Olynyk's rookie season

[cloverleaf]

If he can increase his strength and conditioning to be able to at least hold his own at the five then that would be a pretty massive bonus for the team, having him be able to split his time between the four and the five.

If they both reach their ceilings and you could add an athletic rim protector type to the mix, a three big rotation of Sully, Olynyk and theoretical rim protector would be pretty nice, gives you all aspects you would want in a front court. Rebounding, post play, playmaking skills, jump shooting, and defense.

There are still too many "ifs" with Olynyk at the moment in my opinion, but he has certainly shown enough to warrant the time and effort to develop him to see if he can make it to the level people hope he can. As most realistic people have already said, the Dirk thing is not going to happen but I quite like the Okur comparison. Though I think Okur had more genuine centre skills while I think Olynyk is more of a four.

Another comparison I thought of was Toni Kukoc. I know Kukoc had borderline point guard skills and was a better shooter, but I think Olynyk does have genuine playmaking skills and understanding of basketball concepts, and there is definitely potential to be an above average jump shooter all the way out to the three point line.

Toni didn't play in the NBA until he was 25 and he didn't hit better than .313 from the three until his third year in the league. KO's more a 4/5 than a 3/4, but he's also already a better rebounder than Toni ever was. Still, he was a very good player and the C's will be happy if KO has as good a career.

[BfB]

If he can increase his strength and conditioning to be able to at least hold his own at the five then that would be a pretty massive bonus for the team, having him be able to split his time between the four and the five.

If they both reach their ceilings and you could add an athletic rim protector type to the mix, a three big rotation of Sully, Olynyk and theoretical rim protector would be pretty nice, gives you all aspects you would want in a front court. Rebounding, post play, playmaking skills, jump shooting, and defense.

There are still too many "ifs" with Olynyk at the moment in my opinion, but he has certainly shown enough to warrant the time and effort to develop him to see if he can make it to the level people hope he can. As most realistic people have already said, the Dirk thing is not going to happen but I quite like the Okur comparison. Though I think Okur had more genuine centre skills while I think Olynyk is more of a four.

Another comparison I thought of was Toni Kukoc. I know Kukoc had borderline point guard skills and was a better shooter, but I think Olynyk does have genuine playmaking skills and understanding of basketball concepts, and there is definitely potential to be an above average jump shooter all the way out to the three point line.

Toni didn't play in the NBA until he was 25 and he didn't hit better than .313 from the three until his third year in the league. KO's more a 4/5 than a 3/4, but he's also already a better rebounder than Toni ever was. Still, he was a very good player and the C's will be happy if KO has as good a career.

This is actually a great case point example for the "age" debate. I've never understood why so many people are quick to parrot "age" as if older player's don't also improve. All players, who have the talent and opportunity, improve dramatically between years one and five.

[soxfan2003]

If he can increase his strength and conditioning to be able to at least hold his own at the five then that would be a pretty massive bonus for the team, having him be able to split his time between the four and the five.

If they both reach their ceilings and you could add an athletic rim protector type to the mix, a three big rotation of Sully, Olynyk and theoretical rim protector would be pretty nice, gives you all aspects you would want in a front court. Rebounding, post play, playmaking skills, jump shooting, and defense.

There are still too many "ifs" with Olynyk at the moment in my opinion, but he has certainly shown enough to warrant the time and effort to develop him to see if he can make it to the level people hope he can. As most realistic people have already said, the Dirk thing is not going to happen but I quite like the Okur comparison. Though I think Okur had more genuine centre skills while I think Olynyk is more of a four.

Another comparison I thought of was Toni Kukoc. I know Kukoc had borderline point guard skills and was a better shooter, but I think Olynyk does have genuine playmaking skills and understanding of basketball concepts, and there is definitely potential to be an above average jump shooter all the way out to the three point line.

Toni didn't play in the NBA until he was 25 and he didn't hit better than .313 from the three until his third year in the league. KO's more a 4/5 than a 3/4, but he's also already a better rebounder than Toni ever was. Still, he was a very good player and the C's will be happy if KO has as good a career.

This is actually a great case point example for the "age" debate. I've never understood why so many people are quick to parrot "age" as if older player's don't also improve. All players, who have the talent and opportunity, improve dramatically between years one and five.

Olynyk has a good chance to improve as an NBA 3 point shooter. He obviously works hard on his shooting. Look at his large improvement from the line and field in college. Even as NBA players decline due to age and injuries over the years, a decent percentage of them historically have improved as 3 point shooters. Dee Brown is a decent example. It's Olynyk's defense I seriously question and puts pressure on him to be very good on offense even as just a complimentary player instead of just good good. I fully expect Olynyk to have a few seasons shooting 35% from 3. But for an offensive player, he will need to do better then that to have nice value.

