Either way, what are you guys going to do when we sign Woodson? It seems like you guys are so caught up in criticizing Woodson's coaching when you barely realize that the fault for those losses over the past few years just wasn't Woodson but also BK's, ASG, etc.
I still haven't seen any of the Woody haters here give Woodson credit when he helped Atlanta go to game 7 with Boston. Most of you guys who are criticizing Woodson just seem to be so caught up with his negatives that you barely realize what he's done for this organization. It may not be much, but it's still the first playoff game Atlanta has seen in their court for nine years. Give him credit.
Sund-Woodson
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conleyorbust
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Libid21 wrote:Either way, what are you guys going to do when we sign Woodson? It seems like you guys are so caught up in criticizing Woodson's coaching when you barely realize that the fault for those losses over the past few years just wasn't Woodson but also BK's, ASG, etc.
I still haven't seen any of the Woody haters here give Woodson credit when he helped Atlanta go to game 7 with Boston. Most of you guys who are criticizing Woodson just seem to be so caught up with his negatives that you barely realize what he's done for this organization. It may not be much, but it's still the first playoff game Atlanta has seen in their court for nine years. Give him credit.
I give BK (very little) credit for his good moves of drafting Smith and targeting Johnson (I think he **** up the Joe deal and Smith was a hometown kid that had slipped 10 spots) and I'll give Woody (very little) credit for his good move of having at least 2 players on his team like him and occasionally being right about having joe iso every possession (like the fourth quarter of game 6).
I certainly don't blame most of our losses on Woody, every team loses games and when a team has no depth, few consistent shooters, no premier perimeter defenders, and a massive hole at the point guard position, they are going to lose a lot of games.
On the other hand, I don't see why Woody deserves credit for having to work with a flawed roster because, unless you can point out some specific things he did, he didn't enhance the value or ability of the roster.
Woody doesn't have to be a bad coach, he is a "don't rock the boat" type. Give him a veteran team with some depth, a good point guard, and some decent defenders, and he'll do fine. He isn't a Phil Jackson or Don Nelson (or even a Flip Saunders/Terry Porter) who can work out exotic schemes to take advantage of strengths and hide weaknesses though, which is fine but it doesn't mean he should continue to work for a team that would be better off with a more creative coach.
By the way, I'm tired of hearing about how Woody is "old school". Maybe the 90s Knicks are now the singular definition of "old school" but I think the Celtics, Lakers, Sixers, Bucks, and any other good team of the golden years used to push the pace on most possessions and rarely exclusively on perimeter isolation plays.
Josh, I really don't credit Woody for much here
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td00
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Josh, I really don't credit Woody for much here
Josh,
I just don't see the value in Woody continuing. I'm with Conley, and I also think that the true Woody has been seen. He isn't going to change with more talent or more depth.
He is going to do what he is comfortable with and while he won the power struggle with BK, what gives him the right to continue on as the HC? He himself believes he did an 'excellent' job with last year's team.
Do you agree with him? I truly don't believe anyone does and I thought the true reason for not firing him during the season was because we would have to pay him for non-performance.
But honestly, can you tell me at any time that Woody was the main reason why we won a game here or there? I don't really think he is coaching this team up above their talent. I think we could do much more. But Woody is intent on just wearing our main guys down and not providing any consistency off the bench. He doesn't have a clear idea what his bench is, and he sees these guys every day.
If he is here, he will be here, but there won't be many who believe that better days are ahead with him at the helm. We have a chance for a clean break, and we might mess that up because the ASG will not bend in their support. Someone will be wrong in the end. I just don't think the fans are that nieve.
There are some very intelligent Hawks fans on this boar, many of who see things that I overlook after a game. We would like to see what our bench can do to help us win games. 5 minutes before the half doesn't improve your game and playing Mario West for 45 secs at the end of halves won't be that much of a factor.
I almost forgot about the 2 foul first half rule. I have been watching Tubby Smith so long, I was beginning to think that this was part of the rules of the game. And JJ has only 4 more fouls to give!
I just don't see the value in Woody continuing. I'm with Conley, and I also think that the true Woody has been seen. He isn't going to change with more talent or more depth.
He is going to do what he is comfortable with and while he won the power struggle with BK, what gives him the right to continue on as the HC? He himself believes he did an 'excellent' job with last year's team.
