you watch?

This was a fairly easy decision for me.

Portland was the youngest team in NBA history last year and won 41 games. The three younger team combined didnt reach that total. Roy was the undisputed leader of that team and an all-star.

I like Rudy Gay but he just doesnt have the same impact on a game Roy does. Some argue Rudy is more athletetic which is true but Roy is also a freaky athlete Roy just doesnt need it to be effective.

Brandon was a less efficienct player probably because he was the first option on a half court team, Rudy got a lot of open looks on the perimeter and in transition Roy just didnt have the opportunity to get. The numbers may be similar but the true impact of there games greatly favors ROY.

OdenRoyLMA2 wrote:

NetsForce wrote:
No Brandon Roy never got triple teamed constantly. There is one maybe two players int he league who you can say get triple teamed constantly but even then it's a bit of a stretch.

People throw that saying around way too much without really thinking it through...

I watched 82 Blazer games last season. How many did you watch?

I guess that means we should take your word as fact.

I saw several Blazers games. I tried to catch them whenever I could because I see them as a young team with an extremely bright future. I'm one of the people who said if any young team in the NBA has the potential to be a dynasty its the Blazers.

But he never got triple teamed constantly. No one in the NBA gets triple teamed constantly.

Gimmie Gay.