RealGM

#1 Red Auerbach
#2 Phil Jackson
#3 Pat Riley
?

Who is the next best coach?
Is it active coach Greg Popovich (who admitedly has never had to coach a Tim Duncanless team)?
Is it Larry Brown (who rarely stays for more than a couple of years)?
Is it Jerry Sloan (who has volume going for him if not championships)?
Is it Red Holtzman (who coached Willis Reed and Walt Frazier)?
Is it Slick Leonard (who was the best in the ABA, but when the Pacers changed leagues he slipped)?
Is it Alex Hannum (the man who convinced Wilt to focus more on defense than scoring)?
Is it John Kundla (who coached George Mikan, but when Mikan left, so did his winning streak)?

Anyone else? Ramsey, Daly, Wilkens, Nelson, or my personal favorites -- Doug Moe or Stan Albeck?

You should've mentioned Don Nelson and Jerry Sloan (you have to, if you're going to mention Wilkens).

Others: Bill Fitch, Dick Motta, George Karl (Yes, he belongs)

Red Holtzman would be my pick.

Yeah, Sloan definitely belongs. I still pick Larry Brown though; he may not stay around but for getting your screwed up franchise to max its potential in the short term, he's the best. Too many great jobs in too many cities . . . everywhere but NY.

Popopopopopopopopopop

Larry Brown

I'll go with Popovich. His influence in the NBA is very apparent, as you can see by the amount of people that have worked under him that now have NBA jobs. He has 4 titles, the Spurs share the record for the longest streak of consecutive 50 win seasons(if you count '99) in NBA history, his influence in NBA International Drafting is evident, his system has been the best defensive system of this generation and one of the best of all-time.

He's also a total package when it comes to coaching. He's a great x's and o's guy, he's a great motivator, he's good with rotations for the most part, he's a great judge of talent. The only significant flaw he's had as a coach is his inability to coach the backup PG position. Obviously being stubborn and arrogant is a flaw, but that seems to be the case with most elite coaches.

pop.

Alex Hannum. NBA titles on 2 teams in an era where nobody but he & Red coached title winner. Saw that his team could be better with the greatest scorer in history not scoring, had the moxie to take action, commanded enough respect that it got done. Oh, and he also won a title coaching in the ABA.

The other guys I thought about here:
-Pop. Love him, but he's only done it in one place on a franchise lucky enough to win the lottery in two of the best years in history.

-Brown. The fact he doesn't stick around puts him under Pop in my book because of his lack of long term impact, but even that aside, he hasn't had the peaks that Hannum had.

I think you have to get the dynastic coaches out of the way... winning one title is impressive but winning more than one is incredible.
Greg Popovich. Tim Duncan is one thing, name one player on the 99 spurs that was on the 07 spurs outside of him.

We've seen him develop young players
We've seen him dominate xs and os
We've seen his great relationship with his players
We've seen the consistent results that are a clear result of attention to detail
We've seen an ability to adapt to different rosters and even implement new plays
We've seen him implement a system that...WORKS.

As great as Timmy is, we can probably name 4 to 6 elite bigs all time who have less rings, but were probably just as good.

Then look at Lebron James, the current most dominant player in the league, and his Cavs. What have they strived for these last few years? to emulate not the 3peat lakers, not the 04 pistons, not the 06 heat, not even the 08 celtics, but the spurs of the decade.

In other words, Popovich's spurs haven't just won, they've won in a sense that they've been THE model franchsie of an entire DECADE. While the rings don't add up to the 60s Celtics and 90s Bulls, or the 80s lakers/celtics, neither has thier talent. That's why I have to give Pop #4

So you are going for Kundla next, Suigintou?

penbeast0 wrote:So you are going for Kundla next, Suigintou?

Tell me about the 1940s (lol) lakers, then we'll see If Popovich was just an average coach blessed with talent i probably wouldn't view him that highly, though. I'd prolly put him in the Rudy T type of tier. it's truly the stuff you have to watch to respect him, which is why in all honesty i hate to have to judge all them ancient coaches...

SuigintouEV wrote:

penbeast0 wrote:So you are going for Kundla next, Suigintou?

