Celtics just won their 18th Championship*

[jigga_man]

We're not talking just mere differences. A disparity of 19 is nothing. You're setting up a straw man to try to discredit our argument. You're trying to portray it like we feel that it must be 1-1 in foul attempts or it's unfair. We're not saying that.

What we're saying is heavily lopsided differences are fishy, especially when suddenly the Lakers are given 21 FTAs in the 4th qtr. of game 7 when they were struggling to get anything going. I'm sure if the shoe were on the other foot Laker fans would be bringing it up. They sure do with the chorus of "2008 was a fluke because we didn't have Bynum," which goes on to this day. "This would be a threepeat if Bynum wasn't hurt in '08" is something I'm hearing and seeing a lot. And Laker fans and even Phil whined about the reffing in Game 2 of this series. Don't try to portray Laker fans as holier than thou and Celt fans as whiny wackos. Gosh, I still hear to this day that 1984 was won because Boston cheated with the locker room conditions, dead spots on the parquet, and because of the heat. Only 1985 and '87 really count, in Laker minds; never mind that Boston was playing hurt in '87. (Which, yes, I know we Celt fans use as an excuse.)

Further, the Celts choked numerous games this year in the 4th. I didn't hear C fans blaming the refs. They blamed Doc and the players. We are questioning the reffing because of the timing, the size of the imbalance, and the fact that this is hardly the first time this has happened in the Lakers' favor when facing elimination. Also, clearly the NBA has a lot invested in Kobe and a winning Kobe is much more marketable. Look at all of this out-of-the-blue Kobe legacy, Kobe greater than Magic, and Kobe greater than MJ stuff the last two weeks.

And that's my last response to you because this is like trying to convince a jihadist that the West is good; a Dem that the GOP is good (and vice versa); or an atheist that this is a God. You ain't gonna dissuade me; I'm not going to change your view.

Gospel truth. I'm done with this issue too. That 4th quarter will go down in history. Some people want to live in denial, some with blinders on, some are just content that their team won no matter what the circumstances.

You are absolutely right about all the blown leads for the C's this year, and many a lost playoff game and series in the past. Not once did I bring up the refs as the reason why we lost. Bad calls, of course I complained... But 4th quarter game 7 2010 NBA Finals will forever change the way I view the legitimacy of the NBA.

Despite all of the problems the C's were having rebounding and scoring, we still lead the whole game. Mostly because the Lakers couldn't get anything going either, even with all of their offensive rebounds keeping them in the game. Kobe was gagging, and the usual calls were not forthcoming from the refs. Enter the final 12 minutes. 19 free throws in 10 minutes, after 16 the previous three quarters combined. More free throws for the Lakers in the 4th quarter than the C's shot all game. You guys couldn't get anything going on offense, the refs tried to let you win legit, but you just couldn't do it. So the refs came along and started calling touch fouls and questionable calls that they hadn't been calling all game. And they only did that for the Lakers, the C's still got the silent treatment. The refs carried you to the title and everyone but those wearing purple and gold know it.

Your rebounding advantage was offset by your terrible shooting. Ray Allen's off night was offset by Kobe's off night. The calls were close going into the fourth, 16-11 FTA. Then 21-6 free throws and you guys get a free pass to the title. Coronation, not Championship.

First time I have ever complained about the officials changing the outcome of a game. Maybe my last.

awesome thread

[Sedale Threatt]

No disrespect, you seem like a civil guy, but your not really addressing the whole crux of what I'm saying about the frequency of calls made for three quarters, then the explosion of calls in the 4th., mostly for the Lakers. You still seem fixated on the quality of each call.

Why doesn't that matter? Why shouldn't that five-point swing near the end of the first half -- which you didn't address either -- matter just as much as a flurry of foul shots in the fourth? Take everything into account, and not just cherry pick one particular stretch that went against your team.

At any rate, I'll say it again -- I wasn't trying to get into some huge debate on the subject. It's rather pointless, to be honest. So much of officiating is in the eye of the beholder. You think what you think, I think what I think, and in the end, all that matters is the scoreboard.

