ImageImage

Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8

Moderators: HMFFL, ATL Boy, dms269, Jamaaliver

Which matchup are you most excited for tonight?

Poll ended at Sat Nov 9, 2019 1:11 pm

Trae vs D Fox
2
67%
Bembry vs Bogdanovic
1
33%
L Pierce vs L Walton
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 3

User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 22,434
And1: 7,869
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#1 » by Jamaaliver » Fri Nov 8, 2019 1:11 pm

Image

Read on Twitter


Hawks looking for answers as they entertain Kings

After Wednesday's loss to Chicago, Atlanta Hawks coach Lloyd Pierce admittedly was stunned that the media had numerous questions following the team's fourth loss in five games. While Pierce made light of the situation, he hopes the Hawks have more answers on the court Friday as they play their third home game in four days with an encounter against the Sacramento Kings.

Read on Twitter

Kings SG Buddy Hield flustered Atlanta in two games last season by scoring 45 points on 16-of-28 shooting from the field, including 9-of-15 from 3-point range.
Yahoo Sports

With the two teams each stumbling in off of a loss, both will be hungry for the win. Two offensive stats to keep in the back of your head while watching: Sacramento are stumbling into the game with the fourth fewest rebounds per game in the league, having accrued only 42.4 on average. Atlanta has experienced some offensive struggles of their own as they are fourth worst in the league in points per game, with only 102.6 on average. It's possible one of these Achilles' heels will wind up tripping the losing team up.
CBS Sports

Spoiler:
The last time De'Aaron came to Atlanta, he put on a show...

Image
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 22,434
And1: 7,869
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: Game Thread: Hawks @ Kings -- 11/8 

Post#2 » by Jamaaliver » Fri Nov 8, 2019 1:12 pm

Who's actually available this game?

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter
User avatar
HMFFL
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 39,416
And1: 1,923
Joined: Mar 10, 2004

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#3 » by HMFFL » Fri Nov 8, 2019 1:49 pm

The Kings are favored to win by 2 points.

Sent from my SM-N920P using RealGM mobile app
lethalweapon3
Pro Prospect
Posts: 934
And1: 1,164
Joined: Aug 13, 2007
Location: State Farm Arena, Moving The Ball From Side To Side
Contact:
 

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#4 » by lethalweapon3 » Fri Nov 8, 2019 8:54 pm

Protect ya neck!

The Sacramento Kings are always deeply fond of the folks under their employ. Until, they’re not.

It’s predicting when the Sacrificial Sacramento Sword comes for these players, these coaches, that has long been the mystery. Do you love our lambs, too, Kings fans? Cool. Sure hope you like shank.

Rick Adelman knew something was up when Geoff Petrie started playing coy about his and his staff’s contracts. The Kings hadn’t been anything of consequence since moving to Norcal from Kansas City, and some would go at least as far back as Cincinnati. Adelman was at the helm of the greatest eight-year run in the franchise’s lackluster history, including Sacramento’s first Conference Finals, and four consecutive seasons of 55-plus wins and trips to the West’s Final Four. But when it came time to talk turkey, Adelman found himself on the serving table.

The writing was on the wall, even if middle-man GM Petrie couldn’t read it aloud. The Magoof Brothers were just waiting for him to recede. Recede they did, in the form of two first-round exits after Chris Webber’s career-crippling injury found him traded to Philly. Even though the last playoff departure came after a valiant effort against the Spurs, The Sword was unsheathed for Adelman.

Butt-hurt by Shaq’s “Queens” assertions, the Magoofs long felt they could do better than second- and third-fiddle to the Lakers, and in their minds, better was the new-school Eric Musselman. Coach Muss rewarded them by pulling a Coach Bud, and not in a good way, with a DUI before the regular season could even arrive. Muss’ team slid to 33-49, a big step down from 44-38 in 2005-06, Adelman’s final campaign. The Kings would not win 40 games, or play a playoff game, since the Magoofs handed Adelman his walking papers.