All that being said, Kukoc is a pretty bad example in any NBA age debate. A rookie player from Europe who has never played in the US in even college should be given a year to adjust to the NBA and a couple of years to try to add the NBA 3.

And his 3rd year in the NBA where he shot 3's well, he obviously benefitted from the return of Michael Jordan who I'm sure got on Kukoc about the importance of spacing the floor for him as Jordan faced double teams. Spacing was always important in the Triangle but with MJ back it obviously becomes more important.

Kukoc as a 2nd year NBA player had one of the best statistical seasons -- arguably the best given context ...larger scoring burden without Jordan for all but 17 games and playing the most minutes of his NBA career as a starter instead of coming off the bench.

[tlee324]

Based on roles, the stats may not come to complete mirrors, as KO will and has played closer to the basket, but his skill set, I believe, is closer to Kukoc, than most of the other comparisons. His production could end up looking like a LaFrentz, but considering he's already a better passer (I'd venture a better handler too), his game will be different. I'd be very happy with a mix of Sabonis, Smits, and Kukoc, which I think he could be if he reaches his potential.

[bbd24]

Based on roles, the stats may not come to complete mirrors, as KO will and has played closer to the basket, but his skill set, I believe, is closer to Kukoc, than most of the other comparisons. His production could end up looking like a LaFrentz, but considering he's already a better passer (I'd venture a better handler too), his game will be different. I'd be very happy with a mix of Sabonis, Smits, and Kukoc, which I think he could be if he reaches his potential.

Hadn't heard much about the Sabonis comparison...I like it.

I think Kelly has a better back-to-the-basket game though. Or at least eventually will have a better game in that area. Right now, he's in slow motion down on the block. He's more than capable tho & that will be better in time.

I love just how much his rebounding has improved since the start of the year. When the shots going up, he's much quicker at finding a guy & getting a body on him. He's going up stronger as well with both hands.

[FingerRoll]

Danny needs to sit him down, hell, maybe even rondo, and tell this guy look "the celtics are a classy organization, we're here to win banners, not to look like wannabe lesbians. Cut the hair and that sorry, no-good lookin' goatee and bury it in the hole it crawled out of."

As far as on court....he need to stop being a damn pussy. If he's only gunna take exhibition games seriously.....then seriously get him on the next flight outta Logan. Give him fab Melos phone number just for good measure.

[cloverleaf]

Toni didn't play in the NBA until he was 25 and he didn't hit better than .313 from the three until his third year in the league. KO's more a 4/5 than a 3/4, but he's also already a better rebounder than Toni ever was. Still, he was a very good player and the C's will be happy if KO has as good a career.

This is actually a great case point example for the "age" debate. I've never understood why so many people are quick to parrot "age" as if older player's don't also improve. All players, who have the talent and opportunity, improve dramatically between years one and five.

Olynyk has a good chance to improve as an NBA 3 point shooter. He obviously works hard on his shooting. Look at his large improvement from the line and field in college. Even as NBA players decline due to age and injuries over the years, a decent percentage of them historically have improved as 3 point shooters. Dee Brown is a decent example. It's Olynyk's defense I seriously question and puts pressure on him to be very good on offense even as just a complimentary player instead of just good good. I fully expect Olynyk to have a few seasons shooting 35% from 3. But for an offensive player, he will need to do better then that to have nice value.

All that being said, Kukoc is a pretty bad example in any NBA age debate. A rookie player from Europe who has never played in the US in even college should be given a year to adjust to the NBA and a couple of years to try to add the NBA 3.

And his 3rd year in the NBA where he shot 3's well, he obviously benefitted from the return of Michael Jordan who I'm sure got on Kukoc about the importance of spacing the floor for him as Jordan faced double teams. Spacing was always important in the Triangle but with MJ back it obviously becomes more important.

Kukoc as a 2nd year NBA player had one of the best statistical seasons -- arguably the best given context ...larger scoring burden without Jordan for all but 17 games and playing the most minutes of his NBA career as a starter instead of coming off the bench.

But OP was saying that Toni was a better shooter. I was simply pointing out it took him three years in the NBA, already with more basketball experience under his belt, to hit from the 3--so it's too early to say KO won't be as good a shooter.

[LongTimeFan]

bbd24:

These are young men and young women about to leave the family nest. The decisions they make over the next few years are going to make or break their lives. His role is to see what they are thinking, come up with a plan to guide them and then lead about 100 men and women to implement the plan. He does this over and over again. He knows (to the extent one can know the future) what kind of young men and women are going to do well, develop well. he knows which ones are likely to crash and burn. And he knows which ones will just stay where they are.

That he moved for Olynyk tells me he has a lot of confidence in his willingness to develop. He moved to get Rondo, too.