I was just popping in to illustrate that this particular piece of information, even if we get beyond the dubious source, does NOT indicate any sort of "proof" of foul play. Far from it, in fact.

[jsimon]

Why doesn't that matter? Why shouldn't that five-point swing near the end of the first half -- which you didn't address either -- matter just as much as a flurry of foul shots in the fourth? Take everything into account, and not just cherry pick one particular stretch that went against your team.

I think it does matter. I agree with you. I think every foul called in every game can swing a game by a few points, a little momentum, playing time for an important player, and on and on. This is my whole point. These calls all matter!

So if that's the case, then you have to look at all calls made in a game and in a series, and totals matter. Because like you said, there could be as much as a 5 or 6 point swing every time. How can you accuse me of cherry picking when in this entire thread I am addressing the whole series and all of game seven?

Series: 198 free throw attempts Lakers (adjusted for intentionals) - 133 Celtics
Game 7: 16 free throws Lakers through 3, 21 in the fourth - 11 for C's through 3, 6 in the 4th.

According to you (and me) each of those fouls could have swung the game by several points. So if the Lakers over the course of the series out shot us at the line by a whopping 65 times, and in game 7 paraded to the line in the 4th in an explosion of free throws (compared to the first three periods) then each of those could have really swung the game, and in the end - DID!

[Sedale Threatt]

I don't accept your conclusion, because I don't accept that the presence of a FT disparity is automatic proof of impropriety. And unless there's some sort of game-by-game, call-by-call assessment -- which we're probably not going to get -- there's no chance I will accept it.

I guess the best one could do is go back through Donaghy's diaries and total everything up. I don't find that all that satisfying as he has a serious credibility issue. I've never trusted him before, so it doesn't seem very honorable that I'd trust him now.

But as I don't have anything else to go with in terms of a third party, I took the time to do it with Game 7. Accounting for free throws given and missed, and baskets that should or shouldn't have counted, the Celtics still ended up a plus four or five points in the ledger.

That's extremely unscientific, of course, so take it for what it's worth (which isn't much). But again, there's zero chance I'm going to look at the FT numbers and automatically concede that the Celtics were f'd. Show me. Prove it to me.

Otherwise, we're just back to square one with the whole eye of the beholder.

[mr_sunshine]

^ If you look at his diary of the 4th quarter of game 7....well, I don't think you need his commentary to see what's going on. They miss a couple calls in favor of Boston, but they miss about 8 or 9 in favor of LA. That's a huge difference in a 4 point game. It's all just a consistency issue. In the 4th they called over the back on Wallace, but never once on Gasol in the game and earlier in the game gave Farmar a foul on a BLATANT over the back by KG. Also, how come when Gasol hit KG's hand on the layup in the 3rd it was a great block the announcers raved about and hand was part of the ball but when Pierce hit Kobe's hand on that blocked dunk attempt it's a foul? Why did the style of officiating, biased or not, all of a sudden change in the 4th?

Lastly, can you really say a series in which Gasol and Kobe shot 121 FTs vs 138 for Boston as a team was fairly officiated? They let get Pau get away with murder all series in terms of pushing, flopping to draw fouls, and going over the back. He averaged 3 fouls per game in 42 minutes while KG and Wallace, his two main defenders, averaged more fouls in less minutes.

[jsimon]

I don't accept your conclusion, because I don't accept that the presence of a FT disparity is automatic proof of impropriety.

It might not be proof of impropriety, but in my mind it's proof that the game was called unfairly.

If you believe like I do that a foul could generally be called on every play for one team or another, than at the end of the day each team should be in the same ballpark. And at the end of the series the gap should be reasonable. Not equal mind you, but reasonable. Someone pointed out that the gap in 2008 was 19. Trusting their numbers, that's reasonable. This year the gap adjusted for intentional fouls was 65. Not reasonable. In game 7 the Lakers shot more free throws in the 4th than the C's shot all game, in my mind, especially with how tough each team was playing, that's not reasonable. The exception would be of course two totally stylistically different teams. A team of three point bombers vs. a low post/driving team. This was of course not the case in this series.

