ParticleMan wrote:eatyourchildren wrote:Your problem is you're applying relatively meaningless monikers to compare the relative value of palyers. For example, Telfair and Gomes are/were starters? And yet, would they have started on the Celtics? The Lakers? Hell, would they even start in Toronto?
As decent as Rondo and Perks are, I'm of the opinion that they've reached maybe 75% of their ceiling. They were far and away the weakest links of that Celtics 5. Their entire role was just "don't f*ck up what PGA" are doing. If you think that's better than what Farmar/Ariza/Vujacic are scraping...sure. But I like the long term prospects of our guys way more than Allen/Powe/Rondo/Perkins.
Bynum/Al Jeff are a tossup to me right now. Of course, Al Jeff is a 12123789128937x better scorer. But I don't see him becoming a dominant defensive anchor. Bynum can become that, hopefully. That's my long-term outlook. But he's already for sure better than Ryan freaking Gomes. Please.
For a rebuilding squad, tell me again how Farmar/Bynum trade is worse than a Telfair/Gomes/Al Jeff trade? Anytime you can get a PG/C combo that has their ceiling you take it. Unless you're friends with another team's GM. Then you don't.
I don't think Big Al vs Bynum is a toss-up at all. Look at it from McHale's viewpoint a year ago:
Big Al had already been a 20/10 player for half a season. He consistently drew double teams and often triple teams. He was about as proven as a young big man could be. Behind DH, he is the best young big man in the league. And in the NBA there is no substitute for having a go-to post scorer. It opens up so many things on the floor. McHale of all people knows this.
Bynum? Sure, lots of potential. Flashes of brilliance. But he will never be the scorer Al is. Not even clear he will ever draw a serious double team. Now, he has the potential to be much better defensively than Big Al. No question. But If I'm McHale, I'm taking the guy who is for sure going to give me 20/10, not some guy who may or may not develop into a defensive anchor. It's really no contest: You know what you're getting with Big Al. Bynum last year was a big ?. In fact, given his injuries, he's still a big ?. So looking back a year later, I'd say McHale made the right choice.
You seem to really love Jordan Farmar. Not sure why. A guy with a 1.3:1 A/TO ratio is not my idea of someone I want running my team. He is another SG in a PG's body (albeit with a nice handle). Telfair, for all his warts, is a true PG. Whatever you may think of Telfair, a true PG has a lot more value than a SG in a PG's body, which are a dime a dozen. With Telfair, it's not a question of his talent so much as his head. He made a lot of strides with the C's, had the bad gun incident, but has continued to mature in Minny. So again McHale made the right choice. If you asked GM's today, ignoring past baggage, I think most would take Telfair over Farmar.
Ryan Gomes you say is terrible, but of all the guys we traded other than Big Al, I think he's the guy the C's would welcome back first. He's no allstar, but he's solid, consistent, and a genuine rotation player. Plus he's a first class person, very hardworking, mature, high-quality guy. Maybe on a good team he's be more like a 6th man, but on a rebuilding team, he's the kind of guy you like to have in the locker room. That counts for something. And nobody was comparing Gomes to Bynum, that's not relevant. The comparison McHale had to make was Bynum vs Al.
Bottom line, I don't think McHale made the wrong call. He actually made the right call given what he knew last year. I don't think there's any way to argue that the Lakers were offering a clearly better package. And frankly, the past year has only confirmed that to be true.
...that's a bit over-critical of both Bynum and Farmar - I think most every GM would take Farmar over Telfair, especially the year the trade went down - Farmar is progressing nicely and will surely improve on the Asst/TO ratio...Bynum was far less proven and I would be shocked if he comes close to AJ's offense - a guy who is sure to lead the league some day IMO - but he's a 20/10 dude in the future and had shown the base tools to believe it could be done...however, the "proven" part comes most into focus - the fact that Ainge and McHale have such a great relationship no doubt helped, but not as some "secret handshake" BS deal - more likley, it was a trust factor...Ainge endorsed AJ, Gomes, and Telfair and McHale trusted that more than the hope that Bynum would work to accomplish his cieling while being forced to take on a couple of big $$ contracts...
