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Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga.

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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#21 » by theman » Mon Dec 2, 2019 7:18 pm

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JR Hawks wrote:Danny gets burned everytime he has more picks than roster spots he's willing to give to a rookie. We were screwed the second he decided he didn't want three first round picks this year...it was clear a bad trade was on the way.


Danny didn't save any roster spots this season via pick trades or stashes. When he traded down from #20 he got the pick he used on Carsen Edwards.

I wonder if Danny considered Chuma Okeke over Langford and then did what Orlanda did of red shirting him. That was a smart move on their part. Danny needs to learn to be innovative.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#22 » by Falstaff » Mon Dec 2, 2019 9:12 pm

theman wrote:
Fencer reregistered wrote:
JR Hawks wrote:Danny gets burned everytime he has more picks than roster spots he's willing to give to a rookie. We were screwed the second he decided he didn't want three first round picks this year...it was clear a bad trade was on the way.


Danny didn't save any roster spots this season via pick trades or stashes. When he traded down from #20 he got the pick he used on Carsen Edwards.

I wonder if Danny considered Chuma Okeke over Langford and then did what Orlanda did of red shirting him. That was a smart move on their part. Danny needs to learn to be innovative.


Isn’t that what he did with Yabusele?
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#23 » by hickfromfrenchlick » Mon Dec 2, 2019 9:25 pm

Bleeding Green wrote:Going into the draft I wanted Clarke, Jontay Porter, Rui, dunno who else was really gonna be available 14-22. Can't really complain about the selections, and 200-300 minutes into a player's career it's really impossible to tell who is good or not, what a player's ceiling is, etc. Clarke, to me, was the safest obvious pick, but who knows what his ceiling is with short arms, a rough looking (but massively improved) shot. He screamed Shawn Marion, and he's been really good so far. Grant Williams is 2 years younger, Romeo Langford 3 years younger. Waters at 51 is a heist, Edwards I'm unsure of, he'll need to be a 40% 3P shooter to be effective, which I suppose he's capable of, but many players who appear to be good shooters just fail to show it. Half of the rookies that have high PER are just hitting threes at an unsustainable rate. Is Brandon Clarke a 48% 3p shooter? Seems about as likely as Grant Williams being a 0% shooter.

I know you never respond to comments in your threads because you don't grasp the concept of an internet forum, but using PER? lmao


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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#24 » by Ed Pinkney » Mon Dec 2, 2019 10:01 pm

I think Williams is going to be a ten year NBA player, that is a rarity in players picked in the 20's and beyond.

Edwards I currently have pretty low expectations for to be honest. A player at his size (and who plays the way he does) is not particularly useful if they cant score. I'll chalk a lot of that up to experience to this point, but he needs to learn how to run the pick and roll really well and diversify how he approaches offense a lot more.

Langford is a complete unknown, but there is a bit of smoke on the approach/attitude front which is always a worry.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#25 » by sully00 » Mon Dec 2, 2019 10:29 pm

FlatearthZorro wrote:I don't think he failed, I think both Carsen and Grant will be solid players. Neither will ever be a star and we probably should've drafted a center or a taller PF. I'm still really high on Langford and even Waters.


I really wanted Brandon Clarke and I just don't understand what the problem was there. I think that Grant Williams will contribute and I love the Edwards pick. Langford was what was left of the lottery tier. I would have taken Clarke at that point I think. I get the trade especially if your not necessarily in love with your options. I think Ainge was looking to create more assets for trades with all the upheaval he was facing and Langford and a future first probably had more trade value than Brandon Clarke. Though that seems kind of suspect now.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#26 » by Bleeding Green » Mon Dec 2, 2019 11:07 pm

celticfan42487 wrote:
djFan71 wrote:I wanted a NAW, Clarke, Claxton draft, but even though its looking bad, it’s still too early to judge. I hope to be proven horribly wrong.


NAW really, really would have been helpful on this team.