I guess were just going to have to agree to disagree.

[Sedale Threatt]

^ If you look at his diary of the 4th quarter of game 7....well, I don't think you need his commentary to see what's going on. They miss a couple calls in favor of Boston, but they miss about 8 or 9 in favor of LA. That's a huge difference in a 4 point game. It's all just a consistency issue. In the 4th they called over the back on Wallace, but never once on Gasol in the game and earlier in the game gave Farmar a foul on a BLATANT over the back by KG. Also, how come when Gasol hit KG's hand on the layup in the 3rd it was a great block the announcers raved about and hand was part of the ball but when Pierce hit Kobe's hand on that blocked dunk attempt it's a foul? Why did the style of officiating, biased or not, all of a sudden change in the 4th?

Lastly, can you really say a series in which Gasol and Kobe shot 121 FTs vs 138 for Boston as a team was fairly officiated? They let get Pau get away with murder all series in terms of pushing, flopping to draw fouls, and going over the back. He averaged 3 fouls per game in 42 minutes while KG and Wallace, his two main defenders, averaged more fouls in less minutes.

I'm not trying to be a dick here -- honestly -- but as a Dwyane Wade fan, you don't it's a bit hypocritical to make these kind of complaints about one team being blatantly favored by the officiating?

Miami had something like a 40-FT differential in the last two games of the 06 Finals alone -- and something like 55 over the last four games, after falling behind 0-2 -- with Wade shooting nearly as many himself as Dallas did as a team in that span.

So I'll pose to you the same question -- can you really say a series in which that happened was fairly officiated?

[Sedale Threatt]

I don't accept your conclusion, because I don't accept that the presence of a FT disparity is automatic proof of impropriety.

It might not be proof of impropriety, but in my mind it's proof that the game was called unfairly.

If you believe like I do that a foul could generally be called on every play for one team or another, than at the end of the day each team should be in the same ballpark. And at the end of the series the gap should be reasonable. Not equal mind you, but reasonable. Someone pointed out that the gap in 2008 was 19. Trusting their numbers, that's reasonable. This year the gap adjusted for intentional fouls was 65. Not reasonable. In game 7 the Lakers shot more free throws in the 4th than the C's shot all game, in my mind, especially with how tough each team was playing, that's not reasonable. The exception would be of course two totally stylistically different teams. A team of three point bombers vs. a low post/driving team. This was of course not the case in this series.

I guess were just going to have to agree to disagree.

I'm not saying it was reasonable. I'm just saying that it wasn't categorically unreasonable. I'd have to see something we're not going to get -- an unbiased third party, going back and charting calls game by game -- until I accepted that.

Like I said previously -- I took the time to do so with Donaghy's piece, and it actually ended up with the Celtics netting four or five more points than they lost.

Hardly proof, and I take it with a massive, massive grain of salt. But it's something, rather than simply looking at FT totals and coming to the automatic conclusion that somebody was screwed because there's a large gap.

[TonyMontana]

At any rate, the only reason I posted was to illustrate that, if you actually read Donaghy's piece, it doesn't really indicate a significant advantage one way or the other. Which is amusing, because the poster who shared the link seems to think it does, as does Donaghy himself with the tone of his lead.

I'm not going to take the time to do so -- the game's over, and my team won, so I don't really care -- but it would be interesting to reconstruct the game based on his observations.

Probably tough to do so, as you impact individual foul totals, and when a team gets into the bonus, and all of that. And that's not even getting into the difficulty of coming up with a consensus on certain calls. Show people a close charge/block, and five will see it one way and five the others.

No matter what, I suspect if one were to take an honest, unbiased look at things -- a high school official who doesn't care about the NBA, for example -- it wouldn't add up to this epic screw job some seem to believe took place.

