ImageImage

John Collins

Moderators: HMFFL, dms269, Jamaaliver

jayu70
RealGM
Posts: 10,028
And1: 7,203
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: John Collins 

Post#81 » by jayu70 » Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:46 pm

More of this needed.
Read on Twitter
?s=20
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#82 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Aug 21, 2019 5:50 pm

Atlanta Hawks roundtable: Will either John Collins or Trae Young make the All-Star team?

Image

Toby Adeyemi: I can firmly lock John Collins in for an All-Star selection. He’ll average 20 points and nearly ten rebounds for an improving and very entertaining Hawks team, and his highlight dunks will continue to make him a fan favorite.


Sam Meredith: I believe it will actually be harder for Collins to make it over Young even though Collins is the better player right now. This isn’t to say Collins couldn’t also be an All-Star, but the competition as a big is much tougher.


Andrew Kelly: While I believe Young is another season away from All-Star recognition, I think Collins will make the All-Star team. Per 36 minutes, Collins averaged 23.4 points and 11.7 rebounds on scintillating efficiency. He also tripled his three point attempts and knocked them down at a 35% rate, a very respectable mark for a big. But Collins still has room to grow, particularly as a play-maker and defender. With improvements in those areas, in conjunction with likely elevated playing time, Collins could simply force his way on to the All Star roster, even if the Hawks are outside of playoff contention. In rare company for a second-year big man, Collins is poised to feast in his third NBA season.
Peachtree Hoops
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#83 » by Jamaaliver » Fri Aug 23, 2019 12:11 pm

NBA's Young Role Players Who Can Still Become Stars

The Obvious All-Stars


John Collins, Atlanta Hawks


Collins' production will become more appreciated when the Hawks inevitably win more games. His new floor looks like the 19.5 points and 9.8 rebounds per game he put up last season.

As Trae Young continues to develop and shooters Cam Reddish, Kevin Huerter and De'Andre Hunter build confidence, Collins could have an elite setup passer, space to operate and plenty of touches.

He also took a notable step forward around the perimeter, having made 0.9 threes per game at a 34.8 percent clip. Those numbers seem bound to rise for the 21-year-old budding star.
Bleacher Report

Re-Drafting the 2017 Draft

6. Orlando Magic: John Collins
:sour:

Image

Jonathan Isaac still has exciting two-way potential, but John Collins is too far ahead of him after two seasons for the Orlando Magic not to prefer him at No. 6.

The explosive big man averaged 19.5 points on 56.0 percent shooting and 9.8 rebounds with the Atlanta Hawks last year, and he still has plenty of room to improve as a one-on-one scorer and shooter.

While Nikola Vucevic gives Orlando offensive versatility from the center spot, Collins would bring the power and bounce for easy baskets inside.

Collins has to become a better defender to avoid empty-stat criticism down the road. Regardless, he is a near lock to average a 20-10 double-double in his prime.

Spoiler:
19. Atlanta Hawks: Thomas Bryant

After underachieving through two seasons at Indiana and mostly working in the G League as a rookie, Bryant revived his stock last season in Washington. He averaged 18.2 points and 10.9 rebounds per 36 minutes, and he hit 33 three-pointers and shot 78.1 percent from the free-throw line.
Bleacher Report
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#84 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Sep 18, 2019 4:38 pm

Read on Twitter
jayu70
RealGM
Posts: 10,028
And1: 7,203
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: John Collins 

Post#85 » by jayu70 » Tue Oct 1, 2019 1:25 am

Good for him.
Read on Twitter
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#86 » by Jamaaliver » Thu Oct 3, 2019 11:58 am

The next step of John Collins’ evolution as a player

The mandate that teams must certify all ages and heights for every player on the roster has stung a few of the Hawks this week.

Read on Twitter


For his part, Collins’ lack of height at the power forward position hasn’t limited his offensive abilities in any way, as he nearly averaged 20 points and 10 rebounds per game last season and did so with elite efficiency. His defense is where he has shown limitations in guarding other big men, although he certainly got better toward the end of last season.

