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Cavs Schmavved! Victory Cigar vs CLE 12/12

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Who smokes the big cigar?

Tatum
15
14%
Brown
29
27%
KP
16
15%
Jrue
6
6%
White
33
30%
Horf
0
No votes
Pritchard
2
2%
Hauser
1
1%
Kornet
0
No votes
Other/Coach/Team
7
6%
 
Total votes: 109

sam_I_am
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Re: Cavs Schmavved! Victory Cigar vs CLE 12/12 

Post#101 » by sam_I_am » Thu Dec 14, 2023 6:22 pm

KillahGhostface wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:
KillahGhostface wrote:
That’s zoya’s point lol. If you run action with Tatum and Jaylen that forces a switch, Tatum is still going to get trapped, and Jaylen will be going against the other teams best defender.

It’s why having different positions for two man games is so important, and obviously someone who can actually punish them.


That’s probably why the 3 man combo of JB, KP, White is so much better than JB, JT and White.


Really with any combination of the starters, the numbers are insane. But White, KP, and Jaylen have a +22.5 net when in together. Drops to +10 without Tatum, but that’s still an excellent number.

White/Tatum without Jaylen: +23.3
White/Jaylen without Tatum: +7.9, still a very good number.

We’ve basically done almost none of Tatum/KP without Jaylen, which makes sense as they’re trying to make KP the safety net for Jaylen.

Jaylen/KP without Tatum is -2.5, which surprised me tbh. I think that will get better as the year goes on.

The Tatum/Holiday numbers are insane. With those two on, and the other three starters off, the team has a +17.1 net.

As long as one of White or Tatum is always in the game, good things usually happen.


Last week, JT-KP-DW was 3rd ranked trio in NBA with minimum 200 possessions. KP-DW-JH was #1.
"I think the criticism's stupid," Stevens said. "So I don't care. I'm with Jaylen (Brown) on that. Those two had achieved more than most 25 and 26 year olds ever had. I'd rather be in the mix and have my guts ripped out than suck."
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Re: Cavs Schmavved! Victory Cigar vs CLE 12/12 

Post#102 » by KillahGhostface » Thu Dec 14, 2023 6:37 pm

sam_I_am wrote:
KillahGhostface wrote:
sam_I_am wrote:
That’s probably why the 3 man combo of JB, KP, White is so much better than JB, JT and White.


Really with any combination of the starters, the numbers are insane. But White, KP, and Jaylen have a +22.5 net when in together. Drops to +10 without Tatum, but that’s still an excellent number.

White/Tatum without Jaylen: +23.3
White/Jaylen without Tatum: +7.9, still a very good number.

We’ve basically done almost none of Tatum/KP without Jaylen, which makes sense as they’re trying to make KP the safety net for Jaylen.

Jaylen/KP without Tatum is -2.5, which surprised me tbh. I think that will get better as the year goes on.

The Tatum/Holiday numbers are insane. With those two on, and the other three starters off, the team has a +17.1 net.

As long as one of White or Tatum is always in the game, good things usually happen.


Last week, JT-KP-DW was 3rd ranked trio in NBA with minimum 200 possessions. KP-DW-JH was #1.


And I’m just showing the numbers for the season as of now.
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Re: Cavs Schmavved! Victory Cigar vs CLE 12/12 

Post#103 » by BK_2020 » Thu Dec 14, 2023 7:42 pm

sam_I_am wrote:
KillahGhostface wrote:
Stan34 wrote:You know why Celtics don't use JB as a screener with Tatum in P&R? Cause JB defender is the second, sometimes first, best defender on the opposite team.
You want to force the change with a lesser defender to let JT attack them.

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That’s zoya’s point lol. If you run action with Tatum and Jaylen that forces a switch, Tatum is still going to get trapped, and Jaylen will be going against the other teams best defender.

It’s why having different positions for two man games is so important, and obviously someone who can actually punish them.


That’s probably why the 3 man combo of JB, KP, White is so much better than JB, JT and White.

You are talking about on/off numbers for less than 100 possessions. It's pure noise.
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Re: Cavs Schmavved! Victory Cigar vs CLE 12/12 

Post#104 » by bucknersrevenge » Fri Dec 15, 2023 12:41 am

165bows wrote:
BK_2020 wrote:Something like a third of Jaylen's points have come in transition.

Which is kind of crazy because the Celtics are the opposite of a prolific transition team. Been a tiny bit faster this year but been bottom barrel pace-wise for awhile.


Not really when you consider that every other player in the rotation profiles as a halfcourt player and/or a complement to halfcourt efficient players. There's a reason why Jaylen always goes on 1-man fast breaks and nobody runs with him when he runs. Players run when Tatum or Derrick run because the rest play at the same pace. The other players create and spot mismatches in halfcourt and exploit them. Plus for the rest of them, their games are not based on athleticism so that matters too.
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