Tim Hardaway Jr.

[Rip2137]

BAZE will get paid, THJ will take his place is my guess. As for "winning the trade" that is so short sighted.

YOu better hope Portis doesnt become a monster. WAY too early to tell that yet IMO

How is it any more short sighted than saying we blew the trade earlier this season? And regardless we needed a wing. The real question is if he turns out better than Oubre and RJH. With Scott, Sap, Muscala, Tavares, horford, splitter in the front court there is no way we would have drafted another front court player.

[Jamaaliver]

YOu better hope Portis doesnt become a monster. WAY too early to tell that yet IMO

How is it any more short sighted than saying we blew the trade earlier this season? And regardless we needed a wing. With Scott, Sap, Muscala, Tavares, horford, splitter in the front court there is no way we would have drafted another front court player.

I think...at the time of the draft...Splitter wasn't yet a Hawk. Millsap hadn't yet re-signed. Edy hadn't agreed to come over just yet. It isn't completely unreasonable that we'd draft a high rated PF considering we only had three bigs under contract through 2017 at the time. (M Scott, M Muscala and Horford)

[Jamaaliver]

THJ goes on ESPN's NBA Lockdown Podcast.

begins around the 28:30 minute mark Here

[PandaKidd]

Muscala/Tavares/Scott arent starters and if not selecting a front court player because those guys were under contract = LOL

Portis is putting in good minutes for Chi Town.

Im just saying, trading a 15th pick after you won 60 GAMES for a player you could have gotten for marketdly less doesnt make it a GREAT TRADE because hes had a 10 game really good stretch.

Theres way too many factors to grade that trade.

The number pick we traded. AFTER A 60 win season.
Trading for a guy who was drafted 24th in the ANTHONY BENNET DRAFT for the 15th pick of a pretty decent draft?
We could have had Portis, and some people thought we would go that way because we were losing Pero/Brand, the Splitter Trade had not happened yet. (splitter came over JULY 9th, Draft was June 25th?)

[jayu70]

BAZE will get paid, THJ will take his place is my guess. As for "winning the trade" that is so short sighted.

YOu better hope Portis doesnt become a monster. WAY too early to tell that yet IMO

How is it any more short sighted than saying we blew the trade earlier this season? And regardless we needed a wing. The real question is if he turns out better than Oubre and RJH. With Scott, Sap, Muscala, Tavares, horford, splitter in the front court there is no way we would have drafted another front court player.

I think...at the time of the draft...Splitter wasn't yet a Hawk. Millsap hadn't yet re-signed. Edy hadn't agreed to come over just yet. It isn't completely unreasonable that we'd draft a high rated PF considering we only had three bigs under contract through 2017 at the time. (M Scott, M Muscala and Horford)

I would counter that we didn't have DMC re-signed and an injured 34 year old SG in Kyle. So Bazemore and Thabo were our only wings under contract. If the Hawks figured they could bring only one back and their preference was Millsap over DMC, no need to add a PF.

[PandaKidd]

I want THJ to be a great trade in hindsight, but theres too many unknowns , and I think we could have gotten him for A LOT LESS.

[Jamaaliver]

I think...at the time of the draft...Splitter wasn't yet a Hawk. Millsap hadn't yet re-signed. Edy hadn't agreed to come over just yet. It isn't completely unreasonable that we'd draft a high rated PF considering we only had three bigs under contract through 2017 at the time. (M Scott, M Muscala and Horford)

I would counter that we didn't have DMC re-signed and an injured 34 year old SG in Kyle. So Bazemore and Thabo were our only wings under contract. If the Hawks figured they could bring only one back and their preference was Millsap over DMC, no need to add a PF.

I suppose. I just don't think it's a coincidence that we've drafted big men in the first round of 2 of the last three drafts. The issue is we gave up on them early for various reasons.

I have a hard time believing a GM would pass on a talented young PF because of the likes of Mike Muscala and Mike Scott.

If we pass on Portis and then Millsap leaves in Free Agency...we'd have been screwed at the PF position. But it'd be okay because we got an injured backup SG in THJ? Bazemore and Thabo are at least starting caliber options. Muscala and Mike Scott...not so much.

[PandaKidd]

We were going to address SF/PF in the draft. We knew DMC was leaving, Thabo and Korver COULDNT PLAY. All the talk was us looking for to replace DMC/PM potentially.

[jayu70]

I think...at the time of the draft...Splitter wasn't yet a Hawk. Millsap hadn't yet re-signed. Edy hadn't agreed to come over just yet. It isn't completely unreasonable that we'd draft a high rated PF considering we only had three bigs under contract through 2017 at the time. (M Scott, M Muscala and Horford)

I would counter that we didn't have DMC re-signed and an injured 34 year old SG in Kyle. So Bazemore and Thabo were our only wings under contract. If the Hawks figured they could bring only one back and their preference was Millsap over DMC, no need to add a PF.

I suppose. I just don't think it's a coincidence that we've drafted big men in the first round of 2 of the last three drafts. The issue is we gave up on them early for various reasons.

I have a hard time believing a GM would pass on a talented young PF because of the likes of Mike Muscala and Mike Scott.

If we pass on Portis and then Millsap leaves in Free Agency...we'd have been screwed at the PF position. But it'd be okay because we got an injured backup SG in THJ? Bazemore and Thabo are at least starting caliber options. Muscala and Mike Scott...not so much.

I don't see the coincidence you are referencing...we drafted Dennis along with Bebe, When we drafted Payne we had healthy KK, DMC, Baze and Thabo. The way I see it - it was less about the two Mikes and more about an injured SG in Korver.

