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LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core

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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#41 » by jayu70 » Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:49 am

https://clutchpoints.com/hawks-news-lloyd-pierce-optimistic-about-cam-reddish-despite-slow-start/

Despite his struggles, Hawks coach Lloyd Pierce isn’t counting out Reddish just yet, believing he will soon find his footing as the season progresses.

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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#42 » by Jamaaliver » Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:25 pm

jayu70 wrote:
Despite his struggles, Hawks coach Lloyd Pierce isn’t counting out Reddish just yet, believing he will soon find his footing as the season progresses.

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Glad the coach is publicly defending the kid.

But i hate that he's been forced into a role he clearly isn't ready for.

Putting on muscle and finding a niche right now are likely the most beneficial things for him. Playing him like 76ers play Thybulle seems like a solid plan. Occasional spot starts when necessary, but mostly just a 3 & D guy off the bench in limited minutes.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#43 » by jayu70 » Thu Oct 31, 2019 12:56 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:
jayu70 wrote:
Despite his struggles, Hawks coach Lloyd Pierce isn’t counting out Reddish just yet, believing he will soon find his footing as the season progresses.

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Glad the coach is publicly defending the kid.

But i hate that he's been forced into a role he clearly isn't ready for.

Putting on muscle and finding a niche right now are likely the most beneficial things for him. Playing him like 76ers play Thybulle seems like a solid plan. Occasional spot starts when necessary, but mostly just a 3 & D guy off the bench in limited minutes.

Unforeseen circumstances with the Huerter injury, Turner with sore achilles, Crabbe MIA, now Trae out.
Before the season started, Pierce did indicate he wasn't clear what his role would be in the offense since he was coming off the surgery and he hadn't been playing.
Unfortunately, we don't have the luxury of just playing him the way Philly is asking of Thybulle, very different team dynamics.

He's learning on the fly and the hope is he doesn't fold under the pressure. For the record I don't think he has - he was effective running the PnR when Trae went down, he has an off dribble pullup 2ptr that's working, his 3pt shooting is non existent, well arse, but it hasn't affected other aspects of his game particularly his defense especially when you consider with young players if their offense isn't clicking they give up on defense.

It's still a development season for this team.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#44 » by jayu70 » Sat Nov 2, 2019 1:57 pm

Meanwhile....
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#45 » by Jamaaliver » Fri Nov 22, 2019 5:56 am

Every NBA Team's Biggest Question Mark

Atlanta Hawks: How Long a Leash Do the Young Guys Get?

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Despite their record, the Atlanta Hawks might be ready to win now due to the play of Trae Young. The second-year point guard is locked in, averaging 27.0 points and 8.7 assists with a 24.4 player efficiency rating (PER), which ranks 13th in the NBA.

At the risk of piling unnecessary pressure on young players, Young's success begs the question: How much longer can head coach Lloyd Pierce keep starting De'Andre Hunter and Cam Reddish?

Given Atlanta's rebuilding status, it makes sense to play the two first-round picks a lot. But Hunter and Reddish haven't just been bad; they've been atrocious. They're both shooting below 40 percent from the field. Reddish is even shooting an abysmal 27.0 percent from the field and 18.8 percent from three while averaging nearly two turnovers per game.

Obviously, they should play non-garbage-time minutes no matter what this year.

But once John Collins returns from his 25-game suspension, Atlanta will have a ready-made starting five of Young, Kevin Huerter, DeAndre' Bembry, Jabari Parker and Collins. It could try to make the playoffs with that group unless Hunter and Reddish improve drastically.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#46 » by Jamaaliver » Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:10 pm

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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#47 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Dec 18, 2019 3:16 am

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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#48 » by Jamaaliver » Tue Dec 24, 2019 6:07 pm

I see a sliver of hope amidst a lost season...

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WE just need a defensive anchor at Center...
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#49 » by jayu70 » Tue Dec 24, 2019 6:16 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:I see a sliver of hope amidst a lost season...

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WE just need a defensive anchor at Center...

Just need a better defensive effort though.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#50 » by jayu70 » Tue Dec 31, 2019 10:18 pm

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"We don't have a quote-unquote natural backup point guard on our roster," Pierce said. "Trae is our point guard, and then we've done it by committee. That's a position that we talked about last year with Kevin: getting him the ball a little more and allowing him to play that backup point spot."