Compliments Brown and Tatum's weaknesses really well on offense and we have to keep half an eye to the future knowing Hayward & Walker won't be around forever. And with the year 30 mark coming up both could hit that cliff any given season after this one.

Yeah, NAW would be getting 8 minutes a game on this team shooting 32 pct. He'd be in the Carsen Edwards role at best with the way he's playing.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#27 » by Taget » Mon Dec 2, 2019 11:38 pm

Can't say I liked the choice of Romeo but given his injuries it really is too early to make a judgement on him. Grant for the position he was taken I still like. And he may pan out. Carsen needs to be sent to Maine. He is just not ready. Showed promise of what he might be able to do if ready. But he isn't. Tremont Waters I'm really liking. But we haven't seen much of him beyond G league.

The problem right now is we are a team looking to compete. Which limits the number of "projects" we can have. For our young guys not on 1st round contracts it's produce or die. With the only exception being maybe Tacko and perhaps due to mostly marketing considerations. If Green, Wanamaker, Semi, Carsen, Poirier, Waters don't show immediate signs of growth by summer next year there will be a line of free agents and draft picks ready to replace them. They will have to fight for their roster spots. Romeo, Grant Williams, and Robert Williams have a bit more time to make the case for the team to extend their team options on their rookie contracts.

This is also made perhaps harder by the fact that it may be in our best interest to be looking to sign more hungry vets and less kids if our goal is to make a deep playoff push. Unless that kid shows "great" promise.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#28 » by Red2 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 12:07 am

if we kept our pick Clarke was there. I don't get how you go into a draft needing size and come away with a 6 6 undersized power forward as your big? I get that we signed enes and got tacko but what about a power forward? I like grant williams- I really do and i think Edwards will eventually be a spark plug off the bench but right now we could really use some bench help and those guys aren't giving us much. I was encouraged though by Grant's play down the stretch against the knicks and i think brad is going to play him a lot in end of game situations so he can switch everything. I just wish he was 3 inches bigger and a bit quicker.We better not draft another wing or guard next year!!
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#29 » by celticfan42487 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 12:59 am

Bleeding Green wrote:
celticfan42487 wrote:
djFan71 wrote:I wanted a NAW, Clarke, Claxton draft, but even though its looking bad, it’s still too early to judge. I hope to be proven horribly wrong.


NAW really, really would have been helpful on this team.

Compliments Brown and Tatum's weaknesses really well on offense and we have to keep half an eye to the future knowing Hayward & Walker won't be around forever. And with the year 30 mark coming up both could hit that cliff any given season after this one.

Yeah, NAW would be getting 8 minutes a game on this team shooting 32 pct. He'd be in the Carsen Edwards role at best with the way he's playing.


Different system, different team mates, completely different player.

I think NAW's playmaking and reasonable size would shine in a Stevens offense as like the 6th option on the team.

For Edwards unfortunately he's either hitting 40 foot 3s or his not. Right now he's not and he is a liability on defense. It's going to be tough for him not being the focal point of the offense and having it built around him like it has been all his life. He'll work through it, assuming his shot is pure. If not then he'll be out of the league in 3 years, that's just how it goes. NAW has many more ways to contribute to a team as a role player.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#30 » by Bleeding Green » Tue Dec 3, 2019 1:04 am

celticfan42487 wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:
celticfan42487 wrote:
NAW really, really would have been helpful on this team.

Compliments Brown and Tatum's weaknesses really well on offense and we have to keep half an eye to the future knowing Hayward & Walker won't be around forever. And with the year 30 mark coming up both could hit that cliff any given season after this one.

Yeah, NAW would be getting 8 minutes a game on this team shooting 32 pct. He'd be in the Carsen Edwards role at best with the way he's playing.


Different system, different team mates, completely different player.

I think NAW's playmaking and reasonable size would shine in a Stevens offense as like the 6th option on the team.