Reggie Theus was put in charge of the resuscitation, and he got the team to 38 wins in his first season there. But then Kevin Martin was plagued with injuries to start the next season, and the Magoofs found the 6-18 run out of the blocks unpalatable. Coach Theus lasted longer on TNBC’s “Hang Time.” Kenny Natt was left to lug the Kings the rest of the way (11-47), and he never coached a pro outfit in the States again.

Paul Westphal took over the tank after two seasons, and few batted an eye when he pushed Martin out of town. but when he essentially declared, “it’s either him (Boogie Cousins) or me!”, after banishing his young star, he wasn’t going to be happy with the answer. Keith Smart goes 28-54? Not good enough. Grand opening, grand closing. Mike Malone goes 28-54 the very next season? Sashay, you stay.

That is, until Malone started the next season at 11-13. The new Kings regime said they simply “expected more,” as they handed the Smart-Natt Memorial Just Holding the Fort Award to Ty Corbin. A 7-21 run later, and now it was curmudgeonly worst-selling author George Karl being handed the keys to the Kings’ tainted coaching throne.

Around Sactown as the PBO since 1994, Petrie seemed like a nice-enough fellow. But years of meddlesome decisions by the Magoofs on coaching and draft-day decisions had him in a bristling mood. Petrie and the executive staff were relieved that when Vivek Ranadive arrived, offering a slimmer of hope they not only would they get to stay in town, they could stick around, keep their jobs, and allow some autonomy in doing those jobs effectively. That didn’t last long.

With smarmy Mayor Kevin and a city having Vivek’s back, Petrie knew he didn’t have a leg to stand on when Vivek announced Malone as the new coach, without much input from him. The Sword was still in town, this time swinging at lame ducks. Petrie was later incensed when Ranadive, explaining away the Kings’ inability to improve on the court, tried to suggest there wasn’t so much as a light bulb on at Kings Inc. when he took ownership. No, Petrie and Smart would note, you walked in and shot all the lights out.

Pete D’Alessandro used his work under Masai in Denver to snag Petrie’s job. But his penchant to leak poison pills to the media about players like Boogie and save-the-Kings-from-Seattle PR spokesman Isaiah Thomas, and coach Malone, wasn’t the wisest way to clean house. Ranadive realized in hindsight that hiring Malone before Pete D (“from Day One… they hated each other’s guts") wasn’t the wisest way to rebuild an NBA franchise.

How does one go about peeving off Shareef Abdur-Rahim, of all people, exactly? You have to be an absolute master of your craft to pull off a feat like that. The assistant GM, once happy to stay in Sactown after retirement, had to sue the Kings in civil court, citing a “hostile work environment,” just to get the salary they owed him after he would no longer be caught in the middle of D’Alessandro’s and Malone’s power plays.

The sense most of us outsiders often get, or are often told, is that Sacramento is some undesirable NBA outpost. But the theme that continues to shine through is the NBA talent there, however they wind up there, would be more than just fine sticking around in perpetuity, being around for the Kings’ eventual resurgence in the league, if only the crap from all the squabbling would quit flowing downhill. These aren’t wildfires that the Kings have had to put out. For the better part of 15 years, these have been wild immolations.

Sneaky Pete wasn’t wild about Vivek bringing in Kings glory-days legend Vlade Divac as a power-usurping “advisor.” D’Alessandro concerns came to life as Ranadive pushed both him and Chris Mullin out to make Divac the top dog in 2015.

The Sword that swung for C-Webb and Kev-Mart and I.T. and Tyreke continues to swing for players under Divac’s watch, notably Cousins, who was sent in a deal that had Reke attached to Pelicans rookie Buddy Hield. It still swings sharply for the coaches, too. The Kings went 39-43 last season, their best finish since Adelman’s ouster eons ago, and a 9-seed in the rough-and-tumble NBA West. That was good enough this past spring for Vlade to earn a contract extension. Not so much for third-year coach Dave Joerger.

Vivek and Vlade thought they could do better. And better, in his eyes, was Luke Walton, Vlade’s old Laker teammate and the coach who could not be entrusted with a rebuilding program centered around LeBron James. Magic fired himself trying to fire Luke, and yet Luke is the one charged with improving upon Joerger’s record.