Give Goodwin a shot as the backup PG.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#51 » by Jamaaliver » Sun Jan 5, 2020 7:20 pm

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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#52 » by jayu70 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 2:00 pm

LP sees the big picture, but TS micalculated the importance of having the right veteran presence not just on the court but in the locker room

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One source told The Athletic’s Shams Charania that the mood inside the Hawks’ locker room is “depressing.” There are just too many soft-spoken players on the team this season to lighten the mood during an 8-32 start. Coach Lloyd Pierce has been trying to get the younger players to speak up with little success. After the team’s shootaround on Friday in Washington, Pierce had De’Andre Hunter break the huddle once practice was over. His breakdown was so quiet that the other players jokingly laughed that they couldn’t hear him.........“No matter if we were winning or losing, they would still be soft spoken,” Kevin Huerter said. “Last year, we had more dominant and louder personalities. Even when we were losing, there were still a lot of funny stories because of their personalities.
“You always need voices in the locker room. You need guys saying the right things. You don’t just want to bring in a loud guy just to bring in a loud guy. That’s been something that Lloyd has been trying to bring out in a lot of us, including myself, John (Collins) and Alex (Len) — guys who have been here. We just need to be louder, especially with the way things are going. We need to have those voices.”


What does Prince think of the job Pierce has done in his two seasons with Atlanta?
“I think the situation he was put in from the beginning was tough,” Prince said. “Credit to him though because I think he did a great job of continuing to have us play hard and he tried to put us in the best position to win under the circumstances he had. This is his first job. As a rookie, I didn’t know anything. It took me a while to figure it out. I’m sure he’s thinking the same thing of how he can progress every day.”

The Hawks entered this season hoping Young was going to be their leader...... There have been points when the message Young has voiced hasn’t been well-received because he didn’t articulate it as well as he could have. .... he’s 21. After last season, Young credited Anderson as one of the players who helped the most as he navigated his rookie campaign. The two have remained close friends since. Anderson believes Young should be an All-Star and should not be punished for what some people have called “empty stats.” Anderson’s presence was overlooked in the Hawks’ locker room because he didn’t play much, but he was a key voice that was widely respected by his teammates. When he was told about the lack of veteran presence in the locker room, he smirked and pointed up to his name on his locker and said Dedmon had that huge voice. Kent Bazemore had a huge voice. Jeremy Lin’s wasn’t a loud voice but his was respected when he spoke up.

The Hawks weren’t constructed to win. Schlenk told The Athletic that the analytics department projected 30-31 wins before the season......It’s no secret that the Hawks are going to continue to lose many more games with the goal of growing their youngest players. That’s why they’ve played a starting lineup of Young, Huerter, Reddish, Hunter and Collins lately. But they also have to figure out how to keep a locker room from souring to the point of no return. Cam Reddish, I let him know after the game that they kind of win depending on how good he plays. He can be that X-factor. Him being aggressive, Trae being aggressive, (Bembry) bringing whatever it takes, De’Andre Hunter bringing what he does, the bigs doing what they do — I think they can be a great team.”

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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#53 » by kg01 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 2:07 pm

jayu70 wrote:LP sees the big picture, but TS micalculated the importance of having the right veteran presence not just on the court but in the locker room

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One source told The Athletic’s Shams Charania that the mood inside the Hawks’ locker room is “depressing.” There are just too many soft-spoken players on the team this season to lighten the mood during an 8-32 start. Coach Lloyd Pierce has been trying to get the younger players to speak up with little success. After the team’s shootaround on Friday in Washington, Pierce had De’Andre Hunter break the huddle once practice was over. His breakdown was so quiet that the other players jokingly laughed that they couldn’t hear him.........“No matter if we were winning or losing, they would still be soft spoken,” Kevin Huerter said. “Last year, we had more dominant and louder personalities. Even when we were losing, there were still a lot of funny stories because of their personalities.
“You always need voices in the locker room. You need guys saying the right things. You don’t just want to bring in a loud guy just to bring in a loud guy. That’s been something that Lloyd has been trying to bring out in a lot of us, including myself, John (Collins) and Alex (Len) — guys who have been here. We just need to be louder, especially with the way things are going. We need to have those voices.”