For Edwards unfortunately he's either hitting 40 foot 3s or his not. Right now he's not and he is a liability on defense. It's going to be tough for him not being the focal point of the offense and having it built around him like it has been all his life. He'll work through it, assuming his shot is pure. If not then he'll be out of the league in 3 years, that's just how it goes. NAW has many more ways to contribute to a team as a role player.

If NAW were shooting 32 pct from the field, this forum would want him to be in Maine and they'd be looking at Carsen Edwards, playing in Golden State, and saying, "wow why can't Ainge get guys like that?" 100 pct guaranteed.

Alexander-Walker is gonna be really good, but right now he sucks, so he'd be in Maine or getting the Carsen Edwards minutes. He's not getting minutes over Kemba, Smart or Wanamaker at the very least.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#31 » by celticfan42487 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 1:10 am

Bleeding Green wrote:
celticfan42487 wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:Yeah, NAW would be getting 8 minutes a game on this team shooting 32 pct. He'd be in the Carsen Edwards role at best with the way he's playing.


Different system, different team mates, completely different player.

I think NAW's playmaking and reasonable size would shine in a Stevens offense as like the 6th option on the team.

For Edwards unfortunately he's either hitting 40 foot 3s or his not. Right now he's not and he is a liability on defense. It's going to be tough for him not being the focal point of the offense and having it built around him like it has been all his life. He'll work through it, assuming his shot is pure. If not then he'll be out of the league in 3 years, that's just how it goes. NAW has many more ways to contribute to a team as a role player.

If NAW were shooting 32 pct from the field, this forum would want him to be in Maine and they'd be looking at Carsen Edwards, playing in Golden State, and saying, "wow why can't Ainge get guys like that?" 100 pct guaranteed.

Alexander-Walker is gonna be really good, but right now he sucks, so he'd be in Maine or getting the Carsen Edwards minutes. He's not getting minutes over Kemba, Smart or Wanamaker at the very least.


Again, I suggest in Steven's offense playing with Kemba, Smart, Brown, Tatum some of the time Hayward he wouldn't be shooting that low. He'd feast on a lot of open 3 pointers in this system. And with his ability to drive and kick he'd add a good element that guys like Brown and Tatum need to be surrounded by.

This is the theoretical we have for him vs an Edwards in our system. I think he would complement the players on this roster very well with his skillset.

And you say that about Wannamaker, but I wouldn't be so sure. Wanna sucked all last year. He's doing good atm, but he's still undersized and Stevens values versatility on defensive rotations. If Edwards can get quality minutes with Wannamaker in the rotation I'm sure NAW could.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#32 » by Bleeding Green » Tue Dec 3, 2019 1:34 am

OK, so NAW is shooting 32 pct, 43 TS%, but if he were in Boston he would feast on open threes. But Edwards won't feast on open threes despite shooting about the same in college. And he'd play over Wanamaker who is having an genuinely great third-string PG season right now.

Wanamaker. One n. Respect the name.

I think sometimes people don't watch games besides the Celtics, if they even watch those games. NAW has been awful this year and to say he'd suddenly have not been awful in very limited minutes on the Celtics is just fantasy.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#33 » by sully00 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 2:42 am

Red2 wrote:if we kept our pick Clarke was there. I don't get how you go into a draft needing size and come away with a 6 6 undersized power forward as your big? I get that we signed enes and got tacko but what about a power forward? I like grant williams- I really do and i think Edwards will eventually be a spark plug off the bench but right now we could really use some bench help and those guys aren't giving us much. I was encouraged though by Grant's play down the stretch against the knicks and i think brad is going to play him a lot in end of game situations so he can switch everything. I just wish he was 3 inches bigger and a bit quicker.We better not draft another wing or guard next year!!


Clarke is 6'8" maybe so he wasn't the cure for undersized bigs. I just thought he could play out of the box which is what he has done and this team needs. I think Williams can play as well and I can buy that argument that they might be the same guy long term but it never felt right.