Last season was good enough for the Kings to extend near-obligatory contract options for up-and-coming stars (hopefully, for them) Marvin Bagley and De’Aaron Fox. After a period of contention that had Hield mapping routes out of town, the young sharpshooter and the Kings locked up a four-year deal just in time for this season to start. Hield handed his travel guides to Bogdan Bogdanovic, the Serbian swingman who knows he could earn more than Sacramento could offer this summer. That is, if Walton would just give Bogdanovic functional minutes with the starters.

If you went back in time, and told Kings fans in the summer of 2017 that a guy named Harry would be leading the team in minutes, they’d be thrilled. Just don’t tell them that you’re referring to Harrison Barnes. Harry Giles was left out in the cold at option time, the would-be second-year center joined by ex-Hawk Dewayne Dedmon as questionable for tonight’s game against the Kings (TAKE MARTA IF YOU VALUE YOUR SANITY; 7:30 pm Eastern, Fox Sports Southeast and 92.9 FM in ATL, NBC Sports California) with a knee injury.

Divac drafted Zach Collins at #10 in 2017, traded him that night for Portland’s #20 pick, Giles, then basked in the glow of the punditry who looked right past a whole other Collins in declaring that Sacramento got the steal of the Draft.

Known for problematic knee injury issues since he was a prized recruit in high school, Giles was medically redshirted by the Kings in 2017-18. He was essentially a two-way player in the opening months of 2018-19 and was shut down in the closing games of the season, after 58 appearances, for continued rehabilitation.

All the while, the Kings were eager to tout and offer glimpses of Giles’ boundless potential. Much of his highlight reel tape comes from his career high 20 points (10-for-12 FGs) in a satisfying 135-113 win over the visiting Hawks last January.

Now, it appears Giles will bear the brunt of the organization’s blame, not their medical and conditioning staff, for his inability to put up Willie Cauley-Stein numbers, if not at least Zach Collins figures, by the end of this season. The Kings were out of options, contract-wise. But Giles, like Bogdanovic, knows he could have plenty of options this summer as a free agent, if he makes the most of the floor time Walton grants him.

Checking into tonight’s contest at 2-6, Walton and the Kings are eager to, as 92.9 The Game’s Randy McMichael likes to say, “put them foots into” the Hawks, much as the desperate Bulls hooved the home team just two nights prior, much as Joerger’s team did to coach Lloyd Pierce’s crew twice last season.

The Hawks (3-4) took several chair-shots, some more literal than others, during the 113-93 blowout loss to Chicago. As they prepare for a five-game, eight-day road excursion through the Western Conference, they’re unlikely to take another beating from State Farm Arena’s visitors sitting down. Not just because there may not be any chairs standing upright if they waste the time of fans who made it through horrendous motorcade-impacted downtown traffic.

Pierce, unlike Walton, is secure in his team’s mediocrity, and can afford to keep hammering away at lotto-rookies Cam Reddish and De’Andre Hunter, and guys playing like rookies (Kevin Huerter and Alex Len, neither on the injury list any more), until they figure things out. There’s no need to wait until Trae Young (0-for-8 3FGs vs. CHI) cans a shot from Druid Hills before the young Hawks decide to start playing with a competitive spirit, especially when the ball’s in transition in either direction.

What does the Giles situation say to Bagley, who returns in a few weeks after fracturing a thumb in the season opener, or even Fox (6.8 APG, 4.0 TOs/game) and Hield (40.8 3FG%, but 41.1 2FG%), while trying to right the ship under an unsteady Walton’s direction? You’re our rocks, our mainstays, Vivek and Vlade will assure each of them. That is true. Until, they’re not.

Watch your step, kids!



Let’s Go Hawks!

