Is Horford to blame?

Harry10 · Post #1 » by **Harry10** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 3:55 am

I don't know what has happen to him, but after the monster Chicago game, the game that everybody thought would turn the whole team around and propel Al to the next level, Horford has just been playing way below standard. I was hoping to see Horford become like a pre-Hakeem Otis Thorpe, or poor man's Kevin McHale.

his points have gone down, and his rebounds have gone way down. Why hasn't Horford jumped to the next level, since the Chicago game? he is going in a completely opposite direction.

draycon530 · Post #2 » by **draycon530** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:11 am

I honestly think that a little bit of everything is to blame. Horford is not the only one playing below standard since that Chicago. As a matter of fact, the only players that seem to be playing decently are Jeff Teague and Zaza Pachulia, but with Larry Drew's seemingly random rotations, that doesn't matter. The way we run the offense right now, all we ever do is shoot jumpers. While we do have decent jump shooters, you can't live like that (especially if you're just going to quit playing any form of defense). We have 3 players in Johnson, Smith, and Horford that are nearly unstoppable in the paint. We showed that in the first 3 quarters against the Sixers tonight. The problem is that when things get tough, Johnson, Smith, and Crawford start throwing up jumpers before anyone else gets to touch the ball in a decent position. Horford seems to rarely get the ball in the paint. It was very frustrating to watch tonight's game since we played so well in the first 3 quarters, and then we just reverted back to our **** ways in the fourth.

Harry10 · Post #3 » by **Harry10** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:17 am

^ yeah, but the thing is that Horford doesn't really do anything exceptionally well, except for being consistent. Josh is better at shutting down the paint and Joe is better at iso and creating, but both of them are not consistent, Horford is suppose to be the consistent one.

Geaux_Hawks · Post #4 » by **Geaux_Hawks** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:23 am

I see him as a poor mans McHale without the blocks and his stats peaking around 18&9, but I think it's LD fault why the team is failing, while I never thought of Horford as an "Elite" level guy since he doesn't have a "dominating will". He really hasn't done anything to stand pat with the Amare words he suggested. I mean if you are going to go out and say nobody isn't afraid of Amare then it sounds like you would at least be the guy that would go on the court and show how you are one of those guys that isn't afraid of Amare. Al is just going to be a great consistent player and nothing more. No fire to push him over the top. He has 2 All Star appearances due to the East not having many quality Centers, but Hibbert and Lopez are coming up in the East(Bogut just doesn't put All Star numbers up).

parson · Post #5 » by **parson** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 5:26 am

From Rotoworld:

Al Horford: Horford guts through hamstring injury
Al Horford - F/C - ATL - Mar. 23 - 10:04 pm et

Al Horford played through a hamstring strain in Wednesday's loss to the Sixers, compiling eight points and nine rebounds in almost 37 minutes.
Horford did not appear overly limited by the hamstring, although his jumper did look a little stiff. The bottom line is that he missed shots that he normally makes, including two contested layups. With two full days off before Saturday's game against the Nets, we'd expect a bounce-back outing.

Link: http://www.rotoworld.com/content/player ... 144&spln=1

And:

Hawks C Al Horford back in lineup after missing one game with ankle injury

By The Associated Press – Mar 15, 2011

ATLANTA — All-Star centre Al Horford is back in the lineup for the Atlanta Hawks.

Horford sat out Atlanta's last game against Portland with a sore left ankle. After testing it shortly before Tuesday night's makeup game against Milwaukee, he declared himself ready to play.

Horford has missed five games with various injuries this season. The Hawks took their two worst home losses of the season while he was out, but are coming off a win over the Trail Blazers that snapped a four-game skid.

The Bucks are in Atlanta to make up a Jan. 11 game that was postponed because of an ice storm.

Ya knew he was ailing, didn't ya?

ATL DirtyBird · Post #6 » by **ATL DirtyBird** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 7:01 am

Please close this thread.

myrak433 · Post #7 » by **myrak433** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:31 am

ATL DirtyBird wrote:Please close this thread.

why you don't won't anyone to talk about the great Horford? no one on this team is great. Joe is always seeing double teams, but noone else takes advantage of that. noone. if someone else stepped up Joe wouldn't be doubled all the time.

azuresou1 · Post #8 » by **azuresou1** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 1:34 pm

If Joe Johnson learned to pass out of a double team as its forming instead of letting it set and giving the defense time to adjust for the pass after, maybe he wouldn't be doubled all the time.

parson · Post #9 » by **parson** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:29 pm

"the great Horford"????
"the great Horford"????

What has he done to earn such sarcasm? All he does is show up every night, even when he's hurt, like now. We don't have to wonder - each game - if he's going to play like he cares. We know he will or there'll be a good reason why he didn't.

Guy's playing with a rolled ankle and a tweaked hammy and some of y'all are throwing him under the bus. Nobody else on our team gets beat up like Horford does -- each night.

