Trade Thread 2017: Not Once, Not twice, But Thrice!

[Celts17Pride]

I agree with McCeltic. Eventually you are going to have to pay Bradley or trade him. If you trade his 8M salary this year and add Noel at 17M (Biyombo may have screwed this up), you are adding 9M for a defensive center who is from Boston. Zeller cannot match up with Embiid but I bet Noel could.

After 2017 season, you do not resign Zeller at 8M, now you cut Bradley and Zeller essentially to take on Noel's contract with the cap rising. Olynk's 4.5M will be gone with Zizic coming over. And you replace Bradley with a PG with Nets pick. Doesn't look terrible if you ask me.

The Celtics, Ainge and Stevens have designs on Gordon Hayward next year. In order to get him the Celtics can't take on any salary for next year or additional cap holds. Celtics simply won't trade for Noel because of this reason no matter how much people talk about it.

If Hayward falls through and the Celtics love Noel then they will just offer him a max deal in July.

Sixers will match any deal for Noel. Dallas board is discussing a max for Noel as well.

Then match.

[Celts17Pride]

I'm not convinced the max cap space strategy is the best one, and I definitely wouldn't have the patience to stick to it.

That's one of the reasons your not GM.

You want no patience then you should be a Knicks fan. You would love them.

[FlatearthZorro]

Plus re: IT, Smart, Bradley - at some point the salary cap honeymoon is over, and we're either going to have to pay them or trade them. That's true whether we're trading for and re-signing Noel or not.

FWIW, if the league's truly gone pace and space, Noel is as ideal a defensive fit for it as Okafor is an obsolete offensive one. He can block shots, and he can cover a ton of ground with his hops/quicks. On good nights you feel like he could play 1 on 5. The trade-offs are that he's just an ok rebounder (that may change as he continues to physically develop) and can only catch lobs on offense. He could develop a shot, and he could develop a post move or two. He's janky on offense, but he's not stiff.

If this was Bill Belichick, both IT and Bradley would be gone in the next two years. Unless they sign for a bargain again. We're truly locking ourselves into treadmill territory if we're locked into gigantic contracts for 2nd and 3rd option players and miss on the Nets picks.

In this era, IT is worth a big salary commitment on a contender. Bradley isn't, unless you have all the other pieces in place, and he's your gratuitous Tristan Thompson overpay.

That said, Bradley may be worth a big deal (15-20 million) in the analytics era. Defense is more measurable and more valuable now. He's in a tier underneath Jimmy Butler, Klay Thompson, and no one else I'm thinking of off the top of my head. Batum, probably. Derozan. The concern is that he's probably going to be leapfrogged by Wiggins, Jamal Murray, maybe Hield, Russell, Oladipo, Middleton, Hezonja, and our own Jaylen Brown. Shooting guard has been a dry position, but there's an influx of players trending upward.

I 100% agree with you. I love Avery, I just don't know if Danny is gonna pay him ~20 mils. He will not sign for 15 mils. In the current market 17-18 mils a year would be a bargain deal. Obviously Danny's being paid mils to do his job so he knows what he wants to do.

IT is definitely worth 20 mils a year easily. I bet any team in the league that doesn't have an all-star/superstar PG would offer him that. And I actually think when it comes to PGs he's right up there behind RW, CP this year. I think he's at least been on the same tier as Lowry. He's had a legendary season so far. I'm really enjoying it.

Its funny you're mentioning Thompson. I'm hoping the Warriors win it all this year, just so that Durant can re-sign(1 year over 30 mils + 1 optional) and Curry can get that fat 214 mils(?) deal. It would leave them in a really weird position when it comes to Klay. I wonder if we could get him. To me he might be even better on a team like ours(than he has on the Warriors). I'll be monitoring this situation.

[TheOGJabroni]

I'd be willing to include the lesser of PHL or LAL with Noel for Bradley.

This is interesting to me; if we can involve Chicago in the deal to pry away Butler. We don't want to give up BK's pick but if we had another top pick in this draft, say LA just to make this more concrete, we could probably work with them.

Boston in: Butler & Noel
Philadelphia in: Bradley
Chicago in: Brown, Zeller & LA 17- what else would need to be added here?

[Andrew McCeltic]

I'm not convinced the max cap space strategy is the best one, and I definitely wouldn't have the patience to stick to it.