Tell me about the 1940s (lol) lakers, then we'll see If Popovich was just an average coach blessed with talent i probably wouldn't view him that highly, though. I'd prolly put him in the Rudy T type of tier. it's truly the stuff you have to watch to respect him, which is why in all honesty i hate to have to judge all them ancient coaches...

I hate how titles get people over rated around here and in general. If Larry Brown loses in the NBA Finals against the Lakers because Karl Malone is healthy, does that make him a lesser coach. If the Pacers select Tony Parker instead of Jamal Tinsley, would that make Pop a lesser coach.

In my mind, there is no possible way, anyone should be taking Pop ahead of Brown, when Pop himself admits that he could never dream of being as good as LB.

And I would urge people to look at the all time wins before voting. Guys like Don Nelson, George Karl and most importantly Jerry Sloan should not get shorted because they haven't won a title.

My vote goes to Larry Brown - a guy who has never, in my mind, been out coached in a series. You cannot say the same for either Phil Jackson or Pop.

Silver Bullet wrote:In my mind, there is no possible way, anyone should be taking Pop ahead of Brown, when Pop himself admits that he could never dream of being as good as LB.

Larry Brown is a headcase who has beefed with players like popovich never has. That's enough reason for me to not have respect for larry brown as a coach.

I mean "we talking about practice"

that's not AI being a bad teamate, that's Larry Brown starting **** in the media. What kind of coach throws his players under the bus like that? And let's not even discuss the new york debacle. or how he as a coach was a likely distraction in the 05 finals with speculation that he wasn't gunna stay.

Or how about his affinity for interfering with what a GM does. I don't really truly care that pop has 3 more rings. What I do know is that in 2001, the sixers and spurs were roughly equal teams. One franchise went one way, and one went the other. Most credit RC Buford for the former, and Larry Brown for the latter. You tell me.

I DON'T feel brown is a bad coach. His impact on Chauncey Billups is evidence enough that he's a great teacher. But he has other flaws which Popovich does not.

SuigintouEV wrote:

Silver Bullet wrote:In my mind, there is no possible way, anyone should be taking Pop ahead of Brown, when Pop himself admits that he could never dream of being as good as LB.

Larry Brown is a headcase who has beefed with players like popovich never has. That's enough reason for me to not have respect for larry brown as a coach.

I mean "we talking about practice"

that's not AI being a bad teamate, that's Larry Brown starting **** in the media. What kind of coach throws his players under the bus like that? And let's not even discuss the new york debacle. or how he as a coach was a likely distraction in the 05 finals with speculation that he wasn't gunna stay.

Or how about his affinity for interfering with what a GM does. I don't really truly care that pop has 3 more rings. What I do know is that in 2001, the sixers and spurs were roughly equal teams. One franchise went one way, and one went the other. Most credit RC Buford for the former, and Larry Brown for the latter. You tell me.

I DON'T feel brown is a bad coach. His impact on Chauncey Billups is evidence enough that he's a great teacher. But he has other flaws which Popovich does not.

The Sixers and Spurs were roughly the same, because Brown is an insanely good coach. No way would that team win 60+ games with anybody but Larry Brown. And how can you (or anybody for that matter) expect a team with Allen Iverson (a significantly below average shooter) and literally no other average offensive player be a dynasty.

And you do realize that Brown was a coach in this league for 20 plus years before 2001.

And I don't even see the NY thing as a debacle. Any coach worth his salt would have failed there with Isiah Thomas as the GM. You think Popovich or Phil Jackson would not have had issues with Zeke ? Besides the team got significantly worse right after Brown left, even though IT is a decent coach.

The problem is, coaches have always used the media to call out their players, until recently. Brown is outdated (as is Riley btw, though Riley softened significantly), but in my eyes, the best non-college coach to ever step foot on the hardwood.

Larry Brown

I'll vote for Gregg Popovich 4th. Think he belongs here. Probably would've voted Riles at 1.

Put Chuck Daly on that short list btw. Can't believe he hasn't been mentioned in this thread.

i vote for gregg pop