What do we want for Smoove

[ATL Boy]

We heard all these proposals from other fans and all. But I am curious, what would us Hawks fans want for Josh?

[azuresou1]

A young quality C. Brook Lopez, Roy Hibbert, guys like that.

[myrak433]

we would want a sure starting center that would be a clear upgrade over Horford at the center position. like Bogut, Dwight, maybe Gasol.


or someone that is 7 feet tall who as some potential to be our starting center but may have some concerns such as injuries like Beans, Kaman, or Okur; played good for a season or two but may have regressed like Robin Lopez; or may not be a true center but is 7 feet tall and has a true skill set that they are really good at like Bargs in scoring.

with the underlined we would need a first round pick as well. the pick would be to replace Smiths athleticism someone like Derrick Williams, Tristan Thompson, Marcus or Markieff Morris, and Bismack to name a few

[evildallas]

Want to either fix the lineup or fix the payroll.

Josh Smith doesn't have to be traded, so no low ball offers need apply. The rumor mill is churning because of several things like analysis that our ownership is weak, analysis that Joe Johnson is very expensive, realization that Josh and Al truly play the same position although each can play a 2nd position, given his post season performance and length of contract Josh would likely return the most in trade, and Josh being sensitive to public criticism of his shooting.

The big problems with the team contract wise are Joe Johnson, who is got horribly overpaid in terms of dollars and contract length because the team imagined they had no choice, and Marvin Williams, who has failed to earn what should have been a reasonable contract at the time. If you replace Marvin Williams with a rookie scale player that puts up similar stats then there is no pressure to cut salary. If you replace Joe Johnson with someone making half as much money for an approximation of the stats then you have no pressure either.

As far as fixing the lineup, if you figure Al goes to the 4, we need a C and we could use either wing spot (Joe can move to SF) to upgrade Marvin. We also might be looking for a bench scorer to replace Jamal Crawford as well.

[parson]

Want to either fix the lineup or fix the payroll.

This.

[Superiorblogman]

We don't need a either or thing with trading such an important piece. We need a little of everything to trade Josh. I would love to get Bogut or Lopez but I don't see getting a rare quality Center for Josh. Even with Boguts health concerns I would do that trade today, right now. I think at the end of the day. Monta and Biedrins for Josh, Marvin, and Zaza is more feasible and could help us more than any other trade that can be dreamed up.

[guaves13]

How about this from PHX:

Rolo (1yr $2.87m)
Pietrus (1yr $5.3m)
#13 pick in 2011 draft

As a draft day deal it should work in the checker. About $10m in and $12.5 out for ATL.

[HMFFL]

How about this from PHX:

Rolo (1yr $2.87m)
Pietrus (1yr $5.3m)
#13 pick in 2011 draft

As a draft day deal it should work in the checker. About $10m in and $12.5 out for ATL.

Makes no sense for us. Robin Lopez has yet to prove he can be a productive player in the league, Mickael Pietrus has no value since he exercised his player option, and there's a very little chance that whomever we draft with the 13th pick produces what Josh already does for us.

[guaves13]

How about this from PHX:

Rolo (1yr $2.87m)
Pietrus (1yr $5.3m)
#13 pick in 2011 draft

As a draft day deal it should work in the checker. About $10m in and $12.5 out for ATL.

Makes no sense for us. Robin Lopez has yet to prove he can be a productive player in the league, Mickael Pietrus has no value since he exercised his player option, and there's a very little chance that whomever we draft with the 13th pick produces what Josh already does for us.

I beg to differ on Lopez. With Amare in PHX Lopez was actually pretty effective. His back injury set him back quite a bit and he seemed less confident last year without benefiting from all the attention that Amare used to draw. Horford could take some of the pressure off of him and another offseason of rehab should strengthen his back and legs. Not saying he is a sure thing but at less than $3m for 1 season he isn't much of a risk.

As far as Pietrus goes, not sure how he would be of any value in a trade had he opted out. Worst case ATL gets a solid young player and $8m in trade bait or $10m in salary cap relief. Best case ATL hits the jackpot with a player like Biyombo, Thompson, or Hamilton who become a borderline all star like Smith (#18 pick by the way). Lopez bounces back to 09/10 form and could start for you. Pietrus gives you energy off the bench and could net you some more help at the deadline in the form of an expiring.

[HoopsGuru25]

As frustrating as Smith is...his production is much better than his trade value around the league. The only way you trade him is for someone like Brook Lopez or Bogut and trades like that just don't happen in the NBA("big for small").

[HMFFL]

I beg to differ on Lopez. With Amare in PHX Lopez was actually pretty effective. His back injury set him back quite a bit and he seemed less confident last year without benefiting from all the attention that Amare used to draw. Horford could take some of the pressure off of him and another offseason of rehab should strengthen his back and legs. Not saying he is a sure thing but at less than $3m for 1 season he isn't much of a risk.

