The Immortal 6 (MJ, Wilt, Magic, Kareem, Bird, Russell) ....

[JordansBulls]

Usually when talking about the greatest players ever, virtually every list contains these 6 players in varius orders.

MJ, Wilt, Magic, Kareem, Bird, Russell

Cases can be made for Shaq, Oscar, maybe Hakeem or Duncan or West as well,
but generally speaking for the most part no one trumps those 6.

My question is:
Do you see anyone in the league now that will knock someone out of that immortal 6 of MJ, Wilt, Magic, Kareem, Bird, Russell?


Where do you see Lebron when all said and done? Kobe? Wade? Garnett? Duncan?

[kooldude]

Kobe: nope
KG: nope
Duncan: if he wins 2 more rings
Wade: small chance
Lebron: can knock off Bird and possibly Magic

[ponder276]

LeBron, if he wins 3+ championships, should definitely be in the discussion. He'll need to leave Cleveland though - that team is horribly managed and is just not gonna be good enough during LeBron's prime.

[studcrackers]

well the cavs do have some cap room coming soon (pretty sure they do) they screwed up the 1st time with that b/c they couldnt land any big names but maybe this time around they can lure someone to come to there team

but yea i think lebron can at least join the conversation and make it a "Big 7"

[ChargerMan]

Duncan is pretty much in the picture

Kobe maybe with another championship and mvp, or 2 championships.

Lebron needs atleast 1 championship and a couple mvp years.

[Baller 24]

Duncan with 1 more championship should be able to, but LBJ I dunno about knocking off someone like Bird or Magic, thats really tough.

[kooldude]

Duncan with 1 more championship should be able to, but LBJ I dunno about knocking off someone like Bird or Magic, thats really tough.

Duncan is not even greater than Shaq or Hakeem now, how is he going to unseed Magic or Bird with just 1 more title?

[ChargerMan]

Duncan is already equal to Hakeem and Shaq and he still has 3-4 years of good playing time left so I pretty much put him up there in the top 6-7

[joew8302]

Man, I would personally put the Big O ahead of Magic and Bird, but I am sure people will disagree.

[tkb]

Man, I would personally put the Big O ahead of Magic and Bird, but I am sure people will disagree.

You're right about me disagreeing with ranking Oscar over either of those

[ChargerMan]

to me oscar robertson was a great player that unfortunately had to play at a time when other greats were dominating, thus hurting his standing. Like Kobe Bryant Robertson needed Alcindor the big Kareem to finally get him over the hump of losing in the first round of the playoffs and that one loss to the Celtics in the Eastern Conference Championships.

[RoyceDa59]

I only realistically see 3 current players having any chance of cracking the top 6.

Kobe
Duncan
LeBron

The all-time greatest list is all about accolades, accomplishments and legacy. Kobe has 3 rings in 5 finals appearances, and 1 MVP. He will need at least one more MVP, and a finals MVP, to at least earn rights to be mentioned as a potential 7th. I think 5+ more years of at least 25 / 5 / 5 / 45% with 2 championships, 2 finals MVPs and another regular season MVP would put Kobe in that group.

Duncan's MVP days are probably behind him, but he does have 2 already so more championships is really his only way to earn a spot in the untouchables. If Duncan ever pulls off a back-to-back championship, meaning he wins 6 in total over the span of an entire era of basketball, I think that lands him as the 7th member of the elite group. However, he always deserved a DPOY award but never recieved one, if he can also claim one of those while grabbing a back-to-back he will no doubt earn a spot.

LeBron's resume so far consists of 1 finals appearance. Not bad for a 23 year old. However, its worth noting that he is on pace to finish with the best statistics we've seen post 1960's. He's a legitimate 30 / 7 / 7 / 2 / 1 / 50% / 35% / 70% monster. I expect the same level of play for about another 8 or so years. If he ever gets a quality team around him LeBron may earn multiple MVP trophies and win multiple championships. If he can accumulate 30 000+ points, 8 000+ rebounds and 8 000+ assists while winning 3 or more championships (with finals MVP honors), at least 2 MVP's and continue to land a spot on the all-NBA 1st team, he will join the top 7. Statistically he's better than either Duncan or Kobe, but he's much behind in the accomplishments department. Once those start to roll in, he very well may finish higher than KB and TD.