[bbd24]

bbd24:

These are young men and young women about to leave the family nest. The decisions they make over the next few years are going to make or break their lives. His role is to see what they are thinking, come up with a plan to guide them and then lead about 100 men and women to implement the plan. He does this over and over again. He knows (to the extent one can know the future) what kind of young men and women are going to do well, develop well. he knows which ones are likely to crash and burn. And he knows which ones will just stay where they are.

That he moved for Olynyk tells me he has a lot of confidence in his willingness to develop. He moved to get Rondo, too.

Pretty interesting stuff.

I got a lot of respect for Ainge. Seems like he's really passionate about helping others. In life or ball. He's got a good head on his shoulders.

I'm real excited to see what he's got up his sleeve for the next couple of drafts. It will be fun to watch him at work.

[LongTimeFan]

There's a lot of good people, especially in Boston. I've lost my wallet twice and both times it was returned in tact.

If you think about Perkins for a moment and where we got him I think 28 you can get an idea of what I'm saying. I saw an interview of Ainge with all the team after Walker left the first time in a huff. Walker was publicly slamming us and especially Ainge for being a snake in the grass. A reporter asked a question about the future and how this had ruined the teams plans.

In the answer it was like everyone in the room disappeared it was just Ainge talking to Perkins. He laid out how it was the development of players that was going to be key. If the players bought into the developing, then they Celtics would be champions again. (He was still talking about the three Ds, Draft, Develop and Deal) Perkins was a young, fat teenager at the time. Perkins bought it, went to the gym religiously, and remade his body into a lean, mean machine. A year later Peirce leading the league in dental work ended. Someone in Chicago undercut Pierce and he lost another tooth. A couple plays later Perkins retaliated in kind. Perk got ejected and fined. Our stars paid the fine for him. That was the end of the cheep shots until Miami crushed Rondo.

I think his service as bishop helps a lot for him to get a read on whether a kid's attitude are going to lead to crash and burn, stuck on stupid or thriving. He said before the Rondo draft our top five picks were nothing like anybody else's top five picks. I think it is because he looks down the road 3-5 years better than most GMs.

If Rondo has a shot & he recovers, then he hasn't peaked. We got him at 21. I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

[165bows]

There's a lot of good people, especially in Boston. I've lost my wallet twice and both times it was returned in tact.

If you think about Perkins for a moment and where we got him I think 28 you can get an idea of what I'm saying. I saw an interview of Ainge with all the team after Walker left the first time in a huff. Walker was publicly slamming us and especially Ainge for being a snake in the grass. A reporter asked a question about the future and how this had ruined the teams plans.

In the answer it was like everyone in the room disappeared it was just Ainge talking to Perkins. He laid out how it was the development of players that was going to be key. If the players bought into the developing, then they Celtics would be champions again. (He was still talking about the three Ds, Draft, Develop and Deal) Perkins was a young, fat teenager at the time. Perkins bought it, went to the gym religiously, and remade his body into a lean, mean machine. A year later Peirce leading the league in dental work ended. Someone in Chicago undercut Pierce and he lost another tooth. A couple plays later Perkins retaliated in kind. Perk got ejected and fined. Our stars paid the fine for him. That was the end of the cheep shots until Miami crushed Rondo.

I think his service as bishop helps a lot for him to get a read on whether a kid's attitude are going to lead to crash and burn, stuck on stupid or thriving. He said before the Rondo draft our top five picks were nothing like anybody else's top five picks. I think it is because he looks down the road 3-5 years better than most GMs.

If Rondo has a shot & he recovers, then he hasn't peaked. We got him at 21. I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

Fascinating insight, thanks for the posts.

And for the vague but promising prediction, rumored tidbits coming on the regular at this point.

[Datruth345]

Kelly is going to be fine

2 things he is missing right now halfway through his rookie season, are strength and confidence, and they will come in time. his development arc right now is completely natural

[pokeKingCurtis]

bbd24:

These are young men and young women about to leave the family nest. The decisions they make over the next few years are going to make or break their lives. His role is to see what they are thinking, come up with a plan to guide them and then lead about 100 men and women to implement the plan. He does this over and over again. He knows (to the extent one can know the future) what kind of young men and women are going to do well, develop well. he knows which ones are likely to crash and burn. And he knows which ones will just stay where they are.

That he moved for Olynyk tells me he has a lot of confidence in his willingness to develop. He moved to get Rondo, too.

The human component is basically ignored by many professed "elite" armchair GMs. Trading players on whim season after season.

It might be my green goggles speaking but Ainge has done and has continued to do fantastically. Keeping the locker room from becoming like the Sactown Kings of the past few years or the Bucks despite this being a talent starved roster, hiring a guy like Stevens to weather the storm this year...on top of being very acute with the more practical fronts of being a GM.

Tank or not, I trust Ainge to know what he's doing.

[bbd24]

There's a lot of good people, especially in Boston. I've lost my wallet twice and both times it was returned in tact.