I feel like in the end we should have just come away with Clarke and Edwards and we got too cute.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#34 » by celticfan42487 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 4:00 am

Bleeding Green wrote:OK, so NAW is shooting 32 pct, 43 TS%, but if he were in Boston he would feast on open threes. But Edwards won't feast on open threes despite shooting about the same in college. And he'd play over Wanamaker who is having an genuinely great third-string PG season right now.

Wanamaker. One n. Respect the name.

I think sometimes people don't watch games besides the Celtics, if they even watch those games. NAW has been awful this year and to say he'd suddenly have not been awful in very limited minutes on the Celtics is just fantasy.


Wanna hasn't earned my respect. He completely sucked last year which is a hell of a lot bigger sample size than the 15 games you're juding NAW and Wannnnna on.

And yes, I do actually think the Celtics run a different system that NAW's talents are more suited to than the Pelican's system.

He also wouldn't play PG like Edwards does, nor would he be as big of a liability on defense as Edwards is.

Your hard on for Wanamaker is great for you, but you realize even with all the minutes the international scrub is getting Edwards still has earned a quality rotational spot? So a theoretical NAW wouldn't have to outplay Wannamakakaka to get minutes, he'd just replace Edwards role in the rotation. And he may even slide Wkdslfnadksl to PG which his build is more suited for.

And considering our lack of depth when we played Dochawanna at SF for stretches recently I'm confident NAW would have a role on this team.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#35 » by Bleeding Green » Tue Dec 3, 2019 4:22 am

I would probably have to stop watching the Celtics if they played Nickeil Alexander Walker over Wanamaker based on their play this season.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#36 » by sully00 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 12:26 pm

celticfan42487 wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:OK, so NAW is shooting 32 pct, 43 TS%, but if he were in Boston he would feast on open threes. But Edwards won't feast on open threes despite shooting about the same in college. And he'd play over Wanamaker who is having an genuinely great third-string PG season right now.

Wanamaker. One n. Respect the name.

I think sometimes people don't watch games besides the Celtics, if they even watch those games. NAW has been awful this year and to say he'd suddenly have not been awful in very limited minutes on the Celtics is just fantasy.


Wanna hasn't earned my respect. He completely sucked last year which is a hell of a lot bigger sample size than the 15 games you're juding NAW and Wannnnna on.

And yes, I do actually think the Celtics run a different system that NAW's talents are more suited to than the Pelican's system.

He also wouldn't play PG like Edwards does, nor would he be as big of a liability on defense as Edwards is.

Your hard on for Wanamaker is great for you, but you realize even with all the minutes the international scrub is getting Edwards still has earned a quality rotational spot? So a theoretical NAW wouldn't have to outplay Wannamakakaka to get minutes, he'd just replace Edwards role in the rotation. And he may even slide Wkdslfnadksl to PG which his build is more suited for.

And considering our lack of depth when we played Dochawanna at SF for stretches recently I'm confident NAW would have a role on this team.


Brad Wannamaker lead the Celtics in 3pt% last year and had a PER of 14.3 and was 4th on the team in +/-. His sample size was small but if anything he was probably underutilized and is a pretty good distance from sucking. Dude is a very steady hand on a team with plenty of youth.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#37 » by winsomme2 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 6:32 pm

Before the draft I wanted Herro, Fernando, and cam Johnson.

After the draft I was actually pretty pleased with who we drafted altho I was frustrated that we didn't get Fernando. That pick seemed like it was a no brainier. I worried about passing on Clarke just because he went way lower than was expected and could have been a good value pick.

So far I have been really surprised by Williams and Edwards struggles shooting.

