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http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/b ... index.html

Strange trade for the Raptors, IMO. I guess this means TJ Ford is definitely not an option for us.

JO for
Ford, Nesterovic, #17 pick

JO hasn't been a decent player in 2 years now...

I will repeat what I said on the general board.

1. Both JO and Ford are injury prone but Ford is actually still very good when he plays. O'neal has gotten worse for 3 consecutive years. If that continues(and it could since he's turning 30 soon)then this trade is going to look worse than the Vince Carter trade of 3 years ago. I'd prefer Ford/Rasho/17 to an offer of Marvin/Bibby/future 1st and I'd still be pissed if the Hawks did this. I would like to go after Rasho or Foster this summer BTW to replace Zaza.

2. Why would you trade anything of value for the rights to pay JO Kobe/Duncan money even if he is healthy(and there's a good chance that he won't be). Was Elton Brand not available for this package?

3. What about Bargnani? It was just last year that me and a few posters on this board were trying to tell people that he wasn't the next Dirk...now it appears the Raptors have written him off.

I don't get it. TJ Ford > JO as is and the Pacers get Rasho and a pick to boot?

Pacers came out great in this deal. With TJ running the show in OB's high paced offense they suddenly become a pretty exciting team.

I don't see what Toronto is thinking. JO is hurt all the time, doesn't step up in big moments, and really isn't even that good of a player anymore even when he is healthy. You would think they could get a better piece than an injury prone guy like JO for him.

It works for the Raps for a number of reasons.. While Jo is a health and injury risk, so is TJ. JO is also finally healthy and will be motivated in a new situation. He provides the needed toughness and interior D and can also score. He will also help Bargnani develop. While his contract is big, it only runs for two years. So the Raps will have a huge expiring contract and will be flexible enough to make a splash in a couple of years. Is the trade great? Arguably. But it is pretty good for both teams.

It works for the Raptors in that Bosh no longer takes a beating nightly trying to guard other 5's. Worst comes to worst, JO is an expiring contract in the same summer that Wade, Carmelo, Lebron, and others are opting out.

JO and Ford are both injury risk but one persons injuries have led to them declining tremendously in the last 3 years. I could see where the trade makes some sense. If they are at their best...JO helps the Raptors alot more than Ford because he fills a weakness while Ford was just splitting minutes with Calderon. I just think it's a desperation move...you are basically hoping a guy who misses a ton of games every year stays healthy and get's significantly better after 30. The only person I can recall doing that off the top of my head is Marcus Camby.

I love this trade for Indiana. O'Neal is owed 44M over 2 years. Rasho expires and TJ Ford looks like an ironman compared to Jamaal Tinsley. Big upgrade at PG and adding the 17th pick allows them to add 2 talented players to the rotation that will be on rookie deals until after Troy Murphy comes off the cap.

Excellent trade for Indiana. Bird actually did something right for a change because now he has another first round pick to go along with a very young but proven point guard. TJ just needs to stay healthy but he's also not the type of point you keep on the floor for forty minutes.

I even like the for Toronto because they filled a giant need. The franchise is determined to make it to the NBA finals and if Jermaine stays healthy they could very well be the second best Eastern Conference team.

HMFFL wrote:I even like the for Toronto because they filled a giant need. The franchise is determined to make it to the NBA finals and if Jermaine stays healthy they could very well be the second best Eastern Conference team.

2nd best? After us?


I keed. I keed.

I still can't believe that this trade is actually considered good for the Raptors on this site(Knicks fans have even said Bird should be fired for it). This reminds me when everybody was caught up in the Steve Francis to NY hype from a couple of years ago(who was actually younger than Jermaine at the time). This guys knees are probably shot. He is just about the same age as Shareef/Francis/Mashburn/ Speedy when their bad knees finally caught up to them. Could they not have gotten a better player like Artest or Brand for Ford and signed someone like Diop instead?

A little risky for TOR, but it O'Neal plays well with Bosh, it can turn to be a very good trade.

Now, excellent for IND, but it immediatly reminds me the Grizzlies of 2003-05 with lots of young players between 5 and 10 M$/yr (MEM extended Gasol between these two seasons).

Even when healthy, JO hasn't been that good. He was a good (although highly overrated player) in his prime that could not handle the pressure of carrying a franchise after Miller retired.

The best thing about it is that Indy gets another first and an expiring contract. JO isn't a dominate force anymore and is injury prone. So is Ford so that is basically a wash for me.

I just don't see JO making Toronto that better. He will miss over 20 games leaving Chris Bosh to play center becuse they have no legit backup with Rasho gone.

ATLfan wrote:I just don't see JO making Toronto that better. He will miss over 20 games leaving Chris Bosh to play center becuse they have no legit backup with Rasho gone.

Bargnani can play C, atleast I thought he did in the past.

I like it more for Indy than I do for T.O., obviously they have been trying to get rid of JO for a while and getting a talented young guard AND a mid-first is great return. The dinos prolly shoulda held out on that first as they still need a Marvin Williams type athletic wing and there should be one available at 17.

Still though, I think O'Neal makes them a lot better in the short term. He fits well with Bosh and hypothetically will be able to stay in better shape since he is no longer the only inside player/rebounder on his team. O'Neal gets to do what he should have been doing all along which is playing off a better frontcourt player on offense and blocking shots and locking down the opposing team's best frontcourt player on D. It also gives them a lot better balance, they really coulda used that pick though.

It should keep the Raps in the playoffs for the next couple of years (I thought they were in danger of slipping) but when JO's body simply can't hold itself together in two years they will probably with they had gotten a younger player.

I believe it makes Toronto better on paper, but not really on the floor. Jermaine O'Neal should have more in his tank, but I am skeptical of that. I will say this is a better deal for Toronto than the rumored TJ and 17th for Boris Diaw deal (Yikes). This one at least has the potential of being a big success if O'Neal experiences a resurgence because of new team, teammates, and system.

Knicks fans are probably upset because they saw an opportunity to dump salary on the Pacers in exchange for O'Neal whose massive contract expires as Lebron can opt out. There was talk earlier that the Pacers were willing to include the 11 pick to get rid of O'Neal's contract. The Knicks could have offered Curry, Crawford, and Balkman for O'Neal and the 11th setting them up perfectly to make a run at Lebron in 2 years and realistically being about the same this year. The 11th might have given enough ammo to trade up #3 to get Mayo (Minnesota could have used the 6th and 11th to draft Love and another piece for the rebuild). Now they have to figure out how to pare down the 4 large contracts that they'll have in that year (Curry, Randolph, Crawford, and Jeffries) as well as any extensions signed by their popular young players (Robinson and Lee). They don't really have enough attractive pieces to tie around those guys to make other teams clamor for them.

I just read that due to BYC issues the trade can't be consummated until 7/9. Which means we have the ackward stage of the #17 being made by Toronto for Indiana and the #41 being made by Indiana for Toronto. This also means that Toronto will be free to deal their 2009 pick if needed since they will actually be making a pick this year (although not keeping it). Not that important, just tidbits I wanted to share.

I see this as a GREAT trade for Toronto. Ford was not necessary any more with Calderon coming into his own. O'Neal will likely be rejuvenated by going to a team on the rise. Calderon, Bosh, and O'Neal is going to be a pretty solid trio. I see them as the 2nd or 3rd best team in the East next year, with an outside shot of reaching the finals.