Last season, Collins solidified himself as a 3-point shooting threat...This season, his goal is to become more of a playmaking big man where he can grab a rebound and push up court in transition or create looks from the elbow or post. This summer, Collins worked heavily on his ballhandling and dribble work where he would come off screens and hit a pull-up jumper or a 3-pointer. A lot of his time was focused on handling the ball and creating his own shots, which Pierce says he might have to do this season.
The Athletic
hawks_fan25
Sophomore
Posts: 112
And1: 61
Joined: Jan 23, 2019
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#87 » by hawks_fan25 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 12:20 pm

I believe that. He always looks small against the centers in this league. I'm sure many players, though, will measure out shorter than what they are listed as right now. I don't like the idea of him at the center position for any long stretch. I wonder who the last NBA championship was that showcased a center under 6'9".
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#88 » by Jamaaliver » Thu Oct 3, 2019 12:26 pm

hawks_fan25 wrote:I wonder who the last NBA championship was that showcased a center under 6'9".



Image
jayu70
RealGM
Posts: 10,028
And1: 7,203
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: John Collins 

Post#89 » by jayu70 » Thu Oct 3, 2019 4:38 pm

Read on Twitter
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#90 » by Jamaaliver » Thu Oct 17, 2019 5:05 pm

B/R NBA Player Rankings: Top 15 Power Forwards for 2019-20



Image

11. John Collins, Atlanta Hawks

John Collins' offensive game is so much more than rim runs and putbacks. Atlanta has him shooting threes—he hit 49 percent from the corners last year—and he looks more comfortable while making plays with the ball in his hands.

Don't be surprised if he's given more responsibility off the dribble this year. The Hawks seem to be pushing him in the direction of Blake Griffin. He may be tasked with running a few pick-and-rolls.

Atlanta might find out this is an over-extension. That's OK. Collins is still a useful offensive player if he's not jump-starting pick-and-rolls and dribbling into above-the-break triples. His ceiling will be more impacted by what he becomes on the defensive end. As Early Bird Rights' Jeff Siegel said on the Hardwood Knocks podcast (14:23 mark):

"There was like a six-week stretch right after the [All-Star] break until the end of the season, where all of a sudden he was making rotations and being vertical at the rim. All of those basic rim-protection things at the 4, where you're sort of the weak-side shot-blocker, none of those things were in his game for the first year-and-a-half of his NBA career.

Things are starting to turn around, but if he doesn't continue to make massive improvements defensively, there's going to be a real question of whether he is a part of this team's long-term contending future. You can get away with having one bad defender on a high-end, contending playoff team, and that's gonna be Trae Young ... But if you also have to scheme around a bad power forward on defense, that's not going to work long term.”

For now, especially in the Eastern Conference, Collins' combination of pogo-stick offense and floor spacing puts him right at the cusp of being a top-50 player. Without turning into Detroit Pistons Griffin 2.0 or a close-to-average defender, he doesn't have the headway to climb much higher.
Bleacher Report
jayu70
RealGM
Posts: 10,028
And1: 7,203
Joined: Mar 11, 2014
   

Re: John Collins 

Post#91 » by jayu70 » Thu Oct 17, 2019 5:37 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:
B/R NBA Player Rankings: Top 15 Power Forwards for 2019-20



Image

11. John Collins, Atlanta Hawks

John Collins' offensive game is so much more than rim runs and putbacks. Atlanta has him shooting threes—he hit 49 percent from the corners last year—and he looks more comfortable while making plays with the ball in his hands.

Don't be surprised if he's given more responsibility off the dribble this year. The Hawks seem to be pushing him in the direction of Blake Griffin. He may be tasked with running a few pick-and-rolls.

Atlanta might find out this is an over-extension. That's OK. Collins is still a useful offensive player if he's not jump-starting pick-and-rolls and dribbling into above-the-break triples. His ceiling will be more impacted by what he becomes on the defensive end. As Early Bird Rights' Jeff Siegel said on the Hardwood Knocks podcast (14:23 mark):

"There was like a six-week stretch right after the [All-Star] break until the end of the season, where all of a sudden he was making rotations and being vertical at the rim. All of those basic rim-protection things at the 4, where you're sort of the weak-side shot-blocker, none of those things were in his game for the first year-and-a-half of his NBA career.

Things are starting to turn around, but if he doesn't continue to make massive improvements defensively, there's going to be a real question of whether he is a part of this team's long-term contending future. You can get away with having one bad defender on a high-end, contending playoff team, and that's gonna be Trae Young ... But if you also have to scheme around a bad power forward on defense, that's not going to work long term.”

For now, especially in the Eastern Conference, Collins' combination of pogo-stick offense and floor spacing puts him right at the cusp of being a top-50 player. Without turning into Detroit Pistons Griffin 2.0 or a close-to-average defender, he doesn't have the headway to climb much higher.
Bleacher Report

Like this
Read on Twitter
?s=20
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#92 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Oct 23, 2019 4:53 pm

kg01 wrote:I mean, championship teams aren't cheap. We can't worry about having to pay our guys. That's the cost of doing bidness.


Apropos of that...


John Collins has long-range hopes for future with Hawks

Image

John Collins saw the four-year, $130 million max extension the Toronto Raptors gave Pascal Siakam days ago and his eyes widened.

“That’s definitely motivation for me to keep staying in the gym,” Collins said. “I’ve heard a lot of people compare our games to each other...that is definitely a contract path that I’m trying to work towards.”

When looking at the offensive numbers for Collins and Siakam last year, they are pretty close. The main difference between the two is on the defensive end of the floor. Last season, Collins rated as a below-average defender, according to Synergy, while Siakam was rated as an excellent defender.

Five NBA agents were asked what they thought Collins could command when it is time for an extension, and the numbers ranged from $80 million to $110 million for four years. All five noted Collins is an exceptional offensive player who still has room to grow on that end, but each of them expressed some worry about what he has shown on defense.

“If he doesn’t show some sort of defensive improvement this year, I personally wouldn’t give him more than $80 million if I was the Hawks,” one agent said.
The Athletic
kg01
Lead Assistant
Posts: 5,753
And1: 7,385
Joined: Jun 28, 2017
 

Re: John Collins 

Post#93 » by kg01 » Wed Oct 23, 2019 5:27 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:
kg01 wrote:I mean, championship teams aren't cheap. We can't worry about having to pay our guys. That's the cost of doing bidness.


Apropos of that...

John Collins has long-range hopes for future with Hawks

Image

John Collins saw the four-year, $130 million max extension the Toronto Raptors gave Pascal Siakam days ago and his eyes widened.

“That’s definitely motivation for me to keep staying in the gym,” Collins said. “I’ve heard a lot of people compare our games to each other...that is definitely a contract path that I’m trying to work towards.”

When looking at the offensive numbers for Collins and Siakam last year, they are pretty close. The main difference between the two is on the defensive end of the floor. Last season, Collins rated as a below-average defender, according to Synergy, while Siakam was rated as an excellent defender.

Five NBA agents were asked what they thought Collins could command when it is time for an extension, and the numbers ranged from $80 million to $110 million for four years. All five noted Collins is an exceptional offensive player who still has room to grow on that end, but each of them expressed some worry about what he has shown on defense.

“If he doesn’t show some sort of defensive improvement this year, I personally wouldn’t give him more than $80 million if I was the Hawks,” one agent said.
The Athletic


All I read was, "yeah kg, you're right again." :)

Based on what dudes are paid nowadays, I can't argue JColl doesn't deserve a 9-figure deal. Friggin old-arse Buddy Hield almost got that off his one good year.
king01 :king:
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#94 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Oct 23, 2019 7:16 pm

For rising star John Collins and Hawks, the possibilities are endless: 'It's all coming together very nicely'

On the team of the future, the 22-year-old big man is trying to stay present

Image

Within moments of meeting him, it is obvious why Collins elicits [so much] praise. He is the kind of guy who self-edits when he curses in the middle of a sentence about the beauty of unanticipated challenges. He delivers veteran wisdom so nonchalantly that it's easy to forget he isn't one. He turned 22 just a month ago, and he is entering his third year in the NBA.

Collins and the Hawks are favorites of the NBA intelligentsia. People tell him "all the time" that they like watching his team play, he says. Pierce says Trae Young and Collins are "the best guard-big tandem in the league." Collins likes that their wings -- Kevin Huerter, 21; De'Andre Hunter, 21; Cam Reddish, 20 -- complement the pick-and-roll duo, saying that "it's all coming together very nicely."

Last week, [CBS Sports] published a story about how the Hawks could put themselves in position to land a superstar in 2021, which, like the feature I wrote in July, is squarely in the team of the future genre. On consecutive days last December, SB Nation and Vice published features about Collins' rise, both of which are in the rising star genre. This one is, too.

Collins' cachet among diehards, though, stands in stark contrast to his lack of name recognition among "casuals," as he calls them, who never watched him play at Wake Forest and haven't been tuning in to see the team that has gone 53-111 since drafting him No. 19 in 2017. There is tension, too, between the kind of player he could be and the one he is right now.

Spoiler:
Pierce is "always talking to me about my position on the team and me being a leader," Collins says. Pierce tells me he'd be happy with Collins duplicating last year's production, but wants to see him expand his game. He might not be under the same type of pressure as a top-three pick, but there are expectations.

As a rookie, Collins was essentially just a roller and a lob threat. Last season was the first time in his life that he'd been called a stretch 4. Now, he says, "I hear a lot of people say or tell me I might be a 3 one day."

Collins has not shied away from vocalizing his ambition. He wants to be on the same level as LeBron James, Giannis Antetokounmpo, Kevin Durant and Paul George -- megastars who are around the same height as him and have liberated tall kids from the idea that they have to play in the post.

"The way the league is going, versatility-wise, people want everybody to do everything," Collins says. "And I want to be that guy. That seems fun to me."

Pierce is challenging him to make quick reads, facilitate for others from the elbow and defend all over the court. As a core part of a future-focused team, Collins has the luxury of being able to experiment and play through mistakes. In time, he might become more than just a better version of himself: a do-it-all-on-both-ends type, unrecognizable from the player he was when he entered the league. More likely, he will land somewhere in between.

"He's great setting screens and rolling, he's great around the basket, offensive rebounding and for drop-offs," Pierce says. "He's learning how to play with his face-up [game], catch-and-shoot 3s, catch-and-attack downhill, eventually rebound and push."

The NBA has a way of testing your patience. During our interview, Collins realizes that he has accidentally missed the first bus to the team hotel. I note the irony that this "franchise pillar" has been left behind. "It's OK," he says, and he requests an Uber. The driver never makes it to Collins, so he must adjust his game plan again. He walks.
CBS Sports
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#95 » by Jamaaliver » Tue Nov 5, 2019 5:53 pm

Read on Twitter


So, a couple of thoughts:

This is obviously a bad look for John. Whether intentionally or not, his image will take a bit of a hit. He's still the same productive player/good kid he was days ago, but his stock and reputation are clearly worse off today than yesterday.

And this actually might benefit the team a bit in the long run...Collins has missed a note worthy amount of time each fall he's been in the league. As a rookie, he missed a couple of weeks with a shoulder injury. In his second season, he began the year on the injured list due to an ankle issue.

Now, with likely more weeks on the shelf due to the drug suspension, this has to give the Front office the upper hand in negotiating his rookie contract extension. He was always a questionable choice for a max extension, but with so many games missed in 3 years plus the stench of a drug suspension in the most recently* completed season -- the team could benefit and get him on a value deal.

He could always bet on himself and turn down an offer, but he's stated publicly how he wants to be here long term:

Spoiler:
John Collins wrote:I want to be here as long as they want to keep me here. I feel like they have put their best foot forward so far in reiterating that to me. They’ve done their best with welcoming me into the organization. The city has as well. I just want to be somewhere where I’m wanted, and if everything falls into place, which I’m hoping it is, and with the way things are projecting for me, I want to be an Atlanta Hawk for life, if possible. We obviously have to see how the cards play out, but I definitely want to be in Atlanta for as long as I can. That is definitely a fact.
October 2019 -- The Athletic




Just a crackpot theory from a guy who's negotiated a contract or two in his life.
User avatar
Jamaaliver
Forum Mod - Hawks
Forum Mod - Hawks
Posts: 23,318
And1: 8,361
Joined: Sep 22, 2005
Location: Officially a citizen of the World...
Contact:
     

Re: John Collins 

Post#96 » by Jamaaliver » Mon Dec 30, 2019 1:01 pm

Read on Twitter

Return to Atlanta Hawks