No disrespect, you seem like a civil guy, but your not really addressing the whole crux of what I'm saying about the frequency of calls made for three quarters, then the explosion of calls in the 4th., mostly for the Lakers. You still seem fixated on the quality of each call.

You claim you dont complain about the reffs yet this entire thread has you crying and whinning and blaming the officials AS WELL AS OTHER THREADS YOU HAVE POSTED ON AFTER YOU GUYS LOST THE FINALS.

Sit down and rewatch game seven, NBA Tv is showing it every hour or better yet go and set your DVR and record it so can see that your team got out HUSTLED, out rebounded, and they missed several open layups and shot. Was it the officials that took those shots...........No was it the officials that got out hustled........... No. Were the officials boarding for the Lakes....... I must've missed it.

Your team gave up a 13 point lead and they couldnt keep up with the Lakers intensity and the energy flux, we turned it on in the 4qt and your team panic since their shots wasnt falling and our defnese SHUT YOU DOWN. By far every call that was made in the 4th qt was the correct calls maybe maybe 1 or 2 questionable calls like Paus shot that he came down with it. We balled meanwhile you guys paniced and started commiting dumb and uneccessary fouls. You were in the penalty and every call was a freethrow. We can also sit here and say that the 1st 2nd and 3rd qt had a lot of bad and missed calls that went against the Lakes, but then we won who cares.

Its funny how SOME not all of your posters INCLUDING YOU cant just give credit where credit is due. You cry about every call and every lost game and the only reason according to YOU is becuase of the officials or Stern.

So technically according to you, you guys should be undefeated and the 2010 champs since every thread that your team lost from the begining of the season to game 7 was tampered by the reffs and all the calls made agaisnt your team is questionable and wrong.

Maybe next year the league should cancel every game and just hand your team the championship throphy, cause lord knows you guys never commit fouls or miss open shots or layups. Its always somebody elses fault. NOTHING TO DO WITH YOUR TEAM.


You call Laker fans fakers and crybabies but the difference between our fan base and yours is that we give credit where credit is due and when we lose we dont start a million threads about how we got screwed or complaining about the officials.

Go back several pages and start from the begining of the season, every game you guys have lost your board has started a thread blaming the officials. Every single game you guys have lost has been because of the reffs or Stern or Superstar calls.

When you win its break out the victory cigars when you lose its where is the box of Kleenex.

You blame Rays shooting slump on Artest being dirty and he intenionally hurt Ray, yet Ray has never complained about ANY INJURIES when replay shows it was unintentional.

You blamed Perkins injury on LAKERS INTENTIONALLY MANGLED Perkins knee when replay clearly shows that Perkins came down on his knee and it buckeled.

You blamed Rondo's chin on Artest intentionally hurting Rondo when replay clearly show thats Rons elbows were below his shoulders when Rondo came donw after his shot.

You blamed M.Daniles concussion on the Magic when it was Daniels who clearly was swinging his head into Gortat.

You blamed Big Babies concussion on Howard when it was Nate that fouled and pulled down Howards arm when it UNINTENTIONALLY hit Babies face.

I mean the excuses go on and on and on. You even have your own fan base that are coming out and replying to you and others that are crying and whinning and DISPUTING all these accusations and calls your a crying about. Some of your own fans are feed up by guys like you and others since your emberrasing them and your showing that you simply cant except the fact that the better team won.

I do realize its sucks to lose and it sucks when the official ruin a game by bad calls, but we got screwed in game 2 big time infact every game up to game 5 was called like ish but we didnt start 15 20 threads about it like SOME of you guys did. We took the loss and we moved on.

Its seems like SOME of you guys just cant do that.

[mr_sunshine]

^ If you look at his diary of the 4th quarter of game 7....well, I don't think you need his commentary to see what's going on. They miss a couple calls in favor of Boston, but they miss about 8 or 9 in favor of LA. That's a huge difference in a 4 point game. It's all just a consistency issue. In the 4th they called over the back on Wallace, but never once on Gasol in the game and earlier in the game gave Farmar a foul on a BLATANT over the back by KG. Also, how come when Gasol hit KG's hand on the layup in the 3rd it was a great block the announcers raved about and hand was part of the ball but when Pierce hit Kobe's hand on that blocked dunk attempt it's a foul? Why did the style of officiating, biased or not, all of a sudden change in the 4th?