[Jamaaliver]

Im just saying, trading a 15th pick after you won 60 GAMES for a player you could have gotten for marketdly less doesnt make it a GREAT TRADE because hes had a 10 game really good stretch.

Trading for a guy who was drafted 24th in the ANTHONY BENNET DRAFT for the 15th pick of a pretty decent draft?

Yeppers. Not to mention that we passed on THJ in the draft...twice.

Then overpaid for him...coming off an injury!!!

I hope this works out. But avg 8 ppg over the last 10 games isn't enough just yet.

[Jamaaliver]

I don't see the coincidence you are referencing...we drafted Dennis along with Bebe, When we drafted Payne we had healthy KK, DMC, Baze and Thabo.

What I'm getting at is simple: We've needed long-term depth and young talent at PF & C for years. It's why we've invested picks in Bebe, Edy and Adreian. We STILL need long-term, young talent and depth at those positions.

It's not too crazy to think that we'd have taken an athletic young big man to man the position long-term. Since we had literally done so in each of the previous two drafts.

[Jamaaliver]

I don't see the coincidence you are referencing...we drafted Dennis along with Bebe, When we drafted Payne we had healthy KK, DMC, Baze and Thabo.

What I'm getting at is simple: We've needed long-term depth and young talent at PF & C for years. It's why we've invested picks in Bebe, Edy and Adreian. We STILL need long-term, young talent and depth at those positions.

It's not too crazy to think that we'd have taken an athletic young big man to play the position long-term. Since we had literally done so in each of the previous two drafts.

[Geaux_Hawks]

The way I see it, THJ was not worth trading the 15th pick and we should have taken either Oubre or Portis at that time. In hindsight, he may rise to a level of play that will make us forget about any prospect we passed on, but at the time of the deal, we simply overpaid.

With that said, it's obvious that we felt it was more of a need to add a young wing over a young PF/C since we traded for THJ. Maybe they knew Sap was re-signing for sure, and looked at Tavares and Moose as good enough prospects instead of taking Portis. Me personally, I wanted Oubre, and felt like we needed some kind of prospect on the wing anyway.

[King Ken]

THJ goes on ESPN's NBA Lockdown Podcast.

begins around the 28:30 minute mark Here

Great post

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[King Ken]

I am happy with the improvement from Tim. It's what I expected

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[Jamaaliver]

The way I see it, THJ was not worth trading the 15th pick...at the time of the deal, we simply overpaid.

With that said, it's obvious that we felt it was more of a need to add a young wing over a young PF/C since we traded for THJ.

Nailed it!

[Rip2137]

If there is nothing you want at the 15 why draft and pay 15 money?

And Jamal...im sorry man but you don't think it's weird that one page ago you were throwing around WOW's and gushing over Obre being kinda decent over 5 games but now want to temper the excitement over Tim's play?

We got Tim and 2 2nd rounders for the 15. I just think it's weird that Portis and Obre putting up similar numbers during their hot streak during the season is more impressive than what Tim is doing...considering Tim is doing it on a winning team.

[Jamaaliver]

I just think it's weird that Portis and Obre putting up similar numbers during their hot streak during the season is more impressive than what Tim is doing...considering Tim is doing it on a winning team.

This is a very fair point. It mainly comes down to expectations and sample size.

We've seen THJ play hundreds of games as a pro, most of those have been inconsistent and a mixed bag.

We've seen THJ play dozens of games AS A HAWK and most have largely been underwhelming. He is trending up, but in the same way DS playing well hasn't convinced you he's a starter because of the larger sample size of erratic play over multiple years...THJ playing well hasn't convinced me just yet because of the larger sample size of erratic play.

Oubre and Portis showed flashes of talent in College and have again shown flashes of talent. There's still much to be desired from them...but thus far their potential seems evident.

Ultimately, I expect more form a veteran with years in the league vs a rookie with only a few months.

[Rip2137]

I would like to refer you to the Joe Johnson thread. What was that comment about talent and good coaching? Hardaway showed more flash as a rookie than Obre or Portis honestly. Then he played for a god awful team and never progressed. He is 3 times the defender already after 6 months here than his progression in New York.

But lets be clear...i am not saying the trade was a win or a loss...its year one. But people were quick to officially stamp the move a bust a few months in cant be the same ones saying "Well lets wait and see" a few months later. That just screams "I really want this move to fail because it supports something I believe."

You have to see that only offering two options on this move, either a failure or too early to tell, while not accepting a "win" vote makes no sense. Not saying that's totally what you are doing, but if you can't grade it a win due to the sample size, you can't grade it a loss either...

[King Ken]

I would like to refer you to the Joe Johnson thread. What was that comment about talent and good coaching? Hardaway showed more flash as a rookie than Obre or Portis honestly. Then he played for a god awful team and never progressed. He is 3 times the defender already after 6 months here than his progression in New York.

But lets be clear...i am not saying the trade was a win or a loss...its year one. But people were quick to officially stamp the move a bust a few months in cant be the same ones saying "Well lets wait and see" a few months later. That just screams "I really want this move to fail because it supports something I believe."

You have to see that only offering two options on this move, either a failure or too early to tell, while not accepting a "win" vote makes no sense. Not saying that's totally what you are doing, but if you can't grade it a win due to the sample size, you can't grade it a loss either...

Hes been a bad defender since high school. This is the first time I've seen him be a competent defensive player but that's what happens when you get that no PT reality check.

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