~lw3
"Dunking is better than sex." - Shawn Kemp, 1996
ducler
Cold Hard Gameday Facts
Posts: 9,500
And1: 6,991
Joined: Jun 15, 2008
Location: France
Contact:
   

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#5 » by ducler » Fri Nov 8, 2019 9:24 pm

Image
Read on Twitter
Image
jayu70
General Manager
Posts: 9,639
And1: 6,962
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#6 » by jayu70 » Fri Nov 8, 2019 11:05 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20
jayu70
General Manager
Posts: 9,639
And1: 6,962
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#7 » by jayu70 » Fri Nov 8, 2019 11:06 pm

Read on Twitter
?s=20
DirtybirdGA
Analyst
Posts: 3,680
And1: 1,056
Joined: Mar 28, 2005
Location: Augusta
     

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#8 » by DirtybirdGA » Sat Nov 9, 2019 1:25 am

Spurs win looking like a fraud, team has fallen apart, and not competitive.
Where the offseason has more buzz happens.
Rainwater
Veteran
Posts: 2,511
And1: 1,223
Joined: Apr 02, 2017

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#9 » by Rainwater » Sat Nov 9, 2019 2:29 am

The hawks need to make a decision. They are better team with Jabari, Hueter, Trae, Bembey and Len; however, if they want to develop their young players they should start Cam and Hunter but That might cost them the playoffs.
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 22,434
And1: 7,869
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#10 » by Jamaaliver » Sat Nov 9, 2019 4:31 am

All three of these guys should be starters over the next 22 games...

Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter
User avatar
HMFFL
Global Mod
Global Mod
Posts: 39,416
And1: 1,923
Joined: Mar 10, 2004

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#11 » by HMFFL » Sat Nov 9, 2019 8:11 am

I agree all three need to be.
Last night was ugly with the exception of the three of them.
Jamaaliver wrote:All three of these guys should be starters over the next 22 games...

Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Sent from my SM-N920P using RealGM mobile app
jayu70
General Manager
Posts: 9,639
And1: 6,962
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#12 » by jayu70 » Sat Nov 9, 2019 1:01 pm

HMFFL wrote:I agree all three need to be.
Last night was ugly with the exception of the three of them.
Jamaaliver wrote:All three of these guys should be starters over the next 22 games...

Read on Twitter


Read on Twitter


Sent from my SM-N920P using RealGM mobile app

I would be OK with Trae, Kevin, Hunter, Vince and Len (or whichever center) starting.
Jabari's defense is so piss poor, slow and non-existent rotations and close out. Who knew John Collins was our defensive anchor. Let Jabari anchor the bench scoring, he is single minded on offense so I'm not seeing our offense run as smoothly.
King Ken
General Manager
Posts: 8,020
And1: 4,677
Joined: Jul 01, 2014
   

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#13 » by King Ken » Sat Nov 9, 2019 3:13 pm

I like Cam and Hunter starting with Collins but I don't like it at all with Parker.

Like others said on the other forum, without Collins, we lack way too much scoring with the starters so Parker has to start for now.



We need to start a more iso based lineup till Collins is back.

Trae

Kevin

Bembry

Parker

Len



This lineup has Bembry who can play without structure. Hunter at this time can't. Its pointless starting him if Parker is going to consistent blow his assignments and coverages and it makes Hunter job tougher on both ends. Bembry plays a lot better without structure.

Kevin needs to start for the simple reason that with VC starting or Parker starting, our defense won't be that good so we need to score as many points as we can and just have the bench mob be defenders with length, Vince and Crabbe.

Cam

Crabbe

Hunter

Vince

Bruno or Jones should work defensively and they need to learn to play together as well. When Turner is back

Turner

Cam

Hunter

Vince

Bruno



Once Collins is back, we can decide to leave Kevin as the starter over Cam or insert Hunter back into the starting five playing Bembry as a SF off the bench again.

For right now, we need to start the vets. Right now, Trae is asking for PnRs every play, Parker is isoing or asking for post ups, it looks like **** Basketball. The rookies aren't involved in the offense anymore.
User avatar
ATL Boy
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 10,940
And1: 3,971
Joined: May 15, 2011
Location: Atlanta GA
       

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#14 » by ATL Boy » Sat Nov 9, 2019 4:23 pm

The Kings just couldn't miss from 3, especially in that 4th quarter. You sometimes run into a team that gets hot like that and you can't do anything about it, but the issue is that you're now in a bad position at 3-5 with that west coast road trip coming up. I don't think we could afford to lose this game given the early-season circumstances, and that's where that terrible loss to the Bulls and that choke against the 76ers comes into play.