If you think about Perkins for a moment and where we got him I think 28 you can get an idea of what I'm saying. I saw an interview of Ainge with all the team after Walker left the first time in a huff. Walker was publicly slamming us and especially Ainge for being a snake in the grass. A reporter asked a question about the future and how this had ruined the teams plans.

In the answer it was like everyone in the room disappeared it was just Ainge talking to Perkins. He laid out how it was the development of players that was going to be key. If the players bought into the developing, then they Celtics would be champions again. (He was still talking about the three Ds, Draft, Develop and Deal) Perkins was a young, fat teenager at the time. Perkins bought it, went to the gym religiously, and remade his body into a lean, mean machine. A year later Peirce leading the league in dental work ended. Someone in Chicago undercut Pierce and he lost another tooth. A couple plays later Perkins retaliated in kind. Perk got ejected and fined. Our stars paid the fine for him. That was the end of the cheep shots until Miami crushed Rondo.

I think his service as bishop helps a lot for him to get a read on whether a kid's attitude are going to lead to crash and burn, stuck on stupid or thriving. He said before the Rondo draft our top five picks were nothing like anybody else's top five picks. I think it is because he looks down the road 3-5 years better than most GMs.

If Rondo has a shot & he recovers, then he hasn't peaked. We got him at 21. I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

I've always been a public supporter of his drafts. Sure, he isn't perfect but no GM in any sport is. The draft is often a crapshoot.

As you're eluding to, most of the people Ainge has drafted (if not all) have a strong basketball work ethic. They almost all love the game & want to better themselves immediately. Granted, he isn't usually drafting very high so a lot of his picks have something to prove & aren't given something immediately.

What other things does he do for the Bishop role ? Is he just grooming these men for life or is this for the Mormon missionary program ?

I, like you, think he's going to hit big this draft. Especially with the first pick. He'll find another solid add with the 2nd of his picks if he even keeps it.

[bbd24]

bbd24:

These are young men and young women about to leave the family nest. The decisions they make over the next few years are going to make or break their lives. His role is to see what they are thinking, come up with a plan to guide them and then lead about 100 men and women to implement the plan. He does this over and over again. He knows (to the extent one can know the future) what kind of young men and women are going to do well, develop well. he knows which ones are likely to crash and burn. And he knows which ones will just stay where they are.

That he moved for Olynyk tells me he has a lot of confidence in his willingness to develop. He moved to get Rondo, too.

The human component is basically ignored by many professed "elite" armchair GMs. Trading players on whim season after season.

It might be my green goggles speaking but Ainge has done and has continued to do fantastically. Keeping the locker room from becoming like the Sactown Kings of the past few years or the Bucks despite this being a talent starved roster, hiring a guy like Stevens to weather the storm this year...on top of being very acute with the more practical fronts of being a GM.

Tank or not, I trust Ainge to know what he's doing.

I'd agree about the human component. I think we have a GM with so much experience in the league that he knows it can't be ignored.

I heard when he got here he changed the concept of family members on the plane during road trips. He wanted the married players to bring their wives, family, etc. He wanted them as comfortable as possible. Little things like that go a long way.

[CeltsfanSinceBirth]

I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

We talking about a 2007-like transformation? I'm giddy already.

[bbd24]

I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

We talking about a 2007-like transformation? I'm giddy already.

When you add Ainge together with a top pick, anything is possible. The guy just adds talent when he's got that type of asset at his disposal.

[ryaningf]

I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

We talking about a 2007-like transformation? I'm giddy already.

I read this prediction to say that we're sitting on a Rondo-like talent in the draft who for whatever reason isn't as highly valued as he should be and is going to get picked by us in the 20s with the BK pick. I'm guessing he's talking about Selden.

But screw my guesses, just give us the dirt LongTimeFan!

[bbd24]

I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

We talking about a 2007-like transformation? I'm giddy already.

I read this prediction to say that we're sitting on a Rondo-like talent in the draft who for whatever reason isn't as highly valued as he should be and is going to get picked by us in the 20s with the BK pick. I'm guessing he's talking about Selden.

But screw my guesses, just give us the dirt LongTimeFan!

Kyle Anderson !

[165bows]

I have a prediction I cannot make public. I can say, the NBA is going pissed off at us after this draft.

We talking about a 2007-like transformation? I'm giddy already.

I read this prediction to say that we're sitting on a Rondo-like talent in the draft who for whatever reason isn't as highly valued as he should be and is going to get picked by us in the 20s with the BK pick. I'm guessing he's talking about Selden.

But screw my guesses, just give us the dirt LongTimeFan!

That's what I was thinking as well, I was peaking at a couple of later first round DX videos again for sleepers.

Could be anything though, if other guys aren't happy draft day must be somewhat obvious that he landed a big score.