Forgive me for saying this, but folks don't have to HATE the other players on our team in order to love Josh Smith.

parson · Post #10 » by **parson** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 2:35 pm

Harry10 wrote:^ yeah, but the thing is that Horford doesn't really do anything exceptionally well, except for being consistent. Josh is better at shutting down the paint and Joe is better at iso and creating, but both of them are not consistent, Horford is suppose to be the consistent one.

He is the best mid-range shooter in the NBA. How's that for exceptional?

And NO ONE on our team shuts down the paint. Smoove blocks shots but he can - easily - be posted up down low. Teague blocks shot, too. Do you think HE shuts down the paint?

Geaux_Hawks · Post #11 » by **Geaux_Hawks** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:32 pm

myrak433 wrote:
ATL DirtyBird wrote:Please close this thread.

why you don't won't anyone to talk about the great Horford? no one on this team is great. Joe is always seeing double teams, but noone else takes advantage of that. noone. if someone else stepped up Joe wouldn't be doubled all the time.

^ agreed no one is great on this team, but some one could really take advantage and help out more when Joe gets doubled or start to see him about to get doubled and make a great cut to the basket. People always talk about ISO Joe, but when nobody moves off the doubles then Joe just sits back and hold the ball until the shot clock drains and he rains a contested JS.

You can't expect a guy to make pin point passes through defenses when nobody is moving around to make a pass to.Passes to stationary targets are more likely to be picked off.

parson wrote:"the great Horford"????
"the great Horford"????

What has he done to earn such sarcasm? All he does is show up every night, even when he's hurt, like now. We don't have to wonder - each game - if he's going to play like he cares. We know he will or there'll be a good reason why he didn't.

Guy's playing with a rolled ankle and a tweaked hammy and some of y'all are throwing him under the bus. Nobody else on our team gets beat up like Horford does -- each night.

Forgive me for saying this, but folks don't have to HATE the other players on our team in order to love Josh Smith.

Nobody is hating on Horford, but playing on a rolled ankle and a tweaked hamstring(that didn't limit his mobility much) are things you suppose to play through. Plenty of players roll their ankles on a nightly basis. I think the sarcasm comes from, when the fans try to make him the star player on the team or say we should run our offense through him.

myrak433 · Post #12 » by **myrak433** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 6:29 pm

parson wrote:
Harry10 wrote:^ yeah, but the thing is that Horford doesn't really do anything exceptionally well, except for being consistent. Josh is better at shutting down the paint and Joe is better at iso and creating, but both of them are not consistent, Horford is suppose to be the consistent one.

He is the [b]best mid-range shooter in the NBA. [/b] How's that for exceptional?

And NO ONE on our team shuts down the paint. Smoove blocks shots but he can - easily - be posted up down low. Teague blocks shot, too. Do you think HE shuts down the paint?

Horfords mid-range jumps shots are almost always uncontested. he is know where near the best mid-range shooter in the NBA. it is a really good mid-range shooter. but I would rather Bosh, Kobe, Durant, Melo, Paul Pierce, hell even Bargnani taking a game winning mid-range jump shot before Horford. and that is only naming a few I didn't even mention Dirk.
and I like Horford but I would take anyone of those players( except Barngnani and Paul Pierce) over Horford.

JoshB914 · Post #13 » by **JoshB914** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 10:50 pm

parson wrote:
Harry10 wrote:^ yeah, but the thing is that Horford doesn't really do anything exceptionally well, except for being consistent. Josh is better at shutting down the paint and Joe is better at iso and creating, but both of them are not consistent, Horford is suppose to be the consistent one.

He is the best mid-range shooter in the NBA. How's that for exceptional?

And NO ONE on our team shuts down the paint. Smoove blocks shots but he can - easily - be posted up down low. Teague blocks shot, too. Do you think HE shuts down the paint?

Al Horford is not the best mid-range jump shooter in the NBA. He's great at knocking down open shots but that is a crazy statement to make considering some of the guys out there.

Other than that, way too much hate on Horford in this thread. He's one of the few guys left that actually cares. He's a great role player and people want him to be a star for some reason.

Geaux_Hawks · Post #14 » by **Geaux_Hawks** » Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:17 pm

JoshB914 wrote:
parson wrote:
Harry10 wrote:^ yeah, but the thing is that Horford doesn't really do anything exceptionally well, except for being consistent. Josh is better at shutting down the paint and Joe is better at iso and creating, but both of them are not consistent, Horford is suppose to be the consistent one.

He is the best mid-range shooter in the NBA. How's that for exceptional?

And NO ONE on our team shuts down the paint. Smoove blocks shots but he can - easily - be posted up down low. Teague blocks shot, too. Do you think HE shuts down the paint?

Al Horford is not the best mid-range jump shooter in the NBA. He's great at knocking down open shots but that is a crazy statement to make considering some of the guys out there.