That's one of the reasons your not GM.

You want no patience then you should be a Knicks fan. You would love them.

Not sure why you want to pick a fight on this. Let's say we renounce Olynyk, Amir, everyone, and we do get the golden apple of everyone's white eye, Gordon Hayward. Here's the roster:

IT/Rozier/Jackson
Bradley/Smart/Brown
Hayward/Crowder/BKN 17
Horford/Mickey/Yabusele
Zizic/vet min signing

Is that a contender? Hayward's not the final piece of the puzzle. That team's capped out, and pinning all its hopes on Zizic being the answer based on some Euro play.

What's your next move? After Hayward, no cap room left, and even the least expensive of other "stars" - Wall, Butler, Middleton, Cousins - making 15-17 million. How do you match salaries? Which cheaper players do you target? If you have to trade Jaylen Brown straight up for a rookie-scale big, who do you trade him for?

[Andrew McCeltic]

Bradley is not getting moved for Noel. You can forget about that scenario. I really don't believe the Celtics have any interest in Noel at all.

The Celtics have Zizic coming over next year. The Celtics most likely feel that Zizic at $1.5 million can offer something similar to Noel at $17-20 million. I tend to agree.

I'm an Okafor defender, I boost him here, but then he follows up by grabbing 2 rebounds in 20 minutes.

I don't think Zizic can provide what Noel does, they're very very different players. Zizic is going to be closer to other Euro bigs- Biedrins, Nurkic, Potapenko - physical defense, rebounding, hustle. Noel has year 1 of Garnett in Boston defensive potential.

We're not dealing Bradley unless, maybe, you sweeten the deal - Noel or Okafor, the Lakers' 1st, maybe Saric.

Rozier is better than McConnell. You need to investigate Rozier. Major jets, his floor is peak Darren Collison, his ceiling is higher. He can drive, elevate, get to the rim. He's fixed his jump shot. He is still learning how to play in an NBA offense, and run a team, and he's not getting the reps Smart has. But he showed major strides in summer league and made it onto league radars. Rozier is worth more than Noel, on the market, because of Nerlens' contract status and other issues. You'd be making out well. His ceiling is definitely above Jeff Teague, the guy you almost traded Noel for.

Respect the opinion but gonna disagree. Defensive Bigs are hot right now. Whiteside and Noel are two that teams could really really use. Rozier, especially with this upcoming draft, will have diminished value.

I'd be willing to include the lesser of PHL or LAL with Noel for Bradley.

Lesser of PHL or LAL, does that include if the Lakers roll into the top 3? Otherwise that pick evaporates, in 2018 the LA pick might not even be in the lottery.

Personally I'd think hard about that - we get out of Bradley's upcoming contract question, his minutes go to Smart/Rozier/Jaylen/Gerald Green, and losing Bradley's 8 million means even with Noel's cap hold and the LA pick, we have the flexibility to get back down to max cap space if we want/need to.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

Phil and Melo will be talking some time this week.

Clippers played well last night using Speights as a stretch 4.

I still think there's a 0.1% chance Griffin could be traded.

[Andrew McCeltic]

I'd be willing to include the lesser of PHL or LAL with Noel for Bradley.

This is interesting to me; if we can involve Chicago in the deal to pry away Butler. We don't want to give up BK's pick but if we had another top pick in this draft, say LA just to make this more concrete, we could probably work with them.

Boston in: Butler & Noel
Philadelphia in: Bradley
Chicago in: Brown, Zeller & LA 17- what else would need to be added here?

Take out the LA 17, give the Bulls Okafor, and maybe send someone like Robin Lopez to Philly.

Butler, Noel to BOS
Bradley, Lopez to PHI
Zeller, Okafor, Brown to CHI

Or

Butler, Noel to BOS
Bradley, Lopez to PHI
Zeller, Okafor, Rozier, BOS '18 to CHI? Or put Smart in there - lots of permutations to price that end finely.

[TheOGJabroni]

I'd be willing to include the lesser of PHL or LAL with Noel for Bradley.

This is interesting to me; if we can involve Chicago in the deal to pry away Butler. We don't want to give up BK's pick but if we had another top pick in this draft, say LA just to make this more concrete, we could probably work with them.

Boston in: Butler & Noel
Philadelphia in: Bradley
Chicago in: Brown, Zeller & LA 17- what else would need to be added here?

