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Trae vs John

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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#21 » by shakes0 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 5:43 pm

I knew this was going to be a problem as soon a we didn't sign JC. With all the new mouths to feed it only makes logical sense that numbers and touches would go down for everyone who was on the team last year including JC and Trae. Not exactly the scenario you want if you are JC and trying to play for a max contract.

JC wouldn't take $90 million. Would he have taken $100 million? Is it really worth saving $10 million to risk messing up an entire season where we are expected to make a run at a decent playoff seed?

I think the FO really screwed up not getting JC signed. They risked the entire locker room on trying to save a few bucks on JC's contract.
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#22 » by myrak433 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 5:48 pm

shakes0 wrote:I knew this was going to be a problem as soon a we didn't sign JC. With all the new mouths to feed it only makes logical sense that numbers and touches would go down for everyone who was on the team last year including JC and Trae. Not exactly the scenario you want if you are JC and trying to play for a max contract.

JC wouldn't take $90 million. Would he have taken $100 million? Is it really worth saving $10 million to risk messing up an entire season where we are expected to make a run at a decent playoff seed?

I think the FO really screwed up not getting JC signed. They risked the entire locker room on trying to save a few bucks on JC's contract.


I don't have a problem with the FO not giving JC a max deal. I don't think that he is a max player. Maybe he could be, but he hasn't showed it. If he does then sign and/or match any offer he gets. The Hawks are ok.
December of 2019 “Trae Young Involved in 'Emotional' Locker Room Scene After Hawks Loss. Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young is unsurprisingly getting tired of the team's struggles.”

Get Trae some HELP!!!!
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#23 » by Radioblacktive1 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 5:48 pm

myrak433 wrote:Collins to Bulls/ Lavine to Hawks.... I am at it again (LOL)


Ah I knew it was too quiet around here.
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#24 » by shakes0 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 6:08 pm

myrak433 wrote:
shakes0 wrote:I knew this was going to be a problem as soon a we didn't sign JC. With all the new mouths to feed it only makes logical sense that numbers and touches would go down for everyone who was on the team last year including JC and Trae. Not exactly the scenario you want if you are JC and trying to play for a max contract.

JC wouldn't take $90 million. Would he have taken $100 million? Is it really worth saving $10 million to risk messing up an entire season where we are expected to make a run at a decent playoff seed?

I think the FO really screwed up not getting JC signed. They risked the entire locker room on trying to save a few bucks on JC's contract.


I don't have a problem with the FO not giving JC a max deal. I don't think that he is a max player. Maybe he could be, but he hasn't showed it. If he does then sign and/or match any offer he gets. The Hawks are ok.


I didn't say anything about max. I think max is $125 million or something like that. I said they should've offered him another $10 million and see what he did.

At some point the FO has to decide what gap between them and JC's agent is worth risking the entire season over. Or maybe they already had that discussion and decided that anything over $90 million was too much and they would rather just risk the season being ruined.

If the Hawks are planning to match no matter what this offseason then they are essentially risking the entire season on a gamble that no other team is going to offer him a max. Is that really worth it as far as gambles go?
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#25 » by jayu70 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 7:01 pm

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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#26 » by Skin » Fri Jan 8, 2021 7:55 pm

Who's more right though... Trae or John?

*asking for a friend* :)
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#27 » by myrak433 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 8:31 pm

shakes0 wrote:
myrak433 wrote:
shakes0 wrote:I knew this was going to be a problem as soon a we didn't sign JC. With all the new mouths to feed it only makes logical sense that numbers and touches would go down for everyone who was on the team last year including JC and Trae. Not exactly the scenario you want if you are JC and trying to play for a max contract.

JC wouldn't take $90 million. Would he have taken $100 million? Is it really worth saving $10 million to risk messing up an entire season where we are expected to make a run at a decent playoff seed?

I think the FO really screwed up not getting JC signed. They risked the entire locker room on trying to save a few bucks on JC's contract.