Other than that, way too much hate on Horford in this thread. He's one of the few guys left that actually cares. He's a great role player and people want him to be a star for some reason.[/quote]

Thats all he is and fans think he can be a top 5 PF if moved.

Ruhiel · Post #15 » by **Ruhiel** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:17 pm

Bosh is a top 5 PF and Miami still loses, its not about being "top 5". Its about being the best team.

the frontcourt is undersized. Management is to blame cuz they could have let Joe walk or S&T. Forget about position names for a second it's common sense, Smith+Horford + good center lets Hawks play the boards better and match up with the size of the Lakers/Magic/Heat/Knicks.
Melo/Turkoglu cannot guard Smith in the halfcourt Artest and Lebron arguably could. But if Smith played the leakouts like Melo, he'd average over 20 a game with a good PG. Pass the ball into Marvin (SG) or Smith in the post and kick out to a jump shooter. It's worked for Orlando for years.
Hawks stand on perimeter and play outside-in.
It simply puts the team in a better position to get rebounds and WIN. Horford would get more boards against small PFs like Orlando and maybe even Boozer in CHI. We need a center for defensive purposes. Horford is a pinch hitter.
And Orlando is like Atlanta's Detroit Pistons They beat the Hawks multiple times but the sad thing is they had a small roster too. I think Hawks would be the only team outside the Lakers to have threats at the SF, PF, C.

parson · Post #16 » by **parson** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:51 pm

JoshB914 wrote:Al Horford is not the best mid-range jump shooter in the NBA. He's great at knocking down open shots but that is a crazy statement to make considering some of the guys out there.

He's shooting 58% from mid-range, the best in the NBA among qualified shooters - Dirk shoots 52% (Had an more recent link but can't find it. Here's one from January: http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/ ... he-league/ ). And Horford is attempting 4.5 shots/game from mid-range, so he's busy out there. Here's a 2nd link with a little more info: http://www.ajc.com/sports/atlanta-hawks ... 15731.html

Face it, he's the most successful mid-range shooter in the NBA. If it makes y'all happy, I'll say he's the best mid-range shooter in the NBA this year.

Geaux_Hawks · Post #17 » by **Geaux_Hawks** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 5:19 pm

parson wrote:
JoshB914 wrote:Al Horford is not the best mid-range jump shooter in the NBA. He's great at knocking down open shots but that is a crazy statement to make considering some of the guys out there.

He's shooting 58% from mid-range, the best in the NBA among qualified shooters - Dirk shoots 52% (Had an more recent link but can't find it. Here's one from January: http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/ ... he-league/ ). And Horford is attempting 4.5 shots/game from mid-range, so he's busy out there. Here's a 2nd link with a little more info: http://www.ajc.com/sports/atlanta-hawks ... 15731.html

Face it, he's the most successful mid-range shooter in the NBA. If it makes y'all happy, I'll say he's the best mid-range shooter in the NBA this year.

Thats more better if you look at from a statistical stand point, but honestly he takes lesser shots being contested than others. I love the fact that he can hit the open mid-range very consistently, but rarely does he have a hand in his face. I mean a guy like Dirk will pretty much have a guy in his face all the time, and even makes the shot more difficult by fading away.

JoshB914 · Post #18 » by **JoshB914** » Fri Mar 25, 2011 8:22 pm

Parson don't be blinded by the stats. Al takes most of his jumpers when he is wide open. Dirk is hitting 52% of his mid-range j's when there is a hand in his face at all times. Straight up numbers don't tell the whole story. Props to Al for stepping up and knocking that shot down, but his % alone doesn't make him the best mid-range shooter this or any other season.

bigbreakfast · Post #19 » by **bigbreakfast** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:03 am

parson wrote:
JoshB914 wrote:Al Horford is not the best mid-range jump shooter in the NBA. He's great at knocking down open shots but that is a crazy statement to make considering some of the guys out there.

He's shooting 58% from mid-range, the best in the NBA among qualified shooters - Dirk shoots 52% (Had an more recent link but can't find it. Here's one from January: http://probasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/ ... he-league/ ). And Horford is attempting 4.5 shots/game from mid-range, so he's busy out there. Here's a 2nd link with a little more info: http://www.ajc.com/sports/atlanta-hawks ... 15731.html

Face it, he's the most successful mid-range shooter in the NBA. If it makes y'all happy, I'll say he's the best mid-range shooter in the NBA this year.

um, dallas often runs their offense through dirk and his midrange game whereas teams often concede the same shot to horford.

in the link you provided: "Dirk is the best midrange shooter in the NBA, and it’s really not even close. "...it might help next time if the link you post to back up what you say doesn't directly contradict what you say.

but horford isn't to blame, he's doing what he can.

parson · Post #20 » by **parson** » Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:17 am

I wasn't linking them for their opinion but for their stats. I know what they said but it's still Dirk 52% to Horford's 58%. Their stated opinion is that Dirk is better; however, the fact is that - this year - Horford's shooting better from mid-range.

But I'm grateful you read the link and responded.