Why Did the Hawks choose Millsap Over Carroll?

Chriscarr9924 · Post #1 » by **Chriscarr9924** » Tue Sep 22, 2015 7:21 pm

Yes, I do think Millsap is a better player than Carroll. (Just to get that out of the way). But think about this. If the Hawks signed Carroll over Millsap and still traded for Splitter, I dont think they would be that much worse. Carroll showed in the Playoffs he can be a 2nd or 3rd option and is a great defender. He has great size at almost 6'9 and is very strong. Plus, with no Carroll left to man the SF this year, who will take his place? Sefolosha, Hardaway? That is a pretty big downgrade. If they let Millsap walk and traded for Splitter, he is a much better replacement for Millsap than Hardaway is for Carroll. Horford would play PF (his natural posistion) and Splitter would start at C. They would retain some depth with keeping Sef and Hardaway on the bench. So the starting lineup would be:

J.Teague | D.Schroder | S.Mack
K.Korver | T.Hardaway | K.Bazemore
D.Carroll | T.Sefolosha
A.Horford | M.Muscala | M.Scott
T.Splitter | W.Tavares

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MaceCase · Post #2 » by **MaceCase** » Tue Sep 22, 2015 9:05 pm

DeMarre was a product of the system and despite his playoff run is still considered the 5th best starter. You just don't pay that guy over your two time All Star. You start to enter Jerome James territory when you decide to pay a guy based off performances in only 1 and a half playoff series rather than the breadth of his career or even those playoffs themselves (he fell right back to his season averages). He isn't exactly young either at 29 to think that he has great potential to build on that short performance.

Management preferred to keep an All Star frontcourt intact with one of the best backups in the league flanking them instead of overpaying a 3 and D player. I really can't understand why someone would question that logic. Thabo has always been a better defender that has a flirted with a few seasons of 40% shooting from three (35% for his career) and Hardaway Jr. is 6 years younger with greater offensive talent. For the investment, the wings have a much shorter amount of ground to make up if not surpass DeMarre's production than the team would have had in trying to replace Millsap.

Post #3 » by **Jamaaliver** » Tue Sep 22, 2015 9:16 pm

Chriscarr9924 wrote:Yes, I do think Millsap is a better player than Carroll. (Just to get that out of the way). But think about this. If the Hawks signed Carroll over Millsap and still traded for Splitter, I dont think they would be that much worse. Carroll showed in the Playoffs he can be a 2nd or 3rd option and is a great defender. He has great size at almost 6'9 and is very strong. Plus, with no Carroll left to man the SF this year, who will take his place? Sefolosha, Hardaway? That is a pretty big downgrade. If they let Millsap walk and traded for Splitter, he is a much better replacement for Millsap than Hardaway is for Carroll. Horford would play PF (his natural posistion) and Splitter would start at C. They would retain some depth with keeping Sef and Hardaway on the bench. So the starting lineup would be:

J.Teague | D.Schroder | S.Mack
K.Korver | T.Hardaway | K.Bazemore
D.Carroll | T.Sefolosha
A.Horford | M.Muscala | M.Scott
T.Splitter | W.Tavares

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This is actually a really fair question.

My guess is that DeMarre can be replaced more easily than Millsap. Paul is (arguably) our best player. And keeping him and Horford together was more important to the coach. His staff believes they can get Thabo/Bazemore/Holliday to approach DeMarre's production. But there simply wasn't another All Star caliber PF that we could get in the draft or Free Agency.