What does Prince think of the job Pierce has done in his two seasons with Atlanta?
“I think the situation he was put in from the beginning was tough,” Prince said. “Credit to him though because I think he did a great job of continuing to have us play hard and he tried to put us in the best position to win under the circumstances he had. This is his first job. As a rookie, I didn’t know anything. It took me a while to figure it out. I’m sure he’s thinking the same thing of how he can progress every day.”

The Hawks entered this season hoping Young was going to be their leader...... There have been points when the message Young has voiced hasn’t been well-received because he didn’t articulate it as well as he could have. .... he’s 21. After last season, Young credited Anderson as one of the players who helped the most as he navigated his rookie campaign. The two have remained close friends since. Anderson believes Young should be an All-Star and should not be punished for what some people have called “empty stats.” Anderson’s presence was overlooked in the Hawks’ locker room because he didn’t play much, but he was a key voice that was widely respected by his teammates. When he was told about the lack of veteran presence in the locker room, he smirked and pointed up to his name on his locker and said Dedmon had that huge voice. Kent Bazemore had a huge voice. Jeremy Lin’s wasn’t a loud voice but his was respected when he spoke up.

The Hawks weren’t constructed to win. Schlenk told The Athletic that the analytics department projected 30-31 wins before the season......It’s no secret that the Hawks are going to continue to lose many more games with the goal of growing their youngest players. That’s why they’ve played a starting lineup of Young, Huerter, Reddish, Hunter and Collins lately. But they also have to figure out how to keep a locker room from souring to the point of no return. Cam Reddish, I let him know after the game that they kind of win depending on how good he plays. He can be that X-factor. Him being aggressive, Trae being aggressive, (Bembry) bringing whatever it takes, De’Andre Hunter bringing what he does, the bigs doing what they do — I think they can be a great team.”

0


Yeah, TS fumbled this offseason all kinds a-ways. Should've paid Deadman. Shouldn'tve let Crabbe, Turner, Parsons, or Turner (did I mention Turner) anywhere near this team.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#54 » by tbhawksfan1 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 2:53 pm

I disagree that TS messed it up. He is all in on the rebuild. Winning games in a 20-25 win season is not the best strategy. Getting another top 5 pick is. Also likely to get Nets pick at 15-17. That pick came from a win later move to get more FUTURE assets. Only Reason Crabbe and Parsons are on this team was to get FUTURE win assets.

This season is not going to do irrepairable damage to the Hawks Young guys. Next year will be better. Future should be the best Atlanta Hawks teams ever
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#55 » by jayu70 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 3:52 pm

tbhawksfan1 wrote:I disagree that TS messed it up. He is all in on the rebuild. Winning games in a 20-25 win season is not the best strategy. Getting another top 5 pick is. Also likely to get Nets pick at 15-17. That pick came from a win later move to get more FUTURE assets. Only Reason Crabbe and Parsons are on this team was to get FUTURE win assets.

This season is not going to do irrepairable damage to the Hawks Young guys. Next year will be better. Future should be the best Atlanta Hawks teams ever

My concern isn't the win total. It's 2 things - 1. the locker room (which apparently Turner and Crabbe were causing the ruckus) and 2. The expectation was for our vets to give us some court value to help the development of the young guys (not Parsons cause I didn't think he'd play and we didn't get squat for taking that deal, we still have the open roster spot we got by trading Plumlee and Hill). When a young player is struggling, LP should be able to call on a vet to show them the way even for a little.
We also didn't get squat from our backup PG Evan Turner. I'd rather have Baze and his gaze.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#56 » by tbhawksfan1 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:34 pm

jayu70 wrote:
tbhawksfan1 wrote:I disagree that TS messed it up. He is all in on the rebuild. Winning games in a 20-25 win season is not the best strategy. Getting another top 5 pick is. Also likely to get Nets pick at 15-17. That pick came from a win later move to get more FUTURE assets. Only Reason Crabbe and Parsons are on this team was to get FUTURE win assets.