Bogdanovic scored 20 and it felt like it was 40. His 3s were absolute body blows.
SichtingLives wrote:life hack:

When a man heaves a live chainsaw towards you from distance, stand still. No one has good accuracy throwing a chainsaw.
shakes0
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,275
And1: 1,296
Joined: Jul 14, 2017
Location: Chicago
       

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#15 » by shakes0 » Sat Nov 9, 2019 4:29 pm

this is going to be a brutal rest of the year till Collins comes back. Not good when Jabari Parker is your second best player. Having him and Trae out there means we are gonna give up 120+ every game. Not nearly enough offense to make up for that.

I just hope Trae can keep his game up despite being out there basically alone now.


I told you guys over the summer that this team was screwed as long as Len was the starting center. He's absolutely brutal and makes Dedmon look like Wilt Chamberlain.
Rainwater
Veteran
Posts: 2,511
And1: 1,223
Joined: Apr 02, 2017

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#16 » by Rainwater » Sat Nov 9, 2019 10:18 pm

King Ken wrote:I like Cam and Hunter starting with Collins but I don't like it at all with Parker.

Like others said on the other forum, without Collins, we lack way too much scoring with the starters so Parker has to start for now.



We need to start a more iso based lineup till Collins is back.

Trae

Kevin

Bembry

Parker

Len



This lineup has Bembry who can play without structure. Hunter at this time can't. Its pointless starting him if Parker is going to consistent blow his assignments and coverages and it makes Hunter job tougher on both ends. Bembry plays a lot better without structure.

Kevin needs to start for the simple reason that with VC starting or Parker starting, our defense won't be that good so we need to score as many points as we can and just have the bench mob be defenders with length, Vince and Crabbe.

Cam

Crabbe

Hunter

Vince

Bruno or Jones should work defensively and they need to learn to play together as well. When Turner is back

Turner

Cam

Hunter

Vince

Bruno



Once Collins is back, we can decide to leave Kevin as the starter over Cam or insert Hunter back into the starting five playing Bembry as a SF off the bench again.

For right now, we need to start the vets. Right now, Trae is asking for PnRs every play, Parker is isoing or asking for post ups, it looks like **** Basketball. The rookies aren't involved in the offense anymore.


I kinda disagree with some of this assessment. Jabari while a terrible defender for the most part kept the hawks in the game in the first half allowing the hawks, especially Trae who blow up in the 3rd, to make the huge come back in the second half. Everybody with the exception of Jabari and maybe Trae played poorly in the first creating a huge hole they had to fight out of in the second half.

I think the huge problem last night is starting two rookies with the growing pains being understandable. For the most part Cam and Hunter struggled, i don't believe either hit a shot in the first half. To further prove this point, the hawks didn't really make a run until Hunter got hurt, which the coach even mentioned, and Cams got benched in the beginning of the 3rd, and replaced by Huerter, likely to due his poor play.

The rooks are going to have their ups and downs especially Cam who is just not ready and seems like a long term project which is completely fine. I think if the hawks do miss the playoff its likely due to their dependancy on their two rookies choosing to focus on their development instead of winning because if they really wanted to win they should have Huerter, Jabari, Trae, Bemby, and Len starting.
atlantabbq99
Analyst
Posts: 3,653
And1: 1,199
Joined: Mar 28, 2013

Re: Game Thread: Hawks vs Kings -- 11/8 

Post#17 » by atlantabbq99 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:03 am

With hindsight, it looks like Lloyd yelling at the team after the Bulls' game was the wrong coaching move.

For a young team, its better to keep it low key and build up their confidence.

Yelling and calling out the team to the public and press is probably something you only do to a vet team.

Return to Atlanta Hawks