As far as Pietrus goes, not sure how he would be of any value in a trade had he opted out. Worst case ATL gets a solid young player and $8m in trade bait or $10m in salary cap relief. Best case ATL hits the jackpot with a player like Biyombo, Thompson, or Hamilton who become a borderline all star like Smith (#18 pick by the way). Lopez bounces back to 09/10 form and could start for you. Pietrus gives you energy off the bench and could net you some more help at the deadline in the form of an expiring.

Sounds like a great deal of time to invest in Lopez to wait for him to prove himself. His QF is due after next season and that's just too much of a risk for us. I'm just not very impressed with him or anyone that must rely on a teammate to produce.

The high expiring contracts ($5 or more million) tend to be overrated. The reason why he exercised his option is because the $5.3 million he's going to make next season would most likely double his value if he had become a free agent. We already have Kirk Hinrich's expiring contract to possibly move and he actually has value that can acquire us a decent return.

Your offer is low risk, high reward for Phoenix, and for us it's high risk, low reward. Most likely complete bust!

[guaves13]

So the $10m of salary relief in 12/13 wouldn't interest the team? I respect your opinion but considering Smith was picked nearly in the 20's it seems a bit shortsighted to rule out a pick in the late lotto.

Hopefully if the team really is entertaining offers they get some better ones. In my opinion it's a pretty good offer.

[dms269]

So the $10m of salary relief in 12/13 wouldn't interest the team? I respect your opinion but considering Smith was picked nearly in the 20's it seems a bit shortsighted to rule out a pick in the late lotto.

Hopefully if the team really is entertaining offers they get some better ones. In my opinion it's a pretty good offer.

I doubt the Hawks want to straight salary dump Josh Smith. Marvin? Maybe. JJ? maybe, but Josh Smith? Seriously doubt it.

[HMFFL]

So the $10m of salary relief in 12/13 wouldn't interest the team? I respect your opinion but considering Smith was picked nearly in the 20's it seems a bit shortsighted to rule out a pick in the late lotto.

Hopefully if the team really is entertaining offers they get some better ones. In my opinion it's a pretty good offer.

If you want to relieve us of salary you can take Marvin Williams off our hands. Does that interest you? Probably not, which is the same way I feel about Josh Smith, since you're proposal offers us no value, and lowers our chances of improving to a higher seed during next years postseason.

Most of the players from the 04 first round draft are still playing in the NBA, so I view that as a strong draft, but this years draft is considered very weak.

[dms269]

It seems that most offers for Smith are a straight salary dump.

[guaves13]

I guess I just don't see it as a "straight salary dump" when we are giving up our lotto. I bet if it were the Hawk's pick you would see it as alot more valueable. It's ok though, agree to disagree.

[Geaux_Hawks]

Any trade of josh will have to give us a roster fix. Anything involving just salary relief won't help since Joe has such a healthy salary. So we have to make a "win now" move..

[Ruhiel]

Can someone make a thread on what you CAN get for a 6'8 sf/pf.

next to some bigs I'm telling you guys we are close.

Al at 6'10 and a set shooter skills he has a hook shot and contestable fade away in the post. He can defend most power forwards but he is easily smothered in the playoffs.

If Horford were a legit 6'11" and could shoot 3s over people, he'd probably be a hall of Famer, maybe a slow rebounder like Rasheed but more active on offense Rasheed Wallace.
But he's not that big and he's not a hall of Famer or and in 14 years Rasheed a man who was frequently called unaggressive never sunk to the low USG% Al has had.

It's not Al's


Were Horford as athletic or long as Griffin/Amare , he might be able to compensate for his lack of size with leaping ability. But he isn't that athletic, so he has to use positioning and guts to get the job done. Positioning and guts work a lot better against Milwaukee than they do against the Bulls, Knicks, Philadelphia, Miami or Chicago, unfortunately.

Horford has developed a league leading % set shot, shooting the ball mostly on pick and pops ala Boris Diaw on Phoenix or Dirk in Dallas. Horford is not as effective a creator as Dirk by any stretch right now.
His low usage and complimentary more akin to tantalizing Diaw types.
Because of his size, Horford is prone to defenders smothering his shooting pocket something that has plagued him over 39 playoff games. (10ppg)

The truth about Horford hurts because he's the type of kid you want to succeed -- like Shane Battier from Duke or Chuck Hayes of Houston. But unlike those guys, Horford is a center trapped in a smaller man's body and only through massive effort can the much-beloved Hawk overcome his natural deficiencies.
- altered from a certain Draftexpress player

[johnny878]

best player available.

hawks are going to lose out on this trade no matter what more then likely. As smith's impact seems to be much larger then his trade value.

By going soley for need, the hawks will likely further shortchange themselves on the value they are getting back.

[ATL Boy]

I would want to do Josh, Kirk, and future 1st rounder for Bogut, and bad contract. The Bucks get salary relief with Kirks expiring and they let go of a bad contract, and they get Josh, we get our need at center filled. What do you guys think.