This season is not going to do irrepairable damage to the Hawks Young guys. Next year will be better. Future should be the best Atlanta Hawks teams ever

My concern isn't the win total. It's 2 things - 1. the locker room (which apparently Turner and Crabbe were causing the ruckus) and 2. The expectation was for our vets to give us some court value to help the development of the young guys (not Parsons cause I didn't think he'd play and we didn't get squat for taking that deal, we still have the open roster spot we got by trading Plumlee and Hill). When a young player is struggling, LP should be able to call on a vet to show them the way even for a little.
We also didn't get squat from our backup PG Evan Turner. I'd rather have Baze and his gaze.


Yeah, but he didn't sign these vets to play. He brought them in for assets. Except Turner which isn't looking good, but we needed a back up PG, not a wing to take mins from Heurt/Hunter/Cam.

For the rest, as I said, TS absolutly knew this was a tank year with Nothing but development and high pick in mind
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#57 » by jayu70 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:08 pm

tbhawksfan1 wrote:
jayu70 wrote:
tbhawksfan1 wrote:I disagree that TS messed it up. He is all in on the rebuild. Winning games in a 20-25 win season is not the best strategy. Getting another top 5 pick is. Also likely to get Nets pick at 15-17. That pick came from a win later move to get more FUTURE assets. Only Reason Crabbe and Parsons are on this team was to get FUTURE win assets.

This season is not going to do irrepairable damage to the Hawks Young guys. Next year will be better. Future should be the best Atlanta Hawks teams ever

My concern isn't the win total. It's 2 things - 1. the locker room (which apparently Turner and Crabbe were causing the ruckus) and 2. The expectation was for our vets to give us some court value to help the development of the young guys (not Parsons cause I didn't think he'd play and we didn't get squat for taking that deal, we still have the open roster spot we got by trading Plumlee and Hill). When a young player is struggling, LP should be able to call on a vet to show them the way even for a little.
We also didn't get squat from our backup PG Evan Turner. I'd rather have Baze and his gaze.


Yeah, but he didn't sign these vets to play. He brought them in for assets. Except Turner which isn't looking good, but we needed a back up PG, not a wing to take mins from Heurt/Hunter/Cam.

For the rest, as I said, TS absolutly knew this was a tank year with Nothing but development and high pick in mind

When the Crabbe trade occurred, yes it was mostly for the picks. However, there was a rumor that Crabbe would request a buyout, Hawks didn't want that since they saw him as a viable 3 point shooter that would play, he's 27 year old by the way (4 years younger that Turner and Parson) His injuries have severely limited him. So only Parson wasn't expected to not play.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#58 » by tbhawksfan1 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:18 pm

jayu70 wrote:
tbhawksfan1 wrote:
jayu70 wrote:My concern isn't the win total. It's 2 things - 1. the locker room (which apparently Turner and Crabbe were causing the ruckus) and 2. The expectation was for our vets to give us some court value to help the development of the young guys (not Parsons cause I didn't think he'd play and we didn't get squat for taking that deal, we still have the open roster spot we got by trading Plumlee and Hill). When a young player is struggling, LP should be able to call on a vet to show them the way even for a little.
We also didn't get squat from our backup PG Evan Turner. I'd rather have Baze and his gaze.


Yeah, but he didn't sign these vets to play. He brought them in for assets. Except Turner which isn't looking good, but we needed a back up PG, not a wing to take mins from Heurt/Hunter/Cam.

For the rest, as I said, TS absolutly knew this was a tank year with Nothing but development and high pick in mind

When the Crabbe trade occurred, yes it was mostly for the picks. However, there was a rumor that Crabbe would request a buyout, Hawks didn't want that since they saw him as a viable 3 point shooter that would play, he's 27 year old by the way (4 years younger that Turner and Parson) His injuries have severely limited him. So only Parson wasn't expected to not play.


Yeah. I guess TS probably expected to get a bit more out of them, but at the end of the day, I Don't think there's any diff between 20 or 28 wins this season. Only problem for me is these useless vets making waves
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#59 » by tbhawksfan1 » Tue Jan 14, 2020 6:28 pm

Really have to let the draft investment play out. We all want to push the next button. I E improvement on the court. t
The only position to improve next season without compromising the Young core mins is C. What if we draft a C top 5? He will need mins too. The best solution is patience and development.
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Re: LP sees the big picture with Hawks young core 

Post#60 » by Jamaaliver » Wed Jan 15, 2020 3:25 am

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