I don't have a problem with the FO not giving JC a max deal. I don't think that he is a max player. Maybe he could be, but he hasn't showed it. If he does then sign and/or match any offer he gets. The Hawks are ok.


I didn't say anything about max. I think max is $125 million or something like that. I said they should've offered him another $10 million and see what he did.

At some point the FO has to decide what gap between them and JC's agent is worth risking the entire season over. Or maybe they already had that discussion and decided that anything over $90 million was too much and they would rather just risk the season being ruined.

If the Hawks are planning to match no matter what this offseason then they are essentially risking the entire season on a gamble that no other team is going to offer him a max. Is that really worth it as far as gambles go?


I am not a nba salary contract expert, but I believe a max contract for Collins would 25 million a year. So that would be a 4 year 100M contract. So....... $90M is a near max deal that JC turned down.
December of 2019 “Trae Young Involved in 'Emotional' Locker Room Scene After Hawks Loss. Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young is unsurprisingly getting tired of the team's struggles.”

Get Trae some HELP!!!!
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#28 » by Ball4life32 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 8:34 pm

myrak433 wrote:
shakes0 wrote:
myrak433 wrote:
I don't have a problem with the FO not giving JC a max deal. I don't think that he is a max player. Maybe he could be, but he hasn't showed it. If he does then sign and/or match any offer he gets. The Hawks are ok.


I didn't say anything about max. I think max is $125 million or something like that. I said they should've offered him another $10 million and see what he did.

At some point the FO has to decide what gap between them and JC's agent is worth risking the entire season over. Or maybe they already had that discussion and decided that anything over $90 million was too much and they would rather just risk the season being ruined.

If the Hawks are planning to match no matter what this offseason then they are essentially risking the entire season on a gamble that no other team is going to offer him a max. Is that really worth it as far as gambles go?


I am not a nba salary contract expert, but I believe a max contract for Collins would 25 million a year. So that would be a 4 year 100M contract. So....... $90M is a near max deal that JC turned down.

It’s more than that. Might be wrong but I think max he could receive from the hawks would be 4/132 and the max he could get from another team would be 4/121.
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#29 » by jayu70 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 8:39 pm

Skin wrote:Who's more right though... Trae or John?

*asking for a friend* :)

Ha. They both need each other right now.
Trae has to manage his scoring as well as running the offense.
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#30 » by myrak433 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 9:10 pm

Ball4life32 wrote:
myrak433 wrote:
shakes0 wrote:
I didn't say anything about max. I think max is $125 million or something like that. I said they should've offered him another $10 million and see what he did.

At some point the FO has to decide what gap between them and JC's agent is worth risking the entire season over. Or maybe they already had that discussion and decided that anything over $90 million was too much and they would rather just risk the season being ruined.

If the Hawks are planning to match no matter what this offseason then they are essentially risking the entire season on a gamble that no other team is going to offer him a max. Is that really worth it as far as gambles go?


I am not a nba salary contract expert, but I believe a max contract for Collins would 25 million a year. So that would be a 4 year 100M contract. So....... $90M is a near max deal that JC turned down.

It’s more than that. Might be wrong but I think max he could receive from the hawks would be 4/132 and the max he could get from another team would be 4/121.


I believe in order for JC max to be 132M he had to be named to an All-Star team, or a All-NBA team twice, or been the MVP. JC has not done any of that so his max would be 25% of the cap (anually) which is 108M (now I am guessing). so a max for JC would be about 100M (104M) for 4 years.
December of 2019 “Trae Young Involved in 'Emotional' Locker Room Scene After Hawks Loss. Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young is unsurprisingly getting tired of the team's struggles.”

Get Trae some HELP!!!!
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#31 » by HMFFL » Fri Jan 8, 2021 9:14 pm

Thanks, Jayu
The thread was a must. Glad you already posted it up.

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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#32 » by myrak433 » Fri Jan 8, 2021 9:22 pm

jayu70 wrote:
Skin wrote:Who's more right though... Trae or John?

