Collins reminds me of....

[CoachD]

Hey guys - life long Raptor fan here.

I have to tell you, I love John Collins. You guys have a fantastic piece there. I don't know if this comparison has been made or not... but wow, the more I watch Collins, the more he reminds me of pre-Miami Chris Bosh.

If you compare their 2nd years in the league, Collins appears to be a little further ahead offensively, and of course has that 3 point shot which wasn't one of Bosh's weapons at all at that point.

I think Bosh in his second year was a little further ahead defensively - but big, lean, athletic, quick forwards that have a really nice jumper and can finish inside while absorbing contact ... wow. Collins is special! Don't let him go team up with his buddies in South Beach!

I think as soon as next season you guys will be making noise in the playoffs again.

Enjoy the ride.

[Atlanta Hawk Fan]

Thanks, CoachD. We definitely love Collins across the board in the Hawks fan base. There have been comparisons to Bosh and I think your comments are generally on point for where Collins is ahead and behind. Just a fantastic pick by Schlenk and emerging stud that gives us a lot of hope for the future.

[peoriabird]

Collins has to round his game out...very good to excellent in a few areas but not good at all in others. Collins is a very efficient scorer around the basket and a tenacious rebounder. Shooting is much improved and may project to be a good 3 point and free throw shooter. But not good defensively. Doesn't block shots anymore...doesn't get steals and gets lost in coverage a lot. If he can fix his defensive issues which I know he can, He'll be an all star!

[King Ken]

Bosh was better honestly. But Collins is better at movement. Much better. But Bosh was better. He had actually skill with the ball and his defense and his length helped him a lot. Bosh was better in his 2nd year. Sadly, Bosh never had the personnel on Toronto.

[atlantabbq99]

He reminds me of Amare. I wish he can turn into Shawn Kemp, but Collin's lack of defense is more in the tier of Amare.

He also reminds me of Boozer but with better hops.

[CoachD]

He reminds me of Amare. I wish he can turn into Shawn Kemp, but Collin's lack of defense is more in the tier of Amare.

He also reminds me of Boozer but with better hops.

I don't see Amar'e or Kemp in Collins.
They were pure power guys, that had a short jumper (Kemp more than Amar'e).

Bosh was one of the smoothest moving 4s I ever saw live. Off the bounce, or on the block he was essentially un-guardable.
I don't know that Collins has that type of post game at this stage - please tell me if I'm wrong. Bosh's post game at that age was very advanced with multiple moves going each way from either block.

I do see Collins having that same silky movement and ability curl in from the dunker spot when Trae or another guard penetrates. That is the en vogue way to use bigs in the NBA today, but it isn't the way you FEATURE a big. That's the role for a Capella, or Nurkic or guy like that - and I think Collins can be much, much better.

I'm not sure how good a passer Collins is right now. I don't see your team utilizing him a lot in that role. His assist to turnover ratio for a big is pretty bad. That may be in part due to how he's being used or his teammates around him... but it's certainly an area to monitor.

[Jamaaliver]

Bosh was one of the smoothest moving 4s I ever saw live. Off the bounce, or on the block he was essentially un-guardable.
I don't know that Collins has that type of post game at this stage - please tell me if I'm wrong. Bosh's post game at that age was very advanced with multiple moves going each way from either block.

I could listen to you analyze opposing players all day.




Also, no. Collins had an effective post game in college. But it has not translated here in the pros.

[kg01]

Bosh was one of the smoothest moving 4s I ever saw live. Off the bounce, or on the block he was essentially un-guardable.
I don't know that Collins has that type of post game at this stage - please tell me if I'm wrong. Bosh's post game at that age was very advanced with multiple moves going each way from either block.

I could listen to you analyze opposing players all day.

Also, no. Collins had an effective post game in college. But it has not translated here in the pros.

Naah ... that's not weird at all, @jamallli. Tell us more.