Lastly, can you really say a series in which Gasol and Kobe shot 121 FTs vs 138 for Boston as a team was fairly officiated? They let get Pau get away with murder all series in terms of pushing, flopping to draw fouls, and going over the back. He averaged 3 fouls per game in 42 minutes while KG and Wallace, his two main defenders, averaged more fouls in less minutes.

I'm not trying to be a dick here -- honestly -- but as a Dwyane Wade fan, you don't it's a bit hypocritical to make these kind of complaints about one team being blatantly favored by the officiating?

Miami had something like a 40-FT differential in the last two games of the 06 Finals alone -- and something like 55 over the last four games, after falling behind 0-2 -- with Wade shooting nearly as many himself as Dallas did as a team in that span.

So I'll pose to you the same question -- can you really say a series in which that happened was fairly officiated?

Why are you changing the subject? And no I don't think it was fairly officiated, are you **** kidding me? I just like Wade as a player. Truthfully the only players on that Miami team I wanted to see get rings were Payton and Walker.

Seriously, now address the real issue. How is it that the Lakers had one of the highest FT differentials in finals history? How did Pau and Kobe shoot almost as many FTs as Boston as a team? Why did they shoot an NBA SEASON HIGH of FTs in the 4th? I'm still waiting....

[mr_sunshine]

By far every call that was made in the 4th qt was the correct calls maybe maybe 1 or 2 questionable calls like Paus shot that he came down with it.

1) Phantom and 1 on Davis vs Gasol
2) Gasol flings the ball 20 feet in the air gets 2 FTs
3) Artest rams into Pierce for an and 1 that's a no call or offensive foul
4) Gasol blatantly travels before he draws a foul refs ignore it
5) Gasol goes up and down and scores a basket
6) Gasol pushes Rondo out of the way right in front of the refs and they ignore and it results in 2 Kobe FTs
7) Gasol hits Rondo in the face on a shot, refs ignore it and Kobe gets 2 FTs on the rebound
8) Why do they call over the back on Sheed (which was a foul) but not on Gasol ONE TIME in the series? Why did they ignore a BLATANT over the back on KG earlier in the game and give Farmar a foul, but in the 4th they call a foul on Boston?


Come on Tony. You're a reasonable guy, open your **** eyes man. I think the officiating was more or less a wash the first 3 quarters of the game (bad calls both ways), but the 4th was just egregious. Yes, they made a questionable call on a Kobe blocking foul but that's it. You can say what you want about rebounding and shooting and whatever, but you know if the Celtics couldn't score all game and then were given 12+ FTs on bull that lead to them locking up the game you'd be pissed too. And there were tons of Lakers fans blaming the refs after game 2 when LA shot over 20 FTs more than the Celtics and still lost, so get the **** out of here with the holier than thou attitude.

[Cqc_Nastyn8]

By far every call that was made in the 4th qt was the correct calls maybe maybe 1 or 2 questionable calls like Paus shot that he came down with it.

1) Phantom and 1 on Davis vs Gasol
2) Gasol flings the ball 20 feet in the air gets 2 FTs
3) Artest rams into Pierce for an and 1 that's a no call or offensive foul
4) Gasol blatantly travels before he draws a foul refs ignore it
5) Gasol goes up and down and scores a basket
6) Gasol pushes Rondo out of the way right in front of the refs and they ignore and it results in 2 Kobe FTs
7) Gasol hits Rondo in the face on a shot, refs ignore it and Kobe gets 2 FTs on the rebound
8) Why do they call over the back on Sheed (which was a foul) but not on Gasol ONE TIME in the series? Why did they ignore a BLATANT over the back on KG earlier in the game and give Farmar a foul, but in the 4th they call a foul on Boston?