Overall, these guys need to step up because this draft is loaded with great players. If none pan out it will have been a really wasted draft.
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#38 » by celticfan42487 » Tue Dec 3, 2019 6:53 pm

sully00 wrote:
celticfan42487 wrote:
Bleeding Green wrote:OK, so NAW is shooting 32 pct, 43 TS%, but if he were in Boston he would feast on open threes. But Edwards won't feast on open threes despite shooting about the same in college. And he'd play over Wanamaker who is having an genuinely great third-string PG season right now.

Wanamaker. One n. Respect the name.

I think sometimes people don't watch games besides the Celtics, if they even watch those games. NAW has been awful this year and to say he'd suddenly have not been awful in very limited minutes on the Celtics is just fantasy.


Wanna hasn't earned my respect. He completely sucked last year which is a hell of a lot bigger sample size than the 15 games you're juding NAW and Wannnnna on.

And yes, I do actually think the Celtics run a different system that NAW's talents are more suited to than the Pelican's system.

He also wouldn't play PG like Edwards does, nor would he be as big of a liability on defense as Edwards is.

Your hard on for Wanamaker is great for you, but you realize even with all the minutes the international scrub is getting Edwards still has earned a quality rotational spot? So a theoretical NAW wouldn't have to outplay Wannamakakaka to get minutes, he'd just replace Edwards role in the rotation. And he may even slide Wkdslfnadksl to PG which his build is more suited for.

And considering our lack of depth when we played Dochawanna at SF for stretches recently I'm confident NAW would have a role on this team.


Brad Wannamaker lead the Celtics in 3pt% last year and had a PER of 14.3 and was 4th on the team in +/-. His sample size was small but if anything he was probably underutilized and is a pretty good distance from sucking. Dude is a very steady hand on a team with plenty of youth.


Well to be fair almost none of my stances in this argument are going to be well supported with facts.

I just really like NAW and I'm having fun *** posting with Bleeding Green. :D

I did think Wanamaker completely sucked last year, and he's been shockingly good this season. It's also heartwarming to see a guy go through all of the Europe leagues to finally have a breakout season at age 30 in the NBA.

Here's hoping Romeo will get healthy and give us another rotational piece though!
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Re: Pass or Fail, 2019 Celtics Draft. Is G Williams + C Edwards > B Clarke. Romeo or Goga. 

Post#39 » by sully00 » Today 4:35 pm

celticfan42487 wrote:
sully00 wrote:
celticfan42487 wrote:
Wanna hasn't earned my respect. He completely sucked last year which is a hell of a lot bigger sample size than the 15 games you're juding NAW and Wannnnna on.

And yes, I do actually think the Celtics run a different system that NAW's talents are more suited to than the Pelican's system.

He also wouldn't play PG like Edwards does, nor would he be as big of a liability on defense as Edwards is.

Your hard on for Wanamaker is great for you, but you realize even with all the minutes the international scrub is getting Edwards still has earned a quality rotational spot? So a theoretical NAW wouldn't have to outplay Wannamakakaka to get minutes, he'd just replace Edwards role in the rotation. And he may even slide Wkdslfnadksl to PG which his build is more suited for.

And considering our lack of depth when we played Dochawanna at SF for stretches recently I'm confident NAW would have a role on this team.


Brad Wannamaker lead the Celtics in 3pt% last year and had a PER of 14.3 and was 4th on the team in +/-. His sample size was small but if anything he was probably underutilized and is a pretty good distance from sucking. Dude is a very steady hand on a team with plenty of youth.


Well to be fair almost none of my stances in this argument are going to be well supported with facts.

I just really like NAW and I'm having fun *** posting with Bleeding Green. :D

I did think Wanamaker completely sucked last year, and he's been shockingly good this season. It's also heartwarming to see a guy go through all of the Europe leagues to finally have a breakout season at age 30 in the NBA.

Here's hoping Romeo will get healthy and give us another rotational piece though!


Honestly I really have a lack of respect for his game. I felt like you because he actually played really well when the team was coming apart. But have to give it to the guy he knocks down his shots and he is pretty reliable even if he looks like a guy from the YMCA.

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