Take out the LA 17, give the Bulls Okafor, and maybe send someone like Robin Lopez to Philly.

Butler, Noel to BOS
Bradley, Lopez to PHI
Zeller, Okafor, Brown to CHI

Or

Butler, Noel to BOS
Bradley, Lopez to PHI
Zeller, Okafor, Rozier, BOS '18 to CHI? Or put Smart in there - lots of permutations to price that end finely.

I don't think that's enough going to Chicago from what I've understood.

I like the deals that keep Johnson here though. He can still be valuable to us on the court and as a contract to match another bigger deal.

[Banks2Pierce]

Not sure why you want to pick a fight on this. Let's say we renounce Olynyk, Amir, everyone, and we do get the golden apple of everyone's white eye, Gordon Hayward. Here's the roster:

IT/Rozier/Jackson
Bradley/Smart/Brown
Hayward/Crowder/BKN 17
Horford/Mickey/Yabusele
Zizic/vet min signing

Is that a contender? Hayward's not the final piece of the puzzle. That team's capped out, and pinning all its hopes on Zizic being the answer based on some Euro play.

What's your next move? After Hayward, no cap room left, and even the least expensive of other "stars" - Wall, Butler, Middleton, Cousins - making 15-17 million. How do you match salaries? Which cheaper players do you target? If you have to trade Jaylen Brown straight up for a rookie-scale big, who do you trade him for?

Would start Hayward at the 2 and then trade from depth to get a big. We'd have a lot of depth to trade from, but I can't figure out the big. If Griffin's cooked, the play might just be to forego 2017 cap space and play around now.

[Curmudgeon]

When folks start talking seriously about Melo and Rudy Gay, they are obviously starved for some sort of trade.

[CelticsPride18]

Lol DijonRondo just riled up the Knicks board because he said Melo doesn't have a lot of value.

[Valid]

Lol DijonRondo just riled up the Knicks board because he said Melo doesn't have a lot of value.

How dare he say a declining 32-year-old with bad knees who doesn't play defense and has $80 million left on his deal doesn't have a lot of value!

[CelticsPride18]

Lol DijonRondo just riled up the Knicks board because he said Melo doesn't have a lot of value.

How dare he say a declining 32-year-old with bad knees who doesn't play defense and has $80 million left on his deal doesn't have a lot of value!

And they said Celtics drafting is awful when they haven't resign a first round pick in at least 10 years.

[Valid]

Lol DijonRondo just riled up the Knicks board because he said Melo doesn't have a lot of value.

How dare he say a declining 32-year-old with bad knees who doesn't play defense and has $80 million left on his deal doesn't have a lot of value!

And they said Celtics drafting is awful when they haven't resign a first round pick in at least 10 years.

That's what happens when you're always in the playoffs. You don't get the chance to have good first-round picks.

The Knicks could have good first-round picks, but they trade them off for players like Andrea Bargnani.

[Shamrock]

When folks start talking seriously about Melo and Rudy Gay, they are obviously starved for some sort of trade.

Ugh... I can't stand Melo anymore. He's in that Dwight category of guys you really wanted back in the day but are now above average and still have that enormous ego.

[Marty McFly]

I'm not convinced the max cap space strategy is the best one, and I definitely wouldn't have the patience to stick to it.

That's one of the reasons your not GM.

You want no patience then you should be a Knicks fan. You would love them.

we haven't won a championship in almost 45 years. we don't have patience?

[ConstableGeneva]

Read on Twitter

Might be helpful to have someone like Noel covering for IT in PnR D. Stupid cap restrictions.
Anyone know why Noel didn't play again in their last game?

[OFWGKTA]

Read on Twitter

Might be helpful to have someone like Noel covering for IT in PnR D. Stupid cap restrictions.
Anyone know why Noel didn't play again in their last game?

I asked the Philly board when I saw he wasn't playing last night, they said tweaked ankle.

[London2Boston]

Read on Twitter

Might be helpful to have someone like Noel covering for IT in PnR D. Stupid cap restrictions.
Anyone know why Noel didn't play again in their last game?

I'm getting around to the idea of Noel a lot more. I don't see Celtics getting Griffin or Hayward so the cap space might aswell go to signing Noel if he ends up fitting well here. Just a big NO to Okafor though.