*asking for a friend* :)

Ha. They both need each other right now.
Trae has to manage his scoring as well as running the offense.


I like Collins but I would trade him in a heartbeat if there is conflict and/or drama with Trae.
December of 2019 “Trae Young Involved in 'Emotional' Locker Room Scene After Hawks Loss. Atlanta Hawks star Trae Young is unsurprisingly getting tired of the team's struggles.”

Get Trae some HELP!!!!
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#33 » by johanliebert » Fri Jan 8, 2021 9:28 pm

Jamaaliver wrote:1. Thanks for the links, Jayu.

2. D@mn!!! This reeks of ego on Trae's part and an agenda on John's behalf. Trae shut down over modest criticism in a orivate setting from a close teammate?

Reminds me of Kobe in the mid-2000s. It's gonna fall to the (next?) coach to get Trae Young to deal with these issues in a more productive manner.

Eye opening observation:

Code: Select all

There was a moment during a timeout in the third quarter when, perhaps sensing Young was not happy, Collins put his arm around Young’s shoulders and patted him on the back to encourage him. Young did not say anything nor reciprocate Collins’ friendly gesture and instead walked away.
The Athletic

In trae's defence pg's often take that type of criticism personal especially when they're responsible for so much of the offence. hope they work it out cause theres nothing worse than a petty PG who will look you off.
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#34 » by Zummba » Fri Jan 8, 2021 9:34 pm

I believe Luka MVP hipe is getting to Trea. He feels he needs to prove he is on the same level. And him trying too hard will not help the Hawks win, which is a shame. Hope this gets resolved soon, gl.
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#35 » by HMFFL » Sat Jan 9, 2021 12:32 am

Zummba wrote:I believe Luka MVP hipe is getting to Trea. He feels he needs to prove he is on the same level. And him trying too hard will not help the Hawks win, which is a shame. Hope this gets resolved soon, gl.
If that's the case he needs to mature and just play his game. The numbers will happen. I hope to see our vets back on the floor soon. Right now, it's as if we never signed any.

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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#36 » by Jamaaliver » Sat Jan 9, 2021 1:14 am

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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#37 » by tbhawksfan1 » Sat Jan 9, 2021 11:30 am

Kids will be kids. Need a coach that can keep this on the rails
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#38 » by HMFFL » Sat Jan 9, 2021 12:59 pm

tbhawksfan1 wrote:Kids will be kids. Need a coach that can keep this on the rails
Exactly.
I think I'm just going to watch and hope everything works it's self out..lol
Hopefully Coach isn't doing what I'm doing.

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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#39 » by Galloisdaman » Sat Jan 9, 2021 3:09 pm

Spud2nique wrote:
Galloisdaman wrote:
Spud2nique wrote:This is your classic KG/Marbury fiasco. :nonono:


Please no Marbury stuff. I lived through it the first time lol :D


You were a Minny fan?


No I was a Knicks fan whole followed Marbury because he was from Brooklyn. I was happy when he got traded to my Knicks but I soon regretted it. I mean very soon and that was before he even went full Marbury.
My eyes glaze over when reading alternative stat (not advanced stat) narratives that go many paragraphs long. If you can not make your point in 2 paragraphs it may not be a great point. :D
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Re: Trae vs John 

Post#40 » by personanongrata » Sat Jan 9, 2021 4:30 pm

shakes0 wrote:I knew this was going to be a problem as soon a we didn't sign JC. With all the new mouths to feed it only makes logical sense that numbers and touches would go down for everyone who was on the team last year including JC and Trae. Not exactly the scenario you want if you are JC and trying to play for a max contract.

JC wouldn't take $90 million. Would he have taken $100 million? Is it really worth saving $10 million to risk messing up an entire season where we are expected to make a run at a decent playoff seed?

I think the FO really screwed up not getting JC signed. They risked the entire locker room on trying to save a few bucks on JC's contract.


If 100 would have got it done, the Hawks probably would have taken that. JC's representation wanted 120.

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