Come on Tony. You're a reasonable guy, open your **** eyes man. I think the officiating was more or less a wash the first 3 quarters of the game (bad calls both ways), but the 4th was just egregious. Yes, they made a questionable call on a Kobe blocking foul but that's it. You can say what you want about rebounding and shooting and whatever, but you know if the Celtics couldn't score all game and then were given 12+ FTs on bull that lead to them locking up the game you'd be pissed too. And there were tons of Lakers fans blaming the refs after game 2 when LA shot over 20 FTs more than the Celtics and still lost, so get the **** out of here with the holier than thou attitude.

You can point out all the bad calls, but if it was your team that won. You wouldn't be saying a word right now and you know that's true. How do you think Laker fans felt in 08 during game 2 which was even more blatant. We didn't have a chance to play. You guys this season in game 7 had a lead. Did everything right, but towards the end you ran out of gas and became cold. Your team is the worst in the league during the 4th quater. Lakers defense in the 4th was like watching Celtics in 08. It was very well contested on every player and you couldn't make shots. We got more rebounds and 23 of them were offensive and your bound to foul. We were more aggressive after fisher tied the game with the 3pointer. Who gets the calls? The team that is more aggressive..

[jsimon]

I'm not trying to be a dick here -- honestly -- but as a Dwyane Wade fan, you don't it's a bit hypocritical to make these kind of complaints about one team being blatantly favored by the officiating?

Miami had something like a 40-FT differential in the last two games of the 06 Finals alone -- and something like 55 over the last four games, after falling behind 0-2 -- with Wade shooting nearly as many himself as Dallas did as a team in that span.

So I'll pose to you the same question -- can you really say a series in which that happened was fairly officiated?

No. Not at all. It was just as comical as this one.

[jsimon]

You can point out all the bad calls, but if it was your team that won. You wouldn't be saying a word right now and you know that's true.

Actually that's not true. Look it up. I said after game 6 (and several times leading up to game 6) that win or lose game 7 this series is tainted.

[jsimon]

Look let's just set aside the specifics for a moment.

At the end of the day I believe the NBA has an officiating problem. I've watched it from a far in such famous examples as Sacramento - LA 2002 or Miami - Dallas 2006, and now it's hit home with Celtics - LA 2010, to name just a few. The most generous and kind description of this problem is incompetence, choking under the pressure, refs that are mistake prone, or just bad job performance as a whole. The most damning description of this problem would be corruption, game fixing, series extensions, manipulating outcomes, gambling refs, favoritism of certain players propping them up for retail sales, favoritism of certain franchises for the same thing, and profit maximization of the NBA as a whole over athletic competition.

Some people believe this problem exists, and they fall somewhere between those poles. Others believe everything is on the up and up, and the rest of us are just whining conspiracy babies.

I'll tell you this though Lakers fans, you never hear the House in Vegas complaining that the games are stacked against them.

[Cqc_Nastyn8]

Look let's just set aside the specifics for a moment.

At the end of the day I believe the NBA has an officiating problem. I've watched it from a far in such famous examples as Sacramento - LA 2002 or Miami - Dallas 2006, and now it's hit home with Celtics - LA 2010, to name just a few. The most generous and kind description of this problem is incompetence, choking under the pressure, refs that are mistake prone, or just bad job performance as a whole. The most damning description of this problem would be corruption, game fixing, series extensions, manipulating outcomes, gambling refs, favoritism of certain players propping them up for retail sales, favoritism of certain franchises for the same thing, and profit maximization of the NBA as a whole over athletic competition.

Some people believe this problem exists, and they fall somewhere between those poles. Others believe everything is on the up and up, and the rest of us are just whining conspiracy babies.

I'll tell you this though Lakers fans, you never hear the House in Vegas complaining that the games are stacked against them.

well if your going to name a few why don't you put 08 celtics vs lakers???? oh yah because you won...sorry but that's the only reason you mad and looking for an excuse

[jsimon]

well if your going to name a few why don't you put 08 celtics vs lakers???? oh yah because you won...sorry but that's the only reason you mad and looking for an excuse

I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess your a Lakers fan who falls into the "everything's just fine, nothing to see hear" end of the officiating argument.