But it has crossed my mind as well that Splitter and DeMarre would make for a fantastic defensive duo flanking Horford and Teague. Horford-Splitter-Carroll would be a worthy trio in the frontcourt and that top 20 draft pick of ours could have been kept as well to strengthen the rotation.

jayu70 · Post #4 » by **jayu70** » Tue Sep 22, 2015 11:02 pm

Sap's offensive versatility, his ability to play spot minutes at SF in a big lineup was the reason. Additionally, If Splitter is the starter with Al playing PF full time our big man rotation is severely downgraded with Moose, Mike Scott and Edy as backups.
With Thabo still on the roster he is capable of starting. As Jamaal said the younguns Baze, Holiday and THJr will have to fill the DMC void.
I think we are more balanced with these bigs, wings and PGs with Millsap. More options and combination lineups available.

jayu70 · Post #5 » by **jayu70** » Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:52 am

Just saw this to add to Sap's selection over DMC:

"For as much as former Atlanta Hawk SFDeMarre Carroll gained notoriety for his strong defensive prowess, advanced statistics show that PF Paul Millsap was actually the best defender on the 2014-15 Atlanta Hawks. Millsap finished 9th in the NBA in Defensive Rating (99.2), 7th in Defensive Win Shares (4.3) and 9th in Steals Per Game (1.8), as a Power Forward nonetheless!"

TroubleS0me · Post #6 » by **TroubleS0me** » Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:29 am

jayu70 wrote:Just saw this to add to Sap's selection over DMC:

"For as much as former Atlanta Hawk SFDeMarre Carroll gained notoriety for his strong defensive prowess, advanced statistics show that PF Paul Millsap was actually the best defender on the 2014-15 Atlanta Hawks. Millsap finished 9th in the NBA in Defensive Rating (99.2), 7th in Defensive Win Shares (4.3) and 9th in Steals Per Game (1.8), as a Power Forward nonetheless!"

FG% against

DeMare 44.7
Milsap 46.68

MaceCase · Post #7 » by **MaceCase** » Wed Sep 23, 2015 4:45 am

TroubleS0me wrote:
jayu70 wrote:Just saw this to add to Sap's selection over DMC:

"For as much as former Atlanta Hawk SFDeMarre Carroll gained notoriety for his strong defensive prowess, advanced statistics show that PF Paul Millsap was actually the best defender on the 2014-15 Atlanta Hawks. Millsap finished 9th in the NBA in Defensive Rating (99.2), 7th in Defensive Win Shares (4.3) and 9th in Steals Per Game (1.8), as a Power Forward nonetheless!"

FG% against

DeMare 44.7
Milsap 46.68

In the context that one guards predominantly on the perimeter and the other in the post that kind of makes Millsap's defense look even more impressive.

atlantabbq99 · Post #8 » by **atlantabbq99** » Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:51 am

Chriscarr9924 wrote:Yes, I do think Millsap is a better player than Carroll. (Just to get that out of the way). But think about this. If the Hawks signed Carroll over Millsap and still traded for Splitter, I dont think they would be that much worse. Carroll showed in the Playoffs he can be a 2nd or 3rd option and is a great defender. He has great size at almost 6'9 and is very strong. Plus, with no Carroll left to man the SF this year, who will take his place? Sefolosha, Hardaway? That is a pretty big downgrade. If they let Millsap walk and traded for Splitter, he is a much better replacement for Millsap than Hardaway is for Carroll. Horford would play PF (his natural posistion) and Splitter would start at C. They would retain some depth with keeping Sef and Hardaway on the bench. So the starting lineup would be:

J.Teague | D.Schroder | S.Mack
K.Korver | T.Hardaway | K.Bazemore
D.Carroll | T.Sefolosha
A.Horford | M.Muscala | M.Scott
T.Splitter | W.Tavares

Millsap is an All-Star and Carroll isn't. Coach Budz also thinks that 3D players are a dime a dozen and he has confidence in himself in coaching up Holiday, Baz, and Hardaway.

atlantabbq99 · Post #9 » by **atlantabbq99** » Thu Sep 24, 2015 5:53 am

Multi skilled post players are also hard to find and extremely valuable in Budz system.

Mr Gametime · Post #10 » by **Mr Gametime** » Mon Sep 28, 2015 10:11 am

Milsap has star power and is key to The Hawks Success, Carroll has benefited from your system, if you give those mintues to someone else you'll probably see the same type of impact.