Do you agree with him? I truly don't believe anyone does and I thought the true reason for not firing him during the season was because we would have to pay him for non-performance.
But honestly, can you tell me at any time that Woody was the main reason why we won a game here or there? I don't really think he is coaching this team up above their talent. I think we could do much more. But Woody is intent on just wearing our main guys down and not providing any consistency off the bench. He doesn't have a clear idea what his bench is, and he sees these guys every day.
If he is here, he will be here, but there won't be many who believe that better days are ahead with him at the helm. We have a chance for a clean break, and we might mess that up because the ASG will not bend in their support. Someone will be wrong in the end. I just don't think the fans are that nieve.
There are some very intelligent Hawks fans on this boar, many of who see things that I overlook after a game. We would like to see what our bench can do to help us win games. 5 minutes before the half doesn't improve your game and playing Mario West for 45 secs at the end of halves won't be that much of a factor.
I almost forgot about the 2 foul first half rule. I have been watching Tubby Smith so long, I was beginning to think that this was part of the rules of the game. And JJ has only 4 more fouls to give!
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HoopsGuru25
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Getting into games a coach "lost" or "won" is difficult td00. I think Woodson sucks but he has clearly made adjustments to help the Hawks win...for example the 1st game against Orlando was the best game Woodson coached all season. He basically took Howard out the game. The 1st game vs Miami(1 of only 2 times the Hawks won on the road when trailing at the half)when he put Zaza on Shaq in the 4th which led to the Hawks coming back in the game. There was also the Philly game where we down 20 and he went into a zone and Philly went ice cold. Now obviously I could find more games where Woodson's dumb decisions contributed to us losing but I can find two where Woodson's bone headed decisions basically gave the other team the game(which should never happen).
The bottom line is that Woodson is a bad coach and it would be very hard to find someone who has worse than him. What positive has Woody done for the Hawks? I don't even think he did a good job in the Boston series...he still used the 2 foul rule(not that it prevented us from winning but it shows how dumb the entire coaching staff is)and he left Josh Smith on the bench for the first TEN minutes of the 4th quarter in game 6. He is a defensive coach whose teams don't play defense. His offense is uncreative, half court/isolation heavy on a team who doesn't have the roster to play that style(part of this is BK's fault but he's gone). You can blame it on the players all you want but that doesn't change the fact that Woodson doesn't do anything to help this team. What had Woodson done to warrant coming back? What are his strengths as a head coach and how have those strengths help the Hawks win games?
His contract is up so we should be looking for someone to replace him whether it be someone with head coaching experience and if we can't do that then we should be looking to hire one of the assistant coaches around the league. I don't see how anyone can defend Woodson. If you are wondering why people keep blaming Woody it's because he's still the coach after 4 years. The Hawks have have had horrible results and NO ONE has been held accountable. The ASG is the only ownership group who would even let BOTH the GM and coach last throughout their contracts with as bad as the Hawks have been for the last 4-5 seasons...let alone offer both of them the chance to come back after their contracts have expired. No one can dispute that.
The bottom line is that Woodson is a bad coach and it would be very hard to find someone who has worse than him. What positive has Woody done for the Hawks? I don't even think he did a good job in the Boston series...he still used the 2 foul rule(not that it prevented us from winning but it shows how dumb the entire coaching staff is)and he left Josh Smith on the bench for the first TEN minutes of the 4th quarter in game 6. He is a defensive coach whose teams don't play defense. His offense is uncreative, half court/isolation heavy on a team who doesn't have the roster to play that style(part of this is BK's fault but he's gone). You can blame it on the players all you want but that doesn't change the fact that Woodson doesn't do anything to help this team. What had Woodson done to warrant coming back? What are his strengths as a head coach and how have those strengths help the Hawks win games?
His contract is up so we should be looking for someone to replace him whether it be someone with head coaching experience and if we can't do that then we should be looking to hire one of the assistant coaches around the league. I don't see how anyone can defend Woodson. If you are wondering why people keep blaming Woody it's because he's still the coach after 4 years. The Hawks have have had horrible results and NO ONE has been held accountable. The ASG is the only ownership group who would even let BOTH the GM and coach last throughout their contracts with as bad as the Hawks have been for the last 4-5 seasons...let alone offer both of them the chance to come back after their contracts have expired. No one can dispute that.