[joew8302]

I just completely disagree with your assessments of Oscar. He played on the Cincinnati Royals with a cheap owner who made moves to turn in a profit rather than win. You put Wilt, Kareem or anyone else in the situation Oscar was in there and they have no more success. Oscar could pass, score and rebound, he could do everything. I know Bird and Magic are fresher in everyones mind, hence younger people will automatically pick them over a guy like Oscar, but don't kid yourself, with the exception of Jordan, Wilt, Russell and Kareem there hasn't been anyone as good as him. I mean he did outscore both Bird and Johnson, while out rebounding Magic by a good amount as well as out assisting Bird by a fair margin.

[ChargerMan]

I never said Oscar wasn't an all-time great

Magic and Bird were the two best players in the league when they were in their respective primes

Kareem dominated for such a long period of time it is quite unbelievable

Wilt and Russell were the two dominant players of their era

MJ dominated the 90's, its hard to say who was the next best, most say Hakeem, Shaq became a force, Robinson had a stretch that was amazing.

[nate33]

I don't see any way that Duncan can crack the top 6. The best he can do is solidify himself at number 7. Kobe has little chance of cracking the top 6 unless he truly takes it to another level like Jordan did in his 30's.

Lebron has a real shot. I give him at least a 50/50 chance of breaking into the top 6.

[shawngoat23]

Duncan and Kobe are a bit short on the rings and accolades. They don't even come close in terms of statistics. They'll have to go on a ridiculous tear of championships/MVPs to join these six. I don't think it's feasible.

LeBron is a bit short statistically, but he doesn't have the resume yet. He'll have to keep up his statistical production and build an impressive resume to join these six.

[TrueLAfan]

Oscar had good teams that didn't do well. The Royals had, among others, Jerry Lucas, Jack Twyman, Wayne Embry, Bob Boozer, and Happy Hairston . He was a difficult teammate, especially in his early years. His key statistics—especially rebounding--are inflated due to the time period when he played. (Oscar is nowhere near the rebounder Magic, for instance was...he's more like Jason Kidd; good, but not out of line in any way.) And it's not as though his teams were borderline great...Oscar's teams were basically around .500 for the first decade of his career. They missed the playoffs numerous times. I don't agree that he's overrated. He was a great player, but he's got (at least) as many intangible minuses as pluses.

Personally, I've never been sold on Russell...too many other great Celtics players, too good of a coach. I'd take Hakeem over Russell. But that's just me.

Duncan certainly has a chance to crack into that group...maybe one or two more titles where he plays the same role at the same level. He may not even need that; he's got a case now. We are talking about a guy who has been in the top 5 of MVP voting 9 times, has been second twice and won it outright twice...to go along with four rings. Kobe's (much) farther away...he's got a chance to crack the top 10, but that will take some doing. LeBron is young enough so he could make a run at that group.

[firefox390]

The problem I've got with Duncan is his legacy that he'll leave behind. Let's look at these 7 incredible players and how they've inspired the game:

MJ the greatest
Wilt for his freakish scoring/rebounding
Magic for Showtime
Kareem the skyhook and all-time leading scorer
Bird for trash-talk & all-around game
Russell the greatest winner ever.

If there's one player that deserves to be among these 7 players, it's Duncan (I've got him ahead of Oscar and Shaq). But what the heck will he be remembered for? The bank-shot and stoic expression?

[NO-KG-AI]

I can't put Duncan ahead of Shaq, when Shaq was leading the 3 peat, which would really be both of their peaks(Duncan's whole career is like one peak), he was demolishing Tim Duncan, Shaq was an unstoppable force in the playoffs, didn't matter what any team threw at him.

[Point forward]

Possibly Shaq may have the best shot if he somehow finds his second wind, gets another ring and has a 35+ career like Kareem. (Not that I think it is probable, but still...)