[jsimon]

Furthermore, I think I've made my argument in a valid way, going into painstaking detail of why I had a problem with the refs in this series. If I were just some knee jerk fan looking for an excuse, I would have done that after we lost to Orlando last season. I would have screamed about the refs after we lost to Indiana a couple years before that, or when we lost to the Nets back in 2002. I didn't complain then though because there was no cause for complaint. I felt as though we lost fair and square.

My lying eyes told a different story this year. What I saw was the refs pick the Lakers up at the start of the 4th quarter game 7, and for long stretches of 4 other games in this series, and carry them on their backs to the finish line. I saw a coronation not a championship.

I didn't see conspiracies last year, nor in 2005, nor in 2002, nor in any of the other playoff series the Celtics ever lost. Unfortunately this one I did. Disagree with me, that's understandable, but don't sit there and tell me I'm just looking for an excuse as to why we lost.

[ConnorHenry]

Look let's just set aside the specifics for a moment.

At the end of the day I believe the NBA has an officiating problem. I've watched it from a far in such famous examples as Sacramento - LA 2002 or Miami - Dallas 2006, and now it's hit home with Celtics - LA 2010, to name just a few. The most generous and kind description of this problem is incompetence, choking under the pressure, refs that are mistake prone, or just bad job performance as a whole. The most damning description of this problem would be corruption, game fixing, series extensions, manipulating outcomes, gambling refs, favoritism of certain players propping them up for retail sales, favoritism of certain franchises for the same thing, and profit maximization of the NBA as a whole over athletic competition.

Some people believe this problem exists, and they fall somewhere between those poles. Others believe everything is on the up and up, and the rest of us are just whining conspiracy babies.

I'll tell you this though Lakers fans, you never hear the House in Vegas complaining that the games are stacked against them.

well if your going to name a few why don't you put 08 celtics vs lakers???? oh yah because you won...sorry but that's the only reason you mad and looking for an excuse

Why do you come here and get exasperated to see we're not happy over the Laker win? It's akin to be a Democrat or Republican and going to the opposing party's national convention and then being upset that you're not hearing anything positive about your party. What do expect? Don't come here then if this stuff bothers you. We're not posting it on the Laker board, so it's not like we're goading or anything. I'm not going to the Laker board and getting mad at all the Laker praise and Celtic bashing.

[ConnorHenry]

Look let's just set aside the specifics for a moment.

At the end of the day I believe the NBA has an officiating problem. I've watched it from a far in such famous examples as Sacramento - LA 2002 or Miami - Dallas 2006, and now it's hit home with Celtics - LA 2010, to name just a few. The most generous and kind description of this problem is incompetence, choking under the pressure, refs that are mistake prone, or just bad job performance as a whole. The most damning description of this problem would be corruption, game fixing, series extensions, manipulating outcomes, gambling refs, favoritism of certain players propping them up for retail sales, favoritism of certain franchises for the same thing, and profit maximization of the NBA as a whole over athletic competition.

Some people believe this problem exists, and they fall somewhere between those poles. Others believe everything is on the up and up, and the rest of us are just whining conspiracy babies.

I'll tell you this though Lakers fans, you never hear the House in Vegas complaining that the games are stacked against them.

well if your going to name a few why don't you put 08 celtics vs lakers???? oh yah because you won...sorry but that's the only reason you mad and looking for an excuse

Why do you come here and get exasperated to see we're not happy over the Laker win? It's akin to be a Democrat or Republican and going to the opposing party's national convention and then being upset that you're not hearing anything positive about your party. What do you expect? Don't come here then if this stuff bothers you. We're not posting it on the Laker board, so it's not like we're goading or anything. I'm not going to the Laker board and getting mad at all the Laker praise and Celtic bashing.