Also, I don't think it's totally accurate to say his postgame hasn't "translated". It seems more like they've asked him to do other things. When he's had a guy on the block, his postgame still seems to be there

[CoachD]

Bosh was one of the smoothest moving 4s I ever saw live. Off the bounce, or on the block he was essentially un-guardable.
I don't know that Collins has that type of post game at this stage - please tell me if I'm wrong. Bosh's post game at that age was very advanced with multiple moves going each way from either block.

I could listen to you analyze opposing players all day.

Also, no. Collins had an effective post game in college. But it has not translated here in the pros.

Naah ... that's not weird at all, @jamallli. Tell us more.

Also, I don't think it's totally accurate to say his postgame hasn't "translated". It seems more like they've asked him to do other things. When he's had a guy on the block, his postgame still seems to be there

With his length and quickness, If he developed 3 or 4 go-to moves from both sides, and the Hawks featured him on the block 7 or 8 times per game, he would be averaging 22-24 PPG IMO.

[King Ken]

Collins reminds me of no one. He has top tier agility and quickness for his position. Elite motor, coordination and hands. Great awareness on offense, great rebounding instincts and has a great first and 2nd jump. Great feel for the game and has a strong will to win. Defensively, he has a tremendous motor but the rest is a work in progress. The game is slowing down for him defensively and we see that in his recent success.

His ball handling hinders his creating offensively but his court vision is not half bad.

I could see him adding 2-3 go to moves long term but with his style of play, I don't know if it is needed

[Jamaaliver]

With his length and quickness, If he developed 3 or 4 go-to moves from both sides, and the Hawks featured him on the block 7 or 8 times per game, he would be averaging 22-24 PPG IMO.

100% agree.

Sadly, our new scheme (and even previous one) largely de-emphasizes post ups -- initiating offense from the elbow in DHOs or on the perimeter in the PnR instead.

[CoachD]

Collins reminds me of no one. He has top tier agility and quickness for his position. Elite motor, coordination and hands. Great awareness on offense, great rebounding instincts and has a great first and 2nd jump. Great feel for the game and has a strong will to win. Defensively, he has a tremendous motor but the rest is a work in progress. The game is slowing down for him defensively and we see that in his recent success.

...and how is that NOT like Chris Bosh?

[King Ken]

Collins reminds me of no one. He has top tier agility and quickness for his position. Elite motor, coordination and hands. Great awareness on offense, great rebounding instincts and has a great first and 2nd jump. Great feel for the game and has a strong will to win. Defensively, he has a tremendous motor but the rest is a work in progress. The game is slowing down for him defensively and we see that in his recent success.

...and how is that NOT like Chris Bosh?

Just isn't. Bosh had face up skill even out of GT. Bosh had Bosh better length, 7-4 compared to Collins 6-11 wingspan. Bosh was more faceup based. Collins is movement based. We run no plays ever for Collins. Toronto used to run that Calderon pin down to moving to the top of the key to Bosh on the block to use his quickness and agility to score.....


That is like John. Damn, I just remember a lot of face ups with Bosh in Toronto early on. John for the most part has no handles so it's back to the basket, all day

[CoachD]

Collins reminds me of no one. He has top tier agility and quickness for his position. Elite motor, coordination and hands. Great awareness on offense, great rebounding instincts and has a great first and 2nd jump. Great feel for the game and has a strong will to win. Defensively, he has a tremendous motor but the rest is a work in progress. The game is slowing down for him defensively and we see that in his recent success.

...and how is that NOT like Chris Bosh?

Just isn't. Bosh had face up skill even out of GT. Bosh had Bosh better length, 7-4 compared to Collins 6-11 wingspan. Bosh was more faceup based. Collins is movement based. We run no plays ever for Collins. Toronto used to run that Calderon pin down to moving to the top of the key to Bosh on the block to use his quickness and agility to score.....


That is like John. Damn, I just remember a lot of face ups with Bosh in Toronto early on. John for the most part has no handles so it's back to the basket, all day

Calderon wasn't even in the NBA at that point bro.

They had Vince (for part of Bosh's second season), and TJ Ford and others. They'd run bosh off little curls where he'd catch an elbow screen and nobody caught up with him. It wasn't until his 3rd year when he became an all star that he started to REALLY throw in his back to the basket game. He did score on face ups, but most were 1 dribble or no dribble from the mid post or turn arounds from the block

[King Ken]

...and how is that NOT like Chris Bosh?

Just isn't. Bosh had face up skill even out of GT. Bosh had Bosh better length, 7-4 compared to Collins 6-11 wingspan. Bosh was more faceup based. Collins is movement based. We run no plays ever for Collins. Toronto used to run that Calderon pin down to moving to the top of the key to Bosh on the block to use his quickness and agility to score.....


That is like John. Damn, I just remember a lot of face ups with Bosh in Toronto early on. John for the most part has no handles so it's back to the basket, all day

Calderon wasn't even in the NBA at that point bro.

They had Vince (for part of Bosh's second season), and TJ Ford and others. They'd run bosh off little curls where he'd catch an elbow screen and nobody caught up with him. It wasn't until his 3rd year when he became an all star that he started to REALLY throw in his back to the basket game. He did score on face ups, but most were 1 dribble or no dribble from the mid post or turn arounds from the block

You are right about that. The T.J. Ford era. T.J. was a menace at times. That was the season, the VC final T-Dot season.
I used to go to a lot of the games but damn that was awhile ago. This is Josh Smith rookie year. The 13 win Hawks season

[Spud2nique]

I’m gonna go with uncle Cliff Robinson, the much underrated long time Blazer! Nimble big man that was versatile inside and out like our own JC.

https://youtu.be/MfIb1jrH8mU

And here against us!

https://youtu.be/ohEDD1Hx49A


Ps He liked ganja like kg!

[CoachD]

Just isn't. Bosh had face up skill even out of GT. Bosh had Bosh better length, 7-4 compared to Collins 6-11 wingspan. Bosh was more faceup based. Collins is movement based. We run no plays ever for Collins. Toronto used to run that Calderon pin down to moving to the top of the key to Bosh on the block to use his quickness and agility to score.....


That is like John. Damn, I just remember a lot of face ups with Bosh in Toronto early on. John for the most part has no handles so it's back to the basket, all day

Calderon wasn't even in the NBA at that point bro.

They had Vince (for part of Bosh's second season), and TJ Ford and others. They'd run bosh off little curls where he'd catch an elbow screen and nobody caught up with him. It wasn't until his 3rd year when he became an all star that he started to REALLY throw in his back to the basket game. He did score on face ups, but most were 1 dribble or no dribble from the mid post or turn arounds from the block

You are right about that. The T.J. Ford era. T.J. was a menace at times. That was the season, the VC final T-Dot season.
I used to go to a lot of the games but damn that was awhile ago. This is Josh Smith rookie year. The 13 win Hawks season

Yup. That was the year I wanted to KILL Al Horford for taking Ford's head off at a game and essentially ending his career.

[Ball4life32]

And what’s crazy is Collins is doing all of this in literally only 30 minutes per game. 20/10/2 in 30 minutes! Imagine when he starts playing 36-38 MPG to go along with his improvements/experience.

[jayu70]

And what’s crazy is Collins is doing all of this in literally only 30 minutes per game. 20/10/2 in 30 minutes! Imagine when he starts playing 36-38 MPG to go along with his improvements/experience.

I wonder if Pierce is still not running plays for John?

[King Ken]

Calderon wasn't even in the NBA at that point bro.

They had Vince (for part of Bosh's second season), and TJ Ford and others. They'd run bosh off little curls where he'd catch an elbow screen and nobody caught up with him. It wasn't until his 3rd year when he became an all star that he started to REALLY throw in his back to the basket game. He did score on face ups, but most were 1 dribble or no dribble from the mid post or turn arounds from the block

You are right about that. The T.J. Ford era. T.J. was a menace at times. That was the season, the VC final T-Dot season.
I used to go to a lot of the games but damn that was awhile ago. This is Josh Smith rookie year. The 13 win Hawks season

Yup. That was the year I wanted to KILL Al Horford for taking Ford's head off at a game and essentially ending his career.

That was Bosh 3rd season when T.J. got bodied.

That said, Toronto and Atlanta had a strange series